Univ of Michigan or UPenn???

[shindrome]

so here's another post seeking help choosing one or the other.

which would be a better pick...University of Michigan or UPenn?

i'm a born and raised california resident. after visiting both schools i was highly impressed. based on the information provided at each school, the estimated annual total cost (tuition, books, housing...etc) for Michigan and UPenn is $73,000 and $83,000, respectively.

any opinions? any helpful insights would be appreciated.

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[bcdds09]

Being an Ivy and all, I'm assuming a majority of people on SDN would choose Penn. But honestly, that's really tough. I've been accepted at both Penn and Michigan but I to attend my state school instead. If I had to choose though, I would go to Michigan. I think living in Ann Arbor would be awesome, and people just seemed more down to earth there.

 

[TeamGuo]

can't go wrong with either. Do a coin toss.

 

[whlee84]

if the costs are similar, then definitely UPenn! Phillie is a surprisingly diverse, fun city, and you just can't beat UPenn's campus and atmosphere! of course, if you love football and freezing cold weather, go to michigan

 

[TeamGuo]

if the costs are similar, then definitely UPenn! Phillie is a surprisingly diverse, fun city, and you just can't beat UPenn's campus and atmosphere! of course, if you love football and freezing cold weather, go to michigan

I love your extremely biased opinion.

 

[doc3232]

Can you get Michigan residency after the first year?

Were will you be happy location-wise?

 

[glk2101]

if the costs are similar, then definitely UPenn! Phillie is a surprisingly diverse, fun city, and you just can't beat UPenn's campus and atmosphere! of course, if you love football and freezing cold weather, go to michigan

penn has quite a football team also

 

[dentstd]

My vote's for Michigan. Strong reputation, cheaper price tag.

 

[peterngu]

penn has quite a football team also

I think you're thinking of Penn State football, with the eternal Joe Paterno. Can't think of any ivy league schools with respectable football programs.

 

[bcdds09]

I think you're thinking of Penn State football, with the eternal Joe Paterno. Can't think of any ivy league schools with respectable football programs.

Not totally true. Wasn't ESPN going on and on about how there were more players from Brown(?) than from USC representing at the Super Bowl this year? (I think they were kickers though ).

 

[Jimmy Choo]

I think you're thinking of Penn State football, with the eternal Joe Paterno. Can't think of any ivy league schools with respectable football programs.

I think he was being sarcastic since a lot of people mistake UPenn for Penn State?

I don't know much about Michigan but I was impressed with UPenn when I interviewed there. Besides a lot of those Wharton boys looked so yummy!

 

[shindrome]

location wise, i think i'll be happy in either. being from a suburban upbringing, ann arbor seems to reflect where i'm from better. of course, i loved philly too. it's a big city without as much of the big city feel as per say new york. plus, the area of town upenn is located in is a bit quieter.

since they're both not THAT different in price, which school would yield better education/training/memories/friends? i know it's a very broad question.

in the dental world, does one or the other have a better rep than the other?

 

[PSU SHC 414]

I love your extremely biased opinion.

if you've read whlee's previous posts, you shouldn't be surprised... he's back in true form!

 

[daves85]

I would go to Mich. It is slightly cheaper than UPenn, but in addition, i've heard that it's a great school! It's more well-rounded than UPenn. So as far as research/didactics/clinicals, I would go to UMich. However, if you feel more comfortable at Philly, by all means, go to UPenn.

 

[whlee84]

The guy is asking for advice, and I gave my opinion. Let's not talk about biased or whatever, I'm just saying my opinion. It's a win-win situation for either school, but with costs similar, UPenn has a better reputation, more research opportunities, more networking possibilities, and Phillie (in my opinion) is a better location to spend the next 4 years of your life. hop on the bus and you're in NYC or D.C. in 1.5 hours

once again, both are great schools, so choose whichever you want to spend the next 4 years of your life.

 

[zorie]

The guy is asking for advice, and I gave my opinion. Let's not talk about biased or whatever, I'm just saying my opinion. It's a win-win situation for either school, but with costs similar, UPenn has a better reputation, more research opportunities, more networking possibilities, and Phillie (in my opinion) is a better location to spend the next 4 years of your life. hop on the bus and you're in NYC or D.C. in 1.5 hours

once again, both are great schools, so choose whichever you want to spend the next 4 years of your life.

I'm pretty sure Michigan is only second to UCSF in NIH grants, and UPenn isn't even top five to my knowledge.

To the OP: I've only interviewed at Michigan, so I can't say too much about UPenn, but I hope this helps.

Michigan is further north and I used to live there so I can say that yes, it's really cold sometimes, but it's a great college town and it has a lot of diversity. Also, I've heard from some UMich grads that there's a lot of interaction between the various grad programs and you end up making a lot of friends amongst the med and graduate phd students. When I was there for my interview they told us that you're assisting in clinics right away and it seemed like they had a really strong clinical program. It's known for research but our tour guide didn't do any and she didn't really even talk about it that much, only when someone asked. She said it was something you could get involved in if you wanted, but not a must by any means. UMich is known as a university for the strength of its science programs, though, and that definitely seemed like the case for the dental school as well. Their didactic seemed very difficult, but I think if you're prepping for boards that that'd probably be a plus. And no, you probably can't get in-state tuition after the first year. Check out their residency website. It's very...long.

That being said, I know a girl at Penn who loves it there. UPenn was her top choice and she loves the program. I don't like Philly the city very much myself, but in terms of the program nothing's lacking.

 

[TeamGuo]

The guy is asking for advice, and I gave my opinion. Let's not talk about biased or whatever, I'm just saying my opinion. It's a win-win situation for either school, but with costs similar, UPenn has a better reputation, more research opportunities, more networking possibilities, and Phillie (in my opinion) is a better location to spend the next 4 years of your life. hop on the bus and you're in NYC or D.C. in 1.5 hours

once again, both are great schools, so choose whichever you want to spend the next 4 years of your life.

stating your opinions are fine but make sure you have some backbone for the facts that you state because you sound like a ***** when you don't.
And who told you these facts??? the dean of UPENN?

 

[peterngu]

stating your opinions are fine but make sure you have some backbone for the facts that you state because you sound like a ***** when you don't.
And who told you these facts??? the dean of UPENN?

Guo, if you were to change your status to "dental student" even though you haven't attended a single class yet like whlee, you too will gain wisdom that seems to come out of something resembling an anus.

 

[nydds25]

stating your opinions are fine but make sure you have some backbone for the facts that you state because you sound like a ***** when you don't.
And who told you these facts??? the dean of UPENN?

Someone a few posts up said to go to Mich because "It's more well-rounded than UPenn. So as far as research/didactics/clinicals, I would go to UMich"... without any of these facts you wanted. Yet you didn't attack him... you only attacked the person saying the exact same thing in support for UPenn.

You lost all credibility.

 

[TeamGuo]

Someone a few posts up said to go to Mich because "It's more well-rounded than UPenn. So as far as research/didactics/clinicals, I would go to UMich"... without any of these facts you wanted. Yet you didn't attack him... you only attacked the person saying the exact same thing in support for UPenn.

You lost all credibility.

I didn't even catch that. My intentions were not to say that one school is better than the other. Both are great schools in my opinion, I just didn't like the distasteful statement that was made by Whlee, flat out saying PENN's program is just better at everything.

No need to pick fights.

 

[Hysteria24]

I'm pretty sure Michigan is only second to UCSF in NIH grants, and UPenn isn't even top five to my knowledge.

http://www.nidcr.nih.gov/GrantsAndF...talSchools/GrantstoDentalInstitutions2008.htm

1. UCSF
2. Michigan
.
.
.
.
25. UPenn

 

[nydds25]

http://www.nidcr.nih.gov/GrantsAndF...talSchools/GrantstoDentalInstitutions2008.htm

1. UCSF
2. Michigan
.
.
.
.
25. UPenn

I would not base school funding strictly on NIH money.

UPenn is among the leaders in private donations only behind Stanford, Harvard, and Yale (this is data available on internet). Mich is not on the top 10 list and the difference between the top of the top 10 list and the bottom of the top 10 is hundreds of millions... whereas nih grants is 20 million or so difference.

NIH is just one source of money. There plenty of private donors and Ivy league schools have no shortage of them.

 

[dentstd]

NIH is just one source of money. There plenty of private donors and Ivy league schools have no shortage of them.

It's the single most important source. Lots of time, it's make or break in terms of whether you can finance your experiments. The NSF may be the second, but I'm not sure.

 

[shindrome]

hey everyone, no need to get upset with each other. of course if i asked for opinions on each school there will be, inevitably, some bias. i appreciate the advice so far though.

upon looking at the numbers closely they provided at the interview, the living costs stood out. the living costs at michigan for 10 months is $21,025 according their paperwork. for one year at upenn they claim to be about $14,000.

it sorta seems upenn is underestimating their numbers. as i've said, michigan is cheaper by 10k annually based on the numbers each school gave. but with this possibility of the gap being a bit larger, it's definitely something to consider.

just food for thought i guess. thanks for the opinions so far!

 

[mlletoof08]

Hey shindrome, I am in the same boat as you! I am concerned about the chair situation for both schools. I am aware that UPenn has fewer chairs than students and I am unsure about UMich. Are there enough chairs for all the students? I think the UMich tour guide mentioned that the D3 and D4 share the same chair but does anybody know if the two classes have clinic at the same time? Thanks!

 

[zorie]

Hey shindrome, I am in the same boat as you! I am concerned about the chair situation for both schools. I am aware that UPenn has fewer chairs than students and I am unsure about UMich. Are there enough chairs for all the students? I think the UMich tour guide mentioned that the D3 and D4 share the same chair but does anybody know if the two classes have clinic at the same time? Thanks!

The D3 and D4 classes, from what I remember, don't have a problem sharing. The presenter and the student giving the tour both said that there wasn't a problem. They did some stats on this, apparently, based on student feedback or something.

 

[nydds25]

Hey shindrome, I am in the same boat as you! I am concerned about the chair situation for both schools. I am aware that UPenn has fewer chairs than students and I am unsure about UMich. Are there enough chairs for all the students? I think the UMich tour guide mentioned that the D3 and D4 share the same chair but does anybody know if the two classes have clinic at the same time? Thanks!

At penn they work in mini groups with d3's and d4's combined. Groups operate differently, but in most cases D4's always get their own chair and d3's have to share and occasionally search for an open one. The students said that patient disappointment rate is high, so chairs are always available. In the 4th year when you do most work though, you will always have one available.

 

[whlee84]

it's perfectly natural to be biased toward your own school. TeamGuo, ur attending michigan so you have a bias, and I'm attending UPenn so I have a bias.

Having said that, there's a reason why UPenn ranks top 5 in all major graduate schools. I know dental schools aren't ranked, but how can anyone say that Michigan has a BETTER reputation than UPenn?!?? that is absolutely ridiculous and naive. how can anyone say you get more research opportunities at Michigan than at UPenn?? UPenn is second to none behind Harvard in ANY research in this world, especially in the medical field. And have you checked the specialization rates of Michigan vs. UPenn? it's not even close.

However, I'm not saying these factors should be the main reasons you should choose one school over another. In the end, you will become a dentist no matter what. It's all about where you want to live the next 4 years of your life and which school will give you the best opportunity to accomplish your career goals...good luck with your decision

 

[TeamGuo]

it's perfectly natural to be biased toward your own school. TeamGuo, ur attending michigan so you have a bias, and I'm attending UPenn so I have a bias.

Having said that, there's a reason why UPenn ranks top 5 in all major graduate schools. I know dental schools aren't ranked, but how can anyone say that Michigan has a BETTER reputation than UPenn?!?? that is absolutely ridiculous and naive. how can anyone say you get more research opportunities at Michigan than at UPenn?? UPenn is second to none behind Harvard in ANY research in this world, especially in the medical field. And have you checked the specialization rates of Michigan vs. UPenn? it's not even close.

However, I'm not saying these factors should be the main reasons you should choose one school over another. In the end, you will become a dentist no matter what. It's all about where you want to live the next 4 years of your life and which school will give you the best opportunity to accomplish your career goals...good luck with your decision

You are awesome.

 

[MLT1234]

for one year at upenn they claim to be about $14,000.

The living costs for Upenn is definitely underestimated. I lived in a 1BR apt last year on Upenn's campus. Rent alone was $1300/month, not including any utilities.

 

[whlee84]

for one year at upenn they claim to be about $14,000.

The living costs for Upenn is definitely underestimated. I lived in a 1BR apt last year on Upenn's campus. Rent alone was $1300/month, not including any utilities.

Well, $1300 is pretty ridiculous to spend per month by yourself. UPenn is estimating a $700-800 per month rent, not a $1300. why didn't you get a studio or share a 2BR? Those are easily $700-800 per month just minutes off campus.

 

[dentstd]

Having said that, there's a reason why UPenn ranks top 5 in all major graduate schools. I know dental schools aren't ranked, but how can anyone say that Michigan has a BETTER reputation than UPenn?!?? that is absolutely ridiculous and naive. how can anyone say you get more research opportunities at Michigan than at UPenn?? UPenn is second to none behind Harvard in ANY research in this world, especially in the medical field. And have you checked the specialization rates of Michigan vs. UPenn? it's not even close.

However, I'm not saying these factors should be the main reasons you should choose one school over another. In the end, you will become a dentist no matter what. It's all about where you want to live the next 4 years of your life and which school will give you the best opportunity to accomplish your career goals...good luck with your decision

Penn has a stronger name than Michigan, but that's not to say that it has better research. In reality, Penn has weaker research when compared to the other giants in the field. It hasn't been cranking out as much quality research as we would think for a school with such a notorious name. (That's not to say that it has poor research. Just not as good as we think.)

Michigan's one of the strongest forces in the research world. There's no doubt about that. There's actually a good chance it overtakes Penn in that arena. You'd just have to get over the Penn status before you realize that.

FYI, NIH grants don't take into account a school's name. It does take into account the quality of research certain labs have done in the past. There's a reason why Michigan's number 2.

 

[dent2009]

Penn has a stronger name than Michigan, but that's not to say that it has better research. In reality, Penn has weaker research when compared to the other giants in the field. It hasn't been cranking out as much quality research as we would think for a school with such a notorious name. (That's not to say that it has poor research. Just not as good as we think.)

Michigan's one of the strongest forces in the research world. There's no doubt about that. There's actually a good chance it overtakes Penn in that arena. You'd just have to get over the Penn status before you realize that.

FYI, NIH grants don't take into account a school's name. It does take into account the quality of research certain labs have done in the past. There's a reason why Michigan's number 2.

 

[PSU SHC 414]

Well, $1300 is pretty ridiculous to spend per month by yourself. UPenn is estimating a $700-800 per month rent, not a $1300. why didn't you get a studio or share a 2BR? Those are easily $700-800 per month just minutes off campus.

whlee84 -

You are so incredibly naive... I'm leaving it at that since I'm tired of wasting time trying to refute your blatant idiocy. I'll just say this - I lived right around the corner from the D school one summer, and I have a lot of friends that are in some of the various grad programs at Penn - good luck finding a decent place near Penn for $700-800 (if you want your own room).

Of course Penn is going to low-ball the living expense figure they give you... their tuition/fees alone is already insanely high... if they gave you realistic figures, no one in their right mind would go there without a scholarship (or some rich ass parents/relatives).

And for the sake of everyone on these forums, change your damn status back to "Pre-Dental"... you haven't attended a single minute of D school yet, you pompous ass.

I know personal attacks are "against the rules" on these forums, but I'll bluntly say that I'm starting to sincerely detest you... if the rest of the Penn C/O 2013 is like you, I'm SO glad that I've decided not to go there.

 

[TeamGuo]

whlee84 -

You are so incredibly naive... I'm leaving it at that since I'm tired of wasting time trying to refute your blatant idiocy. I'll just say this - I lived right around the corner from the D school one summer, and I have a lot of friends that are in some of the various grad programs at Penn - good luck finding a decent place near Penn for $700-800 (if you want your own room)...

And for the sake of everyone on these forums, change your damn status back to "Pre-Dental"... you haven't attended a single minute of D school yet, you pompous ass.

I know personal attacks are "against the rules" on these forums, but I'll bluntly say that I'm starting to sincerely detest you... if the rest of the Penn C/O 2013 is like you, I'm SO glad that I've decided not to go there.

I guess we think alike.... lol thanks for writing what I was just about to write.

whlee I hope you don't run for class president....

 

[whlee84]

You are so incredibly naive... I'm leaving it at that since I'm tired of wasting time trying to refute your blatant idiocy. I'll just say this - I lived right around the corner from the D school one summer, and I have a lot of friends that are in some of the various grad programs at Penn - good luck finding a decent place near Penn for $700-800 (if you want your own room)...

And for the sake of everyone on these forums, change your damn status back to "Pre-Dental"... you haven't attended a single minute of D school yet, you pompous ass.

I know personal attacks are "against the rules" on these forums, but I'll bluntly say that I'm starting to sincerely detest you... if the rest of the Penn C/O 2013 is like you, I'm SO glad that I've decided not to go there.

uh, well wise-guy...i'm going down to phillie tomorrow to sign a lease at a brand new apartment building 5 minute walk from the dental school. the price? $1600 for 2BR, $800 per person including all utilities. who are YOU to tell me that my research on housing is wrong?? still don't believe you don't have to spend $1300 per month to have your own room? here is just a BRIEF list of apartments within 10 minute walk from the dental school that currently has $700-800 rooms, either studios or shared 2BR's. please do some research before talking smack about someone...

chestnut hall
hub
wallnut hill
Sprucewood
Spruce Hall
The Berkshire
Surrey Hall
Sylvia Arms
Pine hall
chestnut arms

 

[PSU SHC 414]

uh, well wise-guy...i'm going down to phillie tomorrow to sign a lease at a brand new apartment building 5 minute walk from the dental school. the price? $1600 for 2BR, $800 per person including all utilities. who are YOU to tell me that my research on housing is wrong?? still don't believe you don't have to spend $1300 per month to have your own room? here is just a BRIEF list of apartments within 10 minute walk from the dental school that currently has $700-800 rooms, either studios or shared 2BR's. please do some research before talking smack about someone...

chestnut hall
hub
wallnut hill
Sprucewood
Spruce Hall
The Berkshire
Surrey Hall
Sylvia Arms
Pine hall
chestnut arms

i stand corrected... my apologies, sir. you're right that i didn't do research for apartments at a school that i don't plan to attend, and that i jumped the gun by basing my statement on my past experiences and those of my friends. you're clearly much wiser for having been able to find a place near Penn at that price... then again, you're GOING TO PENN

i still stand by what i said in the rest of my post.

and before you get to the philadelphia area, get it right. "philly" is an abbreviated reference to the city of philadelphia. "phillie(s)" is (1) the name of the philadelphia sports team that is the reigning world champion of major league baseball , (2) the first name of the beloved green mascot of the aforementioned team.

 

[zorie]

i stand corrected... my apologies, sir. you're right that i didn't do research for apartments at a school that i don't plan to attend, and that i jumped the gun by basing my statement on my past experiences and those of my friends. you're clearly much wiser for having been able to find a place near Penn at that price... then again, you're GOING TO PENN

i still stand by what i said in the rest of my post.

and before you get to the philadelphia area, get it right. "philly" is an abbreviated reference to the city of philadelphia. "phillie(s)" is (1) the name of the philadelphia sports team that is the reigning world champion of major league baseball , (2) the first name of the beloved green mascot of the aforementioned team.

Thank you! I thought I was going nuts when I saw people spelling it as "phillie" all over SDN.

 

[dent2009]

this Whlee guy still has lots to learn...esp. the fact that UPENN dental doesn't live up to the level of hype that he believes it to have...

i stand corrected... my apologies, sir. you're right that i didn't do research for apartments at a school that i don't plan to attend, and that i jumped the gun by basing my statement on my past experiences and those of my friends. you're clearly much wiser for having been able to find a place near Penn at that price... then again, you're GOING TO PENN

i still stand by what i said in the rest of my post.

and before you get to the philadelphia area, get it right. "philly" is an abbreviated reference to the city of philadelphia. "phillie(s)" is (1) the name of the philadelphia sports team that is the reigning world champion of major league baseball , (2) the first name of the beloved green mascot of the aforementioned team.

 

[whlee84]

this Whlee guy still has lots to learn...esp. the fact that UPENN dental doesn't live up to the level of hype that he believes it to have...

There's no one else on this forum who advocates his/her school more than I do. Is it wrong for me to say only good things about my school? Is it wrong for me to have such passion for your dream school? I would certainly hope that other students out there love their schools as much as I love mine, and have the same passion for advocating their schools as much as I do...

Some of you still can't even decide on where to attend...at least I did, and I wouldn't change my decision over anything. Chill out on the negative comments about what I say about my own school. If you don't think your school is the best school in the world, there's something seriously wrong with your decision to attend that school.

 

[PSU SHC 414]

There's no one else on this forum who advocates his/her school more than I do. Is it wrong for me to say only good things about my school? Is it wrong for me to have such passion for your dream school? I would certainly hope that other students out there love their schools as much as I love mine, and have the same passion for advocating their schools as much as I do...

Some of you still can't even decide on where to attend...at least I did, and I wouldn't change my decision over anything. Chill out on the negative comments about what I say about my own school. If you don't think your school is the best school in the world, there's something seriously wrong with your decision to attend that school.

Your enthusiasm for Penn is admirable, but the advice and mostly unsubstantiated info that you're spreading about Penn's "greatness" to all the PRE-dents that are still trying to make a CALCULATED decision IS NOT ("calculated" is in caps, because I truly don't believe that you did the same with your decision since you've obviously been brainwashed by the Ivy league status of Penn from the start... I'm clearly not you though, nor do I want to be, so I could be completely mistaken again... no need to state the obvious in your reponse to this post. A lot of other people on SDN seem to share the same sentiments, so I know I'm not completely off-base with my comments). I swear this has to be about the 10th time I've made this EXACT point to you, and you still don't seem to get it.

Some people, such as myself, who "still can't even decide where to attend" are taking such a long time because we're putting very serious and legitimate thought (like talking to current students and instructors at the various schools, revisiting the schools, etc. - so that we can get the FACTS about each school) into a significant monetary and educational investment. We've decided not to buy into a school just because of its Ivy league association - nearly every post you make in favor of Penn seems as if you're trying to justify your decision to yourself and that you're hoping people on SDN will reaffirm your decision. You make that comment as if we should be ashamed to be taking such a long time to make such an important decision. How the hell are you supposed to be so insanely enthusiastic about your school WHEN YOU HAVEN'T EVEN SPENT A MINUTE AS A STUDENT THERE YET.

If you were standing face-to-face with me right now, I think I'd be resisting the urge to smack you across the head...

 

[imeddie]

Having said that, there's a reason why UPenn ranks top 5 in all major graduate schools. I know dental schools aren't ranked, but how can anyone say that Michigan has a BETTER reputation than UPenn?!?? that is absolutely ridiculous and naive. how can anyone say you get more research opportunities at Michigan than at UPenn?? UPenn is second to none behind Harvard in ANY research in this world, especially in the medical field. And have you checked the specialization rates of Michigan vs. UPenn? it's not even close.

I'm pretty sure Michigan has more top ranked graduate programs than Upenn.

 

[whlee84]

I'm pretty sure Michigan has more top ranked graduate programs than Upenn.

Once again, do your research before you post a ridiculous comment like this...Here are the major graduate school 2008 rankings:

Business: UPenn #3, Michigan #12
Law: UPenn #7, Michigan #9
Medical: UPenn #4, Michigan #11

 

[zorie]

Once again, do your research before you post a ridiculous comment like this...Here are the major graduate school 2008 rankings:

Business: UPenn #3, Michigan #12
Law: UPenn #7, Michigan #9
Medical: UPenn #4, Michigan #11

Ok. We get it. UPenn is amazing. RELAX. Stats like these likely aren't helping the OP, who is trying to make a serious decision - probably not based on the business or law school, or any one person's personal opinion.

 

[bcdds09]

To the OP,

Do you even want to do research? Because if you don't, all these numbers and rankings about research funding are not very useful. Because you mentioned that the costs are similar (which they are), as others have posted, go where you believe you fit in best, as well as where you think you'll excel as a dental student. What is a perfect fit for someone (whlee and Penn) is not necessary going to be a perfect fit for you. A comfortable learning environment seems crucial for success in dental school. At which school did you feel you fit in best or most comfortable? Do you like sporting events?

I'm not sure if you want to specialize either, but what whlee is saying about specialization rates being higher at Penn is somewhat misleading. Although I don't know too much about either school, I'm assuming that many students that attend Penn have the goal of specializing, whereas maybe not so many at Michigan (total speculation). At least that's the case at my state school.

 

[imeddie]

Once again, do your research before you post a ridiculous comment like this...Here are the major graduate school 2008 rankings:

Business: UPenn #3, Michigan #12
Law: UPenn #7, Michigan #9
Medical: UPenn #4, Michigan #11

Engineering: Michigan #9, Upenn #30
Education: Michigan #9, Upenn #10
Sciences:
Biological Sciences: Michigan 15, Upenn #21
Chemistry: Michigan #16, Upenn #20
Computer Science: Michigan #13, Upenn #20
Earth Sciences: Michigan #5, Upenn #67
Mathematics: Michigan #9, Upenn #18
Physics: Michigan #13, Upenn #13
Library and Info studies: Michigan #5, Upenn #not listed
Public Affairs: Michigan #7, Upenn, #41
Fine Arts: Michigan #37, Upenn #45
Social Sciences:
Economics: Michigan #11, Upenn #9
English: Michigan #12, Upenn #10
History: Michigan #7, Upenn #13
Political Science: Michigan #3, Upenn #29
Psychology: Michigan #2, Upenn #16
Sociology: Michigan #3, Upenn #10
Health:
Healthcare Mgmt: Michigan #1, Upenn #4
Nursing: Michigan #5, Upenn #3

etc, etc....check US News Best graduate school rankings for more.
http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/grad

"With more than 70% of UM's 200 major programs, departments, and schools ranked in the top 10 in the United States,[77]" -wikipedia "university of michigan"

gg

 

[whlee84]

If you read carefully, I was specifically talking about the MAJOR graduate programs, a.k.a. business, law, medicine.

Anyway, these rankings and stats do not matter to the op. He was just asking for some advice on each school, but this thread beat the topic to dead lol. Once again, good luck with your decision and you really can't go wrong with either school

 

[shindrome]

To the OP,

Do you even want to do research? Because if you don't, all these numbers and rankings about research funding are not very useful. Because you mentioned that the costs are similar (which they are), as others have posted, go where you believe you fit in best, as well as where you think you'll excel as a dental student. What is a perfect fit for someone (whlee and Penn) is not necessary going to be a perfect fit for you. A comfortable learning environment seems crucial for success in dental school. At which school did you feel you fit in best or most comfortable? Do you like sporting events?

I'm not sure if you want to specialize either, but what whlee is saying about specialization rates being higher at Penn is somewhat misleading. Although I don't know too much about either school, I'm assuming that many students that attend Penn have the goal of specializing, whereas maybe not so many at Michigan (total speculation). At least that's the case at my state school.

thanks for redirecting the conversation! as another person mentioned, i'm just trying to collect as much info and feedback as possible to make the best and most thought out decision possible before committing to a school.

at michigan they claimed that they have high rates of specialization and of course that's something i'm interested in as well. interestingly at penn, they provide paperwork showing the directions recent graduates went, including specialization. that was impressive.

i'm really torn between both. philly is so close to major cities and it seems like a lot of fun. michigan has sports (love college football), cheaper rent and cost of living, more space. i have tons of research experience but i'm not quite sure i'll go back to it again. quality of research therefore will not affect my decision. debt is a concern and i think it's obvious which school will rack up more debt. a more quiet and suburban setting might better for me because there will be less distractions. but, will i get bored of having too little distractions or is there enough to do in ann arbor to keep me busy?

perhaps anyone that went to michigan for undergrad can shed some light on this matter?

 

[imeddie]

If you've read carefully, I only said that there are more top ranked graduate programs. n00b.

 

[hattrack04]

thanks for redirecting the conversation! as another person mentioned, i'm just trying to collect as much info and feedback as possible to make the best and most thought out decision possible before committing to a school.

at michigan they claimed that they have high rates of specialization and of course that's something i'm interested in as well. interestingly at penn, they provide paperwork showing the directions recent graduates went, including specialization. that was impressive.

i'm really torn between both. philly is so close to major cities and it seems like a lot of fun. michigan has sports (love college football), cheaper rent and cost of living, more space. i have tons of research experience but i'm not quite sure i'll go back to it again. quality of research therefore will not affect my decision. debt is a concern and i think it's obvious which school will rack up more debt. a more quiet and suburban setting might better for me because there will be less distractions. but, will i get bored of having too little distractions or is there enough to do in ann arbor to keep me busy?

perhaps anyone that went to michigan for undergrad can shed some light on this matter?

I loved Michigan as an undergrad. But that was undergrad. I can't say whether or not I would have liked coming to Michigan as a grad student (after attending a different undergraduate institution). But as far as getting bored, I highly doubt it. There is plenty to do in Ann Arbor. Football Saturday's were some of the best experiences of my life (as an undergrad). But I could imagine it to be a lot of fun as a grad student as well. There are plenty of bars, restaurants, etc to keep you entertained. It's nowhere near the size of Philly obviously, but it definitely does not have the feeling of a suburban town either.

When you go to dental school, you will be doing A LOT of dental school, especially during your first two years. I recommend choosing a school based on whether or not you think you'll enjoy the atmosphere of the school, and not so much the surrounding city, because most of your time is spent at school. Good luck and Go Blue.