What do you look for in a med school?

[durty]

Advertisement - Members don't see this ad

What do you want in a medical school? What do you look for? Let me know.
-durty

 

[Vvandenn]

chicks

 

[majahops]

I'm wired differently... But I don't care so much about the location, the curriculum style, the endowment, the match list or the social scene... I'm looking for a school that truly believes in me, in the goodness of my heart and in my potential for being a great physician and supporter of my fellow human being... When a school shows me that, I will partner myself with them right away and without compromise for the next 4 years. I'm looking to grow in a place of mutual affection and respect between the administration and faculty, my classmates and myself.

 

[MilkmanAl]

I'll second that. I'd also look for a place with a genial student body. Going to school in your dream location would suck badly if everyone there was cutthroat and unfriendly.

 

[DrBowtie]

Free Printing is a must. Seriously.

 

[silas2642]

What do you want in a medical school? What do you look for? Let me know.
-durty

An acceptance letter.

 

[Decicco]

I can't tell if I like a school until after I interview. That is the only way to judge the atmosphere, whether I'd be happy there, etc. If you are going to an MD school, rankings, etc don't matter all that much (except a bit at the very top).. instead you should be focused on how the school fits you.

 

[tiedyeddog]

Must be able to grant power. Oh, and as some else already replied, must have chicks.

I will be looking for a school that is within a close proximity to my loved ones.

 

[DrYoda]

Chicks, and close proximity to bars. So, basically the same as the post above, close to the things I love.

 

[JTubule1386]

I thought I was looking for a top 10 school, but I'm with the person who said they had to interview before they knew where they wanted to go. For instance, before I interviewed at Wake I was shaky about the idea of going there because it is so far away from home and it was not my top choice. When I visited for my interview, I fell in love with the place. I did not want to leave to go home and I was staying in a hotel ( I am not a fan of hotels). I felt like I was supposed to start class there the next day and I was in a place where I belonged finally...

The student and faculty made me feel this way. I also loved their curriculum and the fact that they are involved in the community. It did not seem very competitive either, which is a biggie for me, but it did have a sense of academic urgency to it. There was a sense of WE'VE got to do our best rather than I'VE got to do better than YOU.👍

 

[jdandturk]

In-state tuition

 

[Law2Doc]

In-state tuition

Things that are worth looking for:
1. fin aid
2. geography
3. lectures available online
4. P/F
5. not mandatory lecture attendance required
6. associated with a local teaching hospital
7. The general "vibe" you get when you are there
8. research opportunities -- if you are interested

Things not really worth focusing on:
1. USNews rank
2. Match lists (too many non-school related factors go into these, and you as a pre-med are ill equipped to read them-- not worth your time).
3. Board scores -- they are not publically available, and thus all schools lie about them and being "above average".
4. The student body -- unless you have an inside source, it's awfully hard to tell from your interview day on campus whether you are getting a representative view. You may just happen to talk to the one dud on campus, or be seeing folks the day before an exam, or the day after. So you really won't know what folks are like on an AVERAGE day, how happy they are etc. If you know someone already there, then get the real skinny, but if you are seeing the school from afar, don't form too many conclusions.

 

[Rabbit36]

happy residents and attendings really open to shadowing/scrubbing in, early clinical exposure, good combo of research and service, good global health, academically focused but relaxed, good Irish pub nearby, people are HAPPY and crazy smart, enough free time to do community work/research/stay f-ing sane, close contact with other schools (public health, grad, etc), people are a little stressed and very hardworking but ultimately extremely happy.

 

[Law2Doc]

happy residents and attendings really open to shadowing/scrubbing in, early clinical exposure, good combo of research and service, good global health, academically focused but relaxed, good Irish pub nearby, people are HAPPY and crazy smart, enough free time to do community work/research/stay f-ing sane, close contact with other schools (public health, grad, etc), people are a little stressed and very hardworking but ultimately extremely happy.

A lot of these would be good to know, others will seem to be true everywhere. All schools will brag about their early clinical exposure -- in fact the similarities outweigh the differences in all schools. Global health won't matter for most, and since you are locked into a set core through third year, this probably only impacts 4th year electives. And at most schools you can set up a global elective outside of the school even if your school isn't plugged into a program.

I would suggest that without an inside source or two, there is going to be no way to know if a school is relaxed, or if people are happy vs stressed. On interview day you see a mere snapshot, and it may be a day before or after an exam, so personalities might be totally not the norm. So pick the brains of inside sources, but if you have none, then ignore this factor. Whether folks have enough free time is going to depend on the person you talk to, but in general, you have a ton less free time than undergrad and if you find you have a lot of free time, either you are uber smart or are totally underestimating what you should be doing to do well. More often the latter. I'd say if someone says they have a ton of free time in med school, you want to ask a few more people if their opinions coincide. But bear in mind you aren't going to med school to do community work or research -- these are things you squeeze in if you have time, or do over the summer after first year if you don't. They shouldn't necessarily be the priority.

 

[ar2388]

- location
- more lecture based curriculum (although I can deal with a 50/50 kinda thing, so this isn't super important)
- financial aid
- P/F
- lectures online (powerpoints, notes, etc)
- printing

Sigh, i did fall in love with UPenn which i really did not expect to. it was perfect is every respect except location lol. Columbia was also outstanding. I missed the tour and lunch but I am hoping if i get in (please please please!!!) then they'll have a second look

 

[GoSpursGo]

As a lot of people have said, there's really very few things you can see to differentiate a school from an interview day. Location is one of them, cost is another. For the most part, curricula are the same everywhere (2 years science, 2 years clinical, in some fashion), with a couple of notable exceptions (Duke and Baylor spring to mind). If the US News rankings are useful for anything at all, it's fairly helpful at discerning what kinds of research opportunities are available there, if that's important to you.

Other than that, all I can say is just go to the one that "feels right." There's really nothing else to be done but close your eyes, pick one, and run headlong into it.

 

[PremedIowa]

1. Location
2. Cost
3. What type of doctors the school trains. Do they become primary care clinicians, specialists, researchers, public policy leaders?
4. Happy students
5. Prestige as measured by match lists and what other people think of the school. It remains important and follows you around wherever you go
6. Formal programs for research and service. It is a lot easier to slide into doing them if there is a formal process.
7. P/F or grade intervals used

 

[Law2Doc]

1. What type of doctors the school trains. Do they become primary care clinicians, specialists, researchers, public policy leaders?
2. Happy students
3. Prestige as measured by match lists and what other people think of the school. It remains important and follows you around wherever you go
   

As mentioned before, the first and third of these points above (what type of doctors, and match list) are probably bad things to put much weight on, because what it actually tells you is too often not what you as a premed THINKS it tells you. People go into various fields for different reasons. While for college and med school, you might feel inclined to go to the "best" place you get into, residency is different -- you need to pick something you feel you will happy doing for the rest of your life, notwithstanding how "prestigious" some people find it. So you focus on what makes you "happy" not what you can "get". If the smartest person at XYZ school chooses IM instead of derm (happens lots of places each year), does that really mean the school isn't doing a good job getting people into specialties, or does it simply tell you more about a particular person's motivations? Does it tell you the school does a bad job or is weak in the specialties, or simply doing a really strong job at inspiring people to go into non-specialties? And on the match lists, do you, as a premed, really know which programs are good versus malignant? Of course not. So this info is meaningless to you, or perhaps cuts a different way than immediately apparent. So it's best not to put too much weight on it.

As for prestige following you for the rest of your career, that's not really the case. In medicine, you are as good as the last place you've been. Meaning if you go to Harvard med school and then do a residency at Podunk, you are going to be that guy from Podunk. And vice versa. As an example, note that on Dr. 90210, Dr. Rey always wears his Harvard sweatshirt and has a Harvard coffee mug on his desk -- that was his fellowship (Tufts was his med school). You are as good as the last place you've been. The medical world works this way. So don't fret -- you can get into a good residency program if you do very well in any US allo med school, and if prestige is important to you, that will be the time to do it.

As for "happy students" as I mentioned, you only get a one day snapshot on interview day. So if you see them post-exam you get a very different picture than seeing folks pre-exam. So again, unless you have inside info (a friend in the school), this isn't a good thing to focus on. Second look weekends can help with this, but that is later in the process.

 

[TexasPhysician]

Cost!!!!!

 

[MsKrispyKreme]

An acceptance letter.

👍

Happy students = pure fakeness

Everybody is stressed out in medical school.

Things that are worth looking for:
1. fin aid
2. geography
3. lectures available online
4. P/F
5. not mandatory lecture attendance required
6. associated with a local teaching hospital
7. research opportunities -- if you are interested

👍

 

[URHere]

Happy students = pure fakeness

Everybody is stressed out in medical school.

I agree that students you meet on interviews are usually not representative of the student body as a whole...but please please please don't think that everyone is miserable in medical school.

It is completely possible to manage your first two years (at least) with minimal stress. Sure, there are many stressed-out medical students, but not all of us fall into that category. 🙂

 

[liquid8r]

The school that has the best of the following (that I have a reasonable chance of acceptance which already degrades and removes some of these):

1. Faculty
2. Facilities
3. Student body
4. Location
5. Cost
6. Reputation.

I have yet to be able to determine a way to assess a school's student body, but am willing to take suggestions. The student hosts can tell me a lot but can you ever really know?

Are the schools without a rigorous grading policy the ones without large amounts of gunner/cutthroat types?

 

[mmmcdowe]

Things that are important to me, but not necessarily things which one school has all of.

1) A school with connections to a diverse array of hospitals, including rural/urban.

2) Simulation centers where you can practice doing IV's, etc without damaging real patients.

3) Students that are eager to give tours, talk about their school. I had dozens of kids swarming me to tell me about how much they loved their program at one school, I refuse to believe that many students could be bribed or fake not being burnt out.

4) Active Student life

5) posted lectures online, but a school that still has high attendance to lectures (50+%)

6) A mixture of lectures, small groups, problem solving or case histories integrated into the course

7) Early and continuous clinical exposure throughout the whole course.

8) Touches on medicine as an art, and its philosophy.

9) History/Philosophy of medicine courses available.

10) Students are not arrogant or aristocratic.

11) The ability to take courses at the undergraduate institution.

12) Diverse Students

13) Scholarship opportunities

14) Climate

15) The consideration of whether I would want to me above average at an average school, or average at an above average school.

16) Research, especially in genetics

17) Match potential/prestige/connections

18) pass/fail or not

19) ranks or not

20) dorms vs lack of dorms

And most importantly:

21) How I felt when I was there.

22) Is there a latin dance club/program within walking distance.

 

[-Goose-]

I'm wired differently... But I don't care so much about the location, the curriculum style, the endowment, the match list or the social scene... I'm looking for a school that truly believes in me, in the goodness of my heart and in my potential for being a great physician and supporter of my fellow human being... When a school shows me that, I will partner myself with them right away and without compromise for the next 4 years. I'm looking to grow in a place of mutual affection and respect between the administration and faculty, my classmates and myself.

Save this. Re-read it sometime during your third year.

Trust me. You will laugh.

 

[mmmcdowe]

I'd have to agree, I don't think that medical schools necessarily put that much into those criteria. Sure, they are looking for people who display compassion and aren't degenerates, and of course they are only going to choose students that they think will suceed, but because its pricey to lose lots of medical students. I think they are much more concerned in you being competent, likely to fit in, and also match the things they need, such as diversity, students likely to be a credit to their school via research or by entering academia, and whether your interviewers liked you.

Some people say they are looking for students that match the faculty, essentially they want you if you are like them, but I don't know if I agree with that completely...

 

[AZFutureDoc]

There's only one thing worth looking for... Whether or not you're lucky enough to get in.

Next comes all the stuff that will keep me sane, like bars and establishments that sell ethanolic beverages, people to be friends with and the like.

And finally, all that stuff we're supposed to care about like name, location, curriculum, student morale, etc.


Isn't it interesting though, that none of these factors come into play unles... they let you in! Hence, my main criteria.

 

[scotties123]

if u get an interview, make sure the rec room/lounge has a ping pong table. otherwise dont even bother with the school. also see if they provide students with redbull IVs.

 

[MrBurns10]

happy residents and attendings really open to shadowing/scrubbing in, early clinical exposure, good combo of research and service, good global health, academically focused but relaxed, good Irish pub nearby, people are HAPPY and crazy smart, enough free time to do community work/research/stay f-ing sane, close contact with other schools (public health, grad, etc), people are a little stressed and very hardworking but ultimately extremely happy.

You should reconsider not applying to Duke. Plus, a great Irish pub is only 5 mins away! Its slogan:

"James Joyce: Where you don't have to have a good time to drink."

 

[Katatonic]

All that matters to me right now is going to the closest place, and the cheapest place. And if I have to go further away, I'm okay with it as long as it's CHEAPER.

 

[veaselhaufen]

I'm really surprised that no one has mentioned attractiveness of med students and students nearby. I'm definitely ashamed of it, but this plays a big role in my mind.

 

[mmmcdowe]

I'm really surprised that no one has mentioned attractiveness of med students and students nearby. I'm definitely ashamed of it, but this plays a big role in my mind.

It can't hurt, that's for sure, but I haven't seen any student bodies lacking in... um... bodies. 😀

 

[teddybear]

An acceptance letter.

Seconded.

 

[Nevadanteater]

The big 2:

-Proximity to surf or snowboarding/skiing
-Urban enough to get by without a car

 

[Law2Doc]

2) Simulation centers where you can practice doing IV's, etc without damaging real patients.

Good one. Add this to my list above.

 

[Law2Doc]

8) Touches on medicine as an art, and its philosophy.

But you lost me on this one. Seriously?

 

[Sylar]

A strict popped collar only policy

 

[rachmoninov3]

One thing abut curriculi I was I knew as a pre-med/asked at interviews was:

"when do basic sciences end?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! When does the book/lecture portion end and when do you take step 1?"

I've got only 5 more week of class, and I cannot tell you how awesome it is to know that the sitting in lecture/taking notes/reading text books part of my life is soon to be over! Seriously, I don't think I could handle much more of this. Step 1 looks so good comparatively!

 

[Law2Doc]

One thing abut curriculi I was I knew as a pre-med/asked at interviews was:

"when do basic sciences end?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! When does the book/lecture portion end and when do you take step 1?"

I've got only 5 more week of class, and I cannot tell you how awesome it is to know that the sitting in lecture/taking notes/reading text books part of my life is soon to be over! Seriously, I don't think I could handle much more of this. Step 1 looks so good comparatively!

Well, you will still have didactic sections (lectures) squeezed in during your rotations, so I don't know that that aspect of your life is really "over", and you have quite a few tests ahead of you to study/read for -- the steps and the shelf exams, so your days of reading aren't at an end, but you definitely will get to experience the wards more than the classroom.

 

[searun]

👍

Happy students = pure fakeness

Everybody is stressed out in medical school.



👍

I am a second year med student at a well known med school and I definitely am not stressed out. I work hard on academics but I am almost always out and about on Friday night and Saturday night, unless it is the weekend before exams. I work out at the gym or run about 5 times per week and have a solid group of good friends at my school. I live in a city that is very interesting and exciting and I enjoy exploring it. My life feels balanced.

Third year will be different and less balanced, of course, with less control over my schedule, but I anticipate that it will be very interesting.

My point is that you do not have to put your life on hold when you are a med student. Work hard, be organized, but there is time to have some fun along the way.

Now, if I were married with small kids, I probably would feel more stressed with the additional responsibilities, but I am single and enjoying my life.

 

[majahops]

I expect to. Sometimes I post to share my opinions with others. Sometimes I post in masked attempts to counsel myself... hehe

Save this. Re-read it sometime during your third year.

Trust me. You will laugh.

 

[ar2388]

mmmcdowe, your ballroom/latin dance?

 

[bcat85]

An acceptance letter.

👍

 

[mmmcdowe]

mmmcdowe, your ballroom/latin dance?

And classical ballet/modern

 

[mbe36]

1. Early Clinical Exposure

2. Board Scores

3. Patient Care Philosophy

 

[ButImLETired]

1. Early Clinical Exposure

2. Board Scores

3. Patient Care Philosophy

Oh dear. Law2Doc isn't going to like this. 😉

 

[mmmcdowe]

But you lost me on this one. Seriously?

Absolutely, a school that emphasizes the art of medicine, i.e. how to deal with patients, death, compassion, etc, will make you a better doctor. Medicine was an art way before it was a science, and people forget that as doctors are shielded more and more by layers of machines from their patients. Also, a philosophy that emphasizes patient care is more likely to get you quickly into contact with patients, and they aren't going to let medical school turn you into a robot. By philosophy I also meant philosophy in general, such as a philosophy that promotes cooperation not competition, mentors and mentees not teachers and students, etc etc.
(I get a lot of q's on interviews about this stuff, so after a while I actually started thinking about it lol)

Look at the picture Doctor and Doll. Think about it for a little bit, and then you'll know why I want a school that emphasizes the art of medicine. You won't be doing biochem in the OR, but you might be holding someones hand as they die. I've had to.

 

[MrBurns10]

Absolutely, a school that emphasizes the art of medicine, i.e. how to deal with patients, death, compassion, etc, will make you a better doctor. Medicine was an art way before it was a science, and people forget that as doctors are shielded more and more by layers of machines from their patients. Also, a philosophy that emphasizes patient care is more likely to get you quickly into contact with patients, and they aren't going to let medical school turn you into a robot.

All medical schools do this. I don't know a single school that doesn't have lectures/sessions at some point to teach you how to ask open-ended questions, break bad news, see the human side of each patient, etc.

And as for early clinical exposure, I think it's a LOT less important that pre-meds think it is (and I felt it was important when I was applying, too). You don't know what's going on with them because you don't have the background, and what it mainly turns into is a way to learn how to have a conversation with patients, which is eerily similar to having a conversation with people outside the hospital. Just my opinion.

The rest of your points (the student-student and student-faculty relationship) are definitely important.

 

[Law2Doc]

Oh dear. Law2Doc isn't going to like this. 😉

Yep -- all wrong.
ALL schools these days have early clinical exposure, so any school that emphasizes it simply means they don't have enough other things to brag about. Second, board scores are not published, and so schools feel free to mislead about these -- EVERY school is going to tell you their students score above the national average. Waste of time to try and decide if they are BSing you. Third Patient care philosophy? I have no idea what you mean, but suspect all schools are pro-patient care. Some schools might make a point of saying their philosophy focuses on "the patient over the disease", but the truth of the matter is that all allo schools do this.

 

[Docere]

How to interact with patients is pretty much a course all medical school students take. But while you learn about techniques and "the art of medicine" in the classroom, a lot of what you'll use as an actual physician comes from experience by the bedside. Even then, you can't really gauge how/what a medical school teaches to prepare a student for the doctor-patient interaction.

1. Acceptance letter
2. Financial Aid
3. Location
4. Small classes

All the reasons why I took the Baylor admissions offer. It's close enough to home that I wouldn't miss my mom's home-cooking. It's in the heart of the Texas Medical Center. It's got a cozy class size that resembles that of my high school class. Lectures are all recorded and posted online. Classes take place mostly in the mornings, leaving the afternoon off for naps/study. Not to mention, it's quite high on the ranking list.

 

[scotties123]

I'm really surprised that no one has mentioned attractiveness of med students and students nearby. I'm definitely ashamed of it, but this plays a big role in my mind.

there are about 2 good looking girls in my class of about 160. luckily, the undergrads here are just about all dimes.
this had no bearing on choosing my med school, but it sure as hell doesnt hurt having it around.