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U.S. Gov't Sues Argosy and other for profit universities

Discussion in 'Psychology [Psy.D. / Ph.D.]' started by 2012PhD, Aug 8, 2011.

  1. 2012PhD

    2012PhD Psychology Resident

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    The whole for profit school system is being sued by the federal government and 4 U.S. States for fraud (e..g paying recruiters based on how many students they enroll). For profit colleges account for 10% of enrollments, yet 50% of student loan defaults. One of the largest companies is owned by Goldman Sacks (I didn't know this).

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/09/education/09forprofit.html
     
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  3. cara susanna

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    If this were Facebook, I would "Like" that link.
     
  4. Romy7126

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    I love that one of the sponsor links on the bottom of this post is for Argosy. :laugh:
     
  5. futureapppsy2

    futureapppsy2 Assistant professor
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    My thoughts exactly!... *goes to post it on facebook*. ;)
     
  6. Therapist4Chnge

    Therapist4Chnge Neuropsych Ninja Faculty
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    The gov't needs to adjust the qualifications for educational programs to accept student loans. Some for-profit institutions have little to no endowments, so their reliance on gov't loans can often exceed 80-90%. To maximize on these loans they inflate tuition and fees, which puts more of a burden on students. This reliance on tuition and fees just encourages more predatory practices.
     
  7. roubs

    roubs Ph.D. Student
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    I hope they get the whole $33 billion out of them.
     
  8. PerhapsMaybeOk

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    It cracks me up that no one saw this coming when the operation involves Goldman Sachs hehe:laugh:
     
  9. aequitasveritas

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    This is a good first step. The rock is rolling...lets hope it gathers moss
     
  10. Rivi

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    popcorn.gif
     
  11. zenman

    zenman Senior Member
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    Rolling moss will get you stoned...just saying.
     
  12. PsyDLICSW

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    At least someone is doing something. Is Argosy still sponsoring the APA conference this year? I heard somewhere on the forum that they are.
     
  13. futureapppsy2

    futureapppsy2 Assistant professor
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    Yep, they did. And they have an Argosy prof on the committee for addressing the internship crisis (granted, from one of the "better" Argosy campus, but still...).
     
  14. mperkel

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    :)
     
    #13 mperkel, Aug 14, 2011
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2012
  15. Lyra33

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    I definitely just posted this on Facebook. I am not surprised this finally happened. I'd heard that the APA was looking into revoking accreditation as well.
     
  16. 2012PhD

    2012PhD Psychology Resident

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    Argosy in orange county is still APA accredited despite only a 5% apa internship match rate. It looks like our ineffective government is advocating for our profession more than APA at this point...so sad.
     
  17. domineus

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    5% APA match rate...
    even Fielding has a better match rate...
     
  18. Lyra33

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    I had heard that Argosy's (one of their Chicago area campuses) 2010 APA visit didn't go so well and there was discussion about revoking their status. Not sure how true that is, but that's what I've heard from a few people recently.
     
  19. sunlioness

    sunlioness Fierce. Proud. Strong
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    Excellent! Now they also need to go after all of those "technical" for-profit schools whose television commercials dominate the afternoon hours (in between the commercials for disability and malpractice lawyers). I know more than one person who was strung along by false promises of support and job placement only now to be left with more insurmountable debt.
     
  20. Therapist4Chnge

    Therapist4Chnge Neuropsych Ninja Faculty
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    I have seen job descriptions for technical jobs that say people graduating from one of those technical programs will not be considered. It's a shame so many people rack up debt, though some of the accountability is on the person to do their due dilligence.
     
  21. sunlioness

    sunlioness Fierce. Proud. Strong
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    That's definitely true, and the credits gained at these schools don't transfer to anywhere reputable either. But I think these schools tend to effectively prey on people who are desperate and not savvy enough to do that sort of homework. I once knew of someone who went to a meeting with a recruiter from one of these local technical schools. She was interested in one field of study, but got told by this guy that she was a much better fit for a completely unrelated field of study. She had all kinds of other stuff going on in her life at that point, financial stressors, relationship stressors, etc. and probably wasn't in the best place to be starting school. Still they had no problem telling this person that she was a perfect fit for a career she had never previously considered and signing her up for educational loans. However when she missed classes to deal with all the other stuff, they were not supportive of this at all. It really made me ill to hear about it and was quite an education for me too.
     
    #20 sunlioness, Aug 18, 2011
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2011
  22. Therapist4Chnge

    Therapist4Chnge Neuropsych Ninja Faculty
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    My primary issue with the trend of "for profit" education is that it really skews the spirit of education in favor of economics. I know state universities and private colleges are not exempt from economic concerns, but the impetus for decision making is typically not "$-first". As a businesss that has shareholders, I understand the role of the board to want to maximizing profits. The endgame of business is money, not education.
     
  23. docjohng

    docjohng Founder & CEO, PsychCentral.com
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  24. sunlioness

    sunlioness Fierce. Proud. Strong
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    Ugh. That's really disheartening. I went to an Ivy League school for undergrad and really loved it. But it was a huge strain on my parents even then. I can't imagine how it must be today. I went back there a year or two ago just to wander around and a lot of things had changed. Back when I was there (in the mid-1990s) over half the dorms weren't wired for internet and now they have several flat screen TVs in the dining halls. Tuition is $10,000 higher per year now.

    Med school debt is bad, but at least it's still an in-demand and well-compensated profession. I honestly don't know how psychologists (funded programs aside), lawyers (the job market for lawyers right now is abysmal), social workers, etc. make it out from under the cost of their schooling and when you add undergraduate debt to that . . . Ugh. :(
     
  25. 2012PhD

    2012PhD Psychology Resident

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    Yeah, its crazy out there. The for profit PsyD/PhD graduates in psychology have it the worst, in my opinion. They take out 200K in loans, go to school for 6 years, and generally can't land an accredited internship or post-doc. Plus, nobody in our field takes the for profit school industry seriously. Clinical post-docs pay around 30K these days if they are lucky enough to land one. That's why we caution people against this route on this forum. Its a lose-lose situation. At least lawyers have a small chance to land a job in a law firm that pays 6 figures.
     
  26. Morsetlis

    Morsetlis I wish I were a dentist
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    I don't get it. Does the suit only apply to the four listed colleges, and what will the students (graduated) get out of it?
     
  27. Jon Snow

    Jon Snow Senior Member
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    “Student loan debt has become a macroeconomic factor; it affects the economy,” said Mark Kantrowitz, publisher of the financial aid website www.finaid.org. “Students who graduate with excessive debt are more likely to delay buying a car, buying a house, getting married, having children, saving for their retirement….They're spending less because they first have to tackle their student loan debt.”


    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/08/19/student-debt-americas-next-bubble/
     
  28. roubs

    roubs Ph.D. Student
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    The government is only suing Education Management Corporation and they are doing it to get their (aka, our, the taxpayer's) money back. From what I've read, students who graduated will get nothing back. This really isn't about fixing the problems of the past but rather inducing education companies to behave better in the future and to stop expanding the student loan bubble.
     
  29. sunlioness

    sunlioness Fierce. Proud. Strong
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    Well, one would hope that their debt accrued by attending one of these schools would be forgiven if the government got their money back directly.
     
  30. roubs

    roubs Ph.D. Student
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    Ha. The DOJ and the people who collect the loans are completely separate. I'd be shocked if anyone was forgiven as a result of this.
     
  31. 2012PhD

    2012PhD Psychology Resident

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    "A quarter of all federal student loan borrowers at for-profit colleges defaulted on their loans within three years of beginning to repay them--more than twice the rate of their counterparts at non-profit institutions, according to new data released today by the Department of Education.
    In addition, students taking out loans at for-profit schools were responsible for nearly half of all federal student loan defaults within the three-year timeframe, even though students enrolled at such institutions made up less than 15 percent of college students nationwide."
     
  32. DynamicDidactic

    DynamicDidactic Ass of Prof
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    However, between the 2 types of institutions there is a greater gap between repayment of loans. This may be a byproduct of the students that attend these school more so than the quality of the education (its probably a combination of both).
     

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