What I wish I knew...

[fishycat9]

Hi Everyone,
I am a grad student in an AuD program and I just wanted to put this forum together for students that are going through the process of picking which grad school to attend, some advice from other grad students.

There are so many aspects about the AuD program that I never knew going into it, it was NOT at all like my undergraduate education and I wish if I could help with the adjustment process for other students easier, that would be my goal. Perhaps some programs have some type of help for first year and entering students, but ours did not so I would like to add this forum of ...what I wish I knew before I applied.


First of all, I wanted to say that I learned the hard way. I had no help applying to grad programs and I had to learn everything on my own from scratch starting with applying to schools, to what to say in the interviews.

Currently, I am enrolled in a grad program that I feel stuck in and can't get out, it was not the "picture perfect program" that their online website and brochures etc. made it out to be. I feel like the program was "dishonest" about what to expect when you apply there, they sugar-coat EVERYTHING until you are stuck in their program and paying them tuition each semester. Oh, did you know that high expectations = low satisfaction. Yeah, the more the program brags about their department when they are trying to get you to go there, the more the program probably disappoint when you enter it!

The Dirt-Truth about the program: Most likely, your program will be stressful, not fun, everyone wants to just finish and get out of it, and you will hate your classmates by year 4 since you are with them everyday all day. I HATED how every program I went when I visited to made it seem like theirs would be "fun" to be there. Don't believe any of that, daily life in and audiology program can be feel frustrating and everyday you might come home crying to yourself and angry. You will have to deal with people everyday who do not like you. Oh, and if you think to yourself "I am a happy person, people will like me", its not true, everyone in your class will hate you, but fake be nice to you each day in class, remember you are their competition, and in this major everyone is fighting for themselves.



My feelings of the AuD program- when you enter it, don't interact with any students, they will be immature, don't tell them anything about your life, give as little information as possible about yourself, if you don't take this advice, life will be very hard. Try to separate school and home life as much as possible. If you live in the graduate school housing or dorms on campus, don't opt to live with people in your major because at the end of the day, you will not want to see them. I would highly suggest getting your own apartment if you have any extra cash to dish out.

Remember the good days of undergrad when you get to sign up for the classes you want to take and the number of credits you want to take...in grad its all pre-planned, just like elementary school, you stay with your class and all your freedom is taken away from you. Oh, and they WILL overload your classes as a way for them to save money. They may have you taking 20 credits a semester against your will. Forget about getting that part time job because you will have to be on campus all day off and on between clinic, meetings, cleanings, hearing aid services.

Night time classes- Grad classes take place at night so that you can work in a clinic in the day time. Think about this, you have a full day, most likely won't have time to go home and cook dinner, then after that you have to sit in class for 3-6 hours, depending on the day, listening to teachers that have no lessons in teaching, they are just professors that were hired based on the fact that they had an AuD. They most likely will be poor at teaching, and attendance will be taken, so you have to attend if you want to or not. If you don't go, you may be kicked out of your program, its super strict. Classes mostly will be once a week at night when you are tired and don't want to be there. You may not get out of class until 9 or 10 at night. Make sure when you pick a school, you look at the times of the classes, the teachers, the grading policy (you might fail a class for getting a B), the location, parking, living situations, tuition...all i can say is just take everything into account. Yes, seriously, you can fail out of a program for getting an 84 in a class. Its up to the teacher to decide what is considered passing, so they may make a "B" grade a 87, I have seen it happen. The classes are hard, very hard, and the teachers will "fake' and say they want to see students succeed, when really they would rather narrow down their class and make you fail.



Any other questions/experiences, please post on wall.

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[rEliseMe]

... it was NOT at all like my undergraduate education and I wish if I could help with the adjustment process for other students easier, that would be my goal.

I agree. Graduate school is definitely not like undergraduate, and I'm so glad! My audiology professors had very little time for me as an undergraduate, because I was not a priority for them. As a graduate student, I'm finally a priority!

First of all, I wanted to say that I learned the hard way. I had no help applying to grad programs and had to learn everything from scratch starting from applying to schools, what they want to what to say in the interviews.

I think this is a pretty common experience. I had to specifically ask for help when I needed it, and even then I didn't get much help because the process is so capricious.

Currently, I am enrolled in a grad program that I feel stuck in and can't get out, it was not the "picture perfect program" that their online website and brochures etc. made it out to be. I feel like the program was "dishonest" about what to expect when you apply there, they sugar-coat EVERYTHING until you are stuck in their program and paying them tuition each semester. Oh, did you know that high expectations = low satisfaction. Yeah, the more the program brags about their department when they are trying to get you to go there, the more the program probably sucks when you enter it!

I'm sorry to hear you've had a disappointing experience with your program so far. Mine has not been that way. I think it's important to vet the programs to which you're applying, and talk to plenty of current and past students to get the 'low-down'. I'm sure if you had talked to some current students, at least one would have said, "I hate it here!" or at least been not quite convincing in their sugar-coating.

I'm not trying to put the blame on you, I just want people reading this thread to understand that not all programs are the same. Your point about expectations is key, though. It's important to have realistic expectations in life, especially with the big decisions. I mean, we counsel hearing aid recipients to have realistic expectations... shouldn't we do the same in our own lives for even bigger life changes?

The Dirt-Truth about the program: Most likely, your program will be stressful,

Well, it's graduate school.

not fun, everyone wants to just finish and get out of it,

It's graduate school, not Woodstock! People who enjoy being long-term students are few and far between.

and you will hate your classmates by year 4 since you are with them everyday all day.

Well, since I'm only a first-year, I can't really comment on this. But, it's false so far.

... daily life in and audiology program sucks and everyday you might come home crying to yourself and angry.

Once again, I'm sorry this has been your experience. You know, it's possible to transfer once you're already in a program. Have you looked into your other opportunities?

... if you think to yourself "I am a happy person, people will like me", its not true, everyone in your class will hate you, but fake be nice to you each day in class, remember you are their competition, and in this major everyone is fighting for themselves.

This one, I know is not true everywhere. One of the first things our department head told us was, "Relax. Everyone got in. Your only competition now is yourself." The people in my cohort have taken this to heart and everyone is very supportive of one another.

Any student on here that refers to the AuD program as "fun" - kiss-my-***, its all sugar coated for you so that you will not be scared to apply, and if they do say that they are most likely trying to make themselves feel better, its a a psychological thing to lie to yourself to make yourself feel better.

I wouldn't necessarily say 'fun', but it's definitely stimulating and fulfilling. The sheer volume of knowledge we've gained in only four months in the program is staggering, and it makes me feel so accomplished!

My feelings of the AuD program- when you enter it, don't interact with any students, they will be immature, don't tell them anything about your life, give as little information as possible about yourself, if you don't take this advice, life will be very hard.

Holy moly, what have they done to you there? If you act like that, you'll never connect with anyone and yeah, your classes will be horrible and you won't get any support! Maybe your classmates are immature, but mine certainly aren't. Please, anyone who reads this, don't judge your cohort before you meet them! If they end up being immature, adjust accordingly, but go in with an open mind and an open heart. Just be genuine, and more often than not, people will respond in turn.

Remember the good days of undergrad when you get to sign up for the classes you want to take and the number of credits you want to take...in grad its all pre-planned, just like elementary school, you stay with your class and all your freedom is taken away from you.

Graduate school is set up so you learn the things you absolutely have to know in order to be competent at your job. The audiology program itself is set up to prepare you for the praxis, as well. If you set your own curriculum, you wouldn't be prepared for the praxis, and probably your career as well! Besides, isn't it nice to know that you don't have to worry about fitting everything in anymore?

Oh, and they WILL overload your classes as a way for them to save money. They may have you taking 20 credits a semester against your will.

This did not happen to me. We are not allowed to take more than 15 credits per semester (this rule is courtesy of the graduate college, not the audiology department), and I had 11 credits my first semester. I think I have 13 or 14 this semester, including clinic hours.

Forget about getting that part time job because you will have to be on campus all day off and on between clinic, meetings, cleanings, hearing aid services.

I have at least three classmates (out of 8) who have part-time jobs. The others have assistantship hours.

Grad classes take place at night so that you can work in a clinic in the day time.

This is not true across the board. Our latest class ended at 5:50pm (M/W) last semester, and we only had to attend for half of the semester. Other than that, we were done at 2:30pm or 4:30pm daily. Next semester is the same. Our clinic days are half-days and begin at 8:30am at the earliest, and end at 5pm at the latest since that's when the clinic closes. We do not have night classes.

... listening to teachers that have no lessons in teaching, they are just professors that were hired based on the fact that they had an AuD. They most likely will suck, and attendance will be taken, so you have to attend if you want to or not.

1. My professors have been great so far. They have good people-skills and do their best to teach in a manner which is conducive to learning. I know that not all programs will have great professors, but if it's a good program they'll know their stuff. Don't be afraid to go and talk to your professors about stuff you're not getting... and actually, they expect you to and will wonder about you if you don't.
2. If you have no desire to learn or go to class, graduate school is probably not the place for you. Attendance isn't mandatory in our courses, but the professors notice when you're gone... plus, if you're not there, you'll miss the material, and you won't do well on the exams anyway. That's probably why they aren't militaristic about attendance: the problem resolves itself come grade-time.

Classes mostly will be once a week at night when you are tired and don't want to be there. You may not get out of class until 9 or 10 at night.

Not true at either program to which I applied. But I agree, check this out when you apply!

... the grading policy (you might fail a class for getting a B)

I think this is true everywhere, however some professors are better about helping everyone pass than others. But really, if you can't pull a B in the class, again, you probably aren't cut out for graduate school. They're not going to spoon-feed you.

...all i can say is just take everything into account.

Good advice.

... the teachers will "fake' and say they want to see students succeed, when really they would rather narrow down their class and make you fail.

Uh... why on earth would they want to decrease their revenue? That makes absolutely no sense. My professors have been very accommodating and supportive, but like I said, they're not going to spoon-feed anyone. Graduate school is a commitment, and it's not for the faint of heart (or mind).

The best advice I can give is: prepare yourself mentally, and be before you apply anywhere, make sure you're willing to fully commit to four years of education in audiology. It's not like an undergraduate degree at all; it's an intense half-decade of study and learning (and yes, struggling!). It's very rewarding and satisfying, but to feel those things, you have to be willing to put forth the effort.

 

[peachyAuD]

My program is fun...? I mean, it's hard and stressful, but it's fun. It sounds like you just went to the wrong place, or have the wrong attitude. Perhaps both.

 

[Kitska]

It sounds like maybe this was a wrong choice for you. After almost 3 years, I still like my classmates and we've grown closer over the years. It's not an easy workload, that is for sure, but is any grad program like that in any field? How about med school? Do you think med students get to just kick back? What about science PhD programs where you are expected to be in the lab 80 hours a week?

(By any chance, are you the incredibly bitter person who keeps coming back to this forum with newly invented screen names only to keep getting kicked off? I am highly suspicious because of your bitter tone. If you're not, many apologies and I hope you get what you're looking for in life, but if you are, what exactly do you hope to get out of this behavior for yourself? Seriously, what is in it for you?)

 

[cidanu]

i think there is some truth to what fishy cat is saying. but it does sound like he/she is having a particularly bad time of it.

there are some cohorts in my program that i've seen all become best buddies. other cohorts really do all hate each other. some are in between. each class seems to have its own personality, and the staff/faculty also observe that.

the truth is that Au.D. programs do try to recruit people. higher education is a business. whatever tactics they use - i can't really comment on. i visited two programs and neither one tried to sell their programs as "fun," but i'd believe it if some programs did use that approach.

"fun" is not a word i would use to describe my graduate school experience. i didn't enter graduate school to make friends or have the time of my life. i entered graduate school to obtain skills so that i could get a better-paying more satisfying job than the one i had before. i made some friends, had some fun, and learned a lot, but overall i would not say that graduate school is fun. some of the most fun i have is when school is out and i can actually do something with my friends (whether those are friends i made at school or elsewhere). school is interesting, exciting at times, and fulfilling, but not fun.

as far as the trying to force people out, that could be true but i think it's a bit of a stretch. i know that in order to maintain ASHA accreditation for the program, ASHA has certain limitations in regard to rate of attrition. so in order to maintain ASHA accreditation the program is motivated to keep students. on the other hand, it's in the best interest of the program to drop students if the students might make the school look bad at internships, future practice, etc. the ability to place students at internships and externships is highly dependent on how well previous students have done at those sites.

 

[rEliseMe]

I tried to quote you, Cidanu, but I'm on my phone and it wouldn't cooperate. Your last point is very well-put and I wanted to QFT it.

 

[audaud]

You should never be giving out personal information to anyone in your program anyway---even your classmates, I would give them my name and that's about it, don't even tell them where you live, I totally agree with this.

Good Luck for the rest of your program!

 

[rEliseMe]

You should never be giving out personal information to anyone in your program anyway---even your classmates, I would give them my name and that's about it, don't even tell them where you live, I totally agree with this.

It is a competitive world, I have to agree on that. Competition drives the program. The reason your classmates may all be disrespectful towards each other is because the end they want you to fail and them to succeed. Sorry you have to hear it like this but, its a fact of life in every program.

I don't agree with the method of life, but its built into our society in the AuD programs.

Yikes! I had no idea what kind of mindset the other programs put you in! I'm so glad my cohort has morphed into a support-group of sorts, because I'd be lost without them (they helped me navigate the transition from undergrad in Idaho to grad in Iowa). Yes, there will be eventual competition, but that doesn't mean it has to be cutthroat!

I think it probably helps that we're all interested in different things; I'm interested in research, a couple are interested in intellectual disabilities, some in pediatrics, some in CIs... so it's not like we're in direct competition with each other when we're out.

Besides, it's good to have professional colleagues whom you can consider friends!

 

[cmc271]

Can't tell if the OP is troll or serious?

I would also have to disagree with the majority of what was posted. Yes, it is difficult and yes you will have to work, but I for the most part have enjoyed my program. We have a mix of day and night classes. I have not yet had more than one night class in a semester (6-9pm). Other than that our classes are mostly 9-12 or 1-4.

As far being antisocial and not making friends with any of your classmates I have to wholeheartedly disagree with that statement. The majority of us get along well and while we don't always hang out outside of school, we go out and do other things together. I for one enjoy going to college basketball games with a couple of my classmates, I know others like to go out on the weekends together and various other things. I feel that having those peer relationships can help alleviate some of the stress. I agree that competition is important, but it should be more of a competition with yourself to learn the knowledge and skills that will make you a top notch audiologist upon completion of your degree. Yes, some of us may end up applying to the same 4th years, but really is it that big of a deal? I would much rather have strong relationships with my classmates and professors that will transition to professional peer relationships once I get out of school.

Again, I apologize that your AuD experience has not been the most pleasant, but it is definitely not the only way one can experience an AuD program. I also agree with Elise that professors are more interested in the success of students than the failures.

 

[KCO47]

I'll agree that grad school is a kick in the face in a lot of ways. You have to really be sure you want it.

But I can't shake the feeling that the real motivation behind this post is for you to rant about your atypical experience--not to educate AuD hopefuls.

I'm halfway through my third year and though I'm not always having "fun," I'm still glad I'm here. I've held a 25% assistantship for 7 semesters. It's not easy, but it's doable and the funding is more than enough to pay the bills. It's true that my class is not as close as it once was, but we are all still good friends. Despite competition for funding and externships, nobody has ever tried to sabotage anyone else.

It's true that you don't get to sign up for just any old class. Electives are for undergrads. You will have to take some; most of my class chose to take different levels of statistics. Many of the other options are just a waste of time and money.

Professors do not want students to fail. If a class size is too small, it costs the department more money than it brings in. However it is also true that programs may counsel you out if it is clear that you're not going to cut it. They don't want to graduate someone who will make them look bad.

So in an effort to turn this thread into something useful to prospective grad students, here are some of the factors I would consider when making my choice.

1. Funding opportunities: Programs that do a lot of research will have more need and money for GAs. An assistantship will pay better than a part-time job and will also offer tuition assistance.

2. Practicum settings: Some cities just don't have a high volume of audiologists. Practicum students have to travel quite a ways (as long as a 90 minute drive) to get to their clinic sites. This is something to ask about when you talk to different programs.

3. 4th year: There are a couple schools that do not charge tuition for the fourth year. The trade-off is that they don't help you find your externship. The truth of it is that no matter where you are, you still find your own externship. So this might be something to consider as well.

4. Intercampus and Consortiums: Some programs boast that they are able to pool the resources of more than one campus. The other way to look at it is that their resources are divided among more than one campus. I personally find this design to be kind of a pain, but not so much that I'd call it a deal breaker.

Can anyone add to this?

 

[spring88]

I

So in an effort to turn this thread into something useful to prospective grad students, here are some of the factors I would consider when making my choice.

1. Funding opportunities: Programs that do a lot of research will have more need and money for GAs. An assistantship will pay better than a part-time job and will also offer tuition assistance.

2. Practicum settings: Some cities just don't have a high volume of audiologists. Practicum students have to travel quite a ways (as long as a 90 minute drive) to get to their clinic sites. This is something to ask about when you talk to different programs.

3. 4th year: There are a couple schools that do not charge tuition for the fourth year. The trade-off is that they don't help you find your externship. The truth of it is that no matter where you are, you still find your own externship. So this might be something to consider as well.

4. Intercampus and Consortiums: Some programs boast that they are able to pool the resources of more than one campus. The other way to look at it is that their resources are divided among more than one campus. I personally find this design to be kind of a pain, but not so much that I'd call it a deal breaker.

Can anyone add to this?

Applicants, if you are visiting or interacting with programs, ask the faculty about the cons of their program and how they are improving upon them. It's even better if a program addresses them before you ask. Pay attention to how they answer.

It's easy for people to get stuck on the negative things and often those same people get stuck because they had no idea as to what they were getting into. There is no such thing as a perfect AuD program, many people seem to think that there are and they are often sorely disappointed because it wasn't what they expected.

One thing that stood out about two of my top choices is that they were very forthcoming about the cons rather than just the pros of their programs. One faculty member mentioned one "con" in regards to their program when I was deciding. I ended up choosing that program and when I arrived in the fall, I saw that the program had taken steps to address the same "con" that was originally mentioned to me. If a program mentions their flaws, it shows that they are not only aware but they are likely taking steps to fix them as well.

That being said and done, both of these programs easily get a hundred applicants a year for 10-12 spots. There would've been someone to fill my spot had I declined (and I did at one of the two). Both programs had nothing to lose by discussing their flaws with me. Today, I'm at a program where I know 110% what I'm getting into. As a result, I don't expect myself to be bashing audiology and my program on this forum three years from now.

 

[Kitska]

3. 4th year: There are a couple schools that do not charge tuition for the fourth year. The trade-off is that they don't help you find your externship. The truth of it is that no matter where you are, you still find your own externship. So this might be something to consider as well.

Not adding, but just asking -- what kind of help do you get with finding your externship? Because my school charges tuition AND expects us to find our own externship! We compete with whatever pool is applying. Fortunately for us, there are a number of opportunities in our city, but it is a very stressful time. Our program director is a good go-to person to find out about externships that might not be posted on the AAA registry, etc., but does not actively set us up with externships.

 

[cmc271]

Our program is pretty active in helping students find their placements. You typically work with your advisor to identifty settings you are interested in and location in the country. Then they will work with you to identify specific locations you will apply to. We are required to pay tuition our 4th year. It can be as few as 2 credits/semester or as high as 6 if you need to be able to get student loans to pay tuition for that year. One tool that is very useful is a database of where previous students have had their 4th year placements.

 

[rEliseMe]

Same here; my program will work with us to find an externship site or we can find it on our own. Either way, our externship director vets every placement before we're allowed to proceed. I love that freedom!

We do pay tuition, but minimum hours.

 

[Kitska]

Same here; my program will work with us to find an externship site or we can find it on our own. Either way, our externship director vets every placement before we're allowed to proceed. I love that freedom!

We do pay tuition, but minimum hours.

both to you, rEliseMe and cmc271, How do they work with you? I mean, you still interview, right? Does your program director actually have influence over who they choose?

 

[KCO47]

Not adding, but just asking -- what kind of help do you get with finding your externship? Because my school charges tuition AND expects us to find our own externship! We compete with whatever pool is applying. Fortunately for us, there are a number of opportunities in our city, but it is a very stressful time. Our program director is a good go-to person to find out about externships that might not be posted on the AAA registry, etc., but does not actively set us up with externships.

We are essentially on our own. If someone cannot/doesn't care to find one themselves, they promise to find us an unfunded position in the area. I don't know that anyone has ever taken them up on it.

 

[cidanu]

at my school we have an "externship coordinator. we get a list of "approved sites." these include sites with which we already have affiliation agreements, as well as nationally advertised sites (AAA registry and otherwise-some sites simply email AuD program directors to inform them of the positions). these sites make the list for being well-rounded sites with supportive preceptors. we are also encouraged to make our own inquires to other sites if we want to, but we have to get permission form the externship coordinator before contacting anyone. they want to make sure we get a good experience. we don't have any sites that only accept students from our program, but we do have sites that like our students based on previous students' success. we make a list of our top ten sites that we're interested in then meet with the coordinator to discuss it. she might have some guidance in terms of where to apply that would be most appropriate for us or our interests. after that we apply and it's up to us. we also have a group on blackboard where we can view samples of other students CV's, cover letters, thank you notes, etc. we can also see a list of externships previous students attended, and where former students have secured their first jobs.

 

[rEliseMe]

both to you, rEliseMe and cmc271, How do they work with you? I mean, you still interview, right? Does your program director actually have influence over who they choose?

No, but they do have influence over who I choose! During the third year, we discuss with our advisor and/or the outplacement director about what kind of fourth-year placement we're looking for. At that point, she will suggest placements that fulfill our requirements. If we have placements we're interested in that aren't already on her vetted list, she'll contact them and see if they have space for us and whether or not it would be a good fit (recently, Real Ear Measures were an issue; the placement didn't have the capabilities, so it was crossed off the list as an appropriate placement for that student).

Then we apply! Our director's purpose is to help align students with appropriate placements so that they get a good range of experiences and have good supervisory relationships. The students still have to apply with everyone else who's interested in that same placement, but she can help narrow things down a bit based on the individual's criteria.

Those were horrible paragraphs, but it's been a long day of instruction in insurance-billing, so I don't have the energy to go back and edit!

 

[cmc271]

both to you, rEliseMe and cmc271, How do they work with you? I mean, you still interview, right? Does your program director actually have influence over who they choose?

Our faculty are similar to rEliseMe. They will assist in making contact with various placements, vetting appropriate placements, and working on the list of placements. The faculty also work with students on resumes, mock interviews, etc. Once initial contact is established, interview responsibility is entirely with the student and to my knowledge the faculty have no pull on the decision of the site. The current 4th years are in CA, Atlanta, Memphis, NC, and KY. Of the current 3rd years, 1 or 2 have accepted placements in Atlanta, another in Kansas City and the others are still looking.

 

[dayfive]

There's definitely some underlying truth in what OP is saying. Although, someone once told me "any program worth its salt makes you question why you're there at least some of the time".

There's no lie, it's hard. Sometimes it's painful. Agonizing even.

If you have hope and combine it with willpower you will succeed. Don't give up. Believe in yourself. All of us have some problems and issues. Maybe somehow it helps to talk about it? Counseling is part of the service we provide, yet it's undeniable that we ourselves could sometimes benefit from counseling.

As long as you believe in yourself, you can accomplish great things.

 

[KCO47]

cmc271, do you know which practice in Kansas City?! The curiosity is killing me.

 

[cmc271]

cmc271, do you know which practice in Kansas City?! The curiosity is killing me.

The VA hospital there. I think she said they were taking 2 or 3 fourth years.

 

[Kitska]

...The current 4th years are in CA, Atlanta, Memphis, NC, and KY. Of the current 3rd years, 1 or 2 have accepted placements in Atlanta, another in Kansas City and the others are still looking.

Nobody in my class wants to move far! It makes for a competitive situation!

 

[TheEarDoc]

I have to say some of my best friends are my previous classmates from graduate school. We went out together almost every weekend. We went to concerts together. We hung out at each others homes and apartments. We have been to each others weddings. We've been to family members funerals and baby showers. Graduate school was one of the most rewarding and enjoyable times in my life. Was it easy? For me yes it was, but then again I was a little older, used to the academic demands of graduate school (a hard pre-med major with multiple part time jobs at the same time really beefs up your study skills and time management skills!), and I really enjoyed audiology.

Did our program have drawbacks? Yes we had to drive usually an hour to get to a clinical setting, but we had a good variety of settings from private practices, ENT offices, several regional medical centers, and even some school placements. The only thing our program didn't give much in was cochlear implants. All of my classmates statyed in our state during their fourth years and we all still work in the same state.

As for having evening classes, yes this often happens. Be prepared to have a 40 hour week of class and work. It's graduate school. I had a 20 hours per week assistantship my whole first 3 years of graduate school and I still carried over 16 credit hours a semester. It can be done, you just have to manage your time. I worked hard, but I played hard too.

As for externships for fourth years, yes it's one of the most stressful times in your life! Often many places such as VA hospitals will not make a decision on placements until February or March when many are leaving for externships in May or June which can really rake your nerves. Then you have the option of paid or unpaid. The way I viewed the fourth year was this:
1. Did it have all the patient populations I wanted to see?
2. Did I get a good variety of all the areas of scope of practice in audiology (hearing aids, pediatric/adult evals, ABR, balance testing)?
3. Was it funded? (I do not believe in work for free I know how students are worked in externships and you are expected to be an employee. If I'm going to invest my skill set and time into your business you are going to invest some capital in me.)
4. Was there the potential for a job at the site after the fourth year? Would the site give me a good well-rounded experience for what direction in audiology I wanted to go?

I am kind of a maverick and I thought outside the box. You need to sell yourself, just like you're interviewing for a job. Be confident, but don't be overbearing. You have a skill set. No one gets to the fourth year without being able to be pretty close to being autonomous. Keep track of how much business you do in your 3rd year clinicals. Figure out what the average salary is for an audiologist in the area/setting you're at and then you can half that for your fourth year and negotiate from there. Private practices will often refuse to pay students in their fourth year. I avoided these for this reason. ENT clinics can be great, but you have to read the physician and see how they treat their staff. Ask to shadow a day or two at the site you want to do your fourth year at. You can see how staff members interact and you can tell within a day who really likes who and how people are treated. I've always been good at reading people and I can walk into a workplace and within about 20 minutes I can tell whether people enjoy working there and if staff actually get along.

A medical graduate program is stressful and a whole different animal than any other graduate program. You have be a student and a clinician and often times an employee too. It's a tough mixture and some people get it from day 1 and others are still struggling with it during their 3rd year.

I will say I loved my program and my school. I loved it so much I am actually pursuing a second masters at it as a nurse practitioner. It is what you make of it!

 

[rEliseMe]

Nobody in my class wants to move far! It makes for a competitive situation!

Hmm, good point. I'm part of the group that would love to do their 4th year in a totally different place. I guess, because of that, I never really feel like I'm in eventual-competition with my cohort because I highly doubt we'll want the same place!

 

[cmc271]

Hmm, good point. I'm part of the group that would love to do their 4th year in a totally different place. I guess, because of that, I never really feel like I'm in eventual-competition with my cohort because I highly doubt we'll want the same place!

Something that may factor into that is where your cohort comes from. Most of the audiology cohorts at my program have students who have come from across the country and I think that plays into where they end up searching for 4th year sites. The SLP program draws from a wide range of places but at the same time has a higher percentage of "local" students so they seem to have more students stay in the area, but also send their grads across the country.

 

[Kitska]

Something that may factor into that is where your cohort comes from. Most of the audiology cohorts at my program have students who have come from across the country and I think that plays into where they end up searching for 4th year sites. The SLP program draws from a wide range of places but at the same time has a higher percentage of "local" students so they seem to have more students stay in the area, but also send their grads across the country.

I think in our case, the program is in a location (big city) with a lot of good externship sites, but many also happen to be from the area. 3 have significant others with jobs, and one of has kids and I can't imagine would uproot the family for a year.

 

[PetPony]

There are so many aspects about the AuD program that I never knew going into it, it was NOT at all like my undergraduate education and I wish if I could help with the adjustment process for other students easier, that would be my goal.

Oh, and they WILL overload your classes as a way for them to save money. They may have you taking 20 credits a semester against your will.

It's not supposed to be like undergrad. It's a professional program after all!

Other professional programs have a higher course load like that. And that is something you could've researched before. I am 2 1/2 years away from applying to vet school, but I know my classes will be hard and I will have a heavy course load (many schools have semesters with 25 credits). It's all about researching before you get into it.

 

[cmc271]

It's not supposed to be like undergrad. It's a professional program after all!

Other professional programs have a higher course load like that. And that is something you could've researched before. I am 2 1/2 years away from applying to vet school, but I know my classes will be hard and I will have a heavy course load (many schools have semesters with 25 credits). It's all about researching before you get into it.

Since the curriculum is so set you should be able to see a 4 year plan while visiting schools and know exactly how many credits you will be enrolled in. Most programs will have it somewhere on the department website or will provide it if you ask for it. Your courseload should never be a surprise. Our program typically averages 12-14 credits/semester.

 

[Dustbug10]

Though I don't agree with much of what the OP said, I'm glad it was posted. It is the truth that there are very few resources out there for prospective Au.D. students. Aside from this forum, there is next to none. Mentoring programs are good for incoming students, but not particularly helpful in my case considering I was one of just a few males. In other health professions, there are a ton of books out there dedicated to preparing students while their in pre-professional programs or even high school. Without question, my knowledge and view of the field itself has largely been shaped in my time as a audiology student. Luckily, I have enjoyed it. Other students weren't so lucky and did not realize that they probably needed to jump ship until their 2-3rd year after accruing a lot of debt. Some didn't even try to research the profession beforehand, but I definitely feel for those who did and were still left with a vague impression of audiology. A guide for the application/interview process would be nice as well.

As for my classmates, I get along with them just fine despite the fact that I don't have much in common with them. You could sense students becoming annoyed with each other towards the end of the 1st year, because you're constantly around each other. We began off-campus practicum in our 2nd year and now I rarely see them more than 2 days per week. My class is the polar opposite of competitive. The group that came in after us appears more academically motivated and competitive, but they seem to be a tight knit group. Occasionally, they have focused their competitiveness towards us and assaulted 3rd years with questions during our Grand Rounds presentations. There is nothing wrong with competitive drive and performing like a top notch student, but for you prospective students, attempting to show up fellow students is a no-no in the unwritten laws of not being a douche. They are a likeable group and the 1st years seem to be as well. Even if you're classmates are 'fighting you' as the OP put it, I can assure you that having a 4.0 matters very little to prospective employers vs. having a 3.5 GPA. Disregard it and do what you have to do. I have not had one 4th year externship interview where that information was requested of me.

As for the workload, you can carry a part-time job if you don't have a problem with work ethic. Consider yourselves lucky as in many doctoral professions, this wouldn't even be an option. I have consistently worked 16-24 hours each week, often working a side job on the weekends if needed as well as payment from my blog. I typically work full time hours during breaks, though I did not this past Christmas break. Tuition prices are absurd and I'm at one of the cheaper programs in the country.

There are a lot of things I wish I knew coming in that seem negative. It comes with the territory.. I wish I knew that the female to male ratio is seemingly no different than SLP. I wish I had known which practicum sites to aim for coming in, because quite frankly, some of them stink.. I did not know how to fit a hearing aid in my 2nd year. That's scary.. I would have like to have known that despite the movement towards EBP, clinical practice standards and protocol are largely at the discretion of the professionals/instructors. Furthermore, there are multiple methods supported by research.. Trying to wrap my head around SRT when being taught Modified Hughson-Westlake and ASHA method at the same time was nerve-wracking. I wish I had fully grasped that the AuD is not universally viewed as prestigious by all and the degree is very new. My program has experienced the growing pains right before my eyes.. There were times when the program seemed to be moving in all different directions with no real plan or focus. They have showed drastic progress in the past few years and worked hard to bring in top notch clinical instructors. As for professors wanting students to fail, I don't see how that could be truthful considering how important attrition rate is to funding.. Granted, I did face a few adjunct professors who seemed to let personal feelings/motives interfere, but I would definitely say that overall, our faculty has been completely fair and competent.