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What the world of job interviewing has tought me

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by theslave, Dec 16, 2008.

  1. theslave

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    Sorry, I just need to vent.

    What have I learned? (in my area of the upper Midwest)

    - Employers don't want you to have goals when applying for an entry level job. They want you to work the job for them and be their worker. If you mention any plans about wanting to go to graduate school, you killed your chances at the job. They just want someone to be their slave. When you apply for a research assistant job, they just want some person with no drive to do the grunt work and then you are on your way out the door once the project or fudning is done. Where do you go? Get another research assistant job or maybe get a manager job managing the assistants for the project?

    - You are judged based on where you went to school (in my area of the country). It doesn't matter what your work experience is around here. If you have that big name school as the place you got your degree, you get hired over people with real world experience that graduated from a no name place.

    - If you say that you want to go medical school, PA schoool, or even just show passion for a medical profession, you might as well just ask for money on the street as you will get money faster that way then you will from the employer.

    - Just about every employer hates the "one year gap" thing that new college graduate students do.

    - We are a specialized economy. The last job you had is the job that you are the most qualifed for.

    Screw all of this crap. Go directly from high school to college and then to graduate school (PA, MD, DO, etc). If you have to take that extra year off, I wish you the best for finding an employer that is actually carying about your future and WANTS you to do the best you can for yourself. The day I find a hiring manager that understands the "gap year" thing I will ask to mary in a split second (not literally).
     
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  3. Lukkie

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    i agree with most of the post except this part. a lot of academic research groups like hiring fresh out of college, gap-year(s) type people because they are far more motivated than someone who just wants the paycheck (they'll go the extra mile to get some publications and stronger LOR). Hopefully they get this increased quality output without having to worry about promoting them or raising their pay. The retraining of the next piece of fresh meat is always annoying but I think their cost-benefit analysis over time has proven to be beneficial.
     
  4. Slowpoke

    Slowpoke I haz cheezburger
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    don't burn my future plans by saying the gap year is horrendous!

    are you looking in the right places? how are your interviewing skills?
     
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  6. theslave

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    I've got two medical writing jobs that I do from home (took 6 months to get both). I just needed to vent with all of the job hunting crap that I had to deal with since last May.

    Some of you will get lucky and have research projects and labs that want fresh college graduates that are motivated. I've just learned that this is not the case in my area. Makes me wish I lived in California or in the Northeast so I could get a job that wants a person that is motivated to work hard and push for publications and be valuable member of the science and medical community.

    I also just wanted to let the current college students know that the "gap year" is not all roses with how crappy the economy is right now (unemployment for college graduates is up). That is why I said in my original posting that I hope some of you get lucky and find a lab or a department at a hospital that wants a person that is passionate about medicine and not having to deal with a department that just wants a person to work their project and say adiouse once the project is complete. My worst dealings were with head hunters....promising me an interview or a job interview and getting neither, lol. Getting past the HR people is another hassle that sucks (get to the hiring manager even if the HR people reject you).
     
  7. aznb0y129

    aznb0y129 Oh hamburgers!
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    I dunno. Maybe it's different in the Midwest, but I've always been upfront with my employers about my plans to go to med school. Before you ask, I was an RA and currently a research coordinator and got LORs from both PIs. My current supervisor has been especially supportive of my ambitions beyond his research project.
     
  8. b33sharp

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    I agree entirely with the OP. At this point, it is borderline impossible to find people that are interested in having someone for one year, even if you can make the argument that you'll need less training. In my experience, I'll get to the interview and they'll begin by saying they want a 2+ year commitment.

    I think if you are planning on taking 2 years or more off in between, you'll probably be fine; one year off is pretty tough imo.

    (I'm also in the Midwest, FWIW)
     
  9. silverhorse84

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    I didn't have any problems as long as I kept things vague. When asked about future plans I didn't mention med school and just kept it vague saying I would always be in medicine and would go back to school at some point, but now I just want real world experience (I hadn't started applying to schools at the time and I was trying to decide if I wanted to take 1 or 2 years off so I didn't feel bad saying this).

    You just have to think about what you're going to say, and what impact that may have on the interviewer. :oops:
     
  10. Excelsius

    Excelsius Carpe Noctem
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    That's too big of an over-generalization, especially the bolded parts. The question is what kind of jobs have you had? I think this is more a function of where you applied rather than a function of your geographic location. In law we often deal with professionals, sometimes from outside of USA, who are getting a job here. Experience is ALWAYS more important than where you got your degree. I know high level managers at a research facility who didn't even complete their bachelors (much less worry about the name of the school). If you applied to any of the jobs I applied to without any goals, you wouldn't be accepted. Good employers want to hire an intelligent asset. Unless you are going to be a cleaning person, no one wants to hire a sheep. At both of my workplaces I know at least four different people who are working on their masters, applying to law school school, or have open plans to pursue Ph.D. Hell, one of the places even pays you a limited amount to get a higher degree.

    It sucks that you have had such negative experiences, but know that your experience is not the norm and it will not be the best advice for pre-meds trying to find a good job. And it is obvious that if you are applying for an engineering position, you don't really have to mention that you are planning for medical school on the day of your job interview, even though it might actually benefit you in some places because determination is highly valued by any successful employer. Your attitude is also very important. Try to see whether it has played any part in the negativity that you have experienced towards you.
     
  11. rocketbooster

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    You guys don't understand since it sounds like you're from the coasts.

    I'm from the midwest and I know what the OP is posting about. He's definitely right that it is very hard to find a 1-year PAYING job in the research field. The way you overcome that and get your foot in the door is by offering to start off VOLUNTEERING in the lab. you start off volunteering to show you are interested in the research and not the money. lab instructors love workers who simply have a strong interest in the research. I know many ppl who started as a volunteer and were then hired.

    in the midwest, you definitely get laughed at by the PI when you meet them and say "I want to get something published this year." that isn't a realistic goal here. it takes half of the time for them just to train you. it is possible, but it's usually more a matter of luck of volunteering for the right PI who is dishing out the publications already. the problem is those professors are well-known and are not going to have a spot open for you if you're just some random person seeking a job. all of the ppl I know who are in the labs dishing out publications took classes with the professor thus they already had connections to the inside.
     
  12. Kaustikos

    Kaustikos Archerize It
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    I started off working as a pharmacy technician working minimum wage to get my foot in the door. Then I boasted confidently that I could do the work required and BAM - I'm working at Lilly in Indianapolis.

    JK

    I hear you guys, it sucks. The economy is down, but if there's one thing I'm seeing here it's to keep your pride and not take ANY job in science because it might have devastating consequences on future aspirations. The position I have vs something at the same price range in LOB (hit-to lead receptor biology) has seen a huge difference in turn-around for people quitting/leaving. I've seen people swear off biology/science forever because of how they were treated/the position they have. You just have to find that position where the person in charge shares the same passion for science and knowledge and understands the position you're in.


    edit

    I did want to also highlight something I have learned working here - major pharmaceutical companies are outsourcing EVERYTHING scientific, making it outrageously hard to land a job at a major pharmaceutical company if you're interested in science. There are 3 major companies here in the midwest off the top of my head and they outsource their lab/science to so many smaller companies it's ridiculous. So, if you don't land a job at a major company, don't feel so bad. It's not your fault
    Goodluck and don't take **** from no one, even PI's. You don't deserve that crap even if they have a PhD.
     
  13. scarletgirl777

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    I feel like that's been true for a while. If you want to do something substantive in just one year, you have to look very hard. Don't be one of those people who takes 2 years off just because you can't find anything else to do.
     
  14. Kaustikos

    Kaustikos Archerize It
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    Or

    ya know

    lie. Unless they make you sign a 2-4 year contract, you don't have to do anything.
     
  15. vadd0

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    Even if you do sign, you can still quit. I think the 13th amendment of the constitution extends onto not forcing people to work because of contracts.
     
  16. Schlockinz

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    The economy is in the crapper, deal with it. I have 3 yrs engineering experience, I have outstanding recommendations from my supervisors. After oil crashed, I haven't heard any news from employers. I'm having friends with jobs who were supposed to get full time that are being laid off, and offers withdrawn from others. Thats just the nature of the beast, its real tough to get a job and employers know that they can cherry-pick their employees right now.

    As far as research assistantships, most people that I talked to did want a 2 year commitment, the fact that I'm looking into an MD/PhD at the same school has usually gotten past that, but the lack of funding is rearing its head. My brother is on the west coast and they forced the older members of his lab (all the PhD students that passed the quals) to write their thesis and graduate within 6 months, otherwise they were out of the lab with only a masters. So this is happening everywhere, just be prepared to live poor if thats what it comes down to.
     
  17. theslave

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    Just so everyone knows, I’m not complaining about having had a tough time, I’m letting those in the near future know the reality of things in the Midwest. I consider myself lucky with having two jobs that are mobile and that I can continue to work when I go to graduate school in one and a half years from now.

    Those of you in the Northeast have it really lucky…..big name hospitals, big research universities, research companies galore, and so much more. Here, in Wisconsin, all we have are the few job postings that the UW-Madison posts and a couple of local jobs at Covance (a poster above already touched on the outsourcing thing…Covance is one of the companies the pharmas outsource to).

    It also isn’t easy to lie. Even if you say that is fine there will still be instances where they will ask certain type of questions to try and know what you really want to do in the future.

    I strongly urge the young pre-med students on SDN to try and get some sort of certification so they can work as a pharmacy tech, a blood tech (mind is blank on the name at this second), CAN, paramedit, and the like (or even an MLT). These are good jobs to have in the “gap year” because they don’t ask specific questions to try and cut the pile of applicants to a few.

    For myself, I will just continue with my medical writing jobs and just get a job caring for the elderly for $10 an hour during the third shift and call it good until I start graduate school.

    Also, for those of you in the Midwest, good luck with getting a job at a biotech company….not an easy thing to do.
     
  18. therocketman

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    this is kind of true. i tried to cover the fact that i was going to medical school when i applied to the research position i am currently working at. i figured they would want to hire someone that would stay longer than one year (due to the effort and time invested in teaching someone new all the lab techniques.) however.. i got lucky cause my pi is awesome and actually a lot of the past people in his lab were med students getting a phd :) so he understood my situation.
     
  19. rocketbooster

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    me too. the reason it worked out for me was because he is a PhD researcher at my state med school and told him I would love to continue working in his lab during med school if I am accepted there. one of his workers over the summer was an M2 so he understood my desire for med school. I do only go in a few times a week as a volunteer, but if I was able to do it fulltime I would get paid. the 2 fulltime, paid assistants in his lab are trying to get into grad school. he knows they could be gone in a year. in order not to waste his money on training them, he made them volunteer fulltime for a month. once they were properly trained, they started getting paid. however, this is a lab that I doubt any of the assistants will get publications. we prepare the slides, run the gels, and gather data for HIS research he's working on.
     
  20. DrYoda

    DrYoda Space Cowboy
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    It's bad business to hire and then train someone who you know is going to jump ship 12 months later. Employeers love goals, but it has to involve them in some capacity for them to like it. I'm not sure why you guys expect an employeer to be cool with a one year stint.
     
  21. Handy388

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    that much more includes big concentration of Ph.Ds, effectively making it impossible to find a job as a college grad.
     
  22. aznb0y129

    aznb0y129 Oh hamburgers!
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    Depends, if you're a PhD you're probably going to start your own project rather than be an RA (possibly a coordinator). I doubt they're angling for the same positions as college grads.
     
  23. scarletgirl777

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    I call BS on that. Also, it's never a good idea to make a bad name for yourself--you never know who your supervisor might know.
     
  24. aznb0y129

    aznb0y129 Oh hamburgers!
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    Agreed, don't sign the contract unless you intend to honor the minimum requirements. You don't want to unnecessarily burn some bridges unless it's unavoidable. Plus, if you don't end up getting an LOR from that PI (doubtful if you bailed on your contract), it might look suspicious to adcoms.
     
  25. b33sharp

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    fair enough, for jobs that require more extensive training and/or have some benefit for the employee in the form of a paycheck, possibility for a publication, etc.

    but some employers like to ignore the causes of high turnover in entry level jobs like research techs/assistants. there's a reason why people don't want to stay, mainly because there is usually no upward mobility (not to mention potentially low pay and stressful environment depending on the PI and coworkers). it makes more sense to me to fill these jobs with people that will work hard for the time that they are there and leave before they start to hate it.

    what's frustrating is that candidates often end up volunteering during the training process, even if they already have a degree. in what other field are you expected to work without pay to obtain the entry level job described? My point is, I can see how people with a biology degree can get disillusioned...and why we're having trouble getting bright people in this country to choose scientific careers.
     
  26. Kaustikos

    Kaustikos Archerize It
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    Yeah, it's a sad and understandable truth. Why should they hire you if takes at least 25% of your employment in order to be trained?
    Suspicious unless you have sufficient LOR from other sources. But the fact of the matter is, unless they make you sign a x year contract, you have every right to lie in my books. It's hard enough getting a job, why crush them with higher goals than being a research tech?
     
  27. vadd0

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    Because employers can force their employees to work? You know like having indentured servants? Or having slaves? :smack: It may be burning bridges, but it is not BS. I did not say to do it, rather I said you can do it.
     
  28. rocketbooster

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    yep, that's what I had to do and am doing right now. it makes it much easier to find a "job" because the PI won't lose any money from training a new person if he/she was only volunteering at the time. I think it's a good idea because then the volunteer has no commitment to keeping the job since they are not a real employee. You get to find out for yourself if you like the job before you sign up for 1-2 years or whatever.

    the part I bolded is correct, though. it really isn't fair NOT to be started off being paid. in reality, though, it's just the most successful route to start as a volunteer first. if you are pressed for money, then what are you to do in the meantime? I could only do it because I am still supported by my parents. I see this job only temporary until med school, though. I'm not counting on this to be my career.
     
    #27 rocketbooster, Dec 16, 2008
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2008
  29. DrYoda

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    Vadd0 is correct, while it may be unprofessional you are not forced to honor contracts. You can be penalized though, for example you may have to return a sign on bonus or something for not staying on to term. Which is why it's good to carefully read anything you sign.
     
  30. b33sharp

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    yep. most people don't have the luxury of working for free unless they're supported by parents, but as you say it seems to be the best way to get your foot in the door to get a paying position. this is one of my main pet peeves with the process of applying to medical school: not only is it expensive, but your success is partly dependent on being in a position financially to volunteer in hospitals or labs. this is easier to do as a student before graduation, so i'd recommend skipping the gap year if finances are a major consideration and you don't have something already lined up.

    this goes along with rocketbooster's comment about the job being temporary. it's hard not to have that sentiment come out in the interview. i'd say most people in these types of jobs see it as a stepping stone rather than a long-term career. it seems employers want a hard-working, motivated candidate who happens to have no plans for the near future. :rolleyes:
     
  31. alibai3ah

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  32. wasteoftime

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    It's because the premeds that have come before you that a PI may be cautious about hiring you. No one wants to hire someone just padding their application for something else when they aren't really dedicated to science.
     
  33. Bahadur

    Bahadur Cookies! nom nom nom
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    Totally unrelated to this topic, but are you Persian/Iranian/Afghan/Tajiki?

    haha sorry for the random question, it's just that not a lot of people are familiar with Ibn Sina (Avicenna) and your icon piqued my curiosity.
     
  34. medfool24

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    Yes. I totally agree.

    The other thing that I find startling is that pre-meds (unless you do research) usually have no marketable skills or relevant experience (internships). All of my best friends (they're all engineers, except one, he does neuroscience research) have jobs. I'm stuck trying to find something that I can do that doesn't require research skills. I even have a master's in public health, and I'm still having a tough time. The economy is terrible, and that makes it even more difficult.

    And yes, you are judged on where you go/went to school. Recruiters go to specific schools that they have ties with to get new employees. Also, if you went a "good" school and some random employer sees your resume, it is likely that he will have a good impression of you, and he is an alum, an even better impresion.

    Volunteering is good if you have no experience and need to get your foot in the door. But again, as someone mentioned, it's not paid work and you need support from family/friends.

    It's always good to have a fallback plan. Mine was getting a master's. So far it hasn't paid off, but we will see.
     
  35. EpiPEN

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    dunno about you, but it tought me how to spell ;)



    but you know where's a great place to work for a year? In a teaching hospital. There people actually give you great advice and help you get into med school. They also understand that you won't be staying long because you are on a med track. That's where I worked for a year and got some great LORs not to mention the publications. Clinical Research may not pay much, but it is the shiznizzels for getting into medical school. Especially since most of the fellows and researchers in these studies are also on a tight time table themselves, which means they like to tackle manageable projects that could use a lot of help (where you come in).
     
  36. scrplyr86

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    i completely agree with the op. i live in the midwest, i graduated in may, took a year off, and had to look for a job this summer during my gap year. luckily, i found a job in a pathology research lab at a hospital very quickly, but a lot of my other pre-med/science friends had a much harder time finding one. during my interview the dr i am now working for told me how two of his students had just left to begin med school (he was obviously really bitter about it i dont know why) and he wanted to know what my future plans were and if i could give him a two year commitment. he made it clear that he didn't really care about what any of my future career aspirations were, he wanted someone to be focused on his research.
    although i knew i was planning on applying to med school this cycle, i knew there was no guarantee that i would get in, and everyone i knew was having such a hard time finding a job, so i told him i planned on going back to school sometime in the future but that two years sounded fair. i did not sign any sort of contract saying that i agreed to stay two years.
    well...now that i know that i for sure will be going to school next fall i have no idea what to tell him. i dont think im going to say anything until marchish, and then leave around the fourth of july. i figure that will give him a few months to find a replacement. ahhh im nervous to tell him!
     
  37. ejay286

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    [YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSXf-qv-gAo[/YOUTUBE]
     
  38. ButImLETired

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    Definitely true. I looked for jobs doing bench research after graduation, and zilch (by the way, it's much worse in the East Coast because the competition is a nightmare- try looking for a job at MGH when every premed of every single college in Boston is doing the same). So I became a lot more flexible and annoying. I emailed my college professors and asked them if they were doing research, needed an assistant, and could pay a comfortable salary. When they all said no, I asked them if they knew people who might. I applied to jobs throughout the US, not wanting to limit myself geographically (time to grow up and be open-minded, this is a very large country). I asked friends of friends to hook me up at their big research universities with either clinical or bench research, sent my resume out EVERYWHERE. At this point I was living in New York, but when I got a phone call to come visit a friend in Northern California and interview for a clinical research coordinator job, I got on the first plane over here. I made it extremely clear that I'd be applying to med school this year, that I'd have to take vacation time for interviews, and that I'd be quitting next summer.
    The beauty of clinical research, as Epi said, is that most projects aren't all that long-term (drug companies dont want their drug trials to take 3 years and delay FDA approval), and training takes a pretty short time. It looks great on applications (it has both the research component and the patient care component, plus PIs are usually so glad you're doing all the gruntwork for a study that they'll write you great letters) and may or may not result in papers, depending on whether the research was run by your PI or by the drug company. I've been working at a huge, big-name research University for a year, I'm running my own clinical trial and assisting on a bunch of other ones, I've been published 3 times, and I got two LORs out of it. I've never lived in California before now, but it's been good, and it's nice to have good contacts strewn about the country. Not only does no one mind that I'm leaving in the summer, but they're all extremely supportive and very excited to figure out where I'm gonna go (everyone has an opinion :rolleyes:).

    Seriously, stay open-minded and look into clinical research. Ask everyone for help, that's what your undergrad is there for. Ask your premed adviser, friends' parents, doctors you've met a few times, everyone. Look everywhere. Good luck! :D
     
  39. BTC

    BTC
    7+ Year Member

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    So you're saying finding a job is hard? In this market? Really?

    Employers have many many potential candidates to choose from and they don't have very much information about that candidate (a resume and possibly a cover letter). If you've ever been the one interviewing to hire someone you'd know how risky the proposition really is. There are A LOT of awful employees out there. Over time some employers learn tricks that help them avoid these awful employees.

    Finding someone from a good school is a good example. Most labs don't have the resources to thoroughly vet a potential employee like schools do so they trust the school's decision. It's not a guarantee to get someone good but it certainly helps.

    Assuming you didn't go to a top ranked school, take a look at the average student in your school and ask yourself if you would hire them. I didn't go to a great school and that answer for me is a resounding NO. Realizing this, I knew I had to be proactive in my research job seeking. Submitting resumes online is a waste of time. At the University I currently work at, all positions have to be posted online, even if the PI is going to fill the spot with someone he knows. So you are most likely applying to a job posting that doesn't have a position available behind it.

    So go volunteer in a lab, get some experience and a letter of reference from someone in the field, network, and hopefully you'll get lucky.

    The working world, like most of life, is not like school where everything you want is spoon fed to you.
     
  40. savant

    savant XIII
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    I think you can get around this by looking for a research job in the college you went to.
     
  41. magikdoc

    2+ Year Member

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    Definitely agree with you there.

    My current research employer interviewed at least 10 applicants for his research assistant job before he took me. I think what really got be through was word of mouth from other people in the field. After that, the interview was not a problem because I tried to show genuine interest in the research topic and had some references in the bag to prove that I was a hard worker.

    Now that I have been working 3-4 months now during my year off, I have to say, the lab doesn't really value my ability to think at all. But more so, to do grunt work perfectly and repetitively every time. But eh, its a job.

    So my advice, try to work with what you already have (previous employers) and ask if they can hook you up.
     
  42. theslave

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    A couple of you are missing the point of my thread and the reasons for us in the Midwest having such a tough time.

    It isn't that we can't get interviews. Its what the company wants out of us and the reasons why they hire the ones they do that pisses so many of us in the Midwest off. Let me give you a few examples.

    Job interview 1: This was for a clinical research coordinator position at a teaching hospital. This research group has two doctors, three research coordinators, and one manager. One of the research coordinators decided she might want to leave her job. So they advertised her job and I interviewed for it. When I spoke with her, she told me she didn't have any idea what she wants to do in the future for a career yet and that this current job is just something to do in the mean time. She graduated from a local big name school. The other two coordinators were ex-nurses (both in their 50's). These positions were state jobs. So they can keep their jobs year after year. The hiring manager tested my ability to present a patient history, explain medical terms (that were given to me), and a couple of other things. She said this should only take about 15 minutes to get done. Well, I was done with it all in less than two minutes. She was shocked at how fast I was able to do it with perfect accuracy. So then she wanted to know more details about my past job history...well, I have over five years of hospital work experience, I work as a medical writer, and I read the medical/science literature for fun----I didn't say it in those specific words (I don't care what others think). Then she wanted to know what I wanted to do in the future. I made it a point to explain why I wanted a career in clinical research and how I wanted to take the clinical research experience as I further my career. I got a job rejection in an email the next day, lol, lol, lol. Like I didn't have the ability to do the job.

    Job interview 2: They took 10 minutes to explain the organizational chart of their department (yes, I would at the bottom of the department. Big deal is what I thought the whole time). They stressed three times that they wanted to hire their new employee to stay with the whole research project that was estimated to take another five years. We then talked about how my work experience fits the position. I've done every single thing they wanted for the job in my past job experiences. They asked three different questions to get my future career plans. Once they figured out that I actually want a future beyond their research project (take the experience from this position and apply to future career growth), they once again talked about wanting a person for the remainder of the project because the last person lied to them and left for medical school. I never heard back from them again, lol, lol.

    Job interview 3 (several were like this--estimated around 7 total): We want a person that will be here for a long....we want a person that will be here for a long time....we want a person that will be here for a long time.

    Job interview 4: The interview went great. The last thing he asked was, what do you want to do as a career when this job is done in three years? So I explained what my career goals are. Got a job rejection email the next day, lol, lol.

    I interviewed for jobs in MN, IA, IL, and WI and they were all like the above examples.

    I then applied for a medical writer job at the nations number 1 health information website on the Internet. I applied for the job and two hours later was asked to have a conference call with the hiring manager. We talked on the phone for a little over 30 minutes and I was hired on the spot!!!!!!!

    Now tell me this, how can I use the same work experience with just a few changes in the resume to relfect the differences in the job they wanted to hire for and I can get hired by the Internets number one health information website and not get one of those simple clinical research or research assistant jobs? :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh::laugh: :laugh::laugh::laugh:

    I don't have enough fingers and toes to count the number of times the interview started with: "we require (blank) number of years."

    I remember way bank in May I interivewed for a research assistant job. The scientist quized me left and right to see if I had the knowledge of the type of research done in his lab. He said I was the smartest person he had interviewed for the position. He skipped all of the psychological type of interview questions and went right at my future career goals. I simply explained that I want to gain some research experience and how I would love to go graduate school (PA, MD, DO, or Ph.D.) and still continue to work with basic research. I noticed him change his tone of voice just a little (this lead me to asking the other members of the lab how long they have worked in the lab when I meet them later on). It turns out that ALL employees of his lab have worked their for longer than five years besides the post-docs.

    I think the other posters from the Midwest know what I'm talking about and most likely have had to deal with the same thing.

    I had one doctor tell me point blank: "we have a really tough time keeping people for these type of jobs, but we don't have any trouble at all for hiring people for these positions." So that explains the mindset of what crap we have to deal with to just get real world work experience.
     
    #41 theslave, Dec 17, 2008
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2008

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