What would make medical school less stressful?

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DJay4534533

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I often find myself thinking about ways that medical school can be so unnecessarily stressful. If certain things changed in the system, it would make the process so much better.

For me personally, I’ve been thinking a lot about the obnoxious volume of information that we learn, and honestly....if there were an option, I would gladly choose to go to a medical school that lasts 6 years, if it meant that I got to learn the material at a reasonable pace & still have a life outside of class.

Another thing - we deserve WAY more breaks than we get. I know it’s a taboo in American society to cherish vacation time, but it’s a necessary rest period that everyone should have. This constant studying & cycle of stress can wear on you over time. Just because we’re studying/in training doesn’t mean we shouldn’t have a good quality life.

What are some things that would make med school less stressful for you?

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For me personally, I’ve been thinking a lot about the obnoxious volume of information that we learn, and honestly....if there were an option, I would gladly choose to go to a medical school that lasts 6 years, if it meant that I got to learn the material at a reasonable pace & still have a life outside of class.

Another thing - we deserve WAY more breaks than we get. I know it’s a taboo in American society to cherish vacation time, but it’s a necessary rest period that everyone should have. This constant studying & cycle of stress can wear on you over time. Just because we’re studying/in training doesn’t mean we shouldn’t have a good quality life.
Disagree with your first point, I'd rather get it over with in a shorter amount of time. Agree with your second point, although I guess it kinda requires the first point lol.

I wish we had less required, useless stuff from our school. I wish professors didn't sometimes blatantly contradict what is in multiple other resources because they think their way is better. I wish all schools had P/F truly unranked pre-clinical grading and a universally standardized clinical grading system.
 
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I often find myself thinking about ways that medical school can be so unnecessarily stressful. If certain things changed in the system, it would make the process so much better.

For me personally, I’ve been thinking a lot about the obnoxious volume of information that we learn, and honestly....if there were an option, I would gladly choose to go to a medical school that lasts 6 years, if it meant that I got to learn the material at a reasonable pace & still have a life outside of class.

Another thing - we deserve WAY more breaks than we get. I know it’s a taboo in American society to cherish vacation time, but it’s a necessary rest period that everyone should have. This constant studying & cycle of stress can wear on you over time. Just because we’re studying/in training doesn’t mean we shouldn’t have a good quality life.

What are some things that would make med school less stressful for you?
Practice mindfulness techniques
Exercise
Do not skimp on sleep
 
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P/F pre-clinical, standardized clinical grading, every school taking the NBME subject exams, no Step 2 CS.

Lengthening the time of schooling would increase stress overall IMO. I'd rather all schools have a 12 month pre-clinical, and then lots of elective rotations/time for research over the next 3 years.
 
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Non-mandatory attendance.
 
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One of my peeves is students complaining about useless information they are required to learn. Face it, they are students, who dont know very much yet but somehow know what they dont need to know. Whew. Got that off my chest. Now, about the stress. Stress is mostly self induced. Try to be kind to yourself, set goals like reading a couple chapters , then treat yourself to a break, exercise socialize, meditate, something different. Also, having a support system or network is crucial. Being alone with your thoughts too often is not healthy
 
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P/F pre-clinical, standardized clinical grading, every school taking the NBME subject exams, no Step 2 CS.

Lengthening the time of schooling would increase stress overall IMO. I'd rather all schools have a 12 month pre-clinical, and then lots of elective rotations/time for research over the next 3 years.
3 years of clinical rotations would be awesome, but idk how prepared we be.
 
Def agree with more breaks. Even just a week once a semester.. you even get that in residency.
 
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One of my peeves is students complaining about useless information they are required to learn. Face it, they are students, who dont know very much yet but somehow know what they dont need to know. Whew. Got that off my chest. Now, about the stress. Stress is mostly self induced. Try to be kind to yourself, set goals like reading a couple chapters , then treat yourself to a break, exercise socialize, meditate, something different. Also, having a support system or network is crucial. Being alone with your thoughts too often is not healthy
I actually don’t think most of the info that we learn is useless. However, the pace at which we learn the info makes it harder for it to stick in the long run....imo. Hence, why I would be fine with taking more time to learn the material well. I can’t tell you how many doctors/residents/upperclassmen who let me know they don’t remember 90% of the stuff they were taught in med school. I think that’s tragic. Like....isn’t med school supposed to be where we build a foundation of knowledge before we specialize. It just seems like it would be a better use of everyone’s time to just take the time to allow students to digest and process (and store & retain) the info to better utilize in the future.
 
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I actually don’t think most of the info that we learn is useless. However, the pace at which we learn the info makes it harder for it to stick in the long run....imo. Hence, why I would be fine with taking more time to learn the material well. I can’t tell you how many doctors/residents/upperclassmen who let me know they don’t remember 90% of the stuff they were taught in med school. I think that’s tragic. Like....isn’t med school supposed to be where we build a foundation of knowledge before we specialize. It just seems like it would be a better use of everyone’s time to just take the time to allow students to digest and process (and store & retain) the info to better utilize in the future.
You are correct. This is why you see repeating themes. One of my mentors used to say" Repetition is the key to mastery". You need years, into residency and beyond to master the things pertinent to your specialty. Many attending will tell you they didn't become comfortable in their trade until about 5 yrs of practice after residency/fellowship.
 
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if there were an option, I would gladly choose to go to a medical school that lasts 6 years, if it meant that I got to learn the material at a reasonable pace & still have a life outside of class.

lol and be 500k in debt by the end of medical school, no thanks
 
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lol and be 500k in debt by the end of medical school, no thanks
If you’re getting the the same material & resources over the course of your education, the final price should still come out the same. I’m obviously speaking hypothetically, but IF more schools seriously considered this schedule, I feel like they would have to cut down on the yearly cost of tuition.
 
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I often find myself thinking about ways that medical school can be so unnecessarily stressful. If certain things changed in the system, it would make the process so much better.

For me personally, I’ve been thinking a lot about the obnoxious volume of information that we learn, and honestly....if there were an option, I would gladly choose to go to a medical school that lasts 6 years, if it meant that I got to learn the material at a reasonable pace & still have a life outside of class.

Another thing - we deserve WAY more breaks than we get. I know it’s a taboo in American society to cherish vacation time, but it’s a necessary rest period that everyone should have. This constant studying & cycle of stress can wear on you over time. Just because we’re studying/in training doesn’t mean we shouldn’t have a good quality life.

What are some things that would make med school less stressful for you?
That's the way it is in most of the world for a good reason. There's no doubt that if the same amount of information taken in the first 2 preclinical years was spread out over 3 years instead, med school would be a lot less hectic.
(Maybe I'm just jaded as I had my cardiovascular block exam today with hundreds of drugs to memorize just for the pharmacology part of it.)
Of course the real issue here is that there's no reason undergrad should be 4 years for people who most of the time are determined to be physicians since high school and before. Ideally, there would be a new system where medical school is right after high school/ 1 year of college with the MCAT or other standardized exam as the main academic criteria for admissions. Of course, this would mean a much more rigorous high school curriculum that includes the college equivalent of Bio 101-102, Gen chem, Orgo, Physics, and Psych.
I know I'm dreaming though because there's no way our "prestigious universities" are gonna let go of the cash cow they have in form of premeds and premed hopefuls majoring in a useless Bio degree for $100k or more.
 
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P/F pre-clinical, standardized clinical grading, every school taking the NBME subject exams, no Step 2 CS.

Lengthening the time of schooling would increase stress overall IMO. I'd rather all schools have a 12 month pre-clinical, and then lots of elective rotations/time for research over the next 3 years.

I agree that this is the ideal approach (although the preclinical year might be hectic but worth it), and it shows why some schools have adopted the 1 year preclinical/3 year clinical model with a research year and electives built in.
 
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Looking back, orgies after each exam would have added a lot
 
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I often find myself thinking about ways that medical school can be so unnecessarily stressful. If certain things changed in the system, it would make the process so much better.

For me personally, I’ve been thinking a lot about the obnoxious volume of information that we learn, and honestly....if there were an option, I would gladly choose to go to a medical school that lasts 6 years, if it meant that I got to learn the material at a reasonable pace & still have a life outside of class.

Another thing - we deserve WAY more breaks than we get. I know it’s a taboo in American society to cherish vacation time, but it’s a necessary rest period that everyone should have. This constant studying & cycle of stress can wear on you over time. Just because we’re studying/in training doesn’t mean we shouldn’t have a good quality life.

What are some things that would make med school less stressful for you?

No exams, No USMLE... just make it a fun day every day. You go to class to sleep and play hide and seek with the fellow students. We discuss NBA scores/football scores of the night before in our small group discussion... Instead of vital signs we look at baseball stats.Instead of problem solving, we talk about fantasy teams.
 
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If we're talking within the realm of possibility but not gonna happen, nothing mandatory whatsoever for the first two years.

If we're talking pipe dream? A guaranteed match in whatever specialty you desire as long as you pass everything. I think the match is the single most stress inducing aspect of this whole thing. Some of us will not match, due to a number of reasons: an uncompetitive step, a step score that's not competitive enough, a subpar step, etc. Everything that you've done beforehand will be for naught if you fail to match. It's the stuff of nightmares.
 
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honestly....if there were an option, I would gladly choose to go to a medical school that lasts 6 years, if it meant that I got to learn the material at a reasonable pace & still have a life outside of class.

While I agree that work-life balance is important and that there are many ways in which medicine and the medical training process could be improved, the above comment is totally insane unless you have some massive trust fund or something. Do we you have any idea how much 2 years of attending salary is worth after 30-40 years invested in index funds and bonds with dividends reinvested?

I mean, voluntarily adding 2 years onto your medical school education would probably cost you $2-4 million over 30 years, assuming you were investing wisely.
 
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I often find myself thinking about ways that medical school can be so unnecessarily stressful. If certain things changed in the system, it would make the process so much better.

For me personally, I’ve been thinking a lot about the obnoxious volume of information that we learn, and honestly....if there were an option, I would gladly choose to go to a medical school that lasts 6 years, if it meant that I got to learn the material at a reasonable pace & still have a life outside of class.

Another thing - we deserve WAY more breaks than we get. I know it’s a taboo in American society to cherish vacation time, but it’s a necessary rest period that everyone should have. This constant studying & cycle of stress can wear on you over time. Just because we’re studying/in training doesn’t mean we shouldn’t have a good quality life.

What are some things that would make med school less stressful for you?
This sounds great in theory. But they would never just give you the same amount over 6 years. Some schools would start to use the extra time to teach their students more, demand more research, etc. schools make you do more and/or students have more time to pad that cv. Then everyone else adjusts. Next thing you know every med student needs to have a cv a mile long with publications. All of our schools found more bull crap to jam down our throats. Our levels of competency and knowledge base are almost at new FM attending level but the residency is of course still three years. And guess what? It wasn’t cheap to teach us all that mess. More tuition!!!

The faster my school loses my number, the better. 2 more years? No way!
 
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The pace is necessary with such a late matriculation age here in the U.S. P/F step 1 would be a huge stress relief and probably free up quite a bit of time for a lot of people, but I have a feeling it would also add stress in whatever other areas become more heavily weighted in residency selection as a result

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The pace is necessary with such a late matriculation age here in the U.S. P/F step 1 would be a huge stress relief and probably free up quite a bit of time for a lot of people, but I have a feeling it would also add stress in whatever other areas become more heavily weighted in residency selection as a result

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:beat:
 
Reduce the discrepancy in pay and lifestyle (if possible) between specialties, mainly by increasing the pay of the lowest paying specialties and decreasing the pay of the highest specialties. Then maybe you'd have people who were actually interested in each specialty apply for it... probably see less dermatology hopefuls if primary care paid as much... and pay resident physicians at least as much as PAs

No more undergrad necessary for medical school, 6 years out of high school, tuition free med school, maybe reduce salaries for physicians overall some as well. Then you'd get less of a rat race for getting into medicine as well and people would free up 3-5 years of their life with less undergrad and gap years.
 
You are a 100% set on FM/IM/pathology
 
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You are a 100% set on FM/IM/pathology

Yeah, stress levels would be approaching zero unless you were trying to match in a highly coveted location or program. Or you were couples matching.
 
free (good) food, massages, housing, board exams, ERAS fees, interview traveling fees. thank you for coming to my TED talk
 
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Reduce the discrepancy in pay and lifestyle (if possible) between specialties, mainly by increasing the pay of the lowest paying specialties and decreasing the pay of the highest specialties. Then maybe you'd have people who were actually interested in each specialty apply for it... probably see less dermatology hopefuls if primary care paid as much... and pay resident physicians at least as much as PAs

No more undergrad necessary for medical school, 6 years out of high school, tuition free med school, maybe reduce salaries for physicians overall some as well. Then you'd get less of a rat race for getting into medicine as well and people would free up 3-5 years of their life with less undergrad and gap years.
Why should pay go down for higher paid specialities? Most of them (except dermatologists) are justified in being paid higher.
 
Why should pay go down for higher paid specialities? Most of them (except dermatologists) are justified in being paid higher.
How do you mean? Based on hours worked, stress, level of specialization (ie. Cumulative residency/fellowship years)? Just curious what the train of thought is

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Lol at the dermatology comment...

I think the huge discrepancy in pay is one reason why some specialties are so competitive, so by reducing that discrepancy you’re going to select for people who are actually interested in the specialty in and of itself. I don’t really see why orthopedic surgeons should necessarily make more than general surgeons. If you say that we should just raise general surgeon pay to that of ortho pay and neurosurgeon pay... maybe. but then I’d suggest you have to raise non surgical pay by A LOT because I don’t think surgical specialties should necessarily make more than non surgical pay. So to me it makes sense to maybe average ortho and Neuro and general pay and raise non surgical to be roughly commensurate.
 
Why should pay go down for higher paid specialities? Most of them (except dermatologists) are justified in being paid higher.
Why targeting derm? They deserve what they make. Derm docs see 40 patients on average per day. FM docs would me making 350k+ if they were able to see that # of patients.

We should always advocate for specialties like FM/Peds/IM/ID to make more but not at the expense of other specialties.
 
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How do you mean? Based on hours worked, stress, level of specialization (ie. Cumulative residency/fellowship years)? Just curious what the train of thought is

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Are you referring to the dermatology part of my comment?
 
Are you referring to the dermatology part of my comment?
I assumed the derm was more of a joke but curious about all of it as everyone seems to have differing opinions on what is just compensation

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Why should pay go down for higher paid specialities? Most of them (except dermatologists) are justified in being paid higher.

Have you seen ortho procedures? Knee and hip replacements could be performed by non-physicians. Vocationally-trained techs could do them as long as there’s a single doc standing by in the unit in case of emergency.
 
I think one of the biggest problems is that individual schools are given way too much free reign over what they ask of their students.

Every school should be non-mandatory attendance. Every school should give NBME subject exams for each test. Every school should give the Shelf on rotations and the grading on clerkship should be standardized.

There should be rules on how often schools can mandate attendance for ANY event during pre-clinical.
 
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free (good) food, massages, housing, board exams, ERAS fees, interview traveling fees. thank you for coming to my TED talk
It blows my mind that ERAS fees aren't waived for students who qualified for FAP during the med school application process. I qualified for FAP yet am expected to pay even MORE money during the match process.
 
Have you seen ortho procedures? Knee and hip replacements could be performed by non-physicians. Vocationally-trained techs could do them as long as there’s a single doc standing by in the unit in case of emergency.

Lol
 
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Dont laugh. A hernia clinic has been in existence in Canada for decades. They use GP's who are trained in the repair tech with steel wire and local anesthesia. You walk in, lie on the or table, and its all done under local, and you walk out and go gome., Their success rate is quite high and recurrence is quite low. I believe it's called Shouldice clinic or something like that
 
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...bringing this back to the OP.

Best way to make med school less stressful is for students to take a gap year or two before starting school.

People who have had a job usually have an easier time. Spending 40 hours a week doing something you are not crazy about really puts things into perspective. It makes you focus more on the learning (process) and less on the grade (performance). Med school is about becoming a doctor, not about test scores and random facts.
 
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It blows my mind that ERAS fees aren't waived for students who qualified for FAP during the med school application process. I qualified for FAP yet am expected to pay even MORE money during the match process.
Are they not included in your school's 4th year COA?

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As of my own personal experiences I can recommend:
1. Most stress arises from the very simple fact that medical school is demanding and can be tough. The only working answer is to have an actual program of studying, than cram until the eleventh hour at exam days. Once you know what are the requirements, you can do other things in your life stress-free. I've come to accept that 5 hours per day should go to studying no matter what, and once I keep that promise, I can do whatever I want and still ace my studies.
2. Have a life outside hospital, or you're very likely to get absorbed into it, and I promise you, that won't do you any good. Especially during clinical years. Hospital stuff remains there, outside life remains outside.
3. Reward yourself sometimes! There will come a time that you'll do a great job and hardly anybody will notice. You'll find other who are half as competent as you and get twice rewarded! Don't lose it there! You're just great, and keep the heat up.
4. Get yourself a good personal diary book or an app in your phone that does the same. Be sure to know when you're on-call!
5. My Golden Rule. I always write the exam days two days earlier in my calendar, and study like crazy for that day; although the actual exam time is two days later. Then I have 48 hours quality time to review and ace the exam! I know that all of us wish there was 5 minutes to review this or review that. This makes life a lot better an a lot easier.
6. No all-nighters! Research says cutting on sleep causes grey matter damage. And it will damage your brain if you are chronically sleep deprived, just don't do it. Organize your life.
7. Exercise! There's a local mountain in my town that I climb each weekend. You have to find what works for you. Some people jog early, some at evenings. But work with your body. Med students are very prone to a sedentary lifestyle and unless you actually actively fight it, you'll end up there! Exercise eases up stress like nothing else does.
8. Make peace with yourself. You can't heal the world unless yourself. Are there emotional holes in your life? Some bad break-up? Romantic issues? Carrying the baggage around will not change the reality and how hard you think and overthink it, you'll be damaging yourself, and wasting valuable time. If you find yourself going such things over and over, spend a weekend on it, evaluate whether this relationship is worth salvaging and if so, make amends and how that you care. If they don't respond, that's their problem, and you have to get on with your life!
9. 90% of material lies within 10% of books. I don't say read nothing except review books, hardly anyone gets the picture that you get after reading Robbins! But, don't go obsessive-compulsive over minutiae. That'll hurt your understanding. And even trying to master 1000-15000 Anatomy books might be possible, but what are you gonna do with door-keepers like Harrison's? Basics repeat over and over, and if you know intricate molecular pathways for atherosclerosis and you can't diagnose and MI, you are in big big trouble! And guess what? Trouble leads to more stressful life!
10. Every once in a while cut yourself some slack. You can have time for that if you have organized your time, but if you have not, you won't even enjoy your break and your mind will keep wandering on the work that remains.

BELIEVE IN YOURSELF Good Doctor! You're gonna make it, you know what? This Doctor Can!
 
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The people who setup our curriculum and give us pointless busy work/mandatory meetings on trivial BS that interferes with studying. Clin med course at my school that takes up 80% of our second yr class time/studying all of which is exceedingly low yield for step 1 which is a huge time eater and takes away from board prep. My stress comes from my school, not studying in and of itself. If my school said ok youre on your own go study for boards were cancelling class for the rest of the year I would honestly be less stressed. All of my stress comes from the school itself. Their argument is its not all about boards-well, it is actually its actually all about boards rn at this point in my training since there are so many med students and new med schools popping up it is about boards and a good score is more important right now as an M2 than anything else. I dont understand why they dont get that lol my classmates and i have a theory that my school (DO school) doesnt want us to do that well on boards so we are forced to do primary care. Dont get me wrong i feel very fortunate to be in medical school I just wish some schools would be more practical
 
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stress comes from my school, not studying in and of itself. If my school said ok youre on your own go study for boards were cancelling class for the rest of the year I would honestly be less stressed. All of my stress comes from the school itself

It was similar at my school as well, but tbh a lot of it isn't even their fault. So much of that stuff is LCME mandated.

Edit: Also, looking back on med school and my stressors, there's a lot I would do different but most of my shortcomings were purely my own fault. I did find it difficult to deal with all the stress to the point where I would simply procrastinate until a couple days before major exams (covering weeks worth of material in several classes) to begin studying. This carried on from late first year, through second and third year. It was like the senioritis at the end of undergrad just crept back in.
 
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The people who setup our curriculum and give us pointless busy work/mandatory meetings on trivial BS that interferes with studying. Clin med course at my school that takes up 80% of our second yr class time/studying all of which is exceedingly low yield for step 1 which is a huge time eater and takes away from board prep. My stress comes from my school, not studying in and of itself. If my school said ok youre on your own go study for boards were cancelling class for the rest of the year I would honestly be less stressed. All of my stress comes from the school itself. Their argument is its not all about boards-well, it is actually its actually all about boards rn at this point in my training since there are so many med students and new med schools popping up it is about boards and a good score is more important right now as an M2 than anything else. I dont understand why they dont get that lol my classmates and i have a theory that my school (DO school) doesnt want us to do that well on boards so we are forced to do primary care. Dont get me wrong i feel very fortunate to be in medical school I just wish some schools would be more practical
Clin med and stuff is low yield for step, but it’s the highest yield for actually being a doctor. It’s a hell of a lot easier to transition to 3rd year if you’ve actually taken the time to develop a history taking style and know what to do on a physical exam...

Also, there’s no way DO schools WANT you to do worse. It looks poorly on them. That would make zero sense. It’s more that, by en large, DO students have always had lesser scores than MDs, even in college and such and will continue to do so. No idea why “my school has it out for me” is such a popular idea on here

Sure there’s crap that DO students have to put up with, and MD schools streamline things better, but it’s not active malice...it’s just ignorance that will eventually fade
 
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Clin med and stuff is low yield for step, but it’s the highest yield for actually being a doctor. It’s a hell of a lot easier to transition to 3rd year if you’ve actually taken the time to develop a history taking style and know what to do on a physical exam...

Also, there’s no way DO schools WANT you to do worse. It looks poorly on them. That would make zero sense. It’s more that, by en large, DO students have always had lesser scores than MDs, even in college and such and will continue to do so. No idea why “my school has it out for me” is such a popular idea on here

Sure there’s crap that DO students have to put up with, and MD schools streamline things better, but it’s not active malice...it’s just ignorance that will eventually fade
Right now in my training studying for Step 1 is most important. A 220 Step 1 and a strong clinical background from studying clin med (info which ill forget by next yr anyway) snt going to get me anywhere if one wants a more competitive specialty. Clin med at my school isnt about history taking its about questions like how much methacholine to give during an asthma challenge or how to give a cardiac stress test how much dobutamine to give during a cardiac stress test. that stuff is not important rn
 
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