What would you do in my situation? Serious Advice

[stewfoo412]

Hi,
I'm looking for serious and mature responses on whether or not I should apply this coming cycle. I really appreciate any insight I can get from this forum. I realize that most of you have stats that blow mine out of the water, but I'm not going to shy away from being real with y'all lol.

STATS:
3.01 Overall GPA
2.95 Science GPA
20AA 19TS 22 PAT nothing below 18
100 shadowing hours
150 volunteering hours
Member of a fraternity for all of my undergrad career(I'm currently a Junior)(Held a chair position for a semester)
Member of the Pre Dental society
Did a semester of research in a Biochemistry lab
Have all of my LORs (2 great ones and 2 good ones) and I'm working on my PS at the moment

BACKGROUND:
Caucasian Male. Texas resident.
Like I said, I am currently finishing up my junior year of undergrad at a large public university in Texas. Unfortunately, my transition from high school to college was not smooth whatsoever. In high school, I graduated pretty highly in my class and had a good SAT score and basically never studied for anything. Once I got to college I pledged a fraternity and assumed my same study habits would work but that was not the case. I finished my first semester of college with a 1.85 GPA with D's in both engineering physics and calculus. My second semester I did slightly better with about a 2.5 GPA. I changed my major from Biochemistry to Biomedical Science halfway through sophomore year and have since buckled down and raised my GPA to what is stated in my STATS portion above with 100 total credits and 77 science credits completed.

OPTIONS:
1) I can go all out and apply to 20 schools (my 3 Texas in state schools+ the easier of the private schools) this cycle and just really roll the dice.
or 2) I only apply to my state schools this round(super cheap; 150 bucks total) and maybe get lucky. But if no luck, I've saved my money for applying all out my senior year when hopefully my GPA will be even higher.

Honestly, one of the good things that has come out of being in a fraternity is I now have great people skills and could probably do great in an interview.
But what would you do if you were in my shoes? I'm dead set on dentistry and know that this is the path I am committed to.

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[FeralisExtremum]

I'd apply to 20 schools (or at least more than just your in-state). Your GPA is low enough that admission to your 3 in-state schools is not a sure thing, and the money you'd potentially save weighed against the risk and cost of having to re-apply next cycle makes it not worth it.

 

[JLT223]

I'd personally save my money and apply after a post bac or SMP. I doubt you'd be able to raise your GPA much with 2 semesters left unless you get 4.0's. Your DAT score would be fine if you had a ~3.5, but it doesn't offset your GPA. People do get in with 3.0's, but it's very hard to do so.

 

[NutritionIllinois]

Definitely apply to 20 schools, or whatever number is realistic. Pick your schools carefully. Write a killer essay that explains your grade trend and why it was low at first but improved. Some schools really look at grade trend. Also, really sell in your essay why you love dentistry. The goal should be to get some interviews, then kill it at the interviews and hopefully get admitted. Your DAT is solid, so if you can convince a school that your overall GPA does not represent your work so much as it represents you had a hard first year, I think some schools may be forgiving. Be patient. Interviews may not come until after December, but tons of people get admitted with post-December interviews. Go all out to try and get in, but maybe also look into a post Bach program just in case it doesn't work out. But it is definitely possible.

 

[stewfoo412]

I'd apply to 20 schools (or at least more than just your in-state). Your GPA is low enough that admission to your 3 in-state schools is not a sure thing, and the money you'd potentially save weighed against the risk and cost of having to re-apply next cycle makes it not worth it.

So just to make sure I'm understanding you, you are opting for option 1 correct? Saying that I would be best going all out this cycle as opposed to having a gap year and going all out next year?

I'd personally save my money and apply after a post bac or SMP. I doubt you'd be able to raise your GPA much with 2 semesters left unless you get 4.0's. Your DAT score would be fine if you had a ~3.5, but it doesn't offset your GPA. People do get in with 3.0's, but it's very hard to do so.

So are you saying that I should not apply this cycle or next cycle and wait until after I have completed a 1 year post-bac or SMP? Which would be potentially 2+ years(2 if one year program, 3 if two year program) from now and probably have to retake the DAT.

 

[stewfoo412]

Definitely apply to 20 schools, or whatever number is realistic. Pick your schools carefully. Write a killer essay that explains your grade trend and why it was low at first but improved. Some schools really look at grade trend. Also, really sell in your essay why you love dentistry. The goal should be to get some interviews, then kill it at the interviews and hopefully get admitted. Your DAT is solid, so if you can convince a school that your overall GPA does not represent your work so much as it represents you had a hard first year, I think some schools may be forgiving. Be patient. Interviews may not come until after December, but tons of people get admitted with post-December interviews. Go all out to try and get in, but maybe also look into a post Bach program just in case it doesn't work out. But it is definitely possible.

Okay!! Thanks for the encouraging words. Do you really think I should mention grades in my personal statement? Or are you referring to a different essay. I've heard that you should avoid talking about your stats in Personal Statements and focus on why you want to be a dentist.

 

[NutritionIllinois]

I'd personally save my money and apply after a post bac or SMP. I doubt you'd be able to raise your GPA much with 2 semesters left unless you get 4.0's. Your DAT score would be fine if you had a ~3.5, but it doesn't offset your GPA. People do get in with 3.0's, but it's very hard to do so.

My grades are better than OP's grades, but I did great last semester, emailed all the schools I applied to as soon as I got my grades rather than waiting for the slow academic update. Three schools invited me for an interview within a week after I sent the email. Possibly a coincidence, but I doubt it. I think it is more important to some schools how you have performed lately than your overall GPA, although some schools seem more stat driven.

 

[stewfoo412]

Oh and also I retook both Calculus 1 and Physics 1(the courses I received D's in) and got A's in both if that helps

 

[JLT223]

So just to make sure I'm understanding you, you are opting for option 1 correct? Saying that I would be best going all out this cycle as opposed to having a gap year and going all out next year?


So are you saying that I should not apply this cycle or next cycle and wait until after I have completed a 1 year post-bac or SMP? Which would be potentially 2+ years(2 if one year program, 3 if two year program) from now and probably have to retake the DAT.

I didn't even think of the fact you'd maybe need to retake the DAT if you did that. That changes things. I would think if you can get your GPA up to 3.2-3.3 you'd have a much better shot at getting multiple interviews, I just don't know if that's feasible. Just focus on school. Apply all over the place and very early. You never know what will happen. Obviously the higher your GPA the better your chances, but the fact you'd have to take the DAT over possibly is a huge negative t0 waiting. See how things go.

 

[stewfoo412]

My grades are better than OP's grades, but I did great last semester, emailed all the schools I applied to as soon as I got my grades rather than waiting for the slow academic update. Three schools invited me for an interview within a week after I sent the email. Possibly a coincidence, but I doubt it. I think it is more important to some schools how you have performed lately than your overall GPA, although some schools seem more stat driven.

Were these your fall semester grades?

 

[NutritionIllinois]

Okay!! Thanks for the encouraging words. Do you really think I should mention grades in my personal statement? Or are you referring to a different essay. I've heard that you should avoid talking about your stats in Personal Statements and focus on why you want to be a dentist.

Others can chime in as there may be no right answer, but you can't hide your GPA. I think at least in a round about way explain it. Maybe not specifically, but you could discuss how you overcame your struggles and have worked hard to achieve your dream goal of becoming a dentist. I wouldn't discuss specific grades ofpr your GPA, just let them know you as a person, your struggles, what you learned by struggling, etc. Some schools love to see a person overcame obstacles, and that doesn't necessarily mean you came out of a poor family. Everybody has different struggles. Make it sincere and heart-felt.

 

[NutritionIllinois]

Were these your fall semester grades?

Yes.

 

[JLT223]

Others can chime in as there may be no right answer, but you can't hide your GPA. I think at least in a round about way explain it. Maybe not specifically, but you could discuss how you overcame your struggles and have worked hard to achieve your dream goal of becoming a dentist. I wouldn't discuss specific grades ofpr your GPA, just let them know you as a person, your struggles, what you learned by struggling, etc. Some schools love to see a person overcame obstacles, and that doesn't necessarily mean you came out of a poor family. Everybody has different struggles. Make it sincere and heart-felt.

Good point. Be honest and say you got caught up in your frat/whatever else it may have been. Schools love honesty. Also tell them what you've learned from the experience. You have to make mistakes to learn!

 

[fogorvostan]

Your DAT scores are the same as mine, so I wouldn't be concerned with them. But your GPA is too low IMO. I would do post bacc or SMP to raise it.

 

[stewfoo412]

Your DAT scores are the same as mine, so I wouldn't be concerned with them. But your GPA is too low IMO. I would do post bacc or SMP to raise it.

The issue with post-bacc/SMP is that my DAT may expire by then. I'm only a junior in undergrad so basically I have another year of essentially what a post-bacc would do to my gpa anyways. Now of course if I don't get in via option 1 or 2 that I described then I will opt for a post-bacc or probably the 1 year Biomedical Science Master's program that my school offers.

 

[Advance]

Option 1 all the way. If money isn't an issue.

 

[stewfoo412]

Option 1 all the way. If money isn't an issue.

I wouldn't say money isn't an issue. Or else I'd just go all out 20+ schools until I got in. I'm using bonds that my grandparents gave me when I was a newborn and they've accumulated enough value to cover options 1 or 2 for one go around.

 

[fogorvostan]

The issue with post-bacc/SMP is that my DAT may expire by then. I'm only a junior in undergrad so basically I have another year of essentially what a post-bacc would do to my gpa anyways. Now of course if I don't get in via option 1 or 2 that I described then I will opt for a post-bacc or probably the 1 year Biomedical Science Master's program that my school offers.

What will your GPA go up to after next year?

 

[Advance]

I wouldn't say money isn't an issue. Or else I'd just go all out 20+ schools until I got in. I'm using bonds that my grandparents gave me when I was a newborn and they've accumulated enough value to cover options 1 or 2 for one go around.

In any case. Option 1 would give you a greater chance of getting in next cycle. You will spend 150k$+ more attending an OOS school compared to staying instate but if you don't mind that I say go for it.

 

[stewfoo412]

What will your GPA go up to after next year?

If I could predict GPAs a year in advance I would be making a lot of money selling my services to worried students. But jokes aside I can only see my GPA increasing by how much I do not know.

In any case. Option 1 would give you a greater chance of getting in next cycle. You will spend 150k$+ more attending an OOS school compared to staying instate but if you don't mind that I say go for it.

I'm content with extra debt/going out of state.

 

[dyesht]

Hi,
I'm looking for serious and mature responses on whether or not I should apply this coming cycle. I really appreciate any insight I can get from this forum. I realize that most of you have stats that blow mine out of the water, but I'm not going to shy away from being real with y'all lol.

STATS:
3.01 Overall GPA
2.95 Science GPA
20AA 19TS 22 PAT nothing below 18
100 shadowing hours
150 volunteering hours
Member of a fraternity for all of my undergrad career(I'm currently a Junior)(Held a chair position for a semester)
Member of the Pre Dental society
Did a semester of research in a Biochemistry lab
Have all of my LORs (2 great ones and 2 good ones) and I'm working on my PS at the moment

BACKGROUND:
Caucasian Male. Texas resident.
Like I said, I am currently finishing up my junior year of undergrad at a large public university in Texas. Unfortunately, my transition from high school to college was not smooth whatsoever. In high school, I graduated pretty highly in my class and had a good SAT score and basically never studied for anything. Once I got to college I pledged a fraternity and assumed my same study habits would work but that was not the case. I finished my first semester of college with a 1.85 GPA with D's in both engineering physics and calculus. My second semester I did slightly better with about a 2.5 GPA. I changed my major from Biochemistry to Biomedical Science halfway through sophomore year and have since buckled down and raised my GPA to what is stated in my STATS portion above with 100 total credits and 77 science credits completed.

OPTIONS:
1) I can go all out and apply to 20 schools (my 3 Texas in state schools+ the easier of the private schools) this cycle and just really roll the dice.
or 2) I only apply to my state schools this round(super cheap; 150 bucks total) and maybe get lucky. But if no luck, I've saved my money for applying all out my senior year when hopefully my GPA will be even higher.

Honestly, one of the good things that has come out of being in a fraternity is I now have great people skills and could probably do great in an interview.
But what would you do if you were in my shoes? I'm dead set on dentistry and know that this is the path I am committed to.

Have you thought about applying to both dental school this cycle as well as a master's program? If you don't get in D school this cycle you'll get into a master's program, without wasting time. If you do the master's program, you'll have to retake the DAT, which shouldn't be a big deal, since you've done well already. Good luck!

 

[stewfoo412]

Have you thought about applying to both dental school this cycle as well as a master's program? If you don't get in D school this cycle you'll get into a master's program, without wasting time. If you do the master's program, you'll have to retake the DAT, which shouldn't be a big deal, since you've done well already. Good luck!

Honestly, that's not a bad idea. I was always thinking that I would apply to either or but I suppose I could apply to both. Wouldn't this make me look uncertain of myself though to dental schools? I can't imagine they'd like that.

 

[fogorvostan]

If I could predict GPAs a year in advance I would be making a lot of money selling my services to worried students. But jokes aside I can only see my GPA increasing by how much I do not know.

I'm content with extra debt/going out of state.

There are online predictors where you can enter your current GPA, the amount of credit hours you'll plan on taking, and what grades you'll think you'll earn.

I like the idea someone had of applying to both dental schools and grad programs.

 

[dyesht]

Honestly, that's not a bad idea. I was always thinking that I would apply to either or but I suppose I could apply to both. Wouldn't this make me look uncertain of myself though to dental schools? I can't imagine they'd like that.

They don't have to know that you are applying to a master's program, unless they ask you. Also, it doesn't make you look uncertain of yourself, but it shows that you want to better yourself and your application.

 

[fogorvostan]

They don't have to know that you are applying to a master's program, unless they ask you. Also, it doesn't make you look uncertain of yourself, but it shows that you want to better yourself and your application.

Just skimmed through the application and dyeht is correct. They only ask about applying to other health professional programs or dental school.

 

[stewfoo412]

Gosh I could've sworn I heard that admissions councils don't like someone applying for a masters at the same time as dental school. Can someone else confirm that it's okay? Sorry to be skeptical

 

[stewfoo412]

So I think the favored option is option 1 and apply to 20+ schools this cycle. Is that correct? I'll also look into applying to a masters program as well because I suppose I could always just drop it if I get accepted to D school.

 

[fayevalentine]

Gosh I could've sworn I heard that admissions councils don't like someone applying for a masters at the same time as dental school. Can someone else confirm that it's okay? Sorry to be skeptical

I would love to hear an answer to this as well, as this may be a path I take.

 

[stewfoo412]

Bumparoo

 

[dyesht]

Bumparoo

How many times you wanna hear the same answer lol

 

[DentistJoon]

Apply to 20 schools JUNE 1 (this upcoming cycle) and retake your DAT by mid July, or earlier if you're ready.

 

[stewfoo412]

How many times you wanna hear the same answer lol

I bumped 3 days ago looking for the answer to the unanswered question of if applying to a master's/post-bac at the same time as applying to dental school looks bad

 

[stewfoo412]

Apply to 20 schools JUNE 1 (this upcoming cycle) and retake your DAT by mid July, or earlier if you're ready.

Thanks for the advice. I have a plan now as to what I'm doing

 

[Dent5291]

It only costs 150 dollars to apply to the Texas schools? Honestly I might just do that if I were in your shoes and then apply more broadly in a following cycle once you get that GPA up for 2 reasons:
1) With your current stats I'm not so sure you have a great chance of getting an acceptance even if you do apply to 20 schools and the cost of doing so is astronomical.
2) The Texas schools are so insanely cheap and are really good schools so you should maximize your chances of getting into one of those, even if it takes you an extra year to do so (by applying this year and next year if you don't get in this time)

 

[Advance]

I bumped 3 days ago looking for the answer to the unanswered question of if applying to a master's/post-bac at the same time as applying to dental school looks bad

The question was answered.

Just skimmed through the application and dyeht is correct. They only ask about applying to other health professional programs or dental school.

 

[beachbum627]

I would do whatever it takes to get accepted to your state school!! If that means waiting to apply and trying to raise your GPA then so be it. I personally don't think the debt is worth it at an out of state school or a private school. It will save you SO much money in the long run!!!!! When you're a pre-dent, you think that you will go wherever you get accepted...... But trust me when I say that where you go to school, and how much money you take out in loans, will affect you after you graduate! Think about the long term outcomes!

 

[JakeSill]

Just wondering, if OP was a URM will he have a shot? I'm a URM with similar stats.

 

[Advance]

Just wondering, if OP was a URM will he have a shot? I'm a URM with similar stats.

Read the initial post all the way through.
Apply to 20+ schools and hope for the best.