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US Electives available for International Medical Students

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syrianman

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im final year student from syria:)
im taking the toefl next month and didnt take any step yet
i hope some body give me a list of unis that accept students for electives without step1 or 2
i need to do my elective in those 10 months

please help:oops::oops:
 

draspiration

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i am a final year med student in India and wish to apply for a clerkship in Pediatrics by the end of 2010...what are my best options for pediatric clerkship programs???
 

donaldtang

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im final year student from syria:)
im taking the toefl next month and didnt take any step yet
i hope some body give me a list of unis that accept students for electives without step1 or 2
i need to do my elective in those 10 months

please help:oops::oops:

Use this website http://services.aamc.org/eec/students/ to find out the medical schools and hospitals that provide away rotation to international students. Then browse their websites one by one and you'll find which ones do not require USMLE. It should not be a tough job, since there are only around 50 hospitals available to international students.
 
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Winged Scapula

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Use this website http://services.aamc.org/eec/students/ to find out the medical schools and hospitals that provide away rotation to international students. Then browse their websites one by one and you'll find which ones do not require USMLE. It should not be a tough job, since there are only around 50 hospitals available to international students.

Remember this is NOT an exhaustive list. Many more than 50 US medical schools offer electives to international students but are not listed.
 

dggopal

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I too had the same question... I'm an IMG looking to do some rotations in the US but haven't taken any of the USMLE steps... do you or anyone else have info on schools that not listed on that site that do accept fmg's without step 1?
 

zoz

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Does anyone have info on schools that are not
Listed on that site,that do accept foreign med students withou
Step1
 

schandan13

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Does anyone have info on schools that are not
Listed on that site,that do accept foreign med students withou
Step1

Electives involve patient interaction, taking histories etc. Hence there is liability on the part of the hospital and malpractice insurance is also involved. All hospitals require students to have passed Step 1 in order to be considered for an "elective". "Observerships" are a different story though. Remember, students in US medical schools do electives in their 4th year. It is MANDATORY for them to have passed step 1 before starting even 3rd year. Why should it be any different for foreign medical graduates ?
 

thesea2010

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hi my name is sami. i am medical student in 5th degree my college (6 year programm and 7 resident) i have so many questions plz.:

1- i want to know can i go to US after my resident year as elective?.

2- can i spend my resident year in US as elective year?

thanxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
 

mofonyx

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Hello,

I am very keen on plastic surgery. Which teaching hospital/university should I apply to that would be able to provide me with a good letter surrounding that specialty?

I've heard good things about Yale and Northwestern Chicago. Also, Rochester was mentioned as a good place to apply.

Any info would be immensely helpful. I have completed my Step 1, but my CV is painfully lacking any achievements.

Thanks for your time.
 

NotAProgDirector

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As an IMG, your chances of getting a Plastics residency slot is amazingly small, unless you 1) spend years doing amazing plastics research, 2) get to know someone who is in charge of / has influence over a plastics residency program, and 3) get very lucky. So, if you want to simply come to the US to experience plastic surgery as an elective, be our guest. If you're plan is to do it in the US as a career, that's very unlikely to happen.
 

mofonyx

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As an IMG, your chances of getting a Plastics residency slot is amazingly small, unless you 1) spend years doing amazing plastics research, 2) get to know someone who is in charge of / has influence over a plastics residency program, and 3) get very lucky. So, if you want to simply come to the US to experience plastic surgery as an elective, be our guest. If you're plan is to do it in the US as a career, that's very unlikely to happen.

Thank you for your input. I understand that my chances are slim, and getting into a Plastics residency as a fresh graduate would need some sort of lottery-winning luck. I don't expect my chances to be good when matching as a fresh graduate, but I hope that my chances would improve as I complete a a few years of training in the UK. If I am accepted then, I will consider it then. If I am not, I will remain to train in the UK. Whatever it is, I'll tackle it when it comes.

I appreciate your input and it gave me a lot to think about today. Although I was well aware of this beforehand, I never really gave it much thought. Nevertheless, I am still quite keen on securing a good elective spot in Plastics and I would be grateful if you (or anyone else on this forum) could provide me with recommendations as to where I should apply to.

I already have Yale, NWChicago and Rochester as places I would like to apply to, as I hear the first two are pretty good places for Plastics. Your recommendations would be immensely helpful to me.

Thanks again.
 
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211498

Electives involve patient interaction, taking histories etc. Hence there is liability on the part of the hospital and malpractice insurance is also involved. All hospitals require students to have passed Step 1 in order to be considered for an "elective". "Observerships" are a different story though. Remember, students in US medical schools do electives in their 4th year. It is MANDATORY for them to have passed step 1 before starting even 3rd year. Why should it be any different for foreign medical graduates ?

wrong, e.g. MSSM, UCSD, UTSW, Yale, Harvard
 

schandan13

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wrong, e.g. MSSM, UCSD, UTSW, Yale, Harvard

Yes but having passed the step 1 SIGNIFICANTLY increases your chances of getting a spot. I believe the Harvard application even asks you for an explanation as to why you haven't given step 1. The places you've listed are hardly easy to get into and sometimes may not offer a spot for more than 4 weeks. And I don't think that's always sufficient to get an LOR.
 
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211498

I do not deny that it's smart to take Step 1 before you apply for rotations in the US, especially if your long term goal is to do residency there and you'd have to take the Steps anyways, but there are still enough places to do rotations without Step 1, and I've never heard of anybody having problems to get a spot for more than 1 month without Step 1 if he was flexible regarding the location.
 

schandan13

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I do not deny that it's smart to take Step 1 before you apply for rotations in the US, especially if your long term goal is to do residency there and you'd have to take the Steps anyways, but there are still enough places to do rotations without Step 1, and I've never heard of anybody having problems to get a spot for more than 1 month without Step 1 if he was flexible regarding the location.

Whats your point ? I know of people who applied a year in advance and still only got approved a month. We just know people with different experiences. :rolleyes:

It's smarter to be doing an elective at 1 place for 2 months rather than going to 2 places for 4 weeks each. What that does is -

1. Allows you to have more opportunities to prove yourself and your abilities as a clinician. That, then obviously means that you are in a better position to request an LOR (which is the whole point of an elective anyway). The more interaction you have with the PD, the better chances you'll have of getting an LOR from him. That would have much higher value than 1 from someone junior in the department.

2. If you are really good, you can stay in touch with the faculty after your elective and then apply to that program for residency. A PD once told me that they would much rather invite candidates for interviews who've done electives with them. That way, they are assured of quality, since many candidates look good on paper but may not be very pleasant personalities.

3. If you know which specialty you want to pursue, you always arrange electives in sub-specialties within that field. 1 month of IM, 1 month of Peds and 1 month of Surgery and 3 weak LORs are not as impressive as 3 months of IM and one solid LOR.

Not to mention, finding housing, paying malpractice and living at 1 place sounds more convenient than hoping around different states.
 
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211498

I never said anything about hoping around, it's not a big problem to find two months at one place. But as you said, we simply know people with different experiences...
 

schandan13

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I do not deny that it's smart to take Step 1 before you apply for rotations in the US, especially if your long term goal is to do residency there and you'd have to take the Steps anyways, but there are still enough places to do rotations without Step 1, and I've never heard of anybody having problems to get a spot for more than 1 month without Step 1 if he was flexible regarding the location.

That's what i gathered.
 

mofonyx

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Whats your point ? I know of people who applied a year in advance and still only got approved a month. We just know people with different experiences. :rolleyes:

It's smarter to be doing an elective at 1 place for 2 months rather than going to 2 places for 4 weeks each. What that does is -

1. Allows you to have more opportunities to prove yourself and your abilities as a clinician. That, then obviously means that you are in a better position to request an LOR (which is the whole point of an elective anyway). The more interaction you have with the PD, the better chances you'll have of getting an LOR from him. That would have much higher value than 1 from someone junior in the department.

2. If you are really good, you can stay in touch with the faculty after your elective and then apply to that program for residency. A PD once told me that they would much rather invite candidates for interviews who've done electives with them. That way, they are assured of quality, since many candidates look good on paper but may not be very pleasant personalities.

3. If you know which specialty you want to pursue, you always arrange electives in sub-specialties within that field. 1 month of IM, 1 month of Peds and 1 month of Surgery and 3 weak LORs are not as impressive as 3 months of IM and one solid LOR.

Not to mention, finding housing, paying malpractice and living at 1 place sounds more convenient than hoping around different states.

Thank you for this post. This was something I was thinking about, whether it should be 2 months in one place, or 1 month in two places. You read my mind. Very helpful.
 

drdana

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Hi,
I have to do my elective course next year and i want to do it in the US as it raises my chance of getting the residency there . I didn't take any USMLE steps yet, and i'm planning to take step 2 CS while i'm doing the elective . So i have some questions !:
1. If i'm going to start studying by know when is it best to put my exam date and my elective course period ?
2. Does it matter if the speciality i'm having elective in matches the specialty that i want to specialize in future (residency) ? i mean if i took IM oncology for example and i want to specialize in ophthalmology latter does the elective help me in getting the residency?
3. I don't have a green card , so is it hard for me to get the visa?
4. finally is there any suggestions of specialities that i would get benefit from in USA more than in the middle east ?!
 

mikethomson

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Hi there
this is my first reply and i hope in can recieve answers to my question
i am 4th yr medical student in syria ( still have 2yrs to graduate), i have an american citizenship, i didnt do any USMLE steps nor TOEFL (planning to do TOEFL test this summer)
I wonder if i have a chance to do any elective course in any state at any university.
and thank u all 4 this lovely site
 

macabi

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Hi there
this is my first reply and i hope in can recieve answers to my question
i am 4th yr medical student in syria ( still have 2yrs to graduate), i have an american citizenship, i didnt do any USMLE steps nor TOEFL (planning to do TOEFL test this summer)
I wonder if i have a chance to do any elective course in any state at any university.
and thank u all 4 this lovely site

Hi mike,
I'm sure there are some places you can go to. It really depends on your desired specialty and how much you want to spend. There's a site to find out about electives available. I forget exactly what it's called, but If you google it you'll find it easily.
Good luck!
 

mikethomson

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Hi mike,
I'm sure there are some places you can go to. It really depends on your desired specialty and how much you want to spend. There's a site to find out about electives available. I forget exactly what it's called, but If you google it you'll find it easily.
Good luck!

thx for ur reply
to be honest i spent days and nights looking for elective courses but i couldnt find.
can anyone tell how to do a medical research in USA
because someone told me that doing a research is much better than doing an elective course ( is that true ) and if it is, how can i do it?
 
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DFJ

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i have got clerkship at 3 colleges...Harvard, Northwestern and Beth Israel Medical center..... it would very helpful if anyone could help me choose between them... thank you!!!
Wait, hi, so, good job getting those clerkships.

Question. You had to take the US MLE Step 1 first, right? When did you take it, how did you review for it, and can you say that your med school curriculum helped in your review for Step 1?

Thanks, you're awesome.
 

Shoushu

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hi,

Are we allowed to take elective rotations before the cores? Mix up the order?

I'm a US-IMG student. So want to take as many electives as I can, but if I finish all cores at my uni, I'll be graduated.
 

bambi

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All those saying you need the USMLE everywhere or that it helps your chances are talking nonsense. If a place asks for it, which most do then of course you need it, if they don't, you don't, it's that simple. When I was at a certain Ivy, not a single one of the visiting internationals had done Step 1 and we were in various specialties. Getting an elective isn't that hard, it's just annoying paperwork.
 

Shoushu

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All those saying you need the USMLE everywhere or that it helps your chances are talking nonsense. If a place asks for it, which most do then of course you need it, if they don't, you don't, it's that simple. When I was at a certain Ivy, not a single one of the visiting internationals had done Step 1 and we were in various specialties. Getting an elective isn't that hard, it's just annoying paperwork.

Getting elective rotation isn't hard, but is it possible for internationals to get cores too (by international, i mean, US-IMG in this case: American-citizen student)?
 

MzMDtoBe

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Hi!

I am an IMG from Norway starting looking for Clinical Experience (Prefer IM or EM as those are the fields of interest regarding applying for residency) in hope to get LOR before applying for a Residency. From previous visits I know I would prefer the Mid West to practice so I was also hoping to find a place in that area for a clinical rotation. I am graduating spring 2013 and plan take the rotation fall 2012. My mandatory rotations at my University will be done by then as well as my Thesis. I plan get Step 1 done summer 2012.

Do you think I will be able to find a place within this time to ensure I get some clinical practice with in IM before I graduate in spring 2013? Sadly the only time possible for me to do this would be fall 2012 as there will be impossible for me to get the step 1 done before summer 2012.

Some of you have written it is easy to get a rotation, where did you find the correct places which will accept you for more than 4 weeks? I looked up some of the links provided in this thread and there did not look as there was many options within the Mid West region, however I did find some so at least I have a start where to start sending e-mails :thumbup: I just want to make sure I gather as much information as possible before I start bother the contact person with "the simplest of questions".

Do you have any recommendations for where would be a great place to get a two month rotation within the Mid West?

Forgot one thing; From what I have seen on applications of IM Residency some require you have 6 months to a full year of clinical practice from the US. How is it possible to get this while being in Medical School? Do you know why this is?

Tyvm in advance for helping me out! :love:
 
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bambi

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I just went on the website of every medical school I was remotely interested in. I don't understand the ridiculous lack of initiative on threads like this, everyone wants everything handed to them, just do a bit of research.
 

MzMDtoBe

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I just went on the website of every medical school I was remotely interested in. I don't understand the ridiculous lack of initiative on threads like this, everyone wants everything handed to them, just do a bit of research.

I have checked some of my fav schools, but so far none of them has an 8 week clinical for IMGs and since I only have the fall of 2012 available I would like to have a chance on getting things ready to ensure I actually do get clinical experience before I graduate.... Also I have been communicating with Norwegian MDs which is currently working in the US, so I am working on it, it would just be nice IF someone knew a faster way to get things done. Save me some time. I am sry if you feel I have not done enough before asking questions.
 

bambi

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I have checked some of my fav schools, but so far none of them has an 8 week clinical for IMGs and since I only have the fall of 2012 available I would like to have a chance on getting things ready to ensure I actually do get clinical experience before I graduate.... Also I have been communicating with Norwegian MDs which is currently working in the US, so I am working on it, it would just be nice IF someone knew a faster way to get things done. Save me some time. I am sry if you feel I have not done enough before asking questions.

If you had done the necessary research you would have the answers! You have over a year before you want to go so it's not like you need to save time. The vast majority of places are fine with 8 weeks, not in the same specialty, but 2 different 4 week electives. If you want to do the same specialty either ask nicely like I did or go to 2 different places, this really isn't hard!
 

Winged Scapula

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Getting elective rotation isn't hard, but is it possible for internationals to get cores too (by international, i mean, US-IMG in this case: American-citizen student)?

Shoushu please note that asking the same question in multiple threads is a violation of the SDN Terms of Service agreement you signed when you registered.

As I noted in the other thread, most US programs do not allow visiting students to do core rotations unless your program has a formal agreement (ie, in the case of Caribbean students).
 

MzMDtoBe

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Every hospital will have a different procedure, different criteria. The best way to do it is to start searching the internet for the hospitals that you are interested.

Thank you. The one thing I have not figured out yet, are there only "Residency Hospitals" which accept students for clinical experience or is it possible for me to contact other hospitals in the area I prefer?
 

Shoushu

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Thank you. The one thing I have not figured out yet, are there only "Residency Hospitals" which accept students for clinical experience or is it possible for me to contact other hospitals in the area I prefer?

Same Q. Only teaching hospitals that allow this?

And do they need to be university-affiliated hospitals? Should one rotate @ large univ. hospital for "better" training and professor's LOR?
 

jackking

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Hey,

I was looking through this forum there are lots of places for clinical electives but I can`t seem to find any apart from john hopkins for research electives. Does anyone have an idea or a list of places for research electives?
 

umerzia

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hi . hello every body . i am a student of 3 rd year mbbs , studying at Akhtar Saeed Medical and Dental college .Pakistan
Please Guide me , how i can apply for Electives and observership in AMERICA.
What is the criteria?? requirements??
 

HopeTo99

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Does anyone know which universities do not require completion of all the core clerkships? I haven't rotated in psychiatry yet...I'm really hoping to do an elective this summer. Or should I just give up the search?
 

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Hello! I’m a medical student in Russia. I’m in my 5th year now. I have passed USMLE Step 1. A have US green card. I want to do externship in Minnesota or NY. I almost found doctors that agree to take me. Can anybody help me to find what paperwork I need to do or what requirements I must meet? I couldn’t find information about this on the state medical board. I would really appreciate any help.
Thank you.
 

amroma

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hi
Dear sir/madam
i'm an Egyptian medical student in the final year medical school ,kasr el-ainy ,cairo university, i'm interested in doing an elective internship at usa
medical university,as it will add to my experience and increase my chances.
my regards and thank you in advance.

i so what university now can accept me with minimum requirements(no step 1,lower fees or none,i will take toefl soon)
 

jagatjot

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hi.i'm a final year medical student in india.i wish to clerkship in us in the month of jan.
cn u suggest which college should i choose(in terms of the max.benefit of LOR).plz help fast.
 

joylynkurian

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Thankyou for the information sir.
I appreciate it very much.

What is difference between Clerkship, Internship and Electives for an International Student.
Thankyou.
Final year medical Student from India.
 

NotAProgDirector

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Thankyou for the information sir.
I appreciate it very much.

What is difference between Clerkship, Internship and Electives for an International Student.
Thankyou.
Final year medical Student from India.

A Clerkship is any student rotation.

Clerkships can be Electives, meaning that the student chooses what they want to do. In general, electives are less intense -- usually monday to friday with weekends off and no nights or evenings.

Clerkships can also be Core Rotations. These are usually Internal Medicine, Pediatrics, OB GYN, Surgery, Family medicine, and Psychiatry. Some schools have other required rotations, like Emergency Medicine, Surgical subspecialties, etc. In general, international students are not allowed to do Core Rotations.

A special clerkship during the 4th / final year is called a SubInternship (or SubI). A SubI is an intense rotation where a student is treated like an Intern (see below), usually with less overall patients. The idea is to get a trial run of what it will be like in Internship.

Internship in the US is the first year after graduating from medical school. You are a doctor, you get paid. It is a very busy year.

I want to apply to your program what shall I do ?

Not quite sure what you're asking. SDN isn;t a school, hospital, or training program.

You can check out the following:

https://www.aamc.org/services/ghlo/

https://services.aamc.org/eec/students/

Or, you need to contact each program independently to see if they take foreign students. Each program has it's own criteria, fees, and schedule.
 

civan

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Yes, the two resources you mentioned are helpful - the EEC (extramural electives compenduim) and GHLO at the aamc website.

GHLO is for final year medical students who want to do electives abroad - so if you are an international (or US) med student wanting to go to the USA, Africa, asia, or europe for electives you can do so.

but your school must first be a participating member in GHLO.

www.aamc.org/ghlo
 

medpack87

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I have been checking those links. And most are directed to International Medical Students. I am already a graduate, I was wondering if it still counts?? If not, what can I do? I heard of this page, http://fmgportal.com/clinical-externships/ But I still havent ventured in. Any ideas? input?
 

Medstart108

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    If you have already graduated i don't think most hospitals will let you do an elective. You can always get observerships but they don't allow you to be involved in patient care.
     

    international11

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    Hey everyone,
    I was wondering what is the best time to apply for clinical electives in the states coming from an international medical school? i.e when is the load of american students the lowest so we get the highest chances of acceptance into good elective programs with a hands on experience? Note: i am not going to apply for the match right after my 4th year so i dont mind my elective being after the deadlines for the match. Any input? thanks you
     

    NotAProgDirector

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    In general, the number of students doing electives, especially SubI's, is lowest from Nov - Mar as they are all interviewing and matching. Once you get to April and especially into May, the current 3rd year students start to want to rotate. Dec can be a difficult month because of the holidays. January through March is probably the quietest time. June through September will be the busiest.
     

    cbhdddf

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    In general, the number of students doing electives, especially SubI's, is lowest from Nov - Mar as they are all interviewing and matching. Once you get to April and especially into May, the current 3rd year students start to want to rotate. Dec can be a difficult month because of the holidays. January through March is probably the quietest time. June through September will be the busiest.

    Thanks for the input, but I thought elective is only for final year med student. Do 3rd year students also do elective rotation in April and May ? My understanding was the 3rd year students apply in April or earlier, and begin in June when they rise to 4th year?
     
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