iqe2010

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healthcare costs continue to skyrocket and politicians use the "greedy doctors" as a scapegoat?

What's in the future for American healthcare? Medicare/medicaid cuts are already happening, what about the other insurance companies? Will they follow suite?
 
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In the future, healthcare will become socialized or be more regulated. As a result, doctors will become basically public servants like policemen, and firefighters. This means that a physician will stop making as much as he does. That means that healthcare will decline.
 

Freakfarm0

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In the future, healthcare will become socialized or be more regulated. As a result, doctors will become basically public servants like policemen, and firefighters. This means that a physician will stop making as much as he does. That means that healthcare will decline.
:laugh:
 

circulus vitios

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In the future, healthcare will become socialized or be more regulated. As a result, doctors will become basically public servants like policemen, and firefighters. This means that a physician will stop making as much as he does. That means that healthcare will decline.
NHS physicians make salaries equal to those of their US counterparts. Socialized medicine doesn't necessarily mean less pay.
 

music2doc

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We all move to Canada... or get jobs with UPS or as auto-mechanics (which apparently pays even better than medicine according to this guy)
 
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A lot of what I meant was supposed to be sarcastic, but that is the problem with written word...
Seriously, though, there are problems with our modern day health care system, but I don't think anyone in our beloved Congress can fix it. Doctors/Physicians are not adequately represented in the legislative progress, not as much as Pharmacists though anyway. That is why there is the misconception of the "Greedy doctors," which are simply pharmacy companies trying to make big bucks, and because they are technically part of the health system, they become doctors.
 

FrkyBgStok

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OP you aren't getting serious answers because it has been discussed almost as much as MD vs. DO. It doesn't really matter what happens because the world is going to end on Dec. 21st this year so any conversation about the topic is moot.
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

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It's a lot easier to blame physicians than big pharm, insurance companies, and their army of lawyers.

Socialization of medicine of medicine is likely as the prices are going to continue to increase till eventually it shuts down the system. Whether or not it causes physician's salaries to drastically fall is unknown though, as salary reduction will at most cut a few percent off of the overall costs.
 
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Its hard to say because discussions like these are super opinion based. But my opinion, is that everyone will still need healthcare in the future, and although it may get a little cray, people are still going to need it and have it..

I don't think there will ever be a hault on healthcare, and I definitely don't think doctors will get a large toll on their salaries from this as someone had stated before..
 

NickNaylor

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It's a lot easier to blame physicians than big pharm, insurance companies, and their army of lawyers.

Socialization of medicine of medicine is likely as the prices are going to continue to increase till eventually it shuts down the system. Whether or not it causes physician's salaries to drastically fall is unknown though, as salary reduction will at most cut a few percent off of the overall costs.
Socialization of medicine is likely? What political climate are you living in?
 

Praefectus

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Congress might want to tread cautiously with demonizing doctors. It's not like they could perform surgery on themselves.
 

NickNaylor

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Health care inflation is relentless. Given enough time, health care will be unaffordable to all of the middle class.
I don't see how that necessitates socialized healthcare. Maybe it's less painful to be paying more money in the form of taxes than out of pocket, but nothing about socialized healthcare inherently prevents the inflation of healthcare costs. It slows that growth but doesn't altogether eliminate it. In the end socialized models are unsustainable, just on a longer scale compared to the US system.

Besides, this country is filled with people that vote against things that would suit their interests based on political ideology. I would be surprised if poor conservative people actually voted to support socialized healthcare. This is the political problem.
 

TheMightySmiter

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I see Big Pharma and insurance companies a lot more demonized than doctors are. I think opinions on here about that are pretty biased.
 

scarshapedstar

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Health care inflation is relentless. Given enough time, health care will be unaffordable to all of the middle class.
So? Let them die!

[YOUTUBE]PepQF7G-It0[/YOUTUBE]

When people praise our healthcare system, they often say something like "when a zillionaire Sultan from Dubai needs a doctor, he comes here."

To our elites, affordability is a bug, not a feature.
 
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Intimidating, uncertain future.

I don't think that doctors will "suffer," by any means (whatever policy follows), but I am weary of the costs - burden upon taxpayers and access to care. The Massachusetts Plan has failed to curb costs there (where insurance shifted from ~92% of the population to 97%, and unemployment has always been among the lowest in the country). So, PPACA won't fix the problem, socialization comes with taxes (also, will never happen here), and costs will continue to soar. And in socialized countries, there is indisputable resource allocation, often away from elderly emergency patients, not to mention other penny-pinching measures.

Likely, you're gonna see huge cuts in social welfare programs as we age.

That said, the only road to improvement I see is people taking greater responsibility for their health. Obviously, I don't mean people living in poverty or in food deserts, but it would be nice to see popular support for things like fat taxes and healthier school menus. Also, major tort reform, and people less willing to sue doctors for mistakes would be a great shift forward. That way, you can account for some prophylaxis and standardization in delivery pricing.

Please comment for conversation - whether you agree or disagree with me. Please keep things civil though (I hope I haven't said anything too radical).
 
OP
I

iqe2010

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PMPMD, you're an attending right? Do you take home more than 60%?

I personally thought income tax for the average doc was 30-33%.
 

nysegop

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Doctors deserve high salaries. Why? It's simple math.

4 Undergrad + 4 Med School + 3-7 Residency + 0-3 Fellowship = a possible 18 years of training (The stupid socialized healthcare politicians don't receive that much training).

As for finances (Although there are exceptions):

Average student loan after undergrad - $25,250
+
Average debt after medical school - $156,000
=$181,250 in debt.

Without doctors those socialists wouldn't be able to live.
 

mclinkin94

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In the future, healthcare will become socialized or be more regulated. As a result, doctors will become basically public servants like policemen, and firefighters. This means that a physician will stop making as much as he does. That means that healthcare will decline.
the creative destruction of medicine, DON'T BE A DOCTOR



I cannot be more sarcastic
 

nysegop

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In all seriousness guys, what do you THINK will happen to demand and salary for doctors over the next 20 years?
 

mclinkin94

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In all seriousness guys, what do you THINK will happen to demand and salary for doctors over the next 20 years?
why do you care? If you want to be a doctor for the job security and the money you do not deserve it. I wouldn't mind if I couldn't find a job in the future, I would still do it!

As far as the job, demand will indeed go down and of course salary will go down as well. Just keep in mind, we have technology that can diagnose and prescribe medications in 2012! When that technology gets more popular, we will only need enough doctors to just supervise the machines and tons of technicians to ensure they are working properly.

May I recommend a book called "the creative destruction of medicine" by topol?
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

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Doctors deserve high salaries. Why? It's simple math.

4 Undergrad + 4 Med School + 3-7 Residency + 0-3 Fellowship = a possible 18 years of training (The stupid socialized healthcare politicians don't receive that much training).

As for finances (Although there are exceptions):

Average student loan after undergrad - $25,250
+
Average debt after medical school - $156,000
=$181,250 in debt.

Without doctors those socialists wouldn't be able to live.

Well the amount of time spent in school isn't too relevant, plenty of PhD's spend 5-7 years getting their doctorate, 1-2 years in a post-docc and then nearly half a decade of adjuncthood before they get an assistant professorship ( Making 60k a year) .What makes the difference is that doctors endure a lot more, work more hours, and provide a necessary and strongly demanded labor that cannot be provided by any other group.
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

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]why do you care? If you want to be a doctor for the job security and the money you do not deserve it. I wouldn't mind if I couldn't find a job in the future, I would still do it! [/B]

As far as the job, demand will indeed go down and of course salary will go down as well. Just keep in mind, we have technology that can diagnose and prescribe medications in 2012! When that technology gets more popular, we will only need enough doctors to just supervise the machines and tons of technicians to ensure they are working properly.

May I recommend a book called "the creative destruction of medicine" by topol?
I'm pretty sure you don't have a solid grasp on how the world works. Medicine is a job, a job that you pursue both because it intellectually interests you and puts bread on the table.
 

Lifeman

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why do you care? If you want to be a doctor for the job security and the money you do not deserve it. I wouldn't mind if I couldn't find a job in the future, I would still do it!

As far as the job, demand will indeed go down and of course salary will go down as well. Just keep in mind, we have technology that can diagnose and prescribe medications in 2012! When that technology gets more popular, we will only need enough doctors to just supervise the machines and tons of technicians to ensure they are working properly.

May I recommend a book called "the creative destruction of medicine" by topol?
Oh my god, you sound like you were born in '94 like your username suggests. Please stop posting.
 

newdoc2013

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to the person who said that they would still pursue medicine even if they were unemployable: why? you cant practice medicine without a job. therefore the altruism that you were attempting to convey is completely misguided.

medicine is a job - a very important job.

we have machines that can help pull zebras out of the differential and aid in diagnosis - there is no machine that can take a history, do a physical, diagnose and form a treatment plan. one day that technology might exist - but its not here yet.

also, im hoping doctors are in demand for the next 30-40 years as im in too deep to quit now! :xf:
 
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Machines can use history and statistics to estimate the likelihood of differentials, given variables with some predictive power. Although this can point a doctor in one (perhaps likely the correct) direction, it cannot compensate for the variability inherent to treating individuals. Hence the art in the "medicine is an art and a science." We need to fully understand our own cognition and replicate the human brain's processing power as first steps for machines to ever displace docs. Philosophers may disagree, but I suppose that's their job.

Socialized medicine will not happen in America while Gen. Y is alive. Our children might vie for something like that, but it's very unlikely in the near future, not to mention it's not going to fix our problems.

Doctors will be just fine for the near future. Medicare will not get cut badly enough to disenfranchise geriatric voters. Salaries will never be unlivable by any means, the job will always be more stimulating than any other, and doctors will continue to get sued left and right.

Nothing will change, especially with/without the PPACA.

This is my opinion, OP. Hope that's what you were asking for.
 

Morsetlis

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healthcare costs continue to skyrocket and politicians use the "greedy doctors" as a scapegoat?

What's in the future for American healthcare? Medicare/medicaid cuts are already happening, what about the other insurance companies? Will they follow suite?
Spiral of blame and compounding of problems.

It happened before with other professions / scenarios.

I think we can avert it, though. The public seems smarter these days.
 

NickNaylor

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Spiral of blame and compounding of problems.

It happened before with other professions / scenarios.

I think we can avert it, though. The public seems smarter these days.
Ha, try this on. One of the bigger aspects of the ACA is that it limits the growth of Medicare spending to GDP growth + 1% (or some amount like that). If costs increase more than that ceiling, a board within Medicare MUST reduce costs in order to meet that target. You know what the best part of it is? The following things are EXPLICITLY PROHIBITED from being targets for cost-cutting:

-Anything that might be considered "rationing"
-Raising Medicare premiums
-Reducing Medicare benefits
-A few other things

Aren't our politicians great?
 
Sep 19, 2011
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You know what would save the healthcare industry hundreds of billions of dollars?

Every able bodied American is forced to jog 4-5 days a week for 30+ minutes a time.

All of a sudden you see diabetes rates, obesity rates, heart attack rates, stroke rates, dementia rates, depression rates, and other psychiatric illness rates go WAY down.

There, I just solved medicine.
 
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You know what would save the healthcare industry hundreds of billions of dollars?

Every able bodied American is forced to jog 4-5 days a week for 30+ minutes a time.

All of a sudden you see diabetes rates, obesity rates, heart attack rates, stroke rates, dementia rates, depression rates, and other psychiatric illness rates go WAY down.

There, I just solved medicine.
... and solved the question of whether you are sane or not.

If you wanted to do something like this perhaps the government should build and provide cheap or free access to fitness centers around the country.