What are my chances with my grades?

[jakob95]

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Hello all I am a third year undergraduate student in Hunter College going into my spring semester of Junior year. At first I was really undecided about what I wanted to do, but now I am leaning towards Pharmacy/Dentistry. Now my question here is I live in NYC so I would most likely want to go to a local pharmacy school around here such as Long Island University or Touro College. I am planning to graduate next year in Hunter College with a Psychology degree, and at the same time I am taking my pre-health prerequisites. The problem is my GPA is kind of bad especially my science grades, so far with 83.50 credits my GPA is a 3.355. My science grades/math grades however are very low and they are:
Biology 1 (4.5 Credit Class): B,
Biology 2 (4.5 Credit Class): B
General Chemistry 1(4 Credit Class): B
General Chemistry 2(4 Credit Class): B+
General Chemistry Lab (3 Credit Class) A+
Organic Chemistry 1 (4 Credit Class): B-
Organic Chemistry 1 Lab (3 Credit Class): A-
PreCal (4 Credit Class): B+
Calculus (4 Credit Class): C

As you can see my grades are pretty terrible as I don't have any A's in any of the lecture science classes. This is a major reason why I decided not to pursue dentistry, but am I also screwed with Pharmacy? I still need to take Organic Chemistry 2 and its lab which I am doing now, and will be taking Anatomy 1,2, Biochemistry, and MicroBio all next year in my senior year.

 

[HealthCareProfessional]

According to Pharmcas, both Touro and Long Island have an average gpa of 3.3. So to be competitive you need to have a cumulative and science gpa >3.3. This is not a cutoff but usually the higher, the better. Your cumulative seems okay since it is just above the average mark, and im not sure if youre science gpa surpasses 3.3. Have you taken the pcat? If you have and scored well (>85) then you should be fine (though i dont think touro requires pcat)! But definitely try to improve your gpa further with your orgo 2, anat, biochem, and microbio. Good luck and dont lose hope!

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[jakob95]

I still haven't took the Pcat will be taking it this summer most likely. Another thing is LIU doesn't need BioChemistry, while Touro needs it. On the other hand LIU needs Physics 1, while Touro does not. So I have to decide what school I have the best chance of getting into as well so I know which class to take as I only have 1 year left of school and don't intend to waste time and stay an extra year over one class. I don't think I would be able to honestly take Physics plus Biochemistry because that would be a killer and extremely hard to do so in Hunter.

 

[Pharmerjoe77]

Pharmacy school isn't hard to get into anymore. A lot of schools end up taking students who only meet the minimum requirements. It's basically become a scam. I'd recommend looking into other options. The future is no longer looking so good for the profession.

 

[jakob95]

Pharmacy school isn't hard to get into anymore. A lot of schools end up taking students who only meet the minimum requirements. It's basically become a scam. I'd recommend looking into other options. The future is no longer looking so good for the profession.

What recommendations do you suggest? And when you mean that do you mean in general, or are you talking about LIU and Touro?

 

[HealthCareProfessional]

In general, the fact that there are numerous pharmacy schools makes it relatively easy to get into A pharmacy school. Its also hard to find jobs in retail in metro areas (not too sure about hospital, industry, govt etc), and these problems are apparently worse in NY where there are about 7 or 8 pharmacy schools. There is saturation in all professions (dentistry, physiotherapy...) but retail pharmacy is a little severe. If you enjoy hospital, or industrial pharmacy, OR if youre willing to relocate then its not bad. Im canadian so my situation is slightly different

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[Pharmerjoe77]

What recommendations do you suggest? And when you mean that do you mean in general, or are you talking about LIU and Touro?

No sadly it's the whole field. I would be scared out of my mind if I was just starting pharmacy school. I'm an experienced pharmacist and upset and the market situation and outlook of the profession.... I'm thinking pharmacist will be a very unstable and low paying job in the future. If I was doing undergrad now then I would definitely go into software engineering. I'd recommend looking into it. Or if you want to do something in the medical field then I'd put in the time to become a physician. Or there's nursing, dentistry or PA. All much better options than becoming a pharmacist.

 

[jakob95]

No sadly it's the whole field. I would be scared out of my mind if I was just starting pharmacy school. I'm an experienced pharmacist and upset and the market situation and outlook of the profession.... I'm thinking pharmacist will be a very unstable and low paying job in the future. If I was doing undergrad now then I would definitely go into software engineering. I'd recommend looking into it. Or if you want to do something in the medical field then I'd put in the time to become a physician. Or there's nursing, dentistry or PA. All much better options than becoming a pharmacist.

I mean I already took so many of the science classes and I actually would like to do something with them, going to something like software engineer would make my 3 years of college completely a waste of time pretty much.

 

[Pharmerjoe77]

I mean I already took so many of the science classes and I actually would like to do something with them, going to something like software engineer would make my 3 years of college completely a waste of time pretty much.

I'd do PA school or nursing if you want to minimize your time in school but still have a promising career. Oh or dentistry, much smarter choice than pharmacy.

 

[PharmtoCS]

I mean I already took so many of the science classes and I actually would like to do something with them, going to something like software engineer would make my 3 years of college completely a waste of time pretty much.

The science courses you took are a sunk cost. You have already spent the time and money taking these courses, and there is little practical use of them other than going to PA or dentistry school if you want job security. I would consider going to a coding boot camp or learning programming on your own. Doing so would cost a fraction of the $200k+ you will be spending on pharmacy school, yet land you much better job prospects and decent pay.

If you want to stay in NYC, then I would go toward a career in finance or computer programming, as those types of jobs are abundant in NYC. If you choose pharmacy, you will most likely be forced to relocate anyway since there are pretty much no job openings in NYC.

 

[TheFactionless]

The science courses you took are a sunk cost. You have already spent the time and money taking these courses, and there is little practical use of them other than going to PA or dentistry school if you want job security. I would consider going to a coding boot camp or learning programming on your own. Doing so would cost a fraction of the $200k+ you will be spending on pharmacy school, yet land you much better job prospects and decent pay.

If you want to stay in NYC, then I would go toward a career in finance or computer programming, as those types of jobs are abundant in NYC. If you choose pharmacy, you will most likely be forced to relocate anyway due to the difficulty of landing a job in NYC.

Who the heck is paying 200k for pharmacy school?

 

[Pharmerjoe77]

Who the heck is paying 200k for pharmacy school?

Apparently it's pretty common. I've paid off my student loans but still regret pharmacy.

 

[PharmtoCS]

Who the heck is paying 200k for pharmacy school?

The OP is from NYC which has a very high cost of living. Touro's tuition alone is $40k/year.

The private schools in Southern California charge around $50k/year in tuition.

 

[Pharmerjoe77]

The OP is from NYC which has a very high cost of living. Touro's tuition alone is $40k/year.

The private schools in Southern California charge around $50k/year in tuition.

That is just sickening. So foolish to take on that kind of debt for a field that has terrible prospects for the future. So sad. All these greedy pharmacy schools upset me. Even the state/public and reputable schools are to blame for expanding class sizes.

 

[PharmtoCS]

That is just sickening. So foolish to take on that kind of debt for a field that has terrible prospects for the future. So sad. All these greedy pharmacy schools upset me. Even the state/public and reputable schools are to blame for expanding class sizes.

The only real pharmacy school admission standard that's left is the amount of loan money you are willing to sign away.

 

[Pharmerjoe77]

The only real pharmacy school admission standard that's left is the amount of loan money you are willing to sign away.

Exactly. So it blows me away to see people actually concerned about even getting into pharmacy school... Here I am, a practicing pharmacist who's been out a while wishing I would have done something else. Unfortunately I didn't know pharmacy schools would become such a big scam.

 

[Amicable Angora]

Take the PCAT.

 

[HealthCareProfessional]

Can someone discourage students any further?! Seriously, we're supposed to defend why pharmacy is still good among other healthcare fields not ask people to look for other jobs. There are still people who are crazy/dumb enough, like me, who like this profession that are planning on going to pharmacy schools knowing all this! ( im passionate about it lol) The OP just wanted to know about his chances not hear you guys whine about the profession... there are a million threads about this on sdn already and we get it!

OP take the PCAT if youre still interested! Im sure youll have no problems getting in

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[TheFactionless]

The OP is from NYC which has a very high cost of living. Touro's tuition alone is $40k/year.

The private schools in Southern California charge around $50k/year in tuition.

Wow. Although I'm looking to go to pharm school, I would never pay that much to do it. I'm allergic to debt. If I get into my first choice I already have 2 years worth of school saved up. Aiming for 3.

 

[Saito]

Don't fall for the software "engineering" meme. You'll be a code monkey working for 40k in a cubical. I'd rather be a pill pusher for 90k.
Health care is garbage and it'll get even worse. Unfortunately, most pre-meds are socially disabled, either through being type B personalities, or by being beaten by their parents as kids. They were forced into it basically, and can no longer "imagine" being any other profession.
Yes, the market for pharm school is garbage in NYC, but it's much better in cities like Boston and Austin, not to mention it gives you a pretty kickass health background that you can combine with a marketing degree, MBA, or even your psych degree. I wouldn't worry about jobs right now. Debt too, just take a class or two at a CC every semester and fail it and you'll be a "student" who "can't pay off their loans yet".
Anyway, my grades are similar to yours, although I have more As but a C+ in Orgo 1 sadly. Doing science at a CUNY is awful. Also haven't taken the PCAT yet, but I'm a sophomore. If you do apply keep us updated.

 

[PharmtoCS]

Don't fall for the software "engineering" meme. You'll be a code monkey working for 40k in a cubical. I'd rather be a pill pusher for 90k.

Many of my peers started out with $100k+ salaries straight out of undergrad; I do not hear of many positions that pay less than $75k. That is not profession school with $200k+ loans, but undergrad. Software engineers are in very high demand right now.

Unfortunately, most pre-meds are socially disabled, either through being type B personalities, or by being beaten by their parents as kids. They were forced into it basically, and can no longer "imagine" being any other profession.

Same with pharmacy, from what I see on this board. They fail to consider other careers such as computer programming that have better job prospects and provide much better returns on investment, that is they do not require you take out $200k+ in loans.

I wouldn't worry about jobs right now. Debt too, just take a class or two at a CC every semester and fail it and you'll be a "student" who "can't pay off their loans yet".

Who cares about student loans and job prospects? Just charge up $300k+ in loans, throw in a BMW & a nice vacation around the world, work 8 hours a week, and never pay it back.

 

[HealthCareProfessional]

Many of my peers started out with $100k+ salaries straight out of undergrad. That is not profession school with $200k+ loans, but undergrad. Software engineers are in very high demand right now.



Same with pharmacy, from what I see on this board. They fail to consider other careers such as computer programming that have better job prospects and provide much better returns on investment, that is they do not require you take out $200k+ in loans.



Who cares about student loans and job prospects? Just charge up $300k+ in loans, throw in a BMW & a nice vacation around the world, work 8 hours a week, and never pay it back.

Good for them. All i ask is to keep these threads "pharmacy friendly" and encouraging, as some of us to your amazement are seriously considering pharmacy... after all thats what this forum was designed for.

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[Sugoi Travis]

Good for them. All i ask is to keep these threads "pharmacy friendly" and encouraging, as some of us to your amazement are seriously considering pharmacy... after all thats what this forum was designed for.

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Don't take the doom-and-gloom posts that seriously. Yeah pharmacy is not in a great position right now but it's not like the sky is falling and armageddon is upon us. You can still get a job but you damn well should know that you're going to have to work very hard for it.

 

[jokersmiles]

Your chances of admission are very good.

Even though a 3.3 is a very weak GPA for medical and dental school standards, it is competitive for pharmacy school.

If you want to pursue dentistry retake your low scores and get an A, or take upper division courses to show you can do the work.
Getting accepted with a 3.3 will be difficult so you must get a 22 on your DAT (99 percentile) and have strong dental background.
Moreover, the fact that you have no As on the sciences is a huge red flag, if you can't do well in undergrad science courses
how will you compete against dental students that averaged 3.6 science GPAs in college? Improve yourself before applying.

If you want to go to pharmacy school a 3.3 GPA is perfect and you will have no trouble getting into the best pharmacy schools.
Many schools don't even require the PCAT, this along with the fact that GPA averages are insanely low makes admission a joke.
The future of pharmacy isn't good and your classmates will be filled with people that couldn't get into better professional programs
but if this is the choice you make then good luck. Just a tip, if pharmacy school is the goal you should never worry about your GPA
since everyone gets in.

 

[Saito]

Many of my peers started out with $100k+ salaries straight out of undergrad; I do not hear of many positions that pay less than $75k. That is not profession school with $200k+ loans, but undergrad. Software engineers are in very high demand right now.



Same with pharmacy, from what I see on this board. They fail to consider other careers such as computer programming that have better job prospects and provide much better returns on investment, that is they do not require you take out $200k+ in loans.



Who cares about student loans and job prospects? Just charge up $300k+ in loans, throw in a BMW & a nice vacation around the world, work 8 hours a week, and never pay it back.

Software Engineering is a meme career currently. What I mean by that is employers have a very large pool of workers that they can exploit. It's the new pharmacy. They can pump and dump workers as they wish. One minute you're making 90k the next you're on the street because despite being 23 and talented, they hired the 22 year old they just interviewed. And it'll only get worse with everyone being pushed into it and making an even larger prospective worker pool. The only major that will give you a high paying, steady job is Finance. And you have to be very articulate, good looking and sociable for that; god knows most pre-meds can't even get through a sentence without stuttering. Basically if you're Donald Draper with a Finance degree (or any degree honestly) you're set for life.
I don't see why people make loans out to be such a big deal. If anything you can use them for a lot of benefits and there are very easy ways to avoid making payments, like having a student status.

 

[jakob95]

Your chances of admission are very good.

Even though a 3.3 is a very weak GPA for medical and dental school standards, it is competitive for pharmacy school.

If you want to pursue dentistry retake your low scores and get an A, or take upper division courses to show you can do the work.
Getting accepted with a 3.3 will be difficult so you must get a 22 on your DAT (99 percentile) and have strong dental background.
Moreover, the fact that you have no As on the sciences is a huge red flag, if you can't do well in undergrad science courses
how will you compete against dental students that averaged 3.6 science GPAs in college? Improve yourself before applying.

If you want to go to pharmacy school a 3.3 GPA is perfect and you will have no trouble getting into the best pharmacy schools.
Many schools don't even require the PCAT, this along with the fact that GPA averages are insanely low makes admission a joke.
The future of pharmacy isn't good and your classmates will be filled with people that couldn't get into better professional programs
but if this is the choice you make then good luck. Just a tip, if pharmacy school is the goal you should never worry about your GPA
since everyone gets in.

In my school there really isn't a point of retaking a class if I scored a C or higher because lets say for example I took Calculus again and got an A it would average in and count as a B in the end. And are you really sure that pharmacy schools are that easy to get in? I heard that LIU only takes in 50 transfer students and I can only imagine how many apply.

 

[jokersmiles]

In my school there really isn't a point of retaking a class if I scored a C or higher because lets say for example I took Calculus again and got an A it would average in and count as a B in the end. And are you really sure that pharmacy schools are that easy to get in? I heard that LIU only takes in 50 transfer students and I can only imagine how many apply.

I have friends with 2.9 GPAs that were admitted to Minnesota, UCSF, UCSD, Midwestern ..... etc
They obviously have multiple Ds and Fails and never retook and still got in.
These people had 0 pharmacy experience until literally 6-7 months before they applied.

You are worrying now but I guarantee you that you will get in.

 

[PharmtoCS]

Software Engineering is a meme career currently. What I mean by that is employers have a very large pool of workers that they can exploit. It's the new pharmacy. They can pump and dump workers as they wish. One minute you're making 90k the next you're on the street because despite being 23 and talented, they hired the 22 year old they just interviewed. And it'll only get worse with everyone being pushed into it and making an even larger prospective worker pool. The only major that will give you a high paying, steady job is Finance. And you have to be very articulate, good looking and sociable for that; god knows most pre-meds can't even get through a sentence without stuttering. Basically if you're Donald Draper with a Finance degree (or any degree honestly) you're set for life.
I don't see why people make loans out to be such a big deal. If anything you can use them for a lot of benefits and there are very easy ways to avoid making payments, like having a student status.

Except that that the talented 23-year-old can switch jobs easily and earn $150k instead of $100k. There is a huge shortage of software engineers right now. Companies are desperate for talent.

How are you going to keep deferring your student loan payments? Do you plan to take community college courses until you die? Keep in mind that $200k loans will balloon by about $14k/year for each year you don't make payments on them.

 

[dreamchaserRx]

I have friends with 2.9 GPAs that were admitted to Minnesota, UCSF, UCSD, Midwestern ..... etc
They obviously have multiple Ds and Fails and never retook and still got in.
These people had 0 pharmacy experience until literally 6-7 months before they applied.

You are worrying now but I guarantee you that you will get in.

What? I have never heard of anyone with a 2.9 getting into UCSF....that is one of the top schools in CA. Was this recently?

 

[jokersmiles]

What? I have never heard of anyone with a 2.9 getting into UCSF....that is one of the top schools in CA. Was this recently?

Yes it was recent. Never say never, a quick use of the search function on SDN will show plenty of horrible GPAs getting admitted to UCSF

this one had a 3.0 science and overall
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/chance-me-please-low-gpa-high-pcat.1086382/

a few more 2.9 GPAs
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/low-gpas-accepted-into-class-of-2013.629189/

even the top pharmacy school... is still a pharmacy school, and pharmacy admission is a joke.
OP, as you can see.... your 3.3 GPA is perfect for pharmacy.

 

[bananaface]

I agree with the poster above who said to take the PCAT. Your grades are average for some of the newer schools. The PCAT could be the thing to sway your admission one way or the other. Once you take it you will know how much practical knowledge you retained.