Uq usmle

[igcgnerd]

Just wanted to post this to clear the multiple allegations that are often thrown around on this thread without knowing the facts.

http://mededpath.org/queensland.php?page=http://www.uq.edu.au/international/index.html?page=60982

UQ Students United States Medical Licensing Examination (USMLE) Scores:

* The average STEP 1 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2008:
250.33
98.66
* The average STEP 2 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2008:
PASS
251
99
* The average STEP 1 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2009:
226
93
* The average STEP 2 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2009:
PASS
255
99
I'm not sure of the sample size but this does demonstrate that one can do well coming from this institution. From the students I have met who were in the pilot program of UQ students who first started rotating at oschner, there was one I had met who had taken the USMLE and he performed quite closely to the above states averages.

I just want to take the opportunity to tell people who are in the business of fear mongering on this subforum to move on.

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[Transition]

Just wanted to post this to clear the multiple allegations that are often thrown around on this thread without knowing the facts.

http://mededpath.org/queensland.php?page=http://www.uq.edu.au/international/index.html?page=60982

UQ Students United States Medical Licensing Examination (USMLE) Scores:

* The average STEP 1 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2008:
250.33
98.66
* The average STEP 2 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2008:
PASS
251
99
* The average STEP 1 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2009:
226
93
* The average STEP 2 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2009:
PASS
255
99
I'm not sure of the sample size but this does demonstrate that one can do well coming from this institution. From the students I have met who were in the pilot program of UQ students who first started rotating at oschner, there was one I had met who had taken the USMLE and he performed quite closely to the above states averages.

I just want to take the opportunity to tell people who are in the business of fear mongering on this subforum to move on.

I don't see any scores on the web page you linked to.

Furthermore, this is not very useful without more numbers (need to know number of individuals that take the exam vs. the number that report). Those could simply be the select few that take the exam, do well, and report. We also need an 'n', how many have taken the exam at UQ? What about the locals vs internationals? Some ballpark numbers surrounding what you've posted would be ideal.

Next, your attitude. It does not foster any sort of discussion, it rather accuses people of simply fear mongering without looking at their arguments. Not only that, but you started a thread *just* to bash others. How is this any better than those that are apparently fear mongering (which some are, but some are also bringing up pretty valid points)? Remember, this is a discussion board. If you feel that you can't handle other peoples' views and opinions, or if you feel like you can't back your own up, don't come here or, at the least, ignore them.

Regardless, I have further issues with how UQ is reporting it's numbers. We have been given an entry average of 30 on the MCAT by UQ, but it is obvious that they are accepting anyone with the minimum 24 (there are at least 4 individuals on this forum with mid-20s) and are not upholding their own minimum of 8s in each section. So, whereas that entrance average may have been relatively competitive before, the standards now have almost certainly dropped significantly. Possibly enough to make the past USMLE stats irrelevant. If you had trouble getting 30+ on the MCAT, you will have trouble doing well on the USMLE, more than likely (William et al, 2002, Academic Medicine).

 

[igcgnerd]

Here is the correct link. I apologize for the link error.
http://mededpath.org/queensland.php?page=http://www.uq.edu.au/international/index.html?page=60982
scroll to the bottom of the page.
I was not implying that all students who attend UQ are going to obtain such averages. I realize that as far as looking at the average score for the students reported on this site, can not be used to make any substancial generalizations without knowing the number of students who took the exam and how many of those reported it to the school. I simply stated that it is possible to attend UQ and perform well on it.
I was not trying to start any flame war here but I think it is pretty disappointing the unprofessionalism that goes on in these forums. It's one thing to have a legitimate/ intelligent discussion on a school or its merits but its quit another to just conduct a smear campaign. Especially when those conducting it are neither prospective students/ current students/ faculty, nor anyone really with enough info to conduct a serious discussion but rather someone who just like to repeat rumors and propaganda for lord knows what purpose.

 

[igcgnerd]

Also please keep in mind I am NOT directing this rant at you transition nor any single person in particular but rather a group of people who know who they are.

 

[jaketheory]

yeah, i dont think this is reliable. kimberly cox has reported that data from medpath for flinders was inaccurate. she actually posted an email from tony edwards at flinders saying that.

further, as i recall someone at UQ got like a 270 something last year. say that person and one other reported their score, you might get an average of something like 250. but i dont believe 250 for a sec! a friend of mine just took it and he's a pretty smart cat. he scored above the national average for those entering every specialty but didnt get into the 250's. i'm not buying UQ's average is 250. . .

 

[JanikeyDoc]

Just wanted to post this to clear the multiple allegations that are often thrown around on this thread without knowing the facts.

http://mededpath.org/queensland.php?page=http://www.uq.edu.au/international/index.html?page=60982

UQ Students United States Medical Licensing Examination (USMLE) Scores:

* The average STEP 1 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2008:
250.33
98.66
* The average STEP 2 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2008:
PASS
251
99
* The average STEP 1 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2009:
226
93
* The average STEP 2 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2009:
PASS
255
99
I'm not sure of the sample size but this does demonstrate that one can do well coming from this institution. From the students I have met who were in the pilot program of UQ students who first started rotating at oschner, there was one I had met who had taken the USMLE and he performed quite closely to the above states averages.

I just want to take the opportunity to tell people who are in the business of fear mongering on this subforum to move on.

If you are so interested in North America I suggest you apply to US schools only or Caribbean programs that gear you to pass the USMLE.

 

[theologian]

Thanks for the data "Nerd" - and dont mind transition he's always spinning his own rants and stories
ie there are many publications in pubmed that show no statistically significant correlation b/w MCAT and USMLE - these can be found in Academic Medicine and other journals not funded by the AAMC

 

[Transition]

Thanks for the data "Nerd" - and dont mind transition he's always spinning his own rants and stories
ie there are many publications in pubmed that show no statistically significant correlation b/w MCAT and USMLE - these can be found in Academic Medicine and other journals not funded by the AAMC

Proof? I did not find these and that study was certainly not funded by the aamc. Ugh... what an illogical argument.

At least I had the decency to provide a citation. You, on the other hand, are happy with spewing rhetoric. Seriously, stop deluding yourself or have the decency to discuss the issues instead of putting your hands over your eyes and ears and telling everyone to shut up. Attack my arguments, not me, otherwise it just weakens your stance.

For once, I agree with janikeydoc

anyways, thanks for clearing up your purpose igcnerd. I just took issue with the last line in your last post.

 

[jaketheory]

wendy monk from UQ/Ochsner emailed me today citing the same USMLE scores as mentioned above. apparently i confused the mededpath.org site with some medstudent.net forum (or somethng similar). my apologies.

i didnt realize these numbers were actually coming from the bull. but i still dont believe it!

 

[shan564]

I think we all know that people can do well on the USMLE from UQ or any other Australian school. Still, since they don't have mandatory reporting, I think it's obvious that 250 is a bit excessive. I'd be MUCH more likely to report my score if I got a 250 than if I got a 200.

 

[Pollux]

further, as i recall someone at UQ got like a 270 something last year. say that person and one other reported their score, you might get an average of something like 250. but i dont believe 250 for a sec! a friend of mine just took it and he's a pretty smart cat. he scored above the national average for those entering every specialty but didnt get into the 250's. i'm not buying UQ's average is 250. . .

Step 1 in 2008: N=3
I got a 276, and two of my friends got 230+ and 240+, so the average turned out to be 250. Only the three of us took the Step 1 in 2008. There are apparently a lot more people who took it this year though.

Step 2 in 2009: N=2
I just submitted my score report to UQ last week so they haven't had a chance to include my score in the average.

 

[jaketheory]

Step 1 in 2008: N=3
I got a 276, and two of my friends got 230+ and 240+, so the average turned out to be 250. Only the three of us took the Step 1 in 2008. There are apparently a lot more people who took it this year though.

only the 3 of you took it, or only the 3 of you reported taking it? either way, i think it is pretty useless with n=3.

 

[Pollux]

only the 3 of you took it, or only the 3 of you reported taking it? either way, i think it is pretty useless with n=3.

To my knowledge, only the 3 of us took the Step 1 last year.

I did want to point out that the 3 of us worked very hard and put in countless hours studying. We were very determined to do well on these exams despite the challenges associated with a medical curriculum that is not specifically geared for basic science and boards preparation. It's certainly doable if one puts his/her heart into it.

I'm very tired of seeing people making the claim that students who go to foreign medical schools were subpar students and there's no hope in doing well on the USMLE and getting a US residency spot. It's definitely an overgeneralization.

 

[SFs Own Tone]

From Wendy Monk:

USMLE:


We have the latest information on The University of Queensland School of Medicine USMLE scores:


UQ Students United States Medical Licensing Examination (USMLE) Scores:

• The average STEP 1 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2009:
  226
  93
• The average STEP 2 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2009:
  255
  99

 

[shan564]

Now that international students won't be getting internships in Australia, it'll be interesting to see what happens to their averages in the next couple of years (since we'll probably have a better n-value).

 

[Transition]

Now that international students won't be getting internships in Australia, it'll be interesting to see what happens to their averages in the next couple of years (since we'll probably have a better n-value).

Well, I wouldn't say that internationals won't be getting internships at all. There will likely still be jobs if you're willing to look and move there.

But yeah, it will be interesting to see how these USMLE scores turn out when there are at least a few dozen 'n' per year. Hopefully these schools will also start collecting useful statistics, or at the least try to make reporting mandatory.

 

[Alphonsine]

From Wendy Monk:

USMLE:


We have the latest information on The University of Queensland School of Medicine USMLE scores:


UQ Students United States Medical Licensing Examination (USMLE) Scores:

• The average STEP 1 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2009:
  226
  93
• The average STEP 2 USMLE scores achieved by UQ students in 2009:
  255
  99

Janikey should come over here and explain himself.

Maybe we are getting some biases from self-reported scores but still...

 

[shan564]

Well, I wouldn't say that internationals won't be getting internships at all. There will likely still be jobs if you're willing to look and move there.

It seems like there will be very few, if any, internships available for internationals. There may be a few spots in NT and those areas, but unless something changes in the next few years, the overwhelming majority of us will have to go back home.

 

[Transition]

It seems like there will be very few, if any, internships available for internationals. There may be a few spots in NT and those areas, but unless something changes in the next few years, the overwhelming majority of us will have to go back home.

This is getting a little off topic, but I'll post here for the sake of flow. Perhaps we should start a new thread?

Anyways, the reason I said that it's not going to be too impossible is more a hunch than it is fact. I'll admit that forthright. The reason I still think it's possible though is because internships are given based on state-preferences and, from reading studies/seminars on the matter along with responses from health ministers of each state, it would appear that most states are targeting to keep their students (local, not internationals) within the state (see my blog, medical student tsunami post, I link to relevant articles).

Right now the order of preference for internship is as follows, with NZers sprinkled into 1-2 or 3-4 with internationals getting bumped to 5-6 (in most Aus states):
1) Domestic in-state
2) Domestic interstate
3) International in-state
4) International interstate

Basically, it appears that most states will be attempting to guarantee enough spots for students falling into 1. So, for places like NSW, Queensland and Vic, most of the internships will go to domestics in-state. This also means that there will be relatively few going interstate (so I hope). Now, because SA has not increased it's admissions nearly as much, this also shows that it will not be impacted by 1) as much as the other states. With internationals at Flinders getting 3), they also have an advantage over other internationals who are almost certainly not getting jobs in NSW and Qlnd and likely not in Vic. Count in the fact that there are only about 40 internationals per year in SA (19 Flinders, 20-25 UofA), I don't think the competition should be that bad. Throw in Flinders' close ties with the NT and I think most internationals at Flinders should have a good chance at getting an internship spot, be it in SA or NT.

That is one of the biggest reasons I chose that school (plus the relatively low cost).

 

[shan564]

Do you know the actual numbers involved? QLD, NSW, and VIC have the largest classes (both students and interns), and at the moment, they don't even have enough internships for all of the "guaranteed" people. In 2013 (the year I'd be starting an internship), NSW anticipates over 1100 graduates and about 800 internship spots; VIC and QLD aren't too different. Even if SA and NT have space for a few extra people, I doubt that it'll be enough to handle anywhere near all of the overflow from the bigger states.

There may be space for some of the internationals to stay, but we certainly can't bet our careers on it.

 

[Transition]

Do you know the actual numbers involved? QLD, NSW, and VIC have the largest classes (both students and interns), and at the moment, they don't even have enough internships for all of the "guaranteed" people. In 2013 (the year I'd be starting an internship), NSW anticipates over 1100 graduates and about 800 internship spots; VIC and QLD aren't too different. Even if SA and NT have space for a few extra people, I doubt that it'll be enough to handle anywhere near all of the overflow from the bigger states.

There may be space for some of the internationals to stay, but we certainly can't bet our careers on it.

I know the numbers to a degree, but have had trouble getting solid numbers from anywhere. I have read that there will be 1200 grads in NSW, but I have not been able to find the number of internship spots for 2013/2014. Do you mind linking me to where you saw the 800 number being quoted?

The numbers that I have been able to get so far are as follows:

Queenland grads 2013: 760
Queensland internships (projected, this number should increase): 682
(source)

Vic grads 2012: ~690
Vic internships (projected, unknown as to increase or not): ~690 (intern spots should be guaranteed for domestic CSPs)
(source)

NSW grads 2013: 1195
NSW internships (projected?): ?
(source)

 

[shan564]

I didn't see it online anywhere; that's just the number that people have been talking about (knowledgeable people, that is... i.e. the dean, etc.). Nobody wants to release any precise numbers, so we're not sure exactly how it'll work. I think it was also published in the Sydney Morning Herald article that somebody posted on this forum recently, but I'm pretty sure that their data just came from word of mouth too.

This Thursday, the USyd international students have a meeting to discuss this specific issue; I think some relevant authorities will be there too. I'll keep you guys updated if anything useful happens.

 

[MontereyMD]

Major oversupply of physicians soon in NSW.

In British Columbia where I grew up: population is 4.4 Million with only 224 graduates/Internships from UBC Faculty of Medicine per year.

NSW with a population of 6.6 Million will graduate 1100 Medical Students?

Unsustainable....expect some major Internship slashing. Starting with the Internationals as usual because they don't vote but pay the taxes anyway.