Volunteering useful or a waste of time??

[Gij]

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The first thing that every pre-med knows about is that he/she needs to do some volunteering. I would like to hear your honest opinions about the benefits of volunteering. Also if you feel that it is a waste of time please say so. This is a great place to do an informal study on this. Please first give your opinion, and then (if interested) read my opinion.

MY OPINION:
I don't think volunteering should be as important as having a meaningful experience of working with patients. First, due to legal issues, the patient exposure is minimal or none for most volunteering positions, and second, volunteers almost always have set their minds about becoming a physician beforehand. Therefore, the experiences are not likely to impact their decision. I have seen many of these positions that have involved shelf stocking or moving patients in wheelchairs or recording the duration of visits. While I applaud those who enjoy helping the medical staff of a hospital/clinic voluntarily, I don't think these volunteerings should necessarily be regarded any more important in someone's application than let's say volunteering at food banks etc. I think it is time for medical schools to think outside the box a little bit, and don't force people to do something that is not justified by common sense.

MY EXPERIENCE IN WORKING WITH PATIENTS
I have been trained and worked as an optometric technician. This allowed me to have direct and extensive patient interaction. I however have not done any significant volunteering in hospitals. I actually attempted to do some volunteering, but I found that the position gave me no chance to have any contact with patients. I almost had no contact with doctors neither.

 

[anon-y-mouse]

volunteering shows that a candidate has dedication to public service, and cares about something larger than himself. that, strictly, is the benefit of volunteering. the way you "justify" your volunteer experiences and talk about it as some sort of chore or inane premedical prerequisite betrays a lack of sincerity (to me at least). obviously i could be wrong, but this is just the impression i get.

even if one isn't able to have patient contact in a particular setting (advice here: get another volunteer position), the commitment for an extended period of time can demonstrate strength of character. are you that myopic that you don't believe in the fundamental merits of social service?

 

[Gij]

...are you that myopic that you don't believe in the fundamental merits of social service?

You didn't read my post carefully. Read it again! If you didn't find where you are wrong in saying "are you that myopic...", let me know, and I will clarify.

 

[anon-y-mouse]

No, I'm fully capable of reading. You asked what the value of volunteering was. Medical schools do not 'force' anyone to do anything. If I were an admissions officer, I would consider working with patients a good characteristic of a strong candidate (yes) -- but this would be for vastly different reasons than a candidate who folded sheets. You've got the right idea, that folding sheets at a hospital may not be as rewarding an experience as interacting with patients. You are, however, wrong in thinking that there's a magical hierarchical, value-based checklist of extra-curricular activities. If I were judging candidates, I would ask questions like "has the candidate interacted with patients in a 'medical' setting?" and "does the candidate demonstrate commitment to social service?" Of course folding sheets is stupid if you aren't into it or don't see a point in it. If you're able to answer those questions and love what you're doing, you should have no problems getting admitted. Sorry, I find the issue you've raised utterly pointless.

 

[BigRedZippo]

Moot point/poll. Here, no volunteer (or health care exposure) = no get in.

 

[dilated]

Hospital volunteering is useless but necessary to get in, provided you have some idea what the health care field is like. And if you don't you'll figure it out within 10 hours of volunteering or whatever, the rest is just free labor for a multimillion dollar organization. You too can save MaxiHosp $5.75/hr by stocking syringes!

It infuriated me because if I'm going to spend my time volunteering, I can do it in ways that have a lot more positive impact than replacing someone who would be doing the same job for minimum wage. But oh well, welcome to the world of medical school hoops. It only goes downhill from here.

 

[Law2Doc]

Moot point/poll. Here, no volunteer (or health care exposure) = no get in.

Yes, and there are a few places that actually even like to see both -- i.e. clearly you must have clinical exposure (which can include hospital volunteering, shadowing and the like), but some schools will tell you that the ideal candidate will also have some non-hospital volunteering (charitable, civic or religion related) - the whole Big Brother Big Sister, Habitat for Humanity, soup kitchen kind of stuff. One interviewer specifically waved past my hospital experience, and asked what non-medically related volunteering I did, as the school also considered this an important measure of a candidate.

 

[novawildcat]

Hospital volunteering is useless but necessary to get in, provided you have some idea what the health care field is like. And if you don't you'll figure it out within 10 hours of volunteering or whatever, the rest is just free labor for a multimillion dollar organization. You too can save MaxiHosp $5.75/hr by stocking syringes!

It infuriated me because if I'm going to spend my time volunteering, I can do it in ways that have a lot more positive impact than replacing someone who would be doing the same job for minimum wage. But oh well, welcome to the world of medical school hoops. It only goes downhill from here.

I couldn't agree with this more. There really is not that much time to volunteer when you have to put food on the table and pay the bills.

 

[p00psicleSTICK]

I think volunteering is purely what you make out of it. If you have a volunteer job that you think is useless, you should find a different volunteering job. My advice is to try to find something that is relevant to you. For example, I am a foreigner and luckily, I got to work with disadvantaged refugees and I was able to relate to them which made my job seem a lot more worthwhile. Besides finding a volunteer job that you can relate too, I also think one of the volunteer jobs (clinical or not) should involve helping the less fortunate (esp. if you're from a well-off family), but that's just my opinion. 😉

 

[Shredder]

waste of time. shadowing is enough exposure. i have absolutely no volunteering and got accepted, although im still waiting on my schools of choice. i suspect volunteering 20 yrs ago was meaningless in the admissions process. drs are not public servants, their pay does not attest to servanthood.

dilated is correct on all counts

 

[Gij]

No, I'm fully capable of reading...

I didn't doubt that, but you didn't read carefully again. Did you read that part that I said volunteering in a foodbank should not be reagarded any less important in someone's application? If as you said "service" is what is important, then folding sheets in a hospital and teaching immigrants English shouldn't be different, but in reality they are considered different. Don't tell me what you'd do if you were an admission officer. That was not the question.

 

[Gij]

I know for the fact that there are some (not all) medical schools that first look at volunteering in a hospital. I am trying to get your opinion about that. I also know that there are some other that are less biased. Those are not whom I have problem with.

 

[kimt2234]

I here you and this is a tough one for me too. I am ridiculously busy, as are most of us trying to get A's in our prereq's to compensate for less than stellar gpa's, trying to shadow doctors that will let us, studying for mcat's, working two jobs, and so on. I have volunteered in the past for two years, took a break from that and now wondering if I need to rush out and get a volunteer job doing anything to help my app. I have patient experiences in a hospital so I wouldn't need to volunteer to get hospital experience. But it really is kind of a pain to have to "add" this to the already horendous list of things to do.

I see volunteering in your community or hospital as a thing to do if you have a lot of time on your hands and aren't really spending it doing something prooductive outside of work and home. You know, do something to help society if you aren't doing it threw your job or extra curricular's. I think being put in a position of being "forced" to go out and volunteer when your schedule is already more than full is crap and sort of defeats the purpose of volunteering in the first place. I can tell you when I had less to do, I had more time to devote to volunteering. Toward the end (maybe the last 4-5 months of the two years I was signed up as a volunteer) I was finishing my master's degree and can honestly say my available time diminished quickly and my ability to volunteer lessened a great deal.

And, yes, let us not forget that those of us who have to work and go to school and take care of a house etc. don't have a ton of extra time to give. Adcoms claim they want to see a person being dutiful to society. Well, I consider busting my ass to do well in these classes in order to prepare myself to do well in med school in order to become a physician and take care of people at their time of need being pretty fricken dutiful to society. And let's not even talk about the enormous amount of debt we all go into to apply to med school and ultimately attend med school to be dutiful servants to society as physicians.

People reading this may think it is selfish to complain about having to volunteer to help out your fellow man, but I would rather hold off on volunteering until there is a time when I can actually devote my whole self to the experience then just go out and do it unwillfully and not enjoy it or appreciate the experience as much. I mean who wants to hate when the time comes in the week that they have to go help out society and hate it and literally dread going? I don't care if you are doing something relative to you, it would still suck if you have a ton of stuff to do all the time and have less time to do it because you have to leave for 4 hours or something.

Anyone else feeling me on this "any hour of my time is precious to me" if you are preparing to apply to med school business?

 

[Law2Doc]

i have absolutely no volunteering and got accepted,

Congrats! -- did you get an MD/MBA program?

 

[gdbaby]

My volunteer experience is what made me decide to pursue medicine. I was working as a professor and a fundraiser for a non-profit and decided to start volunteering at The Children's Hospital. I was sitting there holding a baby in the Infant Care Center and realized that this was what I wanted to do (not pediatrics, but medicine). I went home, told my husband, and registered for classes that afternoon. 2.5 years later--__________Med school Class of 2010.

 

[tkdusb]

The first thing that every pre-med knows about is that he/she needs to do some volunteering.

I didn't do any volunteering whatsoever and was accepted at one of my top choices. I've had no trouble with other schools either. I honestly don't know if it's that big of a deal to volunteer. None of my interviewers seems to care when I tell them that I didn't volunteer at all.

EDIT: A reason for this could be that while the activities I've taken part in have been paid jobs, they were very service oriented activities. I go to a terribly expensive school and I figure my interviewers can tell my financial situation and need to earn money to help pay tuition.

Also, I think what Law2Doc said right below me really hits the nail on the head. It all depends on the school you are applying to. Some schools will explicitly state that they don't view volunteering as absolutely crucial, while others specifically state that they consider it essential in an applicant. I would follow Law2Doc's advice and actually find out how the school's which you are interested in applying to view the situation.

 

[Law2Doc]

I didn't do any volunteering whatsoever and was accepted at one of my top choices. I've had no trouble with other schools either. I honestly don't know if it's that big of a deal to volunteer. None of my interviewers seems to care when I tell them that I didn't volunteer at all.

Clearly it is going to depend on the school you apply to. Some schools certainly will be interested in volunteering. If you are not going to volunteer, that's fine, but it pays to find out what level of importance the school puts on it. Sometimes you can glean this from the med school web site or "mission". Otherwise it would be via word of mouth, perhaps.

 

[Thundrstorm]

I did a lot of volunteering, none of which was in a hospital because I like to actually help people when I donate my time, and the opportunities that I found seemed more about padding one's resume than actually being of use. I explained my reasoning to interviewers who wanted to know why. I do realize that actually volunteering, working, or shadowing in a medical setting is important to admissions, so I got a volunteer position at an ER this year, as a sexual assault advocate because I would be filling an actual need of the community. We all have to jump through the hoops to some extent, I guess, but my time is valuable and I'd prefer to spend it volunteering in a way that I find meaningful. It hasn't been a problem so far (one interviewer told me it was, but I have acceptances elsewhere, so...). None of us really knows what being a doctor will be like, whether we've followed one around, changed sheets and bedpans, or read about it in a book. What I do know from my volunteer and work experiences is that I can deal with smelly people, mean people, ungrateful people, homeless people, old people, young people, people from other countries, people with diseases of the mind and body, poor people, and people who don't look like me. And I enjoy it, so I think I'll be alright. In my experience thus far, adcoms agree with me. In this respect, I think both clinical and nonclinical volunteering are useful in terms of admissions and testing your own abilities. Plus, it's just nice to help others, without thought of benefit to yourself.

 

[Law2Doc]

Plus, it's just nice to help others, without thought of benefit to yourself.

Although if you can do both, it's win-win, isn't it?

 

[mantraman1010]

Whether you are volunteering in a hospital or some other setting you should do it because you enjoy it and you want to help people. I am only a scond year undergrad hoping to get into med school, but if you don't there are other roads to follow, is what I have been told and believe it. Volunteering should be a generous gesture rather than a forced once just to put on your resume. There other ways to make your resume look good, and if you do not like volunteering don't do it, medicine would not be the field of choice in MY OPINION is you do not like interaction with others. Just my naive two cents.

 

[mantraman1010]

Excuse my nasty english.

 

[Gij]

Excuse my nasty english.

It breaks my heart to see premeds thinking this way, because this tells that in the next generation of doctors there will still be people who just think that if you don't want to do volunteering in a hospital/doctor's office etc, you don't like interacting with pepole. This is not about me, but if it makes it clear, I have done and still do volunteering as an ESL instructor. This does require interacting with people you help, and arguably very much more so than most hospital volunteerings.
I don't say nobody gets anything out of volunteering in a medical set up, neither do I say that all schools think volunteering in a clinic/doctor's office is more important than other types of volunteering. I do know that poeple get in with no volunteering experience whatsoever, and I am not seeking advice. Although, I certainly thank those who kindly told me what they think I should do. I simply believe there are many people out there that feel they need to spend time in a hospital (even if that does not benefit them) so to make the admission office for some schools happy. This is a truth and can't be denied. The bad thing is that it also works with (some/many) schools.

 

[Mr. Tee]

I think any volunteering is useful if it helped you mature as a person. Medical schools are all about maturity and want to see any activity that helps you mature...just my take on it anyway

 

[Law2Doc]

I simply believe there are many people out there that feel they need to spend time in a hospital (even if that does not benefit them) so to make the admission office for some schools happy. This is a truth and can't be denied. The bad thing is that it also works with (some/many) schools.

I think you are lumping together two different issues. Volunteering and spending time in a hospital. I would suggest that if you don't spend time in a hospital, clinic, or other health care facility, whether volunteer, or paid or in some other capacity, you will have problems with admissions, and rightly so. Medicine is the kind of career you need to go into with your eyes open -- it is not something people should do on a whim. Thus schools expect, and perhaps all even require, a certain amount of clinical exposure, so that you show up with at least a vague idea of what it means to be a physician. It is too many years with too many long hours for someone to go into unless they pretty much know it is what they want to do, and the only way to know that is to see things first hand (not just on Dr 90210).
Volunteering is different, and needn't even be in a hospital. It perhaps shows a willingness to better others' plights, to do an EC that is civic/charitable/religious, but is probably something only heavilly focused on by a handful of schools.
Some folks do both types of EC to better their admissions chances. Some folks do both because that is who they are. Some folks just do the clinical. Different strokes...

 

[bubbleyum]

i think the purpose for volunteering in a hospital is to actually experience the environment from a caregiver's point of view(rather than a patient, as normal people would), so that you have some idea of what you are getting yourself into. adcoms want to know that you are going to be okay with working in a hospital setting, because med school is not something you can just do for a little while and move on to something else if you don't like it. you just put in too much time, effort, money, and emtional stress/sacrifices. so even if you really can't be 100% sure if this is something you will love for the rest of your life until you actually experience it while being a doctor, they want to know that you have at least prepared yourself somewhat. it's not that the only you can prove that you care about your community is by volunteering in the hospital. of course there are other things you can do that may be more fruitful.

in actuality, most volunteers in the hospital don't really "help." i volunteer in the er right now, and what can you really do? you are not a nurse or a tech or an admin. you don't know much and you just do little things like help fetch blankets and stock the syringe pile and glove boxes when needed. most of the time you stand around for hours and do nothing and try to stay out of the way. sometimes it's actually a hindrance almost, because the charge nurse kind of looks at you like she doesn't know what to do with you when you tell her you're a volunteer, and has to try and think of something for you to do so you won't be too bored.

so why do we do it? all for the privilege of being allowed to observe how the doctors work and watch them in the trauma bay etc when a patient is rolled in. to find out that you are able to handle it when you see somebody's arm or leg split open and spurting blood and being sewn up. that you actually like the hospital environment, even if it's not as exciting as it may seem on ER(tv.) and in terms of stocking syringes? i don't mind at all. if that helps ease up the nurse's time, even if they are not busy and just sitting around joking and laughing about their weekend, it helps ease up their work stress, which helps their interaction with the doctors and patients, which helps the hospital go round smoother and more pleasantly in general.

at least that's why i do it.

(now, the only thing that DOES bother me a little is when the nurses forget that you are doing this in your free time for no pay, and order you around like you are some kind of teenaged-underling... 😳 )

 

[prana_md]

no one thinks calling the optometric assistant "myopic" was funny? :crickets:

I love my volunteer job. It helps me chill out from my paying job and from studying and applying. But if you're working your way through school, I'm not going to hold a lack of volunteer experience against you. Because you've got other experience. I think schools just want you to take a break from the books, from the grind. Hang out with humans, the non-pre-med kind. And if you can do some good while you're at it, awesome. I wish more people could volunteer, but paying rent and buying food come first.

 

[LucidSplash]

Just for the clarification, is the OP asking whether we think VOLUNTEERING in a medical environment is important or whether some sort of CLINICAL EXPERIENCE is important?

I think volunteering in general is important, but I've only had paid employment and shadowing as clinical experience. I've volunteered doing other things I enjoyed (helping kids learn to read, creating books on tape for a blind student, etc) but never strictly volunteered in a clinical setting. I don't think the adcoms are looking down on me because I got paid to work at a hospital rather than doing it for free. I think you need to show that you have a commitment to service, which is most easily demonstrated through volunteering - doing something for others that does not materially benefit yourself in an immediate sense.

 

[mantraman1010]

It breaks my heart to see premeds thinking this way, because this tells that in the next generation of doctors there will still be people who just think that if you don't want to do volunteering in a hospital/doctor's office etc, you don't like interacting with pepole. This is not about me, but if it makes it clear, I have done and still do volunteering as an ESL instructor. This does require interacting with people you help, and arguably very much more so than most hospital volunteerings.
I don't say nobody gets anything out of volunteering in a medical set up, neither do I say that all schools think volunteering in a clinic/doctor's office is more important than other types of volunteering. I do know that poeple get in with no volunteering experience whatsoever, and I am not seeking advice. Although, I certainly thank those who kindly told me what they think I should do. I simply believe there are many people out there that feel they need to spend time in a hospital (even if that does not benefit them) so to make the admission office for some schools happy. This is a truth and can't be denied. The bad thing is that it also works with (some/many) schools.

WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TALKIN ABOUT ME FOR?!!!!!
I just said what you said. I just mean please excuse my grammar.

GEEZE LOUIS!!!!!!! 😡

 

[bubbleyum]

WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TALKIN ABOUT ME FOR?!!!!!
I just said what you said. I just mean please excuse my grammar.

GEEZE LOUIS!!!!!!! 😡

(actually, i think he/she hit reply to the wrong post.)

 

[Law2Doc]

Just for the clarification, is the OP asking whether we think VOLUNTEERING in a medical environment is important or whether some sort of CLINICAL EXPERIENCE is important?

I think the water got muddied by the use of the word volunteering. The OP presumably meant clinical experience. Clinical exposure is important. Volunteering (non-health) for some places is also important.

 

[Gij]

WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TALKIN ABOUT ME FOR?!!!!!
I just said what you said. I just mean please excuse my grammar.

GEEZE LOUIS!!!!!!! 😡

I think somewhere you said that "if you don't like interaction with people...". It was interesting for me how you came to that conclusion, based on what I had said earlier. I think there are many people who get the same impression when you tell them that you didn't want to volunteer in a hospital or a clinic. I don't intend to make you or anybody else mad. Your grammar and spelling can't be worse than mine if that makes you feel better.

 

[Gij]

I think the water got muddied by the use of the word volunteering. The OP presumably meant clinical experience. Clinical exposure is important. Volunteering (non-health) for some places is also important.

Getting clinical exposure does not require volunteering. Also volunteering does not necessarily bring clinical exposure. By volunteering I meant volunteering not clinical exposure. There are medical schools that want you to have volunteering experience in a hospital or a physician's office. I believe that in my previous job, I have had far more patient interaction than what a volunteering position at a hospital could get me, but now I see that when it comes to admission volunteering could take you further (in some schools)!! I don't know how to make it any clearer.

PS. I am not trying to prove that my opinion is right. I wanted to get a survey of what pre-meds think of this emphasis on volunteering.

 

[nimotsu]

In many aspects ways it was a waste of time in retrospect, but I think it's extremely important to see medicine from the perspective of all. You mainly get to see the bureaucratic and misc. side of the hospital by volunteering.. so it might be boring but best to see all perspectives.

 

[Shredder]

Congrats! -- did you get an MD/MBA program?

its ohio state, i interviewed there really early like 9/16--their first interview day, and was accepted on the first day after the amcas silence period, mid october. supposedly their turnaround time is 2 weeks and i really appreciate that. however its too similar to ut where i am right now, im hoping for elsewhere. its really the ut of the north, right down to the football, reputation and urban setting. just colder. im applying for the mba later, as getting into the med school is the first and more difficult hurdle. decent business school there but again quite similar to ut, a bit lower though. i didnt do very well in my interview, first one so i was very nervous and fidgety, inarticulate too. basically i got in solely on objective criteria i think. which is really cool, im glad some schools are okay with that.

i think clinical exposure is important for premeds. volunteering no but clinical yes. this is bc its important to show schools that you wont end up quitting medicine and wasting the spot they offered to you. something like that. i too was confused by the unclear distinction between volunteering and clinical exposure in the OP.

 

[Pkboi24]

I volunteered one summer at a big city hospital. It was so boring. I read in the lobby for 4 hours. The nurse never had anything for me to do. I drank tons of coffee and still occasionally went to sleep.

Afterwards, I got a job at the surgery dept of a hospital as a Clinical assistant (or PCT) and in addition to getting paid a good wage, I was getting more patient interaction than ever. One kid even asked for me specifically when he woke from surgery. However, like most pre-medical students, my freewill is forever oppressed by the looming shadow of adcom approbation and so I have once again signed up for volunteering at a local hospital in fear of a lack of volunteering experience.

It's not that I don't want to help people. I love people, but there are certainly more interesting ways of helping the community, such as volunteering at homeless shelters, children's shelters, crisis hotlines, etc.

Oh well, hopefully they'll actually let me do something this time considering I use to get paid to do the same things.

In my opinion (In a perfect world), you should not have to volunteer for the sake of med school admission but rather you should do it because you honestly enjoy working with people and bettering their lives.

However, the world isn't perfect. So we all have to play by the rules.

 

[novawildcat]

adcoms don't live in reality. that is why premeds have to do volunteer work-to make the world a happy and cheerful place and "to help out your fellow man." in reality, a lot of volunteer jobs suck and have no impact on society's problems at all.

 

[Shredder]

adcoms don't live in reality. that is why premeds have to do volunteer work-to make the world a happy and cheerful place and "to help out your fellow man." in reality, a lot of volunteer jobs suck and have no impact on society's problems at all.

very concisely and nicely put. the med school app process in two words--ivory tower

 

[Gij]

Thanks to everybody who voted, but we need more votes!!!!

 

[LizzyM]

In my opinion (In a perfect world), you should not have to volunteer for the sake of med school admission but rather you should do it because you honestly enjoy working with people and bettering their lives.

Those are the applicants I'm looking for.... I like to see some contact with patients whether a volunteer or a paid experience. Shadowing doesn't count in this equation because then the focus seems to be on the doc & not on the experience of the patient.

I like to see some service to the community either as a medical/clinical volunteer or in some other arena (e.g. tutoring/mentoring coaching inner-city kids, soup kitchen/homeless shelter, services for the mentally ill, unemployed or mentally disabled).

 

[anon-y-mouse]

no one thinks calling the optometric assistant "myopic" was funny? :crickets:

thank god someone got it!! 😀

 

[thedelicatessen]

Volunteering is a good experience if you really learn something from it, but if you're just going through the motions to pad your resume, you might as well do something else more productive.