University of Utah School of Medicine

[lis79]

Hi Guys!
I have not seen many people post about Utah. I felt we should start a thread. If you have been accepted or still waiting to hear, please post. I hope to see you guys this August!

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[MedicineBird]

Hi Guys!
I have not seen many people post about Utah. I felt we should start a thread. If you have been accepted or still waiting to hear, please post. I hope to see you guys this August!

we all know I've been accepted -- haven't stopped talking about it since I got the December letter. You may not get too many hits on this thread though becasue I don't think they'll be sending out the majority of acceptances for another few weeks. Can't wait to meet my future class mates.

 

[FMGP8P]

I'm still waiting to hear. It sure would be nice to get in as I was very impressed with the school, especially their facilities.

 

[lis79]

I'm still waiting to hear. It sure would be nice to get in as I was very impressed with the school, especially their facilities.

I wish the best of luck FMGP8P!
When did you interview?

 

[MedicineBird]

I'm still waiting to hear. It sure would be nice to get in as I was very impressed with the school, especially their facilities.

Braaaaand new building just for us!

 

[FMGP8P]

I wish the best of luck FMGP8P!
When did you interview?

Thanks
Last week of January. How bout you?

 

[lis79]

Thanks
Last week of January. How bout you?

First week of January. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you.

 

[FMGP8P]

First week of January. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you.

Same here

 

[bqj]

i just talked to a friend who got rejected last week. that was the first rejection i've heard of. i guess it's at good sign for the rest of us. the bad news hasn't come yet....

 

[MedicineBird]

i just talked to a friend who got rejected last week. that was the first rejection i've heard of. i guess it's at good sign for the rest of us. the bad news hasn't come yet....

chin up bqj -- I don't see a fat lady and I don't hear any singing. My fingers and toes and eyes are still crossed for you.

 

[japhy]

your friend got outright rejected? that is bizarre.

in the past, the u has admitted roughly 40% of the class before april. everyone else, including those that get rejected, don't hear anything until the second week of april.

i wonder if they have changed the process this year?

lis and medicine - from what i can tell, you are going to have a great class next year!

 

[dura]

I think things have changed this year. I think they have admitted only out of state applications to date and I think they will send out admissions between the last week of March and the first week of April.

 

[fisher]

I am glad people are talking about utah. I am waiting patiently for the first week in April too. It would be a great place for me to attend. Good luck all.

 

[MedicineBird]

I think you will hear the last week of March because there is an orientation on April 8th with a deadline to RSVP of April 4th. When I RSVP'd I asked how many students they expected and the response was, "Everyone!"

 

[MedicineBird]

I think things have changed this year. I think they have admitted only out of state applications to date and I think they will send out admissions between the last week of March and the first week of April.

sounds reasonable

 

[tcrex2000]

I interviewed there on January 20th and I'm still waiting to hear. I live in SLC, too, in case that makes a difference. Good luck everyone.

 

[MedicineBird]

I interviewed there on January 20th and I'm still waiting to hear. I live in SLC, too, in case that makes a difference. Good luck everyone.

Welcome to the club. I hope you will hear some good news soon. Sounds like they are stringing the Utah applicants along on a long nail-biting ride.

 

[Sarikate]

You all sound so nice. I want to go to Utah. Too bad I didn't apply this year. Maybe next year! I want to live in the desert.

 

[stanMD]

Hi Guys!
I have not seen many people post about Utah. I felt we should start a thread. If you have been accepted or still waiting to hear, please post. I hope to see you guys this August!

That's because no one gets into Utah. We all HAVE to leave Utah because were white, mormon and male. I can't get accepted into my state school, but I CAN get into Stanford...please explain?

Now when I think back on it, I laugh. I cant stand the U. Good luck to all of you. Wish you well.

 

[FMGP8P]

i just talked to a friend who got rejected last week. that was the first rejection i've heard of. i guess it's at good sign for the rest of us. the bad news hasn't come yet....

I remember Dr. Samuelson saying at the interview that they were going to reject some applicants right away. When did your friend interview?

 

[dura]

That's because no one gets into Utah. We all HAVE to leave Utah because were white, mormon and male. I can't get accepted into my state school, but I CAN get into Stanford...please explain?

Now when I think back on it, I laugh. I cant stand the U. Good luck to all of you. Wish you well.

To explain: ya'll bring to the pot something that is only unique outside of Utah. I have lived back East and jhave attended two of the best Ivy league schools, and I think the same thing about Utah mormons. . .only got into Harvard because he/she was from Utah (diversity child)--works for you and against you. I think the 'for yous' (you got into stanford) outweighs the 'against yous' (had to go out of state, big deal). In the end what really matters is you . . .you will become the doctor you were meant to be regardless of what school you go to.

Also, can't tell you how many conversations I have had with people frustrated with the competition of top ten schools. It's the same frustration I felt in undergrad. You are graded on a curve but adcomms don't note that your curved against the best and the brightest. So, it's easier to be top 10% at a less competitive school. Just my honest opinion.

 

[MedicineBird]

That's because no one gets into Utah. We all HAVE to leave Utah because were white, mormon and male. I can't get accepted into my state school, but I CAN get into Stanford...please explain?

Now when I think back on it, I laugh. I cant stand the U. Good luck to all of you. Wish you well.

Suprising post considering your signature. Try spending some serious time in a fake 'n' bake and change your name to Muhammad.

 

[patzan]

To explain: ya'll bring to the pot something that is only unique outside of Utah. I have lived back East and jhave attended two of the best Ivy league schools, and I think the same thing about Utah mormons. . .only got into Harvard because he/she was from Utah (diversity child)--works for you and against you. I think the 'for yous' (you got into stanford) outweighs the 'against yous' (had to go out of state, big deal). In the end what really matters is you . . .you will become the doctor you were meant to be regardless of what school you go to.

Also, can't tell you how many conversations I have had with people frustrated with the competition of top ten schools. It's the same frustration I felt in undergrad. You are graded on a curve but adcomms don't note that your curved against the best and the brightest. So, it's easier to be top 10% at a less competitive school. Just my honest opinion.

The difference between Utah and top 10 schools is that top schools are forthright about their requirements for admission. Utah gives a list of eight criteria with which they supposedly select their class. MCAT/GPA is one of these, but their entering class has an average MCAT the same as that of the applicant pool - the same as can be expected by choosing a random group of students. You would expect higher stats in the entering class if they had used this as a selection factor.

Looking at a cross-section of the class, these are not the top scholars, most prepared for medical school, or the most experienced. Instead, they are the "most likely to attend" and seemingly just random people. My qualm with Utah is not that they choose the type of people that they do, but that they do not use their stated criteria to choose them.

 

[MedicineBird]

My qualm with Utah is not that they choose the type of people that they do, but that they do not use their stated criteria to choose them.

I really don't want to have this become a flame fest but..

what makes you think that? Is this the sentiment of a rejected applicant? Every school is exactly the same. Talk to the folks in the UW thread. There are plenty of brilliantly qualified folks who are strung along in a competetive pool for 5+ months and get rejected. That's why this whole process is called a crapshoot.They say up front that MCAT/GPA only count for 20% of your overall score. It just seems that they are interested in different things in their student body. I found that they were quite strict about their criteria. You have to exceed (they say meet or exceed) the average scores in the 8 criteria in order to be accepted and on top of that, you have to be socially adept. I don't see why the angst at Utah for a practice a ton of other schools go along with.

 

[patzan]

I really don't want to have this become a flame fest but..

what makes you think that? Is this the sentiment of a rejected applicant? Every school is exactly the same. Talk to the folks in the UW thread. There are plenty of brilliantly qualified folks who are strung along in a competetive pool for 5+ months and get rejected. That's why this whole process is called a crapshoot.They say up front that MCAT/GPA only count for 20% of your overall score. It just seems that they are interested in different things in their student body. I found that they were quite strict about their criteria. You have to exceed (they say meet or exceed) the average scores in the 8 criteria in order to be accepted and on top of that, you have to be socially adept. I don't see why the angst at Utah for a practice a ton of other schools go along with.

I built my resume, beginning my freshman year, around Utah's requirements. I kept a list of them and conscientiously worked on each of them. I did well on the MCAT and graduated cum laude. I had six great letters, two years of quality research, three years clinical experience, extensive church, local, and university leadership and got the boot. Utah was the only school where I interviewed that I didn't get in.

 

[MedicineBird]

I built my resume, beginning my freshman year, around Utah's requirements. I kept a list of them and conscientiously worked on each of them. I did well on the MCAT and graduated cum laude. I had six great letters, two years of quality research, three years clinical experience, extensive church, local, and university leadership and got the boot. Utah was the only school where I interviewed that I didn't get in.

sorry about that -- I know ther are thousands of applicants with similar stories. Maybe they thought you were too cookie cutter-esque. Dunno -- either way you are in somewhere, so what does it matter?

 

[japhy]

To explain: ya'll bring to the pot something that is only unique outside of Utah. I have lived back East and have attended two of the best Ivy league schools, and I think the same thing about Utah mormons. . .only got into Harvard because he/she was from Utah (diversity child)--works for you and against you. I think the 'for yous' (you got into stanford) outweighs the 'against yous' (had to go out of state, big deal). In the end what really matters is you . . .you will become the doctor you were meant to be regardless of what school you go to.

thank god somebody pointed this out. i am sorry, but if you are a white male applicant to utah, you look exactly like the majority of the applicants. you can't fault the school, it is the lack of diversity in the state from which the pool is drawn.

that being said, i know everyone on the interview committee this year. they all put a lot of extra time and energy into this process. lots of candidates look good on paper, but once interviewed the candidate's lack of dedication to medicine becomes apparent. i heard several times that the quality that was being sought was "insight." i take this to mean, insight into one's decision to enter medicine and insight into one's self.

i find it so ridiculous that people think that once they meet the school's minimum requirements that somehow they should be an auto-admit. how arrogant does one have to be? every school has more qualified applicants than can possibly be admitted.

 

[patzan]

thank god somebody pointed this out. i am sorry, but if you are a white male applicant to utah, you look exactly like the majority of the applicants. you can't fault the school, it is the lack of diversity in the state from which the pool is drawn.

The school needs to work on drawing in diversity, not artificially creating it. If the school has 350 white LDS male applicants and 100 non-such, their student body should not be 50/50. This is a hot topic on all Utah campuses, within the committee, and in the state legislature.

that being said, i know everyone on the interview committee this year. they all put a lot of extra time and energy into this process. lots of candidates look good on paper, but once interviewed the candidate's lack of dedication to medicine becomes apparent. i heard several times that the quality that was being sought was "insight." i take this to mean, insight into one's decision to enter medicine and insight into one's self.

"Insight" and intentions to go into medicine, as based on one interviewer's subjectivity should not be the deciding factor, trumping years of work and preparation, which I believe are more reflective of a student's preparation and dedication to medicine.

i find it so ridiculous that people think that once they meet the school's minimum requirements that somehow they should be an auto-admit. how arrogant does one have to be? every school has more qualified applicants than can possibly be admitted.

These students that are being rejected are not just meeting minimum requirements, but are well-published, proven leaders, and, yes, socially adept. I'm not speaking of myself, per se, but this has been the general consensus of students from many years.

If there are so many qualified applicants, why don't they pick more qualified ones? Of the friends I had through class, leadership, etc., these are some of the places they ended up (after being rejected from Utah):

University of Washington
Ohio State University (several X)
Johns Hopkins University
Yale University
USC
Texas-Southwestern
UVa
SUNY - Upstate

Tell me all of these schools were looking for underqualified applicants with no clear ambition or dedication to medicine in addition to being socially inept.

 

[patzan]

One more thing...my favorite quote from a U of U Med School professor/MD, PhD:

"Med students at the University of Utah might be able to sit down and have a conversation with their patients, but they can't figure out what the hell is wrong with them!"

 

[japhy]

you know as well as i do that the decision to admit or not is made by a committee. both of the interviewers have input, but it does not override one's application. i never once claimed that you are not well qualified. from what you claim, you are an excellent candidate, and i am sorry that you won't be at the u next year.

you claimed earlier that the mcat scores are the same for applicants and matriculants - last i checked that wasn't the case. you also stated that there are 8 factors the school evaluates; grades and scores are (and should be) part of the equation, but not the whole package. we don't want med school turning into law school now, do we?

http://uuhsc.utah.edu/som/admissions/demographics.html

i don't understand what you meant by "The school needs to work on drawing in diversity, not artificially creating it. If the school has 350 white LDS male applicants and 100 non-such, their student body should not be 50/50."

how does the school draw in diversity without first creating it? seriously...

and i love how your world view is lds males and 'non-such'. what a telling categorization. anyway, my class was nowhere near 50/50. 85% white, 65% male, 60-70% lds. honestly, is that not enough for you?

 

[stanMD]

I agree Patzan. With all due respect to those from out of state attending the U, may I submit that the situation at Utah is very much different from what you have experienced at home. Ask a Utah resident in your class about the medical school's reputation within the state. Most of you aren't familiar with the state legislature's investigation into the medical school’s admission practices a couple of years ago. (Search SL Tribune, circa 2003). A senator's son, and years later, grandson were denied spots at the U with impeccable CVs, etc. The son went on to somewhere like Dartmouth and the grandson to Yale. I know everyone thinks there state school has questionable admissions policies, but I really do believe the U is on another level with regards to AA and admissions. It's unfortunate, but today many well-qualified Utah resident applicants don’t even apply if they find themselves within those 3 parameters I mentioned above.

I'm not trying to speak unkindly of the U med school, please don't misunderstand me. I mean no disrespect to the hard work some of you have made to gain admissions at a great school. I am simply pointing out that there are many disenfranchised applicants to the University that curiously end up in, shall we say, more highly regarded institutions and there is nothing else to explain it.

Oh... and to add to patzan's list of the overqualified and disenfranchised of whom I know personally:

My cousin: 39 MCAT, well-rounded athlete, 252 USMLE I, currently in ENT in California.
My friend from high school: 36 MCAT, Valedictorian- BYU, George Washington Med.
My friend from LDS hospital: incredible undergrad CV, #1 in his class at Tulane Med, Ortho resident at Mayo Clinic.
An practicing physician at LDS hospital: after begging for a spot after 1st denial, was denied twice by the U, entered Columbia Med, incredible doc.

Common denominator: male, mormon, white. All applied… all denied… no good reason.

 

[bqj]

I remember Dr. Samuelson saying at the interview that they were going to reject some applicants right away. When did your friend interview?

I want to say he interviewed in December and got rejected on 03/07.

 

[MedicineBird]

I agree Patzan. With all due respect to those from out of state attending the U, may I submit that the situation at Utah is very much different from what you have experienced at home. Ask a Utah resident in your class about the medical school's reputation within the state. Most of you aren't familiar with the state legislature's investigation into the medical school’s admission practices a couple of years ago. (Search SL Tribune, circa 2003). A senator's son, and years later, grandson were denied spots at the U with impeccable CVs, etc. The son went on to somewhere like Dartmouth and the grandson to Yale. I know everyone thinks there state school has questionable admissions policies, but I really do believe the U is on another level with regards to AA and admissions. It's unfortunate, but today many well-qualified Utah resident applicants don’t even apply if they find themselves within those 3 parameters I mentioned above.

I'm not trying to speak unkindly of the U med school, please don't misunderstand me. I mean no disrespect to the hard work some of you have made to gain admissions at a great school. I am simply pointing out that there are many disenfranchised applicants to the University that curiously end up in, shall we say, more highly regarded institutions and there is nothing else to explain it.

Oh... and to add to patzan's list of the overqualified and disenfranchised of whom I know personally:

My cousin: 39 MCAT, well-rounded athlete, 252 USMLE I, currently in ENT in California.
My friend from high school: 36 MCAT, Valedictorian- BYU, George Washington Med.
My friend from LDS hospital: incredible undergrad CV, #1 in his class at Tulane Med, Ortho resident at Mayo Clinic.
An practicing physician at LDS hospital: after begging for a spot after 1st denial, was denied twice by the U, entered Columbia Med, incredible doc.

Common denominator: male, mormon, white. All applied… all denied… no good reason.

I am familiar with the investigations. I think you are being narrow minded to think this only occurs at the U. How about the great re-applicants that wind up going to DO school? Far be it from you or any other person to decide what any admissions committee should be looking for in candidates. How about offering your congratulations to those of us who are happy with our acceptance and taking your bitterness elsewhere. That means you, too, patzan. Don't rain on our parade just because you've been rejected. Take your Ivy leage acceptances and be happy with them. Good grief.

 

[Sarikate]

You rock my world, MediBirdy

 

[japhy]

i am still VERY happy for you medicinebird! and you too lis!

no one has answered my question though - do you seriously think the class should be more than 85% white, 65% male and 65% mormon? stan, patzan... i am waiting... how is this taking AA to another level? if that were the case wouldn't the class be closer to 50/50 male/female and a much higher percentage of minority students?

 

[dura]

I remember those investigations going on in Utah. My father told me about it and I laughed--are you serious? (he also sent me along an article from Brigham Young admonishing women to seek medical training, not men). I discussed this with my friends at Harvard and Brown and both found it strange that white males were taking to court a medical school only trying to meet the national standards of diversity of class. Namely, women should be 50% of the class because 50% of the population are women. And Utah is no where near national averages on minority enrollment. These are national standards that all schools strive to acheive (even geographical diversity)--even Stanford does this--they want diversity, hence they are stuck with you--you stacked up better than your peer group in Utah in Stanford's eyes, congrats. I read the committee report responsible for the investigation while applying to the U. and it states that there was nothing wrong with Utah's admissions policies, they had a few suggestions, but overall it is more equitible than most other schools and it was meeting criteria's of state agencies and national bodies. So quit the crying I sure hope I don't run into a lot of you in Utah. Have a little class too--it's embarrassing.

You focus on your grades and MCAT--if you would open your mind and take in truth you would realize that it has nothing to do with your rejection. You compete against your peers. SO, someone with the same GPA and MCAT that was white, male, and from a Utah school stacked up better than you. I may be not be admitted on the same grounds and I know it--this is life. You say you (sob, sob) prepared for this application for years before. Well, you should have seen this coming then and focused not only on your education but also your emotional preparedness. I have (as has everyone for crying out loud) have worked hard to gain admissions to the U. so knowing your handicap, how did you make yourself unique? You have to step up your game.

 

[dura]

Let's move past this issue. . .anyone accepted yet that was in state? Just curious.

 

[MedicineBird]

You're a babe, Dura

 

[MedicineBird]

i am still VERY happy for you medicinebird! and you too lis!

no one has answered my question though - do you seriously think the class should be more than 85% white, 65% male and 65% mormon? stan, patzan... i am waiting... how is this taking AA to another level? if that were the case wouldn't the class be closer to 50/50 male/female and a much higher percentage of minority students?

Thanks Japhy. Can't wait to meet you on the slopes.

 

[patzan]

Let's move past this issue. . .anyone accepted yet that was in state? Just curious.

First let me make a bunch of sweeping generalizations and negative remarks about you before you change the subject. :roll eyes:

BTW: You couldn't figure out why we wouldn't respond to your questions between 11 pm and 7 am?

 

[Loco Loki]

Heh, anyone here know about their MD/Phd program results? I'm biting me nails I am; out of state applicant, but not a URM. They let anyone apply for the md/phd spaces, and I was there around feb 14.

 

[japhy]

i guess what confuses me is that very well qualified candidates get rejected from lots of schools. i have never been able to understand the bitterness that students have towards the u.

i was rejected at several schools ranked lower than utah. does this mean those schools have nefarious admissions policies? no. does it mean they discriminate against white males? no. it just means i wasn't the right student for that school at that time. why is this so hard for students to understand. sure, students may get rejected from utah and get into yale. what's the problem?

 

[patzan]

i guess what confuses me is that very well qualified candidates get rejected from lots of schools. i have never been able to understand the bitterness that students have towards the u.

i was rejected at several schools ranked lower than utah. does this mean those schools have nefarious admissions policies? no. does it mean they discriminate against white males? no. it just means i wasn't the right student for that school at that time. why is this so hard for students to understand. sure, students may get rejected from utah and get into yale. what's the problem?

The problem is that it is rampant and calculated. Did you read the audit report? I don't remember the statistics, but getting in as a minority or female was something like 4X easier than if you were white male. Perhaps the "problem" is getting better, but there is a strong history of having 28% female applicants and 45% female entering class. It is not uncommon for qualified applicants to be rejected from mediocre schools occasionally, but when it can be predicted with near certainty, it's a problem.

 

[patzan]

And the gender/race thing isn't even my main complaint. My problem is in not choosing even the most qualified white males. I was a TA for several classes and nearly went to the admissions committee when I heard that they had admitted one of my students because he/she was undoubtedly the WORST student in my class! I believe he/she got a C (and lucky to get that)!I'm happy with my class of Harvard 4.0s instead of UVSC 3.1s.

 

[MedicineBird]

And the gender/race thing isn't even my main complaint. My problem is in not choosing even the most qualified white males. I was a TA for several classes and nearly went to the admissions committee when I heard that they had admitted one of my students because he/she was undoubtedly the WORST student in my class! I believe he/she got a C (and lucky to get that)!I'm happy with my class of Harvard 4.0s instead of UVSC 3.1s.

It always amazes me that educated people can be such ..... aaarrrrggghhh!! You may be in a class of 4.0's but your reading comprehension skills suck. Let me break it down for you: high grades and MCAT, formulaic EC's, and being an eagle scout who saved a small Brazillian town from killer ants does not equal most qualified. It is not that cut and dried. They want something else, something more intangible. Accept it and move on. The more you rant the more it becomes crystal clear to me why you were passed over.

 

[MedicineBird]

Heh, anyone here know about their MD/Phd program results? I'm biting me nails I am; out of state applicant, but not a URM. They let anyone apply for the md/phd spaces, and I was there around feb 14.

No word yet Loco, but you're surely added to the finger crossing list.

 

[dura]

No, your problem is that they didn't choose you. You ain't representing nothin'--be cool baby.

Did you ever appeal their decision? No, because you're not being honest with us. The group of people you claim to represent wanted to go to Utah over Stanford for other considerations . I think you had no intention to attend Utah, so you're full of ego and that is what infuriates me. Get a life!

 

[MedicineBird]

No, your problem is that they didn't choose you. You ain't representing nothin'--be cool baby.

Did you ever appeal their decision? No, because you're not being honest with us. The group of people you claim to represent wanted to go to Utah over Stanford for other considerations . I think you had no intention to attend Utah, so you're full of ego and that is what infuriates me. Get a life!

PREACH ON!!

 

[japhy]

The problem is that it is rampant and calculated. Did you read the audit report? I don't remember the statistics, but getting in as a minority or female was something like 4X easier than if you were white male. Perhaps the "problem" is getting better, but there is a strong history of having 28% female applicants and 45% female entering class.

dude, you are on crack! if you look at the numbers over the last five years, they had one class at 44 women, every other class was in the mid-30s! since you obviously didn't look at the numbers i will link them again.

http://uuhsc.utah.edu/som/admissions/demographics.html

66 men, 36 women. a far cry from 45%.

and yeah, i read the audit. the single most important conclusion they arrived at - not one unqualified individual had been admitted. patzan, from what i can tell your m.o. on this board is to insult everyone who doesn't agree with you. like medicinebird, i know exactly why you didn't get in (it couldn't possibly be your incredibly childish black and white view of the world, now could it?).

 

[tcrex2000]

Well, I got my rejection letter today. I had an interview on Jan. 20th. Good luck to the rest of you. I guess I'm off to SLU!