UCSF D4/Incoming Ortho Resident- Happy to answer any questions (Admissions/Dental School/Career)

[wilmosta]

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Hello,

I heard AADSAS is opening up tomorrow and just wanted to wish everyone good luck. With lots of free time right now due to shelter in place, I'd be more than happy to talk admissions/dentistry with y'all.

Feel free to ask me anything

 

[Dentalboithrowaway69]

How much debt are you in? what do you think about the rising cost of dental school?

 

[zdoq]

How is it living in San Francisco as a student? What are some of your favorite things about UCSF dental, and where are you headed for your Ortho residency?

 

[Aviat0r]

I have 1 LOR remaining from my science professor that said he will submit early august. If I submit my application without it, can I still receive secondary applications? I know in med school applications, you submit your LOR with you secondaries, so I was just wondering if dental school applications are the same thing

Thanks!

 

[wilmosta]

How much debt are you in? what do you think about the rising cost of dental school?

For dental school, fortunately, I'll come out with a bit less than 175k.

Having talked to multiple practicing clinicians in different specialties including GP, I am convinced that applicants should try to get into the most affordable school possible. Unless one has parents who are willing to help or will consider a military HPSP, I always try to steer people away from schools that are 400k or more.

 

[wilmosta]

How is it living in San Francisco as a student? What are some of your favorite things about UCSF dental, and where are you headed for your Ortho residency?

1. San Francisco is an interesting city to live in as a student. It's very diverse in almost all aspects, and there are lots of fun things to do, whether it's sports events, concerts, cool restaurants, nightlife...etc. The biggest downside to living in the city is the cost of living, as you probably know!

2. It's a P/F school so competitive vibes amongst peers are pretty much non-existant, at least in my eyes. One of the coolest aspects is that almost everyone tries to help each other out and knowledge is shared freely. Faculty, at least the ones I've worked with, are amazing teachers from all walks of life (private practice, academia, retired military...etc). The program seems to be didactically strong and people who are interested in specializing usually get to.

3. I'll be staying at UCSF for residency!

 

[MolarPower]

What are some things you did to help with your application for ortho?

What are tips you have for ortho interviews?

Did you do any externships?

Did you take the GRE if so what resources did you find helpful?

Ty for taking your time to answer questions

 

[wilmosta]

I have 1 LOR remaining from my science professor that said he will submit early august. If I submit my application without it, can I still receive secondary applications? I know in med school applications, you submit your LOR with you secondaries, so I was just wondering if dental school applications are the same thing

Thanks!

I asked my friend who works for UCSF admissions office and she said: "You receive your secondary applications on the centralized AADSAS app. So you can answer them all as you’re inputting the rest of the information. You must wait until the LOR comes in for you to submit your application."

Hope this helps, as AADSAS was slightly different back when I applied in 2015.

 

[ssm38]

If you don't mind me asking, how many ortho residencies did you apply to and how many interview invites did you get? If applicable, what was your class rank (or estimate)? What kind of questions did they ask at the residency interviews and what was the toughest? I'm looking at applying to ortho this cycle but I'm not sure how many to apply to.

 

[wilmosta]

What are some things you did to help with your application for ortho?

What are tips you have for ortho interviews?

Did you do any externships?

Did you take the GRE if so what resources did you find helpful?

Ty for taking your time to answer questions

Good questions:

1) I did a reasonable amount of research that luckily resulted in a first author publication. Other strengths of my application, imo, is a decent GRE score and a decent amount of teaching experience. I held a modest amount of board positions. Overall, I believe I had a well-rounded application but my strengths were research and teaching.

2) Ortho interviews are different for every school. My best tip for you is to contact upperclassmen who have interviewed at the programs you will be interviewing at, and asking for their experience. (DM me again when you get interviews and we can see if I interviewed at any of the programs you'll be visiting)

In general, be prepared to talk a lot. You'll be socializing almost the entire day, during resident social hours, tours, waiting around, and of course the interviews themselves. Formulate short and sweet answers to common questions like "Why ortho?" "Tell me about yourself." "Why should we choose you?"...etc.

3) I didn't do any externships, since I decided on ortho pretty late into the game (like late D3 year). Not sure if anyone at my school who applied ortho actually did any.

4) I took the GRE once, having studied for maybe 2-3 weeks with Macgoosh. Other resources I've heard people use include the manhattan 5lb book, but I think Macgoosh and youtube videos will suffice for the most part.

5) Happy to help

 

[wilmosta]

If you don't mind me asking, how many ortho residencies did you apply to and how many interview invites did you get? If applicable, what was your class rank (or estimate)? What kind of questions did they ask at the residency interviews and what was the toughest? I'm looking at applying to ortho this cycle but I'm not sure how many to apply to.

Definitely don't mind you asking.

I applied to 15 programs and got 6 interviews, 5 of which I actually attended.

I go to UCSF and it's a P/F program with no ranking to my knowledge (unless the dean has a secret list??? lol). I did get "honors" in some of my classes and part of the ADEA PASS app requires to get a "dean's LOR." I imagine that those "honors" and "commendations" would certainly make for a better dean's letter.

The questions range from the basic "Why Ortho" all the way to something super specific to your app like: "Teach me about singing in a minute" (I sing in an acapella group). Some programs may ask you to wire bend or answer hypothetical scenarios (some clinical some totally random).

By far the toughest question I can remember is one interviewer asking: "You are here with 3 other UCSF applicants. Tell me which one of you deserves a position the most and why."

If money isn't a problem, apply to as many programs as you can. I know people who applied to like 29+ programs and got more interviews than number of programs that I applied to haha.

If money is a concern, as it was in my case, I would recommend making a master list of all the available ortho programs and filtering them based on location, cost,...etc so you can figure out which programs you would realistically even go for.

 

[Dr. Li]

Just curious, is it possible to become a general dentist first, maybe work for 2 years and then apply for the ortho residency?

 

[2TH MVR]

Why did you choose Ortho?

 

[wilmosta]

Just curious, is it possible to become a general dentist first, maybe work for 2 years and then apply for the ortho residency?

Totally possible. Met plenty of residents/applicants while I was on the road interviewing who practiced first as GP.

 

[wilmosta]

Why did you choose Ortho?

Personal preference on the scope of practice I would like to do and longevity.

Your and Charlestweed's posts helped a lot while I was making my decision to apply last year. Thanks doc for sharing your knowledge and I look forward to your future posts. Hopefully ortho is still viable in the future

 

[2TH MVR]

Personal preference on the scope of practice I would like to do and longevity.

Your and Charlestweed's posts helped a lot while I was making my decision to apply last year. Thanks doc for sharing your knowledge and I look forward to your future posts. Hopefully ortho is still viable in the future

You'll do fine. Congrats on the acceptance.

 

[wannagiveup]

Is your dad an orthodontist?

 

[wilmosta]

Is your dad an orthodontist?

Nope. I'm the only person in my family doing dentistry.

 

[Dr. Smile]

Thank you for taking the time to answer our questions.

Can you share a bit on your clinical experience in terms of preparedness, competency and range of procedures at UCSF? Would you say UCSF offers plenty of opportunities (patient pool) to students to work with/ prepare them to be a GP?

 

[wilmosta]

Thank you for taking the time to answer our questions.

Can you share a bit on your clinical experience in terms of preparedness, competency and range of procedures at UCSF? Would you say UCSF offers plenty of opportunities (patient pool) to students to work with/ prepare them to be a GP?

Generally speaking, UCSF is big on basics. I think UCSF grads will be competent in the bread/butter of dentistry (operative, crown/bridge, diagnosis/treatment planning including perio). Beyond that, it's really up to each individual student to pursue the education they want. For example, some of my classmates who are interested in endo try to do lots of RCTs/pulpectomies, while others can graduate with minimal endo experience. Some who were interested in OS would go help the residents at SFGH or VA and end up doing more extractions than others. There's a perio clerkship for dental students to do crown lengthening surgeries..etc.

Since UCSF houses all the clinical dental specialty residencies in addition to predoc, you are taught (and often expected) to refer out the difficult cases to the post-graduate residents who are able to deliver better care. This probably contributes to why a substantial percentage of my class applied for specialty training or AEGD/GPRs.

FYI, I'm graduating this June, but I heard that the administration is changing the structure of how clinic runs (planned prior to COVID). So my experience will certainly differ from that of a future class. Also, it's unclear how long COVID will impact the patient pool and the practice of dentistry especially in dental schools, since the previous model of having 40-70 patients on one floor at the same time may not be possible until a resolution regarding COVID is reached.

 

[jirachi38]

Hi, I'm a D3 getting ready to apply to ortho. I'm also from a PNP school. I was wondering what your process was in selecting ortho residencies. Like applying to dental school, it's really hard to know what the schools are really like until you attend them. What kind of questions would you ask admissions/ residents? I know a lot of interviewees ask if they can complete a case (especially if it's only a 2 year program or less). What other questions would be good to ask?

Also, what would you have done differently if you were to apply again?

Thanks for your responses!

 

[wilmosta]

Hi, I'm a D3 getting ready to apply to ortho. I'm also from a PNP school. I was wondering what your process was in selecting ortho residencies. Like applying to dental school, it's really hard to know what the schools are really like until you attend them. What kind of questions would you ask admissions/ residents? I know a lot of interviewees ask if they can complete a case (especially if it's only a 2 year program or less). What other questions would be good to ask?

Also, what would you have done differently if you were to apply again?

Thanks for your responses!

In my mind, cost of the program is the main factor in selecting a program. Yes it is true that you won't know what programs are truly like until you attend them, but at the end of the day your debt will follow you well beyond graduation from ortho. When I made my list, I established a threshold of what I was willing to pay for an ortho residency. I didn't even bother to spend money for apps to programs like NYU, USC, UOP...etc because I know that I cannot afford to attend those programs in good conscience.

However, if money is not an issue for you, I may recommend to inquire and factor in the following:
1) How many cases do your residents start on average? (one of the few objective measures as to the clinical experience you may or may not get)
2) What's the work/life balance for residents in your program? (if it's something you care about)
3) How invested are the faculty in your education? (e.g. do they have an open door policy?)
4) How many cases do your residents get to finish on average? (as you mentioned above)
5) How many transfer cases do residents inherit? (additional experience)

Hope this helps!

 

[allsmiles098]

Hi, Im an incoming D2 wanting to apply to ortho. However, my gpa and rank are super low (4th quartile) and it's really discouraging me on my chances. Do you have any specific advice for students who fall very below average stats in order to improve chances?
I'm starting to get involved in some research and on a few exec boards of clubs at my school.
Also, not sure if true, but upperclassmen at my school mentioned that we should not apply to more than 15 schools as directors talk to each other and know if students apply to a lot.
Any advice or help would be greatly appreciated!!