What jobs or school to consider after failing match?

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Has anyone here done a different kind of school after not matching?

Is MD enough pre-reqs to apply to PA school? Can you do loans for PA after MD?

What kind of work do you try for? Is there anything outside restaurants, house cleaning, and retail?

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Thank you. Can you please send me a message with the name of the program? I finish Ross in January so I have to find something.
 
Thank you. Can you please send me a message with the name of the program? I finish Ross in January so I have to find something.

Wait a minute... you're not done at Ross yet? What year are you? Are you getting ready to graduate? If so, did you apply for residency? Are you in the Match? What about "off-cycle" spots or filling in for drop-outs? Prelims? Transitionals?

Or, are you simply trying to work between January and when residency starts? How about research somewhere? What about a hospital job that doesn't require a medical license? Even temporarily?

What you said here doesn't make any sense. Please explain.

-Skip
 
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Yes, I applied for residency this year. However, I could not afford as much as I should have spent. I applied to 74. So far I only have 3 interviews, so I am trying to come up with a plan to pay bills. I do have a family to support so I can't waste a lot of time. As far as what kind of work, I'm not ruling anything out at this point.
 
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Yes, I applied for residency this year. However, I could not afford as much as I should have spent. I applied to 74. So far I only have 3 interviews, so I am trying to come up with a plan to pay bills. I do have a family to support so I can't waste a lot of time. As far as what kind of work, I'm not ruling anything out at this point.

Look into Podiatry also, if you can deal with feet and extra schooling and extra loans. GL.
 
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I am guessing that off cycle spots are exactly what they sound like. I have seen some of them listed at Frida. There aren't very many of course. Are there alternate ways to find these? Thank you, thank you and thank you for any ideas that you have. Also, would I be able to say I have an MD before May? Even though I finish classes in January, I don't officially graduate until the spring semester ends. I don't have an undergraduate degree, so this really limits my ability to get jobs other than restaurant and cleaning work. My thought was that if I can claim a degree, this may give opportunities for tutoring
 
I had not considered podiatry before. I will have to think about that.

I am so heart and soul stuck on psychiatry. But PAs don't really get hired in psych. Only NPs and that isn't an option.

I did get onto a waiting list today by calling a program and asking a question. Took me two weeks to work up the nerve. (Thanks to OldPsychDoc and aProgDirector). I'm going to try another one tomorrow.
 
I had not considered podiatry before. I will have to think about that.

I am so heart and soul stuck on psychiatry. But PAs don't really get hired in psych. Only NPs and that isn't an option.

I did get onto a waiting list today by calling a program and asking a question. Took me two weeks to work up the nerve. (Thanks to OldPsychDoc and aProgDirector). I'm going to try another one tomorrow.


THIS! Call every single place you haven't heard from once you know that they have already started giving out interviews. Just say something like "I know you guys are super busy right now, but I am really interested in your program and I wanted to see if you had gotten a chance to look at my application". I must have gotten 10 interviews this way.
 
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THIS! Call every single place you haven't heard from once you know that they have already started giving out interviews. Just say something like "I know you guys are super busy right now, but I am really interested in your program and I wanted to see if you had gotten a chance to look at my application". I must have gotten 10 interviews this way.

I could your abjj now! Thank you! It felt so weird to do it, but it turned out to be no big deal at all.
 
If you don't graduate until the spring, you can't start an off cycle program. You need your degree to be a doctor and get your ECFMG Cert. You should clarify this with your school.

Podiatry is a bunch more school and tuition. You shouldn't consider this unless you can't get a spot after trying a few times. I have no idea if they take those with MD's already.
 
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I am so heart and soul stuck on psychiatry.

:smack:

You broke Skip's #1 rule: apply far and wide. Let me clarify what I mean by "wide".

Going "all-in" on a solo specialty, especially one that (while not historically) has gotten more competitive, means that you are essentially placing your entire bet on one spot on the roulette wheel.

What you should do, and it's still not too late, is (again, as I've always said) apply to a few "back-up" programs in another specialty at programs that are desperately in need of residents. This could be a more rural family practice program or a non-university based program in a city that is maybe less desirable. It doesn't matter. You need to make sure that you have a residency spot somewhere in something when the Match is over.

So, what happens if you don't get a Match in psychiatry? Big deal. You list enough programs, and back-up programs, that at least you Match. There will be time after that to switch. Things happen. People drop out. People decide they don't like the specialty. Spots open up. Etc.

Point is, the worst thing that can happen is that you have no spot on July 1, 2018. So, stop thinking about PA school or Podiatry school and apply to a few more FP, IM, Prelim, Transitional (etc.) programs in places that historically have taken Ross grads. And do it TONIGHT!! You can rank them eventually however you want. You are the only one that is going to see your rank list.

I suggest Family Practice. At least 20 more programs. Or, apply to the combined FP/Psych programs, FP/IM programs (etc.) if you haven't already.

-Skip
 
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I know i broke the rule but I really can't afford more. Really. Not a joke. Nothing frivolous.
 
For the record, I did tons of research on the 74 programs. They are 70 of the least desirable programs + one med school i worked for (different dept), one that i have a letter from the behavioral health cmo , one that my mother retired from, and one that was a frivolous waste of $26.

I really couldn't afford more. Seriously, my kids and I could be homeless. I do the best I can, but I have poorly insured children with health care costs that I cover out of pocket because I cant even begin to reach our deductible. One developed DM1 while I was in medical school. Did not see it coming. So, yeah, I should have applied wide but I really couldn't. I broke the rule and I picked the wrong specialty.

And I can't just come up with hundreds of dollars and new family medicine letters. I screwed up. Now I have 3 invites and 4 waitlists. Believe me, I am aware of how bad I screwed up. I could do 8 more programs, but I'm not doing a combined program, way too competitive. I could try desperate FM programs but I don't have letters for FM.
 
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You need your degree to be a doctor and get your ECFMG Cert. You should clarify this with your school.
I wasn't clear about that at all. I really went off on a tangent there, that was about a temporary job from feb 1- graduation. I found a potential job, but I need some kind of degree for it.

I took some tests to tutor math courses online. The income would (a)be flexible around potential interviews (b)survive an interstate move and (c)help survive the orientation period if I do match. Of course you don't need an MD to tutor, but it is acceptable and it will be my only degree. I did email someone at my school to find out if there is a way to do this.

I'm not as scattered as I sound really. It just takes a lot of planning to make things work with a family. And right now the planning is becoming overwhelming because there is a plan to try to match, and then it splits into more plans depending on if I match or if I don't match. And if I do match, then there is the additional consideration that must be given to an orientation that is up to a month long that may or may not be paid. And that will be a complete mystery since asking how long orientation is and whether it is paid or not will eliminate my chance at matching LOL.
 
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I gotta say... I totally feel for you. You have 3 interviews and cant even apply for more. Psych is a lot more competitive and this information should not be new. Thats good that you have done a lot of research before applying.... Smart choice. You have a family and i feel that when a person is at their most vulnerable in life (which seems to be in your case) ... When theres a will...theres a way.

As for work to hold over, research might not be feasible because of training. However, the most demanding and easy/fast to train for is become a subsitute teacher at a public/private school. Its a babysitting job and all school districts need them. Not sure if you need a degree. It isnt a medical field job, but it pays.you can choose which days you want to work and tailor it to your interview dates. GL
 
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As for work to hold over, research might not be feasible because of training. However, the most demanding and easy/fast to train for is become a subsitute teacher at a public/private school. Its a babysitting job and all school districts need them. Not sure if you need a degree. It isnt a medical field job, but it pays.you can choose which days you want to work and tailor it to your interview dates. GL

That is such a fantastic idea! Thank you so much. I will look into this ASAP, regardless of match status.
 
I screwed up.

Maybe not. Time will tell. But, you definitely stacked the deck against yourself. Keep us posted. We'll have a second discussion if you don't Match.

Good luck. (Everyone else, don't do what he did.)

-Skip
 
Maybe not. Time will tell. But, you definitely stacked the deck against yourself. Keep us posted. We'll have a second discussion if you don't Match.

Good luck. (Everyone else, don't do what he did.)

-Skip

She, not he. Not that it matters.

I met with someone at my school yesterday to discuss potential employment before and after match. I explained that I could not apply properly because my financial aid is now two months late being released to me (without a reason.) That went well, as soon as I finish my last clinical I will be working for the school part-time. It is progress.
 
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Not a bit offended. It is funny to me how i just assumed that part of my identity is as prominent online as it is in real life. For four years.now I've been known as "the mom that brought her kids to the island."
 
Not a bit offended. It is funny to me how i just assumed that part of my identity is as prominent online as it is in real life. For four years.now I've been known as "the mom that brought her kids to the island."

i really hope things work out for you
 
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So I had my first of three interview days and it really seemed to go perfectly. But maybe it always feel so perfect?

I had thoroughly researched the program (it is new, but i knew the development schedule), its parent company, the regional demographics, the county's health department, the state of law enforcement mental health training in the region, faculty at the associated medical school, etc. not that i listed anything...but it definitely made it very easy to understand what was being asked, etc.

I really enjoyed the interviews. All of them just felt like meeting super nice and interesting people. Even though they asked a lot of questions it was still mostly like nice conversation. I didn't feel tired at the end at all.

The only weird thing that happened: another applicant from my school was there. one of the interviewers noticed and asked each of us (separately of course) if we knew the other. We were on the island together and spent much of m3 together I respect the other student so much and of course I just beamed and proceeded to tell her what a wonderful person I think he is and what a great psychiatrist he will be. She literally laughed and said "This just does not happen. I have never asked two students about each other during interviews and gotten such enthusiastic answers. Ever." I was definitely confused/surprised/clueless on how to respond. It was the only time of the whole day that I really had no idea what to say. I decided to just let the silence drag a bit. She seemed happy enough and moved on with her questions--so I guess it was fine to just look confused and not respond.
 
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Good luck with everything. Keep trying. Don't give up. Keep applying. You will match. It does not matter how bad the program. Match is a match.
 
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Good luck with everything. Keep trying. Don't give up. Keep applying. You will match. It does not matter how bad the program. Match is a match.

Thank you for the kindness. I keep going over that interview in my head and I can't think of how it could have gone any better. Even when it was my turn to ask questions they went well. I expressed an interest in a population not yet covered in their program, but the pd told me "If you come here I am sure we can put you in touch with Dr. Xxxx in xxxx which is a little far away, but his study..." and went on to explain the current study the guy is doing. It seemed like very promising work. When the pd asked my future goals, he went on to explain why this would be a good place for me. He even volunteered information about some financial incentives during residency, and gave dollar amounts. I did not even know these things existed. I hear that most programs try to get you to rank them high, so I guess this is probably pretty typical...which makes this process even more confusing.

Anyway, I really liked the program a lot! If others think it is bad, good for me :).
 
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What would be great news is if they pre-match!

Funny, I share the same experiences with you during interviews. Definitely you get to see many colleagues that you rotated and seen on the island. Bitter and sweet moment that happens simultaneously. Its nice to see them, but I wish it was under different circumstances. GL
 
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What would be great news is if they pre-match!

Funny, I share the same experiences with you during interviews. Definitely you get to see many colleagues that you rotated and seen on the island. Bitter and sweet moment that happens simultaneously. Its nice to see them, but I wish it was under different circumstances. GL

I am definitely hoping they withdraw from match and offer me a contract, but that's a pipe dream for sure!

This guy that I saw, we still see each other a lot. We were also together imf, much of m3, and still cross paths as m4s. I didn't have any mixed feelings about seeing him. Actually, I would love it if we both matched there. He would make a fantastic co-resident.

GL to you, too. (Though you don't need luck!)
 
I am definitely hoping they withdraw from match and offer me a contract, but that's a pipe dream for sure!

This guy that I saw, we still see each other a lot. We were also together imf, much of m3, and still cross paths as m4s. I didn't have any mixed feelings about seeing him. Actually, I would love it if we both matched there. He would make a fantastic co-resident.

GL to you, too. (Though you don't need luck!)

Everyone needs the luck.... Because it isn't done until the ink has settled. I was told this at the beginning of the match...

"Treat each interview like it is your only".

I wrote about the number of interviews on my thread not to brag, but to inform those who troll or believe that IMGs are lesser than AMG... That it isn't true. It also is meant to serve as hope for those who come after.

Its a tough journey and will continue to be so.
 
"Treat each interview like it is your only".

I hear the spirit of what you say, but you have no idea how much a person can obsess when the interviews are few! I knew a ridiculous amount of info before that interview. If I had 8 interviews I would certainly not be studying the public health, demographics, history, and geology of the county before the interview hoping for an outside chance to get to use a fraction of what I had learned. I'm not saying it was useless, but for what little difference it made in my ability to follow a conversation it was a lot of work.
 
I agree... I use the US census bureau for the fast facts on those info that you listed above. GL
 
I agree... I use the US census bureau for the fast facts on those info that you listed above. GL
I was surprised at how much of the information actually turned out to be useful. As I was spending hours upon hours studying the area, I mostly felt I was obsessing just to have something to do. However, a lot of the information was extremely useful. It was hard for me to see how it was useful before the interview. It's not like I was telling anyone what I had studied. It was useful in knowing what not to ask, and also gave perspective on why the interviewers were asking certain questions. Most of the benefits of doing prior research actually vague and difficult to pinpoint.
 
I got another interview :soexcited:!!!!

That's 4 invites. In 2016 there were 21 US-IMGs who got 4 psychiatry interviews. Fourteen of them matched into psych. Obviously I am not homefree but the odds are seeming to be in my favor now.

Maybe I will match.
 
In 2016 there were 21 US-IMGs who got 4 psychiatry interviews. Fourteen of them matched into psych. .

Where did you get this info, so I can look it up for my specialty? Thanks and congrats to you. GL
 
Where did you get this info, so I can look it up for my specialty? Thanks and congrats to you. GL

This one is for IMGs. US-IMGs are charted separately from foreign grads in this format. If you look closely you will find some SDN rumors are inconsistent with this data.

http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Charting-Outcomes-IMGs-2016.pdf

Another helpful but potentially time-sucking publication:
http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/NRMP-2016-Program-Director-Survey.pdf

This one can help you understand relative importance of different factors across specialties. For instance, which matters more, step 1 or step 2? Which matters more, LORs or step scores? Do basic science grades matter? Do clinical grades matter? These answers differ drastically between specialties.
 
Just a happy update: my interviews have been phenomenal. They could not have gone better. Even though there are only four, I have left feeling great. One of the program directors even gave me his cell number and sent a love letter the next afternoon.
 
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Just a happy update: my interviews have been phenomenal. They could not have gone better. Even though there are only four, I have left feeling great. One of the program directors even gave me his cell number and sent a love letter the next afternoon.
Yes!!! Keep going
 
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Just a happy update: my interviews have been phenomenal. They could not have gone better. Even though there are only four, I have left feeling great. One of the program directors even gave me his cell number and sent a love letter the next afternoon.

Did you do research, by any chance? And any advice regarding how to just cold-call for summer research?
 
Did you do research, by any chance? And any advice regarding how to just cold-call for summer research?

I did not do research. I have experience in a niche field in public health that just happens to work well with a new program at their institution. It is quite unusual and certainly not something you could just go learn. Even if you could the odds of it ever being useful as a doctor are miniscule. Also, not sure of your gender, but this is something only females do.
 
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