Western VS KCUMB (for a CA resident)

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pickledcucumbers

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So I was recently accepted to both Western and KCUMB. I'm from California so I'd preferably wanna do residency/practice here.

PROS:
KCUMB = cheaper tuition (~10k cheaper)/cheaper cost of living, i like the curriculum better, solid DO program overall with good reputation (dunno how much PDs care about this)
Western = close to family and friends, in California (dunno how much of an impact this has on residency matching)

Any advice on how to decide, especially how to weigh going to a school where you want to do your residency vs going to a school with a better curriculum (in my opinion - seems like KCUMB's new curriculum would better prepare you for boards?)
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pickledcucumbers said:
So I was recently accepted to both Western and KCUMB. I'm from California so I'd preferably wanna do residency/practice here.

PROS:
KCUMB = cheaper tuition/cost of living (10k cheaper), i like the curriculum better, solid DO program overall with good reputation (dunno how much PDs care about this)
Western = close to family and friends, in California (dunno how much of an impact this has on residency matching)

Any advice on how to decide, especially how to weigh going to a school where you want to do your residency vs going to a school with a better curriculum (in my opinion - seems like KCUMB's new curriculum would better prepare you for boards?)
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I think WesternU will give you a better fighting chance to do GME in CA but again, it's extremely competitive to land good residencies in CA for both MD and DO, so I don't think location matters that much beyond providing you with opportunities to complete Sub-I's here.

Another big part of landing residency in CA is having good board scores. Now will KCUMB provide you with that because of their new curriculum? Perhaps, but it isn't guaranteed you'll do well.

Because KCUMB is cheaper and has good affiliations with UMKC-SOM and UKMS, and consistently matches a good amount of their grads at very high tier programs at mayo, Cleveland clinic, and other east coast MD university hospitals, id go ( will be going) to KCUMB.

But again, if you are adamant about staying in CA then go to WesternU!

Hopefully that helps!
 
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Both are great schools and I had to choose between the 2 last year. Ultimately I chose KCUMB because it was cheaper but in retrospect I would have given WesternU a bit more consideration.

Family is a big part of a support group and you have to decide if the extra money is worth it.
 
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Go with WesternU.

Both are good schools, but I can't stress enough the importance of having a support group close to you when you are attending med school. Also, if you ultimately want to do your residency in CA, being a WesternU's grad gives you a better chance. The match list confirms this.

Yes, KCUMB is cheaper, but 10k/year is a fair price to pay to be closer to your family and loved ones and to be attending a school in an area where you are more comfortable living in.
 
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How is the COA difference only 10k? The tuition difference is 8k+ alone.. I would think that living expenses would be more than 2 more grand a year living in Pomona vs KC; however, I have never lived in BOTH places so maybe someone who has can chime in?
 
ChiTownBHawks said:
How is the COA difference only 10k? The tuition difference is 8k+ alone.. I would think that living expenses would be more than 2 more grand a year living in Pomona vs KC; however, I have never lived in BOTH places so maybe someone who has can chime in?
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sorry, meant to say tuition cost was around a 10k difference, not COA. fixed my original post.
 
Ibn Alnafis MD said:
Go with WesternU.

Both are good schools, but I can't stress enough the importance of having a support group close to you when you are attending med school. Also, if you ultimately want to do your residency in CA, being a WesternU's grad gives you a better chance. The match list confirms this.

Yes, KCUMB is cheaper, but 10k/year is a fair price to pay to be closer to your family and loved ones and to be attending a school in an area where you are more comfortable living in.
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Disagree. I wouldn't pick this place if I had other places to go now that I know it.
 
pickledcucumbers said:
So I was recently accepted to both Western and KCUMB. I'm from California so I'd preferably wanna do residency/practice here.

PROS:
KCUMB = cheaper tuition (~10k cheaper)/cheaper cost of living, i like the curriculum better, solid DO program overall with good reputation (dunno how much PDs care about this)
Western = close to family and friends, in California (dunno how much of an impact this has on residency matching)

Any advice on how to decide, especially how to weigh going to a school where you want to do your residency vs going to a school with a better curriculum (in my opinion - seems like KCUMB's new curriculum would better prepare you for boards?)
Click to expand...

My friends who went/go to Western have been horribly upset with administration. They get assigned all over the place for rotations, and sometimes after arranging housing find out their rotation site has been cancelled on them within days of starting. Way too often, the onus seems to be on them to do extra work to secure their rotation site if they don't want to be screwed. Because they send people all over the place, some have had rotations with essentially no teaching, while others have had great experiences. At one point, I did a geriatric/rehab elective at an outside institution, and there were Western students on the same team who were there for all of their 3rd year internal med rotations -- at a rehab hospital where there is essentially no acute medicine and you cannot learn the basics to form the foundation of your IM training. Administration apparently doesn't care which you get as long as they get their tuition. Several students have expressed to me that they feel like Western is exclusively run like a business with no concern for the actual students or their education. One of my friends got terrible advising and then didn't match (after following all of the advice they offered and in spite of being in the top half of the class and applying in a reasonable field), and was offered no assistance in the SOAP process.

I know little to nothing abotu KCUMB, but I know this is glaringly different from experiences at my school, and I think for the tuition, students deserve better.
 
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I am a Canadian and facing the same challenge, but I am leaning towards KCUMB (just my one Canadian cent :)
 
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pickledcucumbers said:
interesting, care to elaborate?
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Once you are in medical school, you'll understand the value of your time. All this school does is waste your time with unnecessary things. Also the quackery and pro-osteopathic kool-aid is pretty annoying. We had a teacher say that if they call you an "MD" then they are demoting you and the OMM faculty makes crazy claims like fixing renal failure through OMM.
 
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AlbinoHawk DO said:
Once you are in medical school, you'll understand the value of your time. All this school does is waste your time with unnecessary things. Also the quackery and pro-osteopathic kool-aid is pretty annoying. We had a teacher say that if they call you an "MD" then they are demoting you and the OMM faculty makes crazy claims like fixing renal failure through OMM.
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Whoah, that's crazy...I didn't know OMM was that focused at WesternU
 
AlteredScale said:
Whoah, that's crazy...I didn't know OMM was that focused at WesternU
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Try 4 hours a week when the average school does 2 or 1.5. We have so many crazy osteopaths here, and the OMM fellows walk around like they are better than everybody else.
 
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pickledcucumbers said:
So I was recently accepted to both Western and KCUMB. I'm from California so I'd preferably wanna do residency/practice here.

PROS:
KCUMB = cheaper tuition (~10k cheaper)/cheaper cost of living, i like the curriculum better, solid DO program overall with good reputation (dunno how much PDs care about this)
Western = close to family and friends, in California (dunno how much of an impact this has on residency matching)

Any advice on how to decide, especially how to weigh going to a school where you want to do your residency vs going to a school with a better curriculum (in my opinion - seems like KCUMB's new curriculum would better prepare you for boards?)
Click to expand...

Found a thread from a few years back with the same topic. Some good info on it though, hope it helps! Note the new curriculum at KCUMB is not entirely systems-based as stated in the thread below (check out the school thread for info on it).
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/kcumb-vs-western-comp.462602/#post-5783382
 
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.
 
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AlbinoHawk DO said:
Try 4 hours a week when the average school does 2 or 1.5. We have so many crazy osteopaths here, and the OMM fellows walk around like they are better than everybody else.
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I'm not sure if KCUMB also does 4 hours or if was 2. But that type of attitude regarding the OMM fellow is unfortunate...

MaduNotSoff said:
Found a thread from a few years back with the same topic. Some good info on it though, hope it helps! Note the new curriculum at KCUMB is not entirely systems-based as stated in the thread below (check out the school thread for info on it).
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/kcumb-vs-western-comp.462602/#post-5783382
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Correct, as per Dean Dr. Dubin the new curriculum is a modified application based/systems based curriculum that IMO most closely represents the preclinical curriculum at Loma Linda (http://www.llu.edu/medicine/admissions/curriculum.page), all systems are covered in each year but year 1 covers normal function while year two covers pathology and pharm. On top of that I've heard from current students such as @chizledfrmstone and @Stagg737 that their questions are "board style" so they feel very well prepared for their Step 1.
 
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AlbinoHawk DO said:
Disagree. I wouldn't pick this place if I had other places to go now that I know it.
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Your opinion is stemming off your disapproval of OMM rather than your discontent with the school. Therefore, it is irrelevant to the the topic of this thread.
 
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AlbinoHawk DO said:
You know that it goes way beyond that. The school's curriculum is ridiculous. You even said you agreed over here: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/frustrated-with-m1-curriculum.1103370/page-2#post-15794694 How about YOU talk about this stuff since I know you're very discontent with this.
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My impression has been that these things are not specific to our school. In fact they are not specific to DO schools, with the exception of OMM of course.

I'm not here to praise my school and say it's the best. I'm merely responding to the KCUMB vs WesternU question with respect to the OP's situation (being a CA resident and having the desire to stay there for residency and beyond).
 
Ibn Alnafis MD said:
My impression has been that these things are not specific to our school. In fact they are not specific to DO schools, with the exception of OMM of course.

I'm not here to praise my school and say it's the best. I'm merely responding to the KCUMB vs WesternU question with respect to the OP's situation (being a CA resident and having the desire to stay there for residency and beyond).
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So I take it you're enjoying IPE which only WesternU has? Why aren't you preparing for your presentation?
 
AlbinoHawk DO said:
So I take it you're enjoying IPE which only WesternU has? Why aren't you preparing for your presentation?
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Haha. Ok, you got me with IPE. I surrender.:oops:

On a serious note, I'm very happy that WesternU gave me the opportunity to pursue my dream without having to relocate out of SoCal. there are several thing that I wish were different about our school and it's curriculum. None of these, however, I'd consider a deal breaker.
 
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Ibn Alnafis MD said:
Haha. Ok, you got me with IPE. I surrender.:oops:

On a serious note, I'm very happy that WesternU gave me the opportunity to pursue my dream without having to relocate out of SoCal. there are several thing that I wish were different about our school and it's curriculum. None of these, however, I'd consider a deal breaker.
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To a point, I agree, but when you're paying 52k in tuition and you know they didn't give you the chance based on nothing, I think it isn't a bad idea to be critical.
 
I just learned KCUMB has mandatory attendance. If that's the case, WesternU vs KCUMB, I'd choose neither.
 
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WesternU has it's flaws, that's for certain. One of the great things is (if you so choose) you never have to set foot in the building unless it's lab, quiz, test etc. You can stream all lectures at home. I like attending lectures, so I'm there all day.

Medical school is a business. No point in arguing otherwise, so, like in any business, you make of it what you choose. Forge the necessary connections to perhaps get you slightly ahead when it comes time to arrange rotations, or, as an Ortho resident told us, make your own arrangements and tell the admin where you're going afterward.

This (school) is a means to an end and try to enjoy as much of it as possible. I argued (big shocker right?) my way through Chiro school and I regret that. Remember, the first 2 years of school are to pass boards and not look as much the fool when you enter your first rotation. That's it.
 
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AlbinoHawk DO said:
I just learned KCUMB has mandatory attendance. If that's the case, WesternU vs KCUMB, I'd choose neither.
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for the record, i don't think it's mandatory anymore. they recently changed it

also, i appreciate the feedback everyone. love to hear more though - mainly how much of a leg up would going to a CA school give me in applying for CA residencies
 
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Plecopotamus said:
My friends who went/go to Western have been horribly upset with administration. They get assigned all over the place for rotations, and sometimes after arranging housing find out their rotation site has been cancelled on them within days of starting. Way too often, the onus seems to be on them to do extra work to secure their rotation site if they don't want to be screwed. Because they send people all over the place, some have had rotations with essentially no teaching, while others have had great experiences. At one point, I did a geriatric/rehab elective at an outside institution, and there were Western students on the same team who were there for all of their 3rd year internal med rotations -- at a rehab hospital where there is essentially no acute medicine and you cannot learn the basics to form the foundation of your IM training. Administration apparently doesn't care which you get as long as they get their tuition. Several students have expressed to me that they feel like Western is exclusively run like a business with no concern for the actual students or their education. One of my friends got terrible advising and then didn't match (after following all of the advice they offered and in spite of being in the top half of the class and applying in a reasonable field), and was offered no assistance in the SOAP process.

I know little to nothing abotu KCUMB, but I know this is glaringly different from experiences at my school, and I think for the tuition, students deserve better.
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It seems with almost any DO school you can find posts like this filled with stinging complains about education, administration, etc.

But it's surprising to see this with even established schools like COMP. Being decades old, one would figure they would have a handle on these kinds of issues by now.
 
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Plecopotamus said:
My friends who went/go to Western have been horribly upset with administration. They get assigned all over the place for rotations, and sometimes after arranging housing find out their rotation site has been cancelled on them within days of starting. Way too often, the onus seems to be on them to do extra work to secure their rotation site if they don't want to be screwed. Because they send people all over the place, some have had rotations with essentially no teaching, while others have had great experiences. At one point, I did a geriatric/rehab elective at an outside institution, and there were Western students on the same team who were there for all of their 3rd year internal med rotations -- at a rehab hospital where there is essentially no acute medicine and you cannot learn the basics to form the foundation of your IM training. Administration apparently doesn't care which you get as long as they get their tuition. Several students have expressed to me that they feel like Western is exclusively run like a business with no concern for the actual students or their education. One of my friends got terrible advising and then didn't match (after following all of the advice they offered and in spite of being in the top half of the class and applying in a reasonable field), and was offered no assistance in the SOAP process.

I know little to nothing abotu KCUMB, but I know this is glaringly different from experiences at my school, and I think for the tuition, students deserve better.
Click to expand...

Just wanted to address one thing in your post..KCUMB has also had rotation sites cancelled after starting. Happened to a friend who just graduated this past may. Not sure about the details on why or anything, but I remember his parents saying he had to go elsewhere because the program shut down. No comment on the rest of your post.
 
pickledcucumbers said:
for the record, i don't think it's mandatory anymore. they recently changed it

also, i appreciate the feedback everyone. love to hear more though - mainly how much of a leg up would going to a CA school give me in applying for CA residencies
Click to expand...

If you want to to to Cali for residency, the. Automatically you have an advantage with western full stop. Doing core rotations and electives will give you way more exposure to the system and ability to get good LORs etc.

It is definitely possible to get a Cali residency as a oos, but with Cali being a big destination it will be harder with only a few electives comparatively and if you're not as stellar of an applicant boars score wise.

2cents.
 
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also interviewed and got accepted at westernu. shabby, run down campus, was not impressed by the vibe i got while i was there. if the interviews reflect the school, then anyone attending can expect an cold environment where nobody seems to be enjoying themselves.
KCUMB gets my vote, might see you there in the fall!
 
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stuski said:
also interviewed and got accepted at westernu. shabby, run down campus, was not impressed by the vibe i got while i was there. if the interviews reflect the school, then anyone attending can expect an cold environment where nobody seems to be enjoying themselves.
KCUMB gets my vote, might see you there in the fall!
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It's very crowd specific. If you're the type that's really extroverted and you can pass your classes without having to commit your entire week, you'll find people to enjoy yourself with.
 
serenade said:
Really? Why?
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I am from California and had been thinking about WesternU since I thought about being a D.O.. Here are a list of reasons I would not attend WesternU. Please be aware these are my opinions and some of y'all may not agree.


1. Upon arriving at Western, the first thing that I noticed was the lack of beauty on campus. It literally looks like a run down strip mall in some places. My girlfriend was like "um...is this the school?" I interviewed at Campbell, KCUMB, and DMU and those campuses are much nicer. Nicer buildings, nicer scenery, and nicely landscaped. I want to go to a school that doesn't remind me of my community college or high school. The smog in Pomona also doesn't help the situation. KCUMB has a very nice campus with lots of trees, grass, and bushes. The building are all brick which give it that "established" old school feeling which I liked.

2. The feeling I got at Western was not one that I enjoyed. Although I was very appreciative of the interview invite and was lucky to have the interview, they acted as though everyone there was "lucky to be there." I felt as though Western thinks they are THE top D.O. school in the nation and no one even comes close. It's one thing to think highly of your institution, but to act like you are the shiznit is a turn off. At the other 3 schools I interviewed at, I felt as though they WANTED me there and they made me feel that way. The administration was very friendly at KCUMB and the students were super cool.

3. WesternU is stupid expensive. 50,000+ a year??? LOL. Maybe they should put some of that money into the campus? Not only is the school expensive, but living in California (especially Pomona area) is expensive. I've lived in San Diego my entire life and would like to start saving some of my money instead of spending it all on housing. KCUMB is also pricey, but you will save a ton of money on living expenses.

4. WesternU anatomy lab smelled like....well....you know. It wasn't well ventilated at all. KCUMB has a much nicer lab. Campbell has the BEST anatomy lab that I saw though IMO.

5. The MASHED POTATOES tasted like cleaning solution (serious about this, but I am messing around).

These are a few of the reasons I wouldn't have accepted my acceptance at WesternU.
 
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SynapticDoctah said:
5. The potato salad tasted like cleaning solution (serious about this, but I am messing around).
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Pretty sure they were mashed taters ;)

In all seriousness though to OP and anyone else reading this, I felt the same way as SynapticDoctah about WesternU after my interview there. I definitely would pick KCUMB over WesternU between the two. However, only you can know how important it is for you to stay in Cali/close to your family and friends. For me this was a very important part of my school choice.
 
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Well, then. See you August first lol...
 
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+ we should have a really great/competitive class at KCUMB! ;)
 
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ananasmed said:
Pretty sure they were mashed taters ;)

In all seriousness though to OP and anyone else reading this, I felt the same way as SynapticDoctah about WesternU after my interview there. I definitely would pick KCUMB over WesternU between the two. However, only you can know how important it is for you to stay in Cali/close to your family and friends. For me this was a very important part of my school choice.
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Ummmm....no. ;)
 
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