Was I wrong, if so, how wrong?

[atrovariousg]

---

Members don't see this ad.

At a recent interview, the "Director of Student Affairs" finished off our presentation by reading portions of the financial aid packet. No one from financial aid was available evidently. Interviews were over and we (only 7 interviewees) were sitting at a conference table and were all 15 minutes from being on our way. I was very relaxed, not that I had been that tense all day, but here is exactly what transpired.
The interviewee sitting next to me asked the "Director" if there was a limit to the amounts of subsidized and unsubsidized student loans a student to receive. The "Director" was unable to answer the question and only part of the answer was even in the financial aid packet. I raised my hand, and after being acknowledged said the following "I don't mean to interrupt, but I asked the same question at my previous interview and I believe that around $65K in subsidized loans are allowed, and a total of up to around $189K in total (subsidized and unsubsidized) Stafford loans are allowed."
When finished "addressing" the student that asked the question I looked back at the "Director" and was surprised to find her visibly disgusted that I had interrupted her "presentation". I thought for a second that she had gas or was cramping but the look went away as she continued.
I thought about asking her if I had offended her and apologizing before I left, but I just couldn't bring myself to approach the subject.

Was I wrong to interject the information that I did?

Should I have apologized?

Would it matter either way?

Regardless, I received a letter a week later (dated the day after the interview) that said that the school has decided to "decline further consideration of your candidacy".

 

[catalystman]

At a recent interview, the "Director of Student Affairs" finished off our presentation by reading portions of the financial aid packet. No one from financial aid was available evidently. Interviews were over and we (only 7 interviewees) were sitting at a conference table and were all 15 minutes from being on our way. I was very relaxed, not that I had been that tense all day, but here is exactly what transpired.
The interviewee sitting next to me asked the "Director" if there was a limit to the amounts of subsidized and unsubsidized student loans a student to receive. The "Director" was unable to answer the question and only part of the answer was even in the financial aid packet. I raised my hand, and after being acknowledged said the following "I don't mean to interrupt, but I asked the same question at my previous interview and I believe that around $65K in subsidized loans are allowed, and a total of up to around $189K in total (subsidized and unsubsidized) Stafford loans are allowed."
When finished "addressing" the student that asked the question I looked back at the "Director" and was surprised to find her visibly disgusted that I had interrupted her "presentation". I thought for a second that she had gas or was cramping but the look went away as she continued.
I thought about asking her if I had offended her and apologizing before I left, but I just couldn't bring myself to approach the subject.

Was I wrong to interject the information that I did?

Should I have apologized?

Would it matter either way?

Regardless, I received a letter a week later (dated the day after the interview) that said that the school has decided to "decline further consideration of your candidacy".

yes you were wrong... You should have shut up out of humility...

 

[QofQuimica]

I don't think you were "wrong" to say something, but maybe it was a little too zealous. Still, I can't imagine that they wouldn't accept you because of that! Anyway, in the future, you could just handle it by speaking to the other student privately after the presenter has finished and left the room. That way, no one's toes get stepped on.

 

[argonana]

catalystman, are you serious?

i wonder how much "little" things like this can matter at interviews. for instance, at one school, i remembered during the orientation session that i had forgotten to turn my cell phone off (chronic problem of mine). i stuck my hand in my purse and inconspicuously pressed the off button...only to hear a 10-second default "song" play...i'd forgotten my phone did that. i was humiliated and slumped in my seat and mumbled an apology...everyone at the round table turned to look at me...the admissions deans looked PISSED.

 

[atrovariousg]

I don't think you were "wrong" to say something, but maybe it was a little too zealous. Still, I can't imagine that they wouldn't accept you because of that! Anyway, in the future, you could just handle it by speaking to the other student privately after the presenter has finished and left the room. That way, no one's toes get stepped on.

After I said it, I thought the same thing, wishing I had just told the guy afterward.
The reason I was forthcoming with the info was because the director had little to nothing to offer regarding how these students finance $200k in loans. I thought that she would welcome the help, but I was way wrong.

 

[madonna]

catalystman, are you serious?

i wonder how much "little" things like this can matter at interviews. for instance, at one school, i remembered during the orientation session that i had forgotten to turn my cell phone off (chronic problem of mine). i stuck my hand in my purse and inconspicuously pressed the off button...only to hear a 10-second default "song" play...i'd forgotten my phone did that. i was humiliated and kinda slumped in my seat and mumbled an apology...which attracted even more attention; everyone at the round table turned to look at me...the admissions deans looked PISSED.

well they probably did not know your name anyways

 

[Bernito]

After I said it, I thought the same thing, wishing I had just told the guy afterward.
The reason I was forthcoming with the info was because the director had little to nothing to offer regarding how these students finance $200k in loans. I thought that she would welcome the help, but I was way wrong.

What you did is fine. Leaving your cell phone on on the other hand... 👎

 

[jebus]

At a recent interview... I raised my hand, and after being acknowledged said the following "I don't mean to interrupt, but I asked the same question at my previous interview and I believe that around $65K in subsidized loans are allowed, and a total of up to around $189K in total (subsidized and unsubsidized) Stafford loans are allowed." .... I thought for a second that she had gas or was cramping but the look went away as she continued.
Was I wrong to interject the information that I did?
Should I have apologized?
Would it matter either way?
Regardless, I received a letter a week later (dated the day after the interview) that said that the school has decided to "decline further consideration of your candidacy".

I don't think you were wrong. Granted, your view of what transpired vs. her perception may be drastically different, but you did sort of apologize a priori for interrupting - and your "presentation" seemed succinct and thorough. I think your actions were well within their place. But that's just me and it's only based on what you said you did.
I don't know if it might have affected your application. I guess the lesson is, unfortunately, to keep quiet. That's a pretty shîtty lesson. Best of luck with the rest of your applications and interviews.
And I had to laugh when I saw you thought she was gassy. Although you didn't get either, I've been given the gas face and the evil eye all the time. You know the gas face: when you smell something and you say to yourself, "Wait, what is that smell? Hold on, is it ass? No, it couldn't be, but what else could it be? God, whose ass is that? It reeks." Well, you know the half-pained face people make when they are deciding if the effluvia of ass is slowly lurking across the room. I hope they haven't mattered, either.

 

[J1515]

At the very least you learned a lesson. This seems to be a "problem" a lot of pre-meds have - the desire to show off what they know and in the process making an a** of themselves or pissing someone off. Yes, I believe the right thing to do would've been to speak to the applicant privately after the presentation.

 

[MrDreamWeaver]

Na, speak up and express what you know. If they rejected you for saying that, it's probably not a place i would want to attend anyway.

On the other hand, if the Dean wasn't so high-strung, perhaps s/he would have said "Oh great! thanks"

 

[atrovariousg]

At the very least you learned a lesson. This seems to be a "problem" a lot of pre-meds have - the desire to show off what they know and in the process making an a** of themselves or pissing someone off. Yes, I believe the right thing to do would've been to speak to the applicant privately after the presentation.

I used to be like that, but I was just trying to help, not make a name for myself??
I have a hard time playing dumb or kissing ass, might be a bad combination in the interview setting.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

it doesn't seem like a horrible or totally tactless thing to me. maybe the director was p$ssed because she knew she was incompetent to give such a presentation. actually, that's the offensive thing. these schools are asking us to fork over tons of money in tuition, so they should be able to put together a good financial aid presentation. and yes the presentator should know basic facts like how much you can borrow in staffords.

 

[odrade1]

well they probably did not know your name anyways

That's what the passport pictures they make you submit are for!

 

[atrovariousg]

it doesn't seem like a horrible or totally tactless thing to me. maybe the director was p$ssed because she knew she was incompetent to give such a presentation. actually, that's the offensive thing. these schools are asking us to fork over tons of money in tuition, so they should be able to put together a good financial aid presentation. and yes the presentator should know basic facts like how much you can borrow in staffords.

We spend a lot of money on applications, secondary applications, travel and hotel costs, and then even the most basic of questions is left unanswered? Interviewees given dirty looks?
I never meant to step on any toes, but if you are trying to sell me on your school, and why I should spend 4 years there going in debt to the tune of a quarter mil, the least you should do, if you are going to approach the subject of financial aid, is provide answers. IMHO

 

[badlydrawnvik]

i don't really see how it was big deal. i've been at interviews where people giving presentations did not know an answer and said something like "you've probably heard it somewhere else" and another student will chime in with some information. i dont think the director should have been that bothered by it, but i guess we'll never know for certain. i just tend to not really say much in big group sessions, just listen and ask after if i have a question, seems to work out alright.

 

[zurned]

At a recent interview, the "Director of Student Affairs" finished off our presentation by reading portions of the financial aid packet. No one from financial aid was available evidently. Interviews were over and we (only 7 interviewees) were sitting at a conference table and were all 15 minutes from being on our way. I was very relaxed, not that I had been that tense all day, but here is exactly what transpired.
The interviewee sitting next to me asked the "Director" if there was a limit to the amounts of subsidized and unsubsidized student loans a student to receive. The "Director" was unable to answer the question and only part of the answer was even in the financial aid packet. I raised my hand, and after being acknowledged said the following "I don't mean to interrupt, but I asked the same question at my previous interview and I believe that around $65K in subsidized loans are allowed, and a total of up to around $189K in total (subsidized and unsubsidized) Stafford loans are allowed."
When finished "addressing" the student that asked the question I looked back at the "Director" and was surprised to find her visibly disgusted that I had interrupted her "presentation". I thought for a second that she had gas or was cramping but the look went away as she continued.
I thought about asking her if I had offended her and apologizing before I left, but I just couldn't bring myself to approach the subject.

Was I wrong to interject the information that I did?

Should I have apologized?

Would it matter either way?

Regardless, I received a letter a week later (dated the day after the interview) that said that the school has decided to "decline further consideration of your candidacy".

That is the most ridiculous reason for a rejection that I've ever heard. First of all, even if she were pissed, it could have been brought to the attention of the committee when they make a decision on you, which is a month after your interview usually. Rejecting you like that is just plain mean. Even if someone insults the interviewer to his face, they still have to wait 2 months for a rejection. Anyway, it's too bad that it happened, but seriously f**k them for being pricks. WHich school was this?

And I think you did the right thing if you had good info to share. And you did raise your hand and get called on right? You didn't just yell it out. So yea screw them, and go ace ur next interview.

 

[crazy_cavalier]

Oh my god, I love you guys so much. It's good to see that I'm not the only crazy neurotic person who stresses out about the smallest things (e.g. a couple typos on my AMCAS and worried about the way I phrased something in an email I sent out to committees).

Anyway, the Director might have viewed your interjection as pretentious, but I doubt she'd hold it against you in the long run. I'm sure adcom people face many many small annoyances throughout the process and have a certain tolerance/immunity to most of them. The cell phone thing, for instance, is probably something that was loonngg forgotten, as I'm sure your "incident" was as well. I'm pretty sure they'd only hold something against you if you behaved in an inappropriate or vulgar manner (e.g. telling a racy joke), but I don't think raising a simple fact was something so terribly offensive.

That said, however, be cautious in future interviews. And, try not to think about it too much. Relax/breathe 🙂

 

[robotsonic]

I doubt it made a difference in whether you were accepted or rejected. Unfortunately, many physicians have large egos, and one important thing you learn in clinical years of med school is how to STFU. (Note: learn that one quickly or you will suffer.)

 

[atrovariousg]

I doubt it made a difference in whether you were accepted or rejected. Unfortunately, many physicians have large egos, and one important thing you learn in clinical years of med school is how to STFU. (Note: learn that one quickly or you will suffer.)

I'm 31 years old and a long way from having diarrhea of the mouth. I learned a long time ago that you learn more when your mouth isn't moving. However, my quietness has often been mistaken for arrogance as well, and I have to really try to be outgoing lest someone get the wrong 1st impression.

 

[atrovariousg]

It is a fine line, and I was just wondering if I stepped over it.

 

[QofQuimica]

It is a fine line, and I was just wondering if I stepped over it.

Don't sweat it, atro. Even if she was a little annoyed with you, I think you're worrying way too much about something that this person has likely long forgotten about. When a school rejects you, it's easy to want to blame yourself and try to figure out what you did wrong, but maybe they just decided you're not the right fit for their school. That doesn't mean you won't be a good fit somewhere else. Just don't do any more financial aid presentations at your interviews in the future. 😉

 

[atrovariousg]

Good advice.
Thanks Q.

 

[63768]

i also don't think it hurt you in anyway. i personally just keep my mouth shut in cases like these. it's not a pressing question, but something to be pursued in the event of an acceptance/applying for finaid.

 

[Babooshka]

yes you were wrong... You should have shut up out of humility...

humility? what the hell has this guy got to be humble about? He knew the information that helped someone out.

atrovariousg, you did alright. If you got rejected for this, you got shafted by the system, but cheers. I don't thikn it was very probable to have affected your decision, if your interviewer was reasonable and fair.

 

[BooMed]

I doubt it made a difference in whether you were accepted or rejected. Unfortunately, many physicians have large egos, and one important thing you learn in clinical years of med school is how to STFU. (Note: learn that one quickly or you will suffer.)

That's terrible. And it's one of the reasons that patients can be receive operations on the wrong body part or organs with the wrong blood type--everybody is too afraid to tell the head doctor when he/she is wrong. 🙁

 

[atrovariousg]

humility? what the hell has this guy got to be humble about? He knew the information that helped someone out.

atrovariousg, you did alright. If you got rejected for this, you got shafted by the system, but cheers. I don't thikn it was very probable to have affected your decision, if your interviewer was reasonable and fair.

Yah.....uh my interviewers were both foreigners so I'm not so sure about their evaluations of me, as I'm not sure they could even understand me???🙂

 

[benelswick]

My 2 pesos...

Big Academic Medicine Title = moderate probability of BIG EGO

Large egos require considerable maintenance paramount to making sure you know your place....beneath them to be specific.

So in the future you can duck them as it requires much less of your effort. The fact that you said nothing wrong and were in fact being sincerely helpful is not the take home message in my opinion. Congratulations on your interviews!--Ben.