Volunteering in Africa?

[detvar]

hi,

i would like to know...in your experience or from what you've heard, how common/rare is it for college students to spend a few months in Africa volunteering before applying to medical school?

thanks very much for your input!

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[DropkickMurphy]

It's called medical tourism for a reason.

 

[Mr. Tee]

Not too common in the grand scheme of things.

 

[Rafa]

What DM said. If you've got cash to blow, go for it - though I'd rather vol. at home and spend the cash on a trip to Hawaii - but that's just me.

 

[Mr. Tee]

What DM said. If you've got cash to blow, go for it - though I'd rather vol. at home and spend the cash on a trip to Hawaii - but that's just me.

lawl. It is an insightful learning experience though.

 

[detvar]

thanks for the replies...

seriously, though. in terms of applicants doing this sort of thing, does it sound to medical schools like you're trying too hard? i've heard it can be somewhat of a cliche (as one poster mentioned above)...oh, an idealist college student trying/pretending to save the world to write something on his/her essay to get into med school. i'd like to go, but don't want to go through the effort if it's going to be perceived that way.

 

[alwaysaangel]

thanks for the replies...

seriously, though. in terms of applicants doing this sort of thing, does it sound to medical schools like you're trying too hard? i've heard it can be somewhat of a cliche (as one poster mentioned above)...oh, an idealist college student trying/pretending to save the world to write something on his/her essay to get into med school. i'd like to go, but don't want to go through the effort if it's going to be perceived that way.

The fact that you don't want to go if it won't benefit your application says you're probably going for the wrong reasons - and that will probably shine through in your essays/interviews. I would say forget it.

 

[detvar]

thank you SO much, alwaysaangel! you have changed my life!!

 

[alwaysaangel]

thank you SO much, alwaysaangel! you have changed my life!!

Sorry I wasn't trying to be rude or mean - just giving my opinion. If I was too harsh I do apologize - all I have to go on is what you typed so if you know your reasons are more than what I got the impression they are then go for it.

 

[LJoo83]

i say two thumbs up.
referring to 'young applicant's thread; this is probably the one time of your life you have the ability to do something of such magnitude that can forever change your life. travelling anywhere outside the country, especially to a poorer country, definitely changes your perspective about the meaning of life.
i would absolutley love the chance to do something in africa, regardless of how cliche it may be.

but, i am the girl who wants to get involved with peace corps and/or doctors without borders. being able to work in the foreign field is what motivates me to go to med school anyways.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Instead of the cliched Africa mission trip, why not go somewhere that isn't so seemingly blatantly kneejerk in its execution. For example, a group of us is going to Nepal next summer to train paramedics and critical care hospital staff. If anyone here has EMS or educational experience and would like to go along, please feel free to PM me.

 

[SoCuteMD]

hi,

i would like to know...in your experience or from what you've heard, how common/rare is it for college students to spend a few months in Africa volunteering before applying to medical school?

thanks very much for your input!

Africa was amazing, eye-opening, and life-changing for me. However, I had the opportunity to go with some great classmates and a strong mentor. Without their contributions, my experience would have looked the same on paper but would not have been the same.

In reality, it's not "cliched" as DKM would like to insist (and it also was not "medical tourism"). It was a VERY unique part of my application - but I'm not sure that it was that important with respect to my getting accepted. It certainly made for interesting conversation and helped me reinforce my interest in primary care during the interviews.

If you are going to say that you want to do international work or that you want to work with the underserved in your PS, an experience in Africa (or another needy continent) can help you reinforce that statement. If you are not interested in international work, just working with the underserved, I would save the $$$! I paid for very little of my trip as some family members gave me money (I didn't ask for it) and I got a few grants - so my trip only cost me personally about $200 or so.

 

[mmmkay121]

Can't the money for these trips (several thousand dollars) be used to... feed the hungry people? Maybe you should donate the money if you have it lying around. That would really, really help them. There are many organizations that would take it. Maybe you could start your own chapter.

As to your question, it's very common and it probably isn't going to give you such a unique PS topic or EC.

 

[mmmkay121]

In reality, it's not "cliched" as DKM would like to insist (and it also was not "medical tourism"). It was a VERY unique part of my application - but I'm not sure that it was that important with respect to my getting accepted. It certainly made for interesting conversation and helped me reinforce my interest in primary care during the interviews.

How could a trip reinforce one's interest into going into primary care? I don't see the connection. Are you still interested in going into family practice, internal med, or pediatrics?

 

[Rafa]

Can't the money for these trips (several thousand dollars) be used to... feed the hungry people? Maybe you should donate the money if you have it lying around. That would really, really help them. There are many organizations that would take it. Maybe you could start your own chapter.

Certainly. But generally, these trips are far more about the individual than they are about the 'chance to make a difference' (or whatever was written in the application. Otherwise, as you noted, the money could be spent in a thousand better ways. I'm not judging you, OP, but if I can figure this out as a college student, I'm pretty sure even the greenest of adcoms will know exactly why you chose to spend several k this way. From there on, it depends on them.

 

[Mr. Tee]

How could a trip reinforce one's interest into going into primary care? I don't see the connection. Are you still interested in going into family practice, internal med, or pediatrics?

How couldn't it reinforce? That's like asking "How could a medical experience reinforce one's interest in going into medicine?" Hmmm.....maybe socuteMD's experience in Africa was in primary care????

Tell me how Africa trips are very common.

 

[CaramelDlite]

Trips to Africa aren't common at all. Hospital shadowing, now that's common.

To the OP, only go if you're really interested. If your other EC's do not point to you having a genuine interest in service for the underprivileged, it might look like you're trying too hard. Regardless of what you do in Africa, your true intentions will shine through, be it good or bad, and that will be what adcoms remember most. Also remember, there are many communities in the states in need of a helping hand, and no one group is more worthy than another. Volunteering in local inner city communities is desperately needed and is a lot cheaper too.

 

[SoCuteMD]

How could a trip reinforce one's interest into going into primary care? I don't see the connection. Are you still interested in going into family practice, internal med, or pediatrics?

Because I spent my time at the African equivalent of a "Level 2 trauma center" that served 5000 square miles, about that many people, and had 1 doctor who treated illnesses, delivered babies, performed surgery (and concurrently managed the anesthesia). If that's not primary care, I don't know what is!!!

As for my current career goals, I'm only a 2nd year and I'm doing my best to keep an open mind!

I'm certain that the money could have gone directly to the village to make a difference, but for the most part it was donated by alums of my college specifically for students needing financial assistance in order to volunteer in underdeveloped countries so the money would have been granted to a student wanting to go to one of those areas (not just Africa). Since I'd spent a lot of time working with underserved populations domestically I felt like I had a reasonable case for wanting to go, and apparently the committees that reviewed the funding applications agreed.

I think what's most important to remember is that as a pre-med student you aren't going to be able to do much to help medically in Africa. The best contributions you can make are those that are sustainable. I felt like going raised my awareness and kindled a love for a country that makes me want to help later when I have more tools to do so, and that's probably where the true value of it lies.

 

[xylem29]

The fact that you don't want to go if it won't benefit your application says you're probably going for the wrong reasons - and that will probably shine through in your essays/interviews. I would say forget it.

I dunno why ppl keep saying this - if someone is a good enough writer and a good enough poser or "faker", it can soooo easily be pulled off. You can easily come off as sincere about something even if you are not - now, during the interview, this is a bit tougher.

 

[xylem29]

Now, here is something for y'all to consider - my buddy, who is not premed or anything like that (english MA) said to me that he believes - that volunteering, that is - paying to go overseas to work in underdeveloped countries was one of the most selfish things someone could do.

His arguement being: ppl pay thousands of dollars - or they raise thousands of dollars - so that they themselves, can go over to a poor nation, to gain experience, to help out etc. Rather than spending the funds to support the ppl over there so they themselves can get things started, we use it for ourselves - in effect, exploiting others misfortune so taht we can feel better about ourselves - or, in many premeds cases - exploiting them so we can get into med school.

 

[TSK]

While some peoples' desire to go to Africa is genuine and legit, it isn't that unique. If you, or anyone for that matter, were truly interested in helping the medically underserved, there are thousands of people right here in the states who live in utter poverty. While journeying to an inner city or rural area where a lot of kids dont even get 3 square meals a day let alone see a doctor, may not be as exciting, the end result is still the same.

 

[Rafa]

Now, here is something for y'all to consider - my buddy, who is not premed or anything like that (english MA) said to me that he believes - that volunteering, that is - paying to go overseas to work in underdeveloped countries was one of the most selfish things someone could do.

His arguement being: ppl pay thousands of dollars - or they raise thousands of dollars - so that they themselves, can go over to a poor nation, to gain experience, to help out etc. Rather than spending the funds to support the ppl over there so they themselves can get things started, we use it for ourselves - in effect, exploiting others misfortune so taht we can feel better about ourselves - or, in many premeds cases - exploiting them so we can get into med school.

completely agree.

 

[juice55]

yeah, I have a friend who spent over $2000 just to go on a 2 week "missions trip" ... and they had a lot of fun doing non-medical/touristy stuff. So, I don't know how much you're benefitting the people of the place you're visiting and I don't know how much it will help you.

 

[TexasFool]

yeah, I have a friend who spent over $2000 just to go on a 2 week "missions trip" ... and they had a lot of fun doing non-medical/touristy stuff. So, I don't know how much you're benefitting the people of the place you're visiting and I don't know how much it will help you.

It depends on what type of group you go with. Some people go for a year, which involves real work and others go for a vacation with a little volunteer work on the side.

 

[SpeakLittleB]

it's a bit selfish... but the volunteer experience probably benefits yourself more in terms of eye-opening experience rather than the people you can actually help. so i say really go for it if you're interested, and i doubt you'll regret it. like others have said, though, be careful of what the program is.

i went to kenya this past summer, stayed with a village family, helped out at rural clinics and visited hospitals... really great experience. i don't have plans to focus on int'l medicine for my career, but certainly i would not stop myself from going just because of being afraid of "looking cliche". also it is true that there are many ppl that need help in the states... so if you really want to help out the most, perhaps you should save money and stay here. but if you're looking for an experience that shows you a whole different side of medicine and forces you to re-evaluate your own motivations and goals, i'd say go for as many interesting experiences as you can, traveling abroad being one of them. it's about your own personal development... and most likely, you'll be a better doctor for it.

 

[notdeadyet]

Now, here is something for y'all to consider - my buddy, who is not premed or anything like that (english MA) said to me that he believes - that volunteering, that is - paying to go overseas to work in underdeveloped countries was one of the most selfish things someone could do.

The problem with this logic is that if you actually apply it widely, it means that any form of volunteering is selfish, because you're really doing it just for the satisfaction that you feel in helping others.

Pretty soon, everyone's sitting on the couch with a sixpack, feeling superior to the "selfish" folks volunteering at the clinic.

 

[Rafa]

I volunteered in Africa and all I got was this stinking badge!

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

Now, here is something for y'all to consider - my buddy, who is not premed or anything like that (english MA) said to me that he believes - that volunteering, that is - paying to go overseas to work in underdeveloped countries was one of the most selfish things someone could do.

His arguement being: ppl pay thousands of dollars - or they raise thousands of dollars - so that they themselves, can go over to a poor nation, to gain experience, to help out etc. Rather than spending the funds to support the ppl over there so they themselves can get things started, we use it for ourselves - in effect, exploiting others misfortune so taht we can feel better about ourselves - or, in many premeds cases - exploiting them so we can get into med school.

Another problem is that if you apply this broadly (like notdeadyet suggests), then you could say that raising money for anything versus giving it to charity is selfish. Which is a bit of a stretch, I know.

 

[foofish]

The problem with this logic is that if you actually apply it widely, it means that any form of volunteering is selfish, because you're really doing it just for the satisfaction that you feel in helping others.

Pretty soon, everyone's sitting on the couch with a sixpack, feeling superior to the "selfish" folks volunteering at the clinic.

Exactly....and then isn't it even worse to, say, want to become a doctor? Most people going into medicine do it because they enjoy helping people, and so by the same logic, getting *paid* to enjoy helping people as a doctor is even more selfish....ergo, we should all become i-bankers.

I've always felt a bt queasy about the premed volunteer programs in developing countries, but more on the grounds of premeds who provide care they aren't actually trained to provide, and the zoo/tourism aspect of paying to get "experience" via the impoverished. (And yes, yes, I do see that on the other hand, if unqualified premeds weren't providing care that would be illegal for them to provide in the US, then many people would be going without care at all...but in that case, the whole system needs to change.)

 

[**ALIEN**]

Instead of the cliched Africa mission trip, why not go somewhere that isn't so seemingly blatantly kneejerk in its execution. For example, a group of us is going to Nepal next summer to train paramedics and critical care hospital staff. If anyone here has EMS or educational experience and would like to go along, please feel free to PM me.

THAT WOULD BE A GOOD IDEA, BUT I WILL ALREADY HAVE MY ACCEPTANCES BY THEN. THANKS FOR INVITE THOUGH!

 

[DropkickMurphy]

I volunteered in Africa and all I got was this stinking badge!

That's awesome.....

 

[nekrogg]

well most volunteer experiences that involve any real clinical experience is a bit selfish isnt it? At this point, we as premeds cannot contribute enough to say that it is worth the physician's time to take us on board during rotations. But its still done. Going to Africa after paying all that money is selfish, but so is taking up the air and space when shadowing or observing a surgery or anything cool premeds like to do.

 

[BellyDancingDoc]

The fact that you don't want to go if it won't benefit your application says you're probably going for the wrong reasons - and that will probably shine through in your essays/interviews. I would say forget it.

Totally agree with angel, here.

Frogs

 

[8744]

I volunteered in Africa (sort of) when I was in Liberia for Operation Sharp Edge in the late eighties. I had lots of positive experiences. I learned that African quasi-soldiers scatter if you hold up a smoke grenade, that large swaths of West Africa were probably better off when they were European colonies, and that French people love Americans if we are saving them from being dismembered with machetes.

I put this in my personal statement. Celebrating diversity and all that.

Oh...what's that you say? It only counts if you hold a dying African babies or pass out condoms at the kraal?

Sorry. Disregard this post please.

 

[8744]

Another problem is that if you apply this broadly (like notdeadyet suggests), then you could say that raising money for anything versus giving it to charity is selfish. Which is a bit of a stretch, I know.

You could do a lot more good if you took the money for your airfare to Africa and gave it to charitable orgnaization doing real work, not just observing and holding dying babies.

If you thinik about it, it would make more sense for a physician to donate two weeks of his salary rather than two weeks of his time. I bet the typical American physician salary could pay the yearly salary of a physician in Burkina Faso.

 

[notdeadyet]

If you thinik about it, it would make more sense for a physician to donate two weeks of his salary rather than two weeks of his time. I bet the typical American physician salary could pay the yearly salary of a physician in Bukina Faso.

Very, very true. The NGO's I have the most time for are the ones who are concerned with sustainability. Programs in which American physicians come to provide servcies does not have a fraction of the impact that training a local career physician would.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

that French people love Americans if we are saving them from being dismembered with machetes.

Or when the Germans show up.....

Oh...what's that you say? It only counts if you hold a dying African babies or pass out condoms at the kraal?

Sorry. Disregard this post please.

 

[DrVanNostran]

I say go for it. Even if the OP is going for the wrong reasons ( I AM NOT SAYING THAT YOU ARE), he/she might gain a life changing experience. You only get what you earn, going to Africa to volunteer can be the worst or greatest thing you ever do. You trip to Africa might change your entire perception on life and you may eventually want to spend your life serving the indigent.

I say go for it, for whatever reason you have.

Good luck.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Once again, I would like to reiterate the point PandaBear made (minus the smoke grenades, machetes and French people). One does not need to go to Africa to do assistance work. There are LOTS of places that can benefit from help, some a LOT more than Africa because you never hear about them.
A short list:
-Peru (example: www.loveforperu.org )
-Mexico
-Guatemala
-New Guinea
-Nepal

 

[DrVanNostran]

Once again, I would like to reiterate the point PandaBear made (minus the smoke grenades, machetes and French people). One does not need to go to Africa to do assistance work. There are LOTS of places that can benefit from help, some a LOT more than Africa because you never hear about them.
A short list:
-Peru (example: www.loveforperu.org )
-Mexico
-Guatemala
-New Guinea
-Nepal

Don't forget the states. There is a lot of work to be done here. Check out the Colonias in the Texas and other parts of the southwest.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Personally if we could get the OK, I'd be the first to volunteer to go to Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, and California to help erect a 20ft high solid concrete wall. That would solve a lot of problems (other than the byproduct of creating a shortage of cheap labor)

 

[gujuDoc]

Man between Rafa's posts, Dropmurky's (sp??) posts, and panda bears posts, I can't decide who's more entertaining!!!!!

But I have to say I agree with all 3 of them. They all bring up great points that a lot of you should take to heart. While it will give you a different perspective on life and benefit you, it won't do as much as doing something to make permanent changes in the medical conditions there will.

Oh and I don't believe there's such a thing as a unique applicant. Please refer to TheProwler's thread from a few days ago.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Just say DKM

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Just say "double post"

 

[notdeadyet]

Personally if we could get the OK, I'd be the first to volunteer to go to Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, and California to help erect a 20ft high solid concrete wall.

There are parts of the U.S. I'd like to build that 20ft wall around before I would Mexico...

 

[8744]

There are parts of the U.S. I'd like to build that 20ft wall around before I would Mexico...

Yeah. Like Boston and the Bay area.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

There are parts of the U.S. I'd like to build that 20ft wall around before I would Mexico...

Texas, most of the south, California, New York, Boston, southern Indiana, Kansas (although walling up that state is kind of like taping an empty box shut).....

 

[8744]

I also have to add that I don't have the "White Liberal Guilt" so I am not particularly interested in saving anybody to assuage my conscience and I am not that impressed with people who do and are. If I were an admission committee member I'd take off points for African experience unless the applicant was a mercenary.

"Volunteer Experience: Lead a band of commandos in the overthrow of a small, oil-rich African dictatorship."

Now that's what I call celebrating diversity.

 

[notdeadyet]

southern Indiana,

Is northern Indiana much nicer than southern?

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Amen....I may be a Democrat, but I also happen to believe there is nothing wrong with war..... for example:

I would also vote to bring back carpet and fire bombing. It worked against the Germans and the Japanese and they seem to have stayed in their places quite nicely