UMDNJ to raise tuition 21%, main selling point is now: "Scenic Newark"

[plauto]

It also has many more restrictions than FedEx, which affects cost. They provide services in a wider area, by law, which is unprofitable. That's why it is partially funded.



Again, it's a problem of people not wanting to pay for it, and then complaining that they are running out of money. It's the oldest political trick in the book. Cut funding or don't fund it enough, and then slam the program. Hell, I know firsthand that this even happens at the local township level.

Frankly, I trust them more with it than I trust my insurance company. Just like I'd rather have police protection provided by the government through collective taxation than mercenaries hired by those who could pay. There are certain basic services that I think ought to be part of a modern society. All the other first world countries recognize this except us.

I've been in French hospitals - they're great too. The US doesn't have a monopoly on great care, and it's certainly not the only, or the best, way to provide care.

I agree with everything you say (except the French hospitals, I happened to be there a couple of times and I'd say it's a hit or miss situation). What I am trying to convey to you is that it's the government itself that cuts funding and destroys programs. It's the government itself that makes these systems run out of money. You seem to think that the government is some sort of "noble
institution" and politicians and people screw it up. Well, politicians and people are the government. That is why I will not trust them with my health. They'll stop funding the system after a couple of years and it will become crap. Personally, I am happy with my health insurance company. I'd like more people to be able to afford what I have. I don't want to trade it for something run by the same people who are undercutting every other program the government runs.

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Members don't see this ad.

 

[Ischemic]

Yea idiots who just want a status symbol..the rest worry about what the rest of the world worries about, job prospects and wages and returns on investments

You do know that becoming a doctor pretty much guarantees job security right. People will always be sick, ain't no way you're going to be out of the job unless you get into legal trouble. Concerning wages, doctors get paid a ****load. Even FM/psych/peds who get paid **** still get paid 100K+ (yeah I know about tax and reimbursements suck) but all the other specialties get paid even more than that. Hence, unless you don't live outside your means during residency, you should be able to live comfortably and have a return on your investment (unless you die early). I think these reasons alone and in these economic times people want to go into medicine.

 

[mybubbles14]

Yea well we didn't cause the deficit either and they don't have to tell us 2 weeks before school starts...we already have a high cost of living too not like in bumble**** VA or Illinois

Are u serious...does chicago not have a high cost of living? That's where the main campus is. I'm pretty sure Chicago is more expensive than Newark.

I don't even want to think about how much tuition is going to rise by the time I graduate , but I recognize that not everyone can live in texas and other state schools have ridiculous tuition as well. New Jersey isn't unique.

 

[HAART]

Are u serious...does chicago not have a high cost of living? That's where the main campus is. I'm pretty sure Chicago is more expensive than Newark.

I don't even want to think about how much tuition is going to rise by the time I graduate , but I recognize that not everyone can live in texas and other state schools have ridiculous tuition as well. New Jersey isn't unique.

http://www.city-data.com/city/Newark-New-Jersey.html
http://www.city-data.com/city/Chicago-Illinois.html

Average home in Newark 303k, Chicago 287k (I know, its counterintuitive, but NJ has ridiculously high property values)


A couple things: I originally stated that only two state schools have higher tuition than what UMDNJ's will be (33k was my guess - I actually don't know if that is accurate). People then responded with values of tuition + fees for other schools with lower tuitions than 33k (according to original source). I did not post the tuition plus fees for NJMS. However, I have learned from this thread that comparing at tuition on its own is pointless, as shown by the fact that the UC's have 0 tuition and 35k fees.

I didn't make this thread to say NJ has it worse than others (I've found a Schadenfreudian comfort in knowing others have crap deals), but I suppose in an equally juvenile manner just to rant about UMDNJ. A future physician shortage in NJ is well documented. How are you going to attract students to NJ med schools with similar tuition to private schools, worse facilities than private schools, while located in one of the worst cities in America?

And in response to the need to generate revenue in the bankrupt state, I agree that things like this must be done across the board. However, Christie has preached "shared sacrifice" and let all millionaires taxes expire (lowering taxes for the wealthy), while cutting funding across the board in the public sector resulting in thousands of jobs lost. The argument is give the rich more money because, when the rich buy BMW's they stimulate the economy, and when we fire teachers and police officers (increasing the unemployment rate) to give the rich money to create new businesses, they will employ people in these businesses, lowering the unemployment rate...right?

 

[HAART]

And if I may add to the lovely Newark stories already posted, there is a pizza place across the street from the med school where I got lunch every day the summer of 2007. For one week in 2008 I couldn't eat in that shopping center, because an off duty cop who was driving an armored van was making a drop of $2000 (perhaps at the BofA there?) - when he stepped out of the van he was shot in the head. I had to eat UMDNJ cafeteria food for a week while the shopping center was a crime scene. This occurred in broad daylight literally across the street from campus and from the main dorm for NJMS students.

 

[BigRedder]

It's a seller's market for medical schools. MD diplomas are in short supply, and demand is strong. There will always be people to fill those spots.

 

[Dr Love]

?

 

[theWUbear]

And if I may add to the lovely Newark stories already posted, there is a pizza place across the street from the med school where I got lunch every day the summer of 2007. For one week in 2008 I couldn't eat in that shopping center, because an off duty cop who was driving an armored van was making a drop of $2000 (perhaps at the BofA there?) - when he stepped out of the van he was shot in the head. I had to eat UMDNJ cafeteria food for a week while the shopping center was a crime scene. This occurred in broad daylight literally across the street from campus and from the main dorm for NJMS students.

.

 

[theWUbear]

You thought you had it bad. Try getting a gun pointed at you while you're in the car and stuck because you can't go back b/c cars are blocking you from behind and somehow a funeral procession decided you're getting in the way of their left hand turn during a red light. Gives a whole new meaning to Death at a Funeral, doesn't it? Yes, this is Newark at its finest at times.



But I still love it.

Wow, I've seen a drug deal, been bothered for change countless times, and been in some weird situations in Newark, but never had a gun pointed at me

 

[ArcGurren]

It's actually 18% for in-state and 21% for out of state residents, and this is happening pretty much across the board. And yeah we're all pissed about it (I go to UMDNJ).

I've never heard the scenic newark nonsense used as justification before though... most people pretty much accept it's because the state is slashing the budget for the place and they fell back on the tried and true option to make money off of--leeching it from the medical students (and thus indirectly from the federal government who funds our loans).

That being said Newark really isn't as bad as it used to be. The college town areas and the actual hospital are pretty safe, and there's been a legitimate effort by the mayor (Cory Booker) to clean up the streets and really blast down against organized crime/gangs. It's working pretty well so far. I've never had the crazy experiences that some people are talking about here though (like getting a gun pointed at you or robbed or w/e)... the worst I've seen is a street drug deal that I could see in any city whether it be Detroit or LA or NYC, and the occasional hobo asking for change. This is the case for most large cities anyway.

That being said the city could do with a facelift. It's drab as hell although the Ironbound area is nice. The school itself is pretty excellent and prepares you well for the boards.

 

[student1799]

At least your state schools take majority of residents from your state.. Freaking Pennsylvania sucks.. I think the only school in PA with majority state residents in TCMC while Penn State take majority OOS.. >/ It makes me so mad...

Penn State might be taking so many OOS purely for budgetary reasons--ie that state isn't subsidizing them enough to be mostly IS. Besides, PA has an unusual arrangement with PRIVATE schools in PA to subsidize the tuition of IS students. (So Temple et al have different IS/OOS tuition.) If a lot of IS are going private, there'll be more room at Penn State for OOS.
Vermont, where I go, is 75% OOS, but that's because the state has a tiny population. Unfortunately, VT gives them almost no subsidy: only about $10MM per year for the ENTIRE university, including the undergrads. So the whole operation is financed on the backs of the OOS students. Our tuition is around $50K while the locals are paying less than 30.

It's a great school with awesome facilities and so forth, but I wish VT would pay its fair share to run the place.

 

[tweek125]

Fist pump!!!!!!

 

[ArcGurren]

Fist pump!!!!!!

Lol thank god (or maybe unfortunately) I haven't found anyone resembling the JC cast here.

 

[theWUbear]

Two shot one killed two blocks from campus (broome and court)

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2010/12/three_men_are_killed_four_woun.html

 

[ilovelanguages]

Does anyone know if the tuition is going up a lot again this year?

 

[bobow98]

The finaid info did not indicate any info on this.

 

[Laryngophed]

What are you talking about? The government did a great job with Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, BMVs, and the Post Office. Not to mention the War on Drugs and the War on Poverty. I'm sure that in addition to all these successes we could add providing more people than possible with more health services than practically feasible, all while decreasing our budget deficit.

You are wise beyond your years.

 

[n3xa]

This is not a flattering photo.

 

[bobow98]

This is not a flattering photo.

It only looks that bad when it's rainy or snowy. They have cleaned it up more recently, this pic looks old. Hell, I was there on a rainy day 2 weeks ago and it looked about 5x better than this.

 

[toff4l]

This is not a flattering photo.

I pass the hospital on my way to work. It looks nicer than this. The run-down looking building is the medical sciences building and it doesn't look that bad in real life. The dorms, which are not in the picture but to the right, look very modern and the campus is clean.

 

[Donkeykiss]

During the UMDNJ tuition hearing, they said they're expecting it won't be as bad as last year and are going to try their best to make sure the percent raise is not in the double digits again.

ask real question how tuition revenue is appropriated? to school, between other schools, UMDNJ hospital and clinics as well as other enterprises

No individual bottom line is shown by school. Tuition has increased 100% since 2000. State budget cuts dont justify.

Plus they have increaed revenue by hosting st george kids at rotation sites and now overseeing their whole 3/4th year education. Thats not for free I'll tell you.

Increasing enrollment for every school in same period also decreases the operating cost of educating each student.

School had a state senator on salary at DO school and has fraud medicaid and had to pay that fine

education related revenue shouldnt fund a broke safenet UH hospital, thats the states job. Hospital runs an average $3 mill deficit

NJEFA, check out bond money too. Annual reports dont show what are educational building expenditures. These bonds, 260 mill in 09 could be going anywhere

And lockbox liens on state funds to pay bonds
see for self

http://www.bondsonline.com/Todays_Market/Credit_Rating_News_.php?DA=view&RID=2678

70% of umdnj portfolio has this odd lien that

see an older but more detailed budget, consolidated usually now and you cant get per school on consolidated now even

http://www.umdnj.edu/home2web/about/financial_03_04.pdf

9% tuition raise in 2004, 14% enrollment increase, net 11% more. How much was state education aid cut? 1% overall state cut noted

it was not the 15% of state aid last year across universities im sure, it was biggest ever recent history so I doubt 11% cut to be offset with 11% more revenue, same as they made in 2010 vs 2009 in tuition

Research activities bring in grants and contract money and consistently grows, state and government funding is rarely cut

They sell bonds to get capital and appears at same time or very close together purchase government and corporate bonds for investment, they pay high interest for use of their bond money and returns on government and corporate are worse. A government bond in 2009 has zero or no yield, while umdnj pays 7.47% on their NJEFA bond

school gets $30 bill a year in state funding some majority is unrestricted and can be used without oversight. Dont think for a second you arent getting a raw deal. what? 12 schools, 3 campuses, hospital, clinics, foundations that raise or give money, research centers

and only record pools all into general categories, and individual reports arent even out.

Ive only seen one consolidated one that just showed revenue, not expenditures and that schools last one was in 2007

if they dont show it you are getting screwed and they leave out info there a reason, no coincidences in life

 

[Donkeykiss]

ask real question how tuition revenue is appropriated? to school, between other schools, UMDNJ hospital and clinics as well as other enterprises

No individual bottom line is shown by school. Tuition has increased 100% since 2000. State budget cuts dont justify.

Plus they have increaed revenue by hosting st george kids at rotation sites and now overseeing their whole 3/4th year education. Thats not for free I'll tell you.

Increasing enrollment for every school in same period also decreases the operating cost of educating each student.

School had a state senator on salary at DO school and has fraud medicaid and had to pay that fine

education related revenue shouldnt fund a broke safenet UH hospital, thats the states job. Hospital runs an average $3 mill deficit

NJEFA, check out bond money too. Annual reports dont show what are educational building expenditures. These bonds, 260 mill in 09 could be going anywhere

And lockbox liens on state funds to pay bonds
see for self

http://www.bondsonline.com/Todays_Market/Credit_Rating_News_.php?DA=view&RID=2678

70% of umdnj portfolio has this odd lien that

see an older but more detailed budget, consolidated usually now and you cant get per school on consolidated now even

http://www.umdnj.edu/home2web/about/financial_03_04.pdf

9% tuition raise in 2004, 14% enrollment increase, net 11% more. How much was state education aid cut? 1% overall state cut noted

it was not the 15% of state aid last year across universities im sure, it was biggest ever recent history so I doubt 11% cut to be offset with 11% more revenue, same as they made in 2010 vs 2009 in tuition

Research activities bring in grants and contract money and consistently grows, state and government funding is rarely cut

They sell bonds to get capital and appears at same time or very close together purchase government and corporate bonds for investment, they pay high interest for use of their bond money and returns on government and corporate are worse. A government bond in 2009 has zero or no yield, while umdnj pays 7.47% on their NJEFA bond

school gets $30 bill a year in state funding some majority is unrestricted and can be used without oversight. Dont think for a second you arent getting a raw deal. what? 12 schools, 3 campuses, hospital, clinics, foundations that raise or give money, research centers

and only record pools all into general categories, and individual reports arent even out.

Ive only seen one consolidated one that just showed revenue, not expenditures and that schools last one was in 2007

if they dont show it you are getting screwed and they leave out info there a reason, no coincidences in life

difference in tuition vs private schools will be 8k probably 7k, at a certain point they can shove the subsidy up their ass

without med students and other grad students you lose tuition revenue, donations, state aid, state fringe benefits, as well as health insurance and other fees paid by students

without students you dont have faculty and you lose grant money adn researchers

you are then a community hospital and see what kind of other state aid and donations and funding they get

the hundred board directors, deans, presidents across umdnj can choke on it then

they make money off contracts for services for and from students and others. They sold their HMO for $10 million in 2004, was that used to offset any tuition hike? no

 

[Dartmouth2005]

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2010/07/umdnj_to_raise_tuition_21_perc.html

Thank you bankrupt New Jersey. Thank you budget cutter Chris Christie.

Tuition at New Jersey Medical School is now ~33k. This is comparable to the 40k+ that private schools cost.

The difference? My beloved NJMS has a library that looks like it hasn't been updated since the 1960's (save the addition of computers, that still show signs saying "please do not remove floppy disks from the library!"). There are mice in the library.

I'm pretty sure its the only medical school library that, due to funding cuts, CANNOT AFFORD TO BE OPEN ON SATURDAY. So they cut staff and ceased operation on Saturdays.

The main attraction remaining: beautiful, crime-infested, Newark. And I mean that in a tongue-in-cheek way, yes, but also seriously: a fantastic ER with lots of gunshot victims (I'm sure it makes for a great rotation!) and HIV rates off the charts leading to some great research being done.

/rant

Would you still recommend going to NJMS over a private school that costs around 42k (say, Temple)? Any of you have thoughts on this?

If true, I guess the NJ admins know that gradplus loans will cover the full the Cost of attendance including their new tuition hike. All the incentives are there for them to raise tuition as the feds will be covering the costs.

 

[Donkeykiss]

If true, I guess the NJ admins know that gradplus loans will cover the full the Cost of attendance including their new tuition hike. All the incentives are there for them to raise tuition as the feds will be covering the costs.

same as cali
http://keepcaliforniaspromise.org/4...tuition-to-wall-street-summary/comment-page-1

And you can see all public schools do it and plan on more: http://www.njefa.com/njefa/activity/recent/2009/

you think 200% tuition increase can be explained by state cuts and inflation alone in 10 years? with increased enrollment? They treat you like sheep when they telll you that


http://www.allbusiness.com/banking-finance/financial-markets-investing-securities/11804279-1.html

 

[Donkeykiss]

same as cali
http://keepcaliforniaspromise.org/4...tuition-to-wall-street-summary/comment-page-1

And you can see all public schools do it and plan on more: http://www.njefa.com/njefa/activity/recent/2009/

you think 200% tuition increase can be explained by state cuts and inflation alone in 10 years? with increased enrollment? They treat you like sheep when they telll you that


http://www.allbusiness.com/banking-finance/financial-markets-investing-securities/11804279-1.html

oh yea they can use fees and other money you pay for your education as collateral too, that reduces how much working capital they have so they charge more and gives them better bond rating and if you think all this money goes to the new building you dont need you are a bigger fool, if even used for that. Kickbacks galore or helping out friends or from the contract for what you use new bond money with

 

[Donkeykiss]

UMDNJ shows no budgets for each school and pretty clear they can move money around

Also a little convenient they turned an avg university hospital deficit of $22 mill a year from 2001-2008, not 3 sorry, more in 30s at end to evenish in 2009 and 2010, and positive in 2011

http://www.theuniversityhospital.com/about/minutes/UHBODminutes_4_28_10.pdf

despite paying $8 mill for medicaid fraud in same period and the burden of all the other hospitals closing. Just show me my schools budget and Id be happy or even a summary of all schools rather than grouping all UMDNJ together. Its the states jon to bailout UH not students tuition/fees/or bond money for educational buildings they got in 2009 with no documentation on how $26 mill was spent that wasnt to refund an old bond

its the states job to bailout UH not students, and at least the CEO if not others stand to make millions in bonuses on this turnaround, yet tre bookkeeping of education expenditures is not given

70% of umdnjs bond portfolio is lockbox

 

[Donkeykiss]

UMDNJ shows no budgets for each school and pretty clear they can move money around

Also a little convenient they turned an avg university hospital deficit of $22 mill a year from 2001-2008, not 3 sorry, more in 30s at end to evenish in 2009 and 2010, and positive in 2011

http://www.theuniversityhospital.com/about/minutes/UHBODminutes_4_28_10.pdf

despite paying $8 mill for medicaid fraud in same period and the burden of all the other hospitals closing. Just show me my schools budget and Id be happy or even a summary of all schools rather than grouping all UMDNJ together. Its the states jon to bailout UH not students tuition/fees/or bond money for educational buildings they got in 2009 with no documentation on how $26 mill was spent that wasnt to refund an old bond

its the states job to bailout UH not students, and at least the CEO if not others stand to make millions in bonuses on this turnaround, yet tre bookkeeping of education expenditures is not given

70% of umdnjs bond portfolio is lockbox

oh and every state school does it and a growing trend but when you allow bookkeeping with noneducational aspects in the corporate structure Id watch for fraud

these bonds are for educational buildings only

 

[FIREitUP]

At least you know the cadavers are fresh.

 

[RapplixGmed]

Any civil society is a pytamid scheme. The rich always contribute more than the poor in all services. The young pay for the old. The healthy pay for the sick in insurance pools.

That's sort of the point of a civil society.

The social security + medicare combo is a killer though. It has been estimated that couples going into these programs today will get a lifetime benefit of $1 million:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703864204576314802790577650.html

The only way this is sustainable is if we increase our population and our economic growth perpetually into the future. As soon as that stops, this will collapse. This is why we should be inviting every young person from mexico and asia to come to america. We need the youth in this country or we're screwed.

 

[Donkeykiss]

The linchpin


http://www.umdnj.edu/about/board/pdf/1_27_09_BOT_res.pdf

ssentially university hospital is broke and always in debt to state and others so they use a bond/loan thats for educational buildings only to wipe non education debt, state debt, debt for other clinical reasons, long list, and generic debt service fund. No wonder 2009 was first year in at least a decade that they broke even and positive cash flow in 2011 supposedly

This state debt includes $46 mill in medicaid, $8 of which is a fine for fraud, state forgives half, lets rest get paid back 2013-2028 so hospital gets better bottom line

To pay the woping 7.47% on the bond of $260 mill as well as paying other bonds with any revenue, inlcuding tuition/fees and use our state tution aid at least as collateral and some bank holds all this maybe without paying federally required interest on it

So thats $20 mill a year in interest? just on the one bond and they give us a line that its all about state cuts.

its not the students job to bailout the state and hospital through tuition

oh and any school with a hospital that owes debt to the state isnt far behind

they also buy state/city government as well as corporate bonds which I find odd when its got to be a lower rate

Only maybe $160 of 260 million education building only bond went to that reason, and that may have been trading a better rate for a crappy 7.47%

 

[Lokhtar]

its not the students job to bailout the state and hospital through tuition

It's funny that you think that. All med schools (and hospitals) are positively salivating at the free federally-paid-for pinatas otherwise known as medical students. They can raise their tuition to whatever they want and there'll be enough applicants that apply, and as long as they find the applicants (and finding applicants for med school isn't hard), the federal government will back them with unlimited loans. E.g, that's free federal money flowing into the state. You think anyone in the entire state will EVER refuse free federal money?

 

[Donkeykiss]

It's funny that you think that. All med schools (and hospitals) are positively salivating at the free federally-paid-for pinatas otherwise known as medical students. They can raise their tuition to whatever they want and there'll be enough applicants that apply, and as long as they find the applicants (and finding applicants for med school isn't hard), the federal government will back them with unlimited loans. E.g, that's free federal money flowing into the state. You think anyone in the entire state will EVER refuse free federal money?

uh thats not news to me but using bonds strictly for education buildings to pay medicaid fraud charge of $8million, and $15 more of medicaid debt, while the state forgives $23 since they get paid back too. Then this bonds interested is paid with student tuition/fees as part of all revenue and state aid to students, and all state funds have 1st lien by bondholders-$30 billion a yr to UMDNJ, is physically locked in a bank as collateral till bond owners get paid

This $260 million worth of bonds pays 7.47% rate, insane, and in the agreement they can take another $215 million to payoff healthcare debts

students told hike is cause state budget cut, next year budgets the same and we of course get one, thats meets legal definition of fraud

If you want to take further, what I said is all backed up before. but this I just believe, cause no coincidences in life:

other public colleges in nj and all in us use these education building bonds and at the same time they buy state/city government bonds, a way to kickback money to them from tuition I bet, and corporate, banks that buy their own school bonds.

Bonds with a fixed rate, as only public school converted their variable too on njefa, have a predicable payout of interest and return for ones bought so when they give annual report the bottom line ends evenish. they choose the amount, term, and then its rated by wall street based on that and who they are. its crazy bailing out states and hospitals with student money from loans they pay the federal government interest on,

much higher than the variable and all state/university/city/corporate bonds return, so they end up making money. the one umdnj is only one higher than 6.8 but still higher than plus loans, either way the fed is safe because the variable has been stuck at .25 or whatever since 2008, which they set. The exact same time njefa shows public school abandoning their variable rate bond

thats why fed gives studen loans now I bet and keep variable so low. You think theyd let these fixed loans ever get higher when they set the variable?

Its a way the fed government, and state/city/university, can tax students/fill their deficits/take a piece of students tuition. 6.8%, 7.9%? unsubsidized mostly, while they only worry about inflation and variable? how much money is that? you can go into bankruptcy for student loans which forgives debt on credit after 10 years, only way is die, do a government repayment, or IRB which is still like a tax of 15% for 25 years if you dont make too much

they wont lose on deal, not a coincidence that fed does this at same time variable lowest ever and set by them since 2008 this low.

 

[Donkeykiss]

uh thats not news to me but using bonds strictly for education buildings to pay medicaid fraud charge of $8million, and $15 more of medicaid debt, while the state forgives $23 since they get paid back too. Then this bonds interested is paid with student tuition/fees as part of all revenue and state aid to students, and all state funds have 1st lien by bondholders-$30 billion a yr to UMDNJ, is physically locked in a bank as collateral till bond owners get paid

This $260 million worth of bonds pays 7.47% rate, insane, and in the agreement they can take another $215 million to payoff healthcare debts

students told hike is cause state budget cut, next year budgets the same and we of course get one, thats meets legal definition of fraud

If you want to take further, what I said is all backed up before. but this I just believe, cause no coincidences in life:

other public colleges in nj and all in us use these education building bonds and at the same time they buy state/city government bonds, a way to kickback money to them from tuition I bet, and corporate, banks that buy their own school bonds.

Bonds with a fixed rate, as only public school converted their variable too on njefa, have a predicable payout of interest and return for ones bought so when they give annual report the bottom line ends evenish. they choose the amount, term, and then its rated by wall street based on that and who they are. its crazy bailing out states and hospitals with student money from loans they pay the federal government interest on,

much higher than the variable and all state/university/city/corporate bonds return, so they end up making money. the one umdnj is only one higher than 6.8 but still higher than plus loans, either way the fed is safe because the variable has been stuck at .25 or whatever since 2008, which they set. The exact same time njefa shows public school abandoning their variable rate bond

thats why fed gives studen loans now I bet and keep variable so low. You think theyd let these fixed loans ever get higher when they set the variable?

Its a way the fed government, and state/city/university, can tax students/fill their deficits/take a piece of students tuition. 6.8%, 7.9%? unsubsidized mostly, while they only worry about inflation and variable? how much money is that? you can go into bankruptcy for student loans which forgives debt on credit after 10 years, only way is die, do a government repayment, or IRB which is still like a tax of 15% for 25 years if you dont make too much

they wont lose on deal, not a coincidence that fed does this at same time variable lowest ever and set by them since 2008 this low.

ok heres how it works
http://www.quickanded.com/2010/03/senator-lamar-alexander-is-making-things-up.html

the fed borrows at 2.8% and gives it to us at 6.8%, and after all the money for administering, which should be simple and electronic now, supposedly it gives some pell grants, only undergrad, and money to schools to improve grad rates, as they all hike tuition.

Hmm How about giving to us at 3% and that will help?

I'm pretty sure 4% of whatever billion that is has a very small percent going to pell grants and when they give it to schools that use to pay medicaid debt and healthcare costs, we are again being frauded. or maybe the school just goes and buys state and city bonds to bail them out

 

[Donkeykiss]

ok heres how it works
http://www.quickanded.com/2010/03/senator-lamar-alexander-is-making-things-up.html

the fed borrows at 2.8% and gives it to us at 6.8%, and after all the money for administering, which should be simple and electronic now, supposedly it gives some pell grants, only undergrad, and money to schools to improve grad rates, as they all hike tuition.

Hmm How about giving to us at 3% and that will help?

I'm pretty sure 4% of whatever billion that is has a very small percent going to pell grants and when they give it to schools that use to pay medicaid debt and healthcare costs, we are again being frauded. or maybe the school just goes and buys state and city bonds to bail them out

so 4-6 billion the fed will make in interest each year off these loans and every year for most likely 20-30 years, avg time to pay off, every year you add another 4-6 billion, 10 billion a year 2, 15 year 3, 20 year 4, 25 year 5 and so on till maybe year 15 when some frugal people pay off, most likely year 20 or 25 when IRB forgives debt but in IRB the fed takes 10% of your income at least to pay debt, 15% till 2014 and 25 years to forgive till then

the cost to run and to pell grants and schools I bet is not even 1 billion

http://politicalcalculations.blogspot.com/2011/01/contribution-of-student-loans-to-us.html

public schools bail out state and ciity government with bonds at the same time

 

[Donkeykiss]

so 4-6 billion the fed will make in interest each year off these loans and every year for most likely 20-30 years, avg time to pay off, every year you add another 4-6 billion, 10 billion a year 2, 15 year 3, 20 year 4, 25 year 5 and so on till maybe year 15 when some frugal people pay off, most likely year 20 or 25 when IRB forgives debt but in IRB the fed takes 10% of your income at least to pay debt, 15% till 2014 and 25 years to forgive till then

the cost to run and to pell grants and schools I bet is not even 1 billion

http://politicalcalculations.blogspot.com/2011/01/contribution-of-student-loans-to-us.html

public schools bail out state and ciity government with bonds at the same time

they are looking to cut loan subsidy as well

so if you round to $100 bill a year, 5-10 for pell, and say only 7% avg rate, 4.2% profit. because you have 7.9% plus loans too. And Ill give the government that each kid pays back in 20 years, and I'm only counting 4 years in grad or college where its collecting interest where most have college, then grad and another 6 months of "grace" where it collects interest, so 24 total years its paid

That means, get your own amortization calculator, for every $100 billion a year it makes almost $160 billion. $60 billion profit on each year it distributes, probably ends up 75 billion with subsidy cuts and more 7.9 plus loans. as tuition rises it wont be 20 years to pay back. thats why no pressure to stop tuition hikes

plus unlike if you had a private variable rate now you couldnt consolidate at these, unsurprisingly, great, and steady, rates the treasury or whatever fed sets, you are always stuck paying 6.8 or 7.9% and the best you can do is spread it out to 20- 25 years in irb post college/grad interest build up

 

[Donkeykiss]

they are looking to cut loan subsidy as well

so if you round to $100 bill a year, 5-10 for pell, and say only 7% avg rate, 4.2% profit. because you have 7.9% plus loans too. And Ill give the government that each kid pays back in 20 years, and I'm only counting 4 years in grad or college where its collecting interest where most have college, then grad and another 6 months of "grace" where it collects interest, so 24 total years its paid

That means, get your own amortization calculator, for every $100 billion a year it makes almost $160 billion. $60 billion profit on each year it distributes, probably ends up 75 billion with subsidy cuts and more 7.9 plus loans. as tuition rises it wont be 20 years to pay back. thats why no pressure to stop tuition hikes

plus unlike if you had a private variable rate now you couldnt consolidate at these, unsurprisingly, great, and steady, rates the treasury or whatever fed sets, you are always stuck paying 6.8 or 7.9% and the best you can do is spread it out to 20- 25 years in irb post college/grad interest build up

they could eliminate the $13 trill deficit in 160 years but I doubt that goes down, we just get a tax on school loans now to go along with everything else

 

[Donkeykiss]

http://articles.latimes.com/2010/jan/30/nation/la-na-pell-grants30-2010jan30

only $8.5 billion of 65-75 billion profit is to pell grant a year, they say 16 but if you do by hand thats what i get, either way they make out like bandits at as usual

the fed could just the same give those and every other student 2.8-3% rates and guarantee those like they already do and no one would still be left out for the worst investment ever

oh and it teaches kid fiscal responsibility without raping them with interest at a young age, they would get a taste for a prime rate and watch their credit to keep it

something us education doesnt do

 

[Donkeykiss]

well i guess i was i just the idiot, but did you realize this? and its happening in your state too

http://www.umdnj.edu/about/board/pdf/1_27_09_BOT_res.pdf

it appears the bond from njefa that says on site for education only building, student related, pays for bonds and loans owed by state/city/healthcare facilities:

Child health institute, just clinical, in new brunswick
george st redevelopment assoc, new brunswick city certificate of obligation bond?
university behavioral health building
International center for public health development, in newark research center for vaccines
2 bonds for general operating expenses of umdnj
1989 cops bond, newark obligation?
2000 Economic development authority bond, a newark city obligation?

so if reading right money owed by newark/new brunswick/and umdnjs clinical buildings and general operating expenses

as well as state medicaid debt, and that $8 mill fraud charge in there, is forgiven for doing this

our education related revenue then pays, as it always did for other umdnj hospital debts, but state funds for tuition used as collateral and now it looks like city government debts are paid by our tuition/fees as well from this

i think other public schools here and other states are bailing out healthcare/state/city governments in a similar manner. All very manipulated by the low treasury rate set by fed since 2008 and the economic downfall

state aid has nothing to do with tuition rises, as we are giving them the aid