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what's it really like to be a doctor vs lawyer (my first thread)

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yaypoker

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i just got back from home after a lecturing by my parents on why i shouldnt become a doctor and why i should become a lawyer. there points were

1.) youre in more debt after med school (3 vs 4 yrs) + residency get paid badly

2.) lifestyle of a doctor is harder, more stress, higher stakes, and with health insurance and malpractice insurance, you are working many hours, profession is not as respected asit once was.

3.) its good to have a lawyer in the family and you can help people, alas in a different way, by being a lawyer.

anything i can rebutt with? to me points 1 and 2 seem somewhat valid...im not looking forward to paying back $250,000 and only starting to make good money until age 30, and the possiblity that my lifestyle will be terrible (too many hours) to have a normal family life (spending time with kids etc etc). they propose becoming a patent lawyer, so i can do somethign still sciency and possible medically related....

any input/thoughts would help...

ps. im a rising senior, currently applying to med school
 

park1231

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2.) lifestyle of a doctor is harder, more stress, higher stakes, and with health insurance and malpractice insurance, you are working many hours, profession is not as respected asit once was.

And since when have lawyers been respected :laugh:
 

callendm

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yaypoker said:
i just got back from home after a lecturing by my parents on why i shouldnt become a doctor and why i should become a lawyer. there points were

profession is not as respected asit once was.

To allow your parents to lecture you on this topic is indicative of the fact you really aren't so genuine with your desire to become a physician.......Lawyer....Doctor....why not add venture capitalist...there is plenty more money money elsewhere if that is what you seek. Take a step back and ask yourself why is it that you want to be a doctor?

Not as respected as it once was....are you serious?...I am not even going to go there
 
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Blade28

yaypoker said:
3.) its good to have a lawyer in the family and you can help people, alas in a different way, by being a lawyer.

You can help more than if you were a physician??? :confused:
 

just_in_time

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It seems to me that you want to be a doctor for the wrong reason - $$$. If that is your motivation than this is not the right profession for you. You can go start a business somewhere and make more money. I wouldn't mind having my own Outback Steakhouse. Then I'd be rich and fat.
 

gaf

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yaypoker said:
1.) youre in more debt after med school (3 vs 4 yrs) + residency get paid badly

2.) lifestyle of a doctor is harder, more stress, higher stakes....

1) depends on which law school and which medical school...but first-year associates at large law firms are paid far more than residents

2) depends on the medical specialty and legal practice area in question.
 

jpro

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Physician
1. help people
2. selfless sacrifice
3. feels good about what they're doing
4. make good money
5. intellectually satisfying career

Lawyer
1. use people
2. on the lookout for the big paycheck, who cares who it hurts (physicians)
3. has no soul therefore feels no regret at the end of the day
4. the more evil you are, the more money you make
5. A monkey could do this job

There are some good lawyers out there, but they are not as successful.

There are plenty of ways to make money. Becoming a physician is definitely not the most efficient.
 

vtucci

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I was an intellectual property attorney (copyright, trademark, patent) so I can certainly shead light on this issue.

(1) you will only be slightly less in debt-- law school is 3 years instead of 4 and most programs cost the same per year as medical school.

(2) there is no guarantee that you will get a job in a high paying corporate firm that starts it associates at 125K in NYC. Right now the economy is not so hot---esp.in the high tech legal fields. Just about everyone I know has been laid off in the wake of 9/11. Most people have been forced to take jobs for 40K.

(3) Lifetstyle-- HAH!!!! Even if you do get a job at a large law firm with the big salary, you should realize that if you break the salary down by hour, you will be making less than a waiter/waitress does. On average, I worked from 8:30 am to 10 p.m. my first year as an attorney- 7 days a week and there is no lunch break. There were also many cases of working till 2, 3 or 4 am. So the hours really suck. This is also true of medical residents. However, unlike many medical specialities, these hours continue until and then after you make partner. There are required billable hours and billable hourse are not the same as hours in the office. There were no married female partners in my old firm and none of the women on the partnership track had steady boyfriends or children. (there were some men who had wives and children but there wives did not work).

(4) as an intellectual property lawyer (if you want to do something sciency), you will be cut off from your clientele most of the time. Almost everything is done via e-mail or on the phone. The old idea of client lunches, conferences etc. went out with the 80s unless you are trying to land a new client and you can forget that until you have been practicing for at least 5 years.

(5) having a lawyer in the family.... you will not be able to help your family members out as much as you may think now. Once you specialize in a field of law, that is what you live and breathe. You will not be an expert on the various other fields (tax, divorce, family law, wills and estates) and will likely be much less competent than a lawyer who is in those fields. Also, just as with medicine, there are ethical issues about being a lawyer for a family member.

(6) you should get over the idea that most lawyers are great helpers or advocates for the poor and downtrodden. Most of the lawyers I knew were only interested in the bottom line not helping anyone but themselves. And many of the clients are just as bad if not worse. Ask yourself-- can you handle it if a client comes to you as says- "yes, we stole their __________" but we don;t care because we have 1 million dollars in a war chest and we can bankrupt them on legal fees". This actually happened to me in the course of my practice. This is not to say that there are not fields of law that are meaningful including guardium ad litem (protector of children), DA etc. However, these fields are typically low-paying. My law school roommate took a job for 18K a year!!!

(7) many lawyers are highly unethical. It seems that many lawyers deserve the bad reputation they get in the media. I know I thought it was the esception not the rule before I got into practice. However, after practing for almost 4 years, I can honestly say there were few lawyers who I thought were good (actually fought for their client's interests to the best of their ability) and only one of that group who I thought was ethical.

DO what is in your heart or you will regret it for the rest of your life.
 

susannaQ

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Adding a comparison/contrast:
*Lawyers deal with law and legal spects and basically work to help their client be in the best legal situation they can be in. In law school, I think you'd be basically studying the structure of laws and your role in working around and with laws for 3-4 years.

*Doctors deal with health and the medical aspects of health and basically work to help their client be in the best health situation they can be in. In medical school, I beleive you'd be studying the structure of medicine and your role in working around and with medicine for 4 years.

Its not easy but I think you should pick the one you are most interested in. If you have a love of medicine, I think you should go for it because then you will be happy.
 

AznDoc

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It all depends on what you enjoy doing. Have you spent time with a patent lawyer or a doctor? Have you sat in on some surgeries? Coming from a very career-driven family, which I think is due to the Asian-immigrant mentality, I have had the privilege of having older cousins who can give me guidance and advice for my future endeavors. Anyhow, I have a cousin who is currently a practicing patent lawyer in Boston. He currently logs around 60-70 hours a week depending on the season. What he tells me is that it is a lot of research, paperwork, and the writing of endless reports. Also from what I hear the patent bar has a pretty low pass rate. His brother is a nephrologist who trained at UCSF, and absolutely loves what he does, despite the cursing patients, the nights without sleep, and the lawyers that are constantly trying to put more pressure on him. Although I find nephrology infinitely boring, that just happens to be his cup of tea. However, both enjoy doing what they do. I say all that to say that although commanding a high income is something that we all dream of and hope for. In the end, the decision comes down to what you enjoy doing and not necessarily what your parents want for you (trust me I know this, I have very Asian parents). I hope this helps somewhat and I wish you the best in all of your future pursuits.
 
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ms2209

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just_in_time said:
I wouldn't mind having my own Outback Steakhouse. Then I'd be rich and fat.

LMFAO! Mmm....blooming onion... :D
 

samurai_lincoln

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vtucci said:
I was an intellectual property attorney (copyright, trademark, patent) so I can certainly shead light on this issue.

(1) you will only be slightly less in debt-- law school is 3 years instead of 4 and most programs cost the same per year as medical school.

(2) there is no guarantee that you will get a job in a high paying corporate firm that starts it associates at 125K in NYC. Right now the economy is not so hot---esp.in the high tech legal fields. Just about everyone I know has been laid off in the wake of 9/11. Most people have been forced to take jobs for 40K.

(3) Lifetstyle-- HAH!!!! Even if you do get a job at a large law firm with the big salary, you should realize that if you break the salary down by hour, you will be making less than a waiter/waitress does. On average, I worked from 8:30 am to 10 p.m. my first year as an attorney- 7 days a week and there is no lunch break. There were also many cases of working till 2, 3 or 4 am. So the hours really suck. This is also true of medical residents. However, unlike many medical specialities, these hours continue until and then after you make partner. There are required billable hours and billable hourse are not the same as hours in the office. There were no married female partners in my old firm and none of the women on the partnership track had steady boyfriends or children. (there were some men who had wives and children but there wives did not work).

(4) as an intellectual property lawyer (if you want to do something sciency), you will be cut off from your clientele most of the time. Almost everything is done via e-mail or on the phone. The old idea of client lunches, conferences etc. went out with the 80s unless you are trying to land a new client and you can forget that until you have been practicing for at least 5 years.

(5) having a lawyer in the family.... you will not be able to help your family members out as much as you may think now. Once you specialize in a field of law, that is what you live and breathe. You will not be an expert on the various other fields (tax, divorce, family law, wills and estates) and will likely be much less competent than a lawyer who is in those fields. Also, just as with medicine, there are ethical issues about being a lawyer for a family member.

(6) you should get over the idea that most lawyers are great helpers or advocates for the poor and downtrodden. Most of the lawyers I knew were only interested in the bottom line not helping anyone but themselves. And many of the clients are just as bad if not worse. Ask yourself-- can you handle it if a client comes to you as says- "yes, we stole their __________" but we don;t care because we have 1 million dollars in a war chest and we can bankrupt them on legal fees". This actually happened to me in the course of my practice. This is not to say that there are not fields of law that are meaningful including guardium ad litem (protector of children), DA etc. However, these fields are typically low-paying. My law school roommate took a job for 18K a year!!!

(7) many lawyers are highly unethical. It seems that many lawyers deserve the bad reputation they get in the media. I know I thought it was the esception not the rule before I got into practice. However, after practing for almost 4 years, I can honestly say there were few lawyers who I thought were good (actually fought for their client's interests to the best of their ability) and only one of that group who I thought was ethical.

DO what is in your heart or you will regret it for the rest of your life.

This post is dead on. I just feel compelled to add (quickly, since I need to leave for work) that the "glory days" of patent law have essentially come to an end. If you think a BS in bio or chem is going to parlay into a plum patent law job, think again. The market became saturated a few years back with PhD bioscience types, who realized they could make infinitely more money in law than in research. It has essentially reached the point where a bio or chem PhD is expected, and consider the standard entry level degree for patent prosecutors. You can get away with a lower degree as a patent litigator, but I would strongly suggest researching this career option further.
 

TTSD

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Lawyers are cowards and spinless punks. If they had any REAL balls they'd just mug you for your money and kick you when you're down. :-D
 

ms2209

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vtucci said:
(3) Lifetstyle-- HAH!!!! Even if you do get a job at a large law firm with the big salary, you should realize that if you break the salary down by hour, you will be making less than a waiter/waitress does. On average, I worked from 8:30 am to 10 p.m. my first year as an attorney- 7 days a week and there is no lunch break. There were also many cases of working till 2, 3 or 4 am. So the hours really suck. This is also true of medical residents. However, unlike many medical specialities, these hours continue until and then after you make partner. There are required billable hours and billable hourse are not the same as hours in the office. There were no married female partners in my old firm and none of the women on the partnership track had steady boyfriends or children. (there were some men who had wives and children but there wives did not work).

Wow...this may sound naive, but I had no idea that lawyers had such a lifestyle. That really stinks! One of my friends is planning on going to law school, and she was looking into international law, but her parents want her to go into corporate law because of the $$.
 

TTSD

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ms2209 said:
Wow...this may sound naive, but I had no idea that lawyers had such a lifestyle. That really stinks! One of my friends is planning on going to law school, and she was looking into international law, but her parents want her to go into corporate law because of the $$.

You never read The Firm? :eek: :thumbup: :laugh:
 

medlaw06

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Hey Yaypoker,

Interesting post...I guess it applies to me the most (didn't mean to make that sound cocky) since I am in a dual medicine-law program at UMDNJ and Rutgers-school of law.

It was also interesting reading some of the posts that completely bash on lawyers and doing "monkey work." I got a kick out of that!

In any case, I think this is one of the best programs that is offered (at only 9 med schools though as of last count...but it may be more now). I truly have a new and immense appreciation for law AND medicine.

Yes....alot of those stories you hear about lawyers ARE true...a lawyer IS more aggressive and DOES concern more with $$ than clients. BUT...there are 2 things that 1 can say to challenge this:

1) these are the lawyers that majority of the lawyers DESPISE!! Those "ambulance chaser" jokes prevail in law school too! Majority of the lawyers are NOT like those bottom feeders that you see on your local daytime soap opera commercials. These are the few that ruin it for the rest.

2) Aren't lots pf physicians like that too!?! If it weren't for the grred that physicians had in the 80s and early 90s, we wouldn't be in the position we are in now...with all the med mal cases, Stark, Anti-kickback, EMTALA and such all arose DUE to physician greed. Now, one can easily argue that other people were being jealous of the amount of $$ that docs were making. That may be the case...I will concede to that too. HOWEVER, the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

My "theory": docs started to view their patients as good $ making business. I don't mean that in a malicious way...it's kinda like this: "I, the doc, DO TRULY want to treat this patient and make them feel better...AND I can get paid more IF I could order that 1 more test that may not be NECESSARILY needed, but wouldn't hurt either." Then...docs started making more money as a result of this "innocent greed." People got sick and tired of paying out of their noses for these "extra but apparently necessary" tests. They also concurrently started to get a little jealous of the amount of money that these docs were making AT THE EXPENSE of the $ coming from the patient's own wallet. Then...all these rules and regulations started popping up!!

SO....SOME doctors are also NOT TOO different from lawyers in that respect.


I could post on and on about this.

BUT...I AM PRO PHYSICIAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


And to those who downplay $$ as a consideration towards going into medicine....wake up and smell reality!!!

While I am NOT...I REPEAT NOT....saying that $$$ should be the ONLY (i repeat ONLY) consideration towards going into medicine, I see nothing wrong with having $$ as 1 FACTOR in the decision making process!

Let me ask you this: WILL YOU REPAY MY $220,000 loan (this IS a fact and DOES NOT take into consideration INTEREST) from med school and law school education!?!?!?!

Making $$$ for me is NOT a luxury, but a necessity!!

And...business is a LOT more risky than medicine!

Thoughts?
 

Lion-O

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I always do a double take when I see the question of "doctor vs. lawyer" or "doctor vs. other professional." Do people honesty grow up thinking they want to only be a professional, and that it's just a matter of choosing the right one?

The personal question I had to face was "doctor vs. scientist." I know it's important to have some focus on career and money (these are the reasons I chose doctor in the end), but I'd also hope they're not the sole factors used to decide what one does in life. I guess I just don't see much of a similarity in the actual work day between a doctor and a lawyer.
 

MissM

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another major issue is job security and availability. if you're a board certified doctor, you can get yourself a good job just about anywhere, anytime, and you're not gonna lose it unless you get smacked with a lawsuit or insurance goes too high (possible but not common).

lawyers, on the other hand, are a dime a dozen and the sweet jobs (in terms of money, not hours), are mostly offered to graduates from the very top schools. there's a big difference between the career prospects of a lawyer from Harvard and one from Eastern Southwest Hillside State U. that's not true for medicine - no matter where you go, you're still an MD, and that's all that matters.
 

jpro

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Lion-O said:
I always do a double take when I see the question of "doctor vs. lawyer" or "doctor vs. other professional." Do people honesty grow up thinking they want to only be a professional, and that it's just a matter of choosing the right one?

The personal question I had to face was "doctor vs. scientist." I know it's important to have some focus on career and money (these are the reasons I chose doctor in the end), but I'd also hope they're not the sole factors used to decide what one does in life. I guess I just don't see much of a similarity in the actual work day between a doctor and a lawyer.
Totally agree. :thumbup: I think these two professions are so far apart that anyone torn between the two baffles me. :rolleyes: doctor vs scientist for me too. ;)
 

yaypoker

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thanks for all the replies and comments...didnt think that I'd get many serious answers (thought id get more of the bashing lawyer, why u wanna be doc questions)

i appreciate all the input. indeed, money is somewhat of a concern just coming up from a lower middle class/poverty level background. given that my parents will be retiring pretty soon and will need my support, it has been a consideration. also, as the son of asian immigrant parents, i do get the pressure every now and then that of "what to do" and "what nto to do." it also doesnt help that my sister, and older cousins are trying to discourage me from medicine.

i am seriously consider law because (not to be arrogant, esp since i havent taken the LSATs at all) but i think i have a fair shot at getting into a top law school if i applied (i.e. harvard, columbia, or yale) since it is mostly straight up numbers unlike med school.

i guess i still need to consider my options and real desires, but any more input about what the two professions are really like would be MUCH appreciated.

thanks
 

Garuda

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After I got into medical school, I started thinking about law, which was an early interest of mine. I was almost ready to defer for one year, take the LSAT, apply to law school and see where I get in. But after talking to some lawyers and reading some books about the legal profession, I decided against it.

Law is not that attractive. A very significant percentage of law school graduates (even from elite institutions) only work in law a couple of years, then move on to something else. And legal work is quite dull. Just try reading some legalese, that's what lawyers have to deal with most of the time. Not fun.
 

PMED99

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Law and medicine are on such opposite ends of career fields. It is strange how anyone can go to law school, maybe some only at Bob's school of law and hotdogs, but you have to pass the bar. While medicine very few can go to school, but most pass the boards.
One thing to point out, I believe average doctor makes about 130k a year in their prime. I imagine lawyers make the same, but considering there are so many more, this means they have a lot more income overall.
Funny to notice how society puts medicine down for costs, yet pay lawyers more. Hopefully this will all change. This and malpractice insurance are out of control.
 

velo

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yaypoker said:
i just got back from home after a lecturing by my parents on why i shouldnt become a doctor and why i should become a lawyer. there points were

1.) youre in more debt after med school (3 vs 4 yrs) + residency get paid badly

2.) lifestyle of a doctor is harder, more stress, higher stakes, and with health insurance and malpractice insurance, you are working many hours, profession is not as respected asit once was.

3.) its good to have a lawyer in the family and you can help people, alas in a different way, by being a lawyer.

anything i can rebutt with? to me points 1 and 2 seem somewhat valid...im not looking forward to paying back $250,000 and only starting to make good money until age 30, and the possiblity that my lifestyle will be terrible (too many hours) to have a normal family life (spending time with kids etc etc). they propose becoming a patent lawyer, so i can do somethign still sciency and possible medically related....

any input/thoughts would help...

ps. im a rising senior, currently applying to med school

Yeah all three points are valid....buuut, I'll tell you what the doctor I shadowed in high school told me "if the most important thing to you is financial security then DON'T, I repeat, DO NOT go into medicine. The only good reason to pursue medicine is if you know you wouldn't be happy doing anything else."

If you gave their lecture serious thought you might want to reconsider your commitment to medicine and ask yourself why you really want to be a physician
 

edmadison

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yaypoker said:
i guess i still need to consider my options and real desires, but any more input about what the two professions are really like would be MUCH appreciated.
thanks


How's this for you, I am a doctor and a lawyer. I have many friends who are lawyers. The number who love their job, even the successful ones, I can count on one hand. I don't know many lawyers who get excited about going to work every day.

When I worked for a medium sized law firm and was driving home on Friday night, I used to cringe at the thought that I only had 2 days left before I went back to work (If I had two days off). As a doc you have guarenteed income, prestige and a reasonable amount of independence. Residents and associates both work very hard, but residents have a guarenteed job. If you have luck, skill, don't piss anyone off and work yourself to death for eight years, you may make partner in 8 years at a big firm. Then you will continue to work your butt off. Have a bad year? Your firm will toss you.

Ed
 

samurai_lincoln

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PMED99 said:
Law and medicine are on such opposite ends of career fields. It is strange how anyone can go to law school, maybe some only at Bob's school of law and hotdogs, but you have to pass the bar. While medicine very few can go to school, but most pass the boards.
One thing to point out, I believe average doctor makes about 130k a year in their prime. I imagine lawyers make the same, but considering there are so many more, this means they have a lot more income overall.
Funny to notice how society puts medicine down for costs, yet pay lawyers more. Hopefully this will all change. This and malpractice insurance are out of control.

I think your perception of attorney earnings vs. doctor earnings is skewed. Lawyers do not earn all that much in comparison to docs. And the limited # of attorneys raking in the dough really slant the overall averages.

Yes, a freshly-minted grad from a top school can earn six figures starting out. But this is definitely not the norm. I attended a pretty solid, if unspectacular, law school, and I know of a lot more people that struggled to land jobs in the $40k to 60k range than ended up with $110k to 125k salaries in markets like Chicago, TX, CA, NYC, DC, etc.

Even if you do land one of these plum positions, you also have to consider the fact that firms have an "up and out" policy. You are evaluated yearly on the basis of your contributions to the firm: 1) billable hours (the big one), and 2) bringing in new business (a nice, if rare, side dish). If firm management believes you are not making sufficient partnership ranks, you are given your walking papers. Partnership track at large firms ranges from about 8 to 10 years... most associates don't last half that long before departing, either of their own will or involuntarily. I often compare life as a big firm associate to being an NFL running back. The rewards can be lucrative for a short time, and even more so for those that survive the game, but the vast majority of people are left bruised and battered by the experience.

And for those that think trial lawyers are all filthy rich... ha, think again. Most plaintiffs attorneys can barely afford to pay their bills, and the competition is fierce for a limited number of decent cases.

Sorry for the long tangent. I just felt the need to quell any thoughts that the law was a direct path to easy money. I thought that way once, too, unfortunately falling victim to that irresistable pull. I wish I would have done better research before jumping in with both feet... both as to the type of work an attorney does, and the brutal realities of practice. If not for the wonderful educational experience I had, I would be extremely bitter about my choice to attend law school.

In any case, here are some statistics from the Bureau of Labor Statistics:

http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos053.htm

In 2002, the median annual earnings of all lawyers was $90,290. The middle half of the occupation earned between $61,060 and $136,810. The lowest paid 10 percent earned less than $44,490; at least 10 percent earned more than $145,600. Median annual earnings in the industries employing the largest numbers of lawyers in 2002 are given in the following tabulation:

Management of companies and enterprises
$131,970
Federal government
98,790
Legal services (law firms)
93,970
Local government
69,710
State government
67,910

http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos074.htm

Anesthesiology
$306,964
Surgery, general
255,438
Obstetrics/gynecology
233,061
Psychiatry
163,144
Internal medicine
155,530
Pediatrics/adolescent medicine
152,690
Family practice (without obstetrics)
150,267
 

dmoney41

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Yes, but if you're going to get into a US allopathic school you're not going to be going to Cooley law school. I'd say just being able to get into a US allo school puts you within the top 50 law schools (unless you're one of those people who are completely incompetent at verbal analysis but good at science in which case .... avoid being a lawyer).

And yes, it is possible to consider both law and medical school. I like logical analysis and arguing (my BA is in Philosophy), but I also like science and the hands on aspects of medicine. It took a few days of stalking my friend who worked at Cravath to realize how little I wanted to do what he does. I just don't like paperwork.

Considering the relative uselessness of an undergraduate degree these days, feeling like you need some level of graduate school to get you moving in your chosen career is not unreasonable. The most important thing is to make sure you're picking one where you'll be reasonably happy working a lot, because the number of decent professional jobs in America that don't require a ton of hours per week is rapidly approaching 0.
 

samurai_lincoln

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dmoney41 said:
Yes, but if you're going to get into a US allopathic school you're not going to be going to Cooley law school. I'd say just being able to get into a US allo school puts you within the top 50 law schools (unless you're one of those people who are completely incompetent at verbal analysis but good at science in which case .... avoid being a lawyer).

True, BUT I would say that in reality there are no more than 10 to 15 law schools that all but guarantee you a decent job. And those schools are no picnic to get into. I attended a school that has traditionally been ranked in the top twenty, just down the road from UVA, and know many people from UT, UCLA, USC, and SMU. Those that finished below about the top third in these schools are not landing six figure gigs, barring an influential parent/relative or amazing prior experience (one guy I know that was an early internet "serial entrepeneur"). Top 50 unfortunately doesn't mean much of anything.
 

Gleevec

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samurai_lincoln said:
True, BUT I would say that in reality there are no more than 10 to 15 law schools that all but guarantee you a decent job. And those schools are no picnic to get into. I attended a school that has traditionally been ranked in the top twenty, just down the road from UVA, and know many people from UT, UCLA, USC, and SMU. Those that finished below about the top third in these schools are not landing six figure gigs, barring an influential parent/relative or amazing prior experience (one guy I know that was an early internet "serial entrepeneur"). Top 50 unfortunately doesn't mean much of anything.

Thats a great reason for not allowing MD schools and especially DO schools from proliferating at a high rate.

Also, I saw the ATHF again tonight with samurai lincoln.
 

samurai_lincoln

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Gleevec said:
Thats a great reason for not allowing MD schools and especially DO schools from proliferating at a high rate.

Also, I saw the ATHF again tonight with samurai lincoln.

Agreed... the sad thing is that new law schools keep popping up every year. The problem is that the schools are such cash cows (one prof can lecture anywhere from 20 to 200 students in a single room, and no labs/equipment needed), and the ABA doesn't seem to be too interested in capping the number of schools since it is more fresh blood for their organization.

Very perceptive of you to pick up on the Samurai Lincoln reference. Sweet, thanks for the heads up, it is coming on here in about 25 minutes and I have major insomnia. I have the DVD anyway, but it is just more exciting to see the episodes at random when I manage to stay up late enough.
 

Gleevec

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samurai_lincoln said:
Agreed... the sad thing is that new law schools keep popping up every year. The problem is that the schools are such cash cows (one prof can lecture anywhere from 20 to 200 students in a single room, and no labs/equipment needed), and the ABA doesn't seem to be too interested in capping the number of schools since it is more fresh blood for their organization.

Very perceptive of you to pick up on the Samurai Lincoln reference. Sweet, thanks for the heads up, it is coming on here in about 25 minutes and I have major insomnia. I have the DVD anyway, but it is just more exciting to see the episodes at random when I manage to stay up late enough.

I think the AMA and the AOA need to stop accrediting new schools that dont fulfill a specific, necessary, and unique purpose. This is especially true of the AOA, which has decided that popping up DO schools left and right but not opening up new academic residencies is somehow going to work out well.

My fav episode is the one where all the bad guys go to the moon under the mooninites and name themselves SUNDAY MONDAY TUESDAY ... btw. Carl is a riot, but Im really starting to get tired of Shake.
 

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callendm said:
To allow your parents to lecture you on this topic is indicative of the fact you really aren't so genuine with your desire to become a physician.......Lawyer....Doctor....why not add venture capitalist...there is plenty more money money elsewhere if that is what you seek. Take a step back and ask yourself why is it that you want to be a doctor?

Not as respected as it once was....are you serious?...I am not even going to go there

??? Since when is talking to your parents a bad thing? I let my parents sway me one way, then I go another way, and eventually I find the best path to take. Given that my parents (and the OP's parents) are looking out for my own good, and given that they raised me, I don't see nothing wrong with a little lecturing as long as I make my own decision in the end.
 

edmadison

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samurai_lincoln said:
I attended a school that has traditionally been ranked in the top twenty, just down the road from UVA

How far down the road? I'm puzzled. W&M? W&L? Duke?

Ed
 

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This is really ridiculous how being a lawyer is so criticized.

First off, this is a doctor site, and all doctors/future doctors think they are better then lawyers.

Both professions involve helping people, different type of lawyers may vary in how much they help someone, but same with doctors. My father is a Criminal Defense attorney and I am in college now planning on being one too. This profession is very much helping.

And in my opinion, proven by my father (whose been a non-stop defense attorney for 30 years), being a criminal defense attorney is enjoyable. Trials are pure theater and fun. Many people have a passion for debate as people have a passion for science.

And as far as the idea that lawyers care more about the money, well that's probably because it is harder for them to get. Doctors have it handed to them through insurance with no questions asked, but lawyers have to get it themselves. If there was no such thing as med insurance, doctors would be the same way. You want to be paid for your work.

As far as salaries, it is definitely invalid to say doctors make more. It completely varies. My father who started in a firm for two year eventually started up his own practice makes an average of $400,000 a year. He has no partner is completely on his own. Many days he comes home at 12:30, he enjoys it, and he feels good about helping people who come to him begging to get their relative out of jail.

There you go doctor site, a different side of the story. In my opinion doctors and lawyers are very equally prestigious professions. Although, this thread is 6 years old, now a doctor may be way less desirable with the medical insurance obama nightmare.

-Connor
 

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And don't forget the infamous idea that dentists have one of the highest suicide rates.
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

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    This is really ridiculous how being a lawyer is so criticized.

    First off, this is a doctor site, and all doctors/future doctors think they are better then lawyers.

    Both professions involve helping people, different type of lawyers may vary in how much they help someone, but same with doctors. My father is a Criminal Defense attorney and I am in college now planning on being one too. This profession is very much helping.

    And in my opinion, proven by my father (whose been a non-stop defense attorney for 30 years), being a criminal defense attorney is enjoyable. Trials are pure theater and fun. Many people have a passion for debate as people have a passion for science.

    And as far as the idea that lawyers care more about the money, well that's probably because it is harder for them to get. Doctors have it handed to them through insurance with no questions asked, but lawyers have to get it themselves. If there was no such thing as med insurance, doctors would be the same way. You want to be paid for your work.

    As far as salaries, it is definitely invalid to say doctors make more. It completely varies. My father who started in a firm for two year eventually started up his own practice makes an average of $400,000 a year. He has no partner is completely on his own. Many days he comes home at 12:30, he enjoys it, and he feels good about helping people who come to him begging to get their relative out of jail.

    There you go doctor site, a different side of the story. In my opinion doctors and lawyers are very equally prestigious professions. Although, this thread is 6 years old, now a doctor may be way less desirable with the medical insurance obama nightmare.

    -Connor

    Hello new member I welcome you to SDN. I would like to bring something to your attention. When you make a post, the time it is made is recorded in the left hand corner. As you have now seen you are commenting to a post which is over 6 years old. Thank you for your contributions to the thread but everyone on here has long since left.
     

    overthere

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    Hello new member I welcome you to SDN. I would like to bring something to your attention. When you make a post, the time it is made is recorded in the left hand corner. As you have now seen you are commenting to a post which is over 6 years old. Thank you for your contributions to the thread but everyone on here has long since left.

    I am aware of that, I have knowledge of forums.

    This thread is the first thing that comes up when you search Doctor vs Lawyer and in my opinion it is very biased and incorrect. I figured I would throw in some unbiased logical material.
     

    Longshanks

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    I am aware of that, I have knowledge of forums.

    This thread is the first thing that comes up when you search Doctor vs Lawyer and in my opinion it is very biased and incorrect. I figured I would throw in some unbiased logical material.

    +pity+
     

    bigbad

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    And don't forget the infamous idea that dentists have one of the highest suicide rates.

    Why would they have high suicide rates? Great lifestyle and more than decent income.

    Cite your sources
     

    shoeshopper21

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    I just wanted to point out to overtly nice Mod that it is indeed true that this thread pops up on the top of Google search when you type in "Lawyer vs. Doctor." I looked up solely for curiousity's sake since my best friend is going to be a lawyer. What I read definitely solidified my intent of being an MD while also giving me a prespective of what my b.f. can expect. So in my case, and I'm sure this is the case for many other wanderers who reach this page thanks to Google, the lawyer kid's perspective definitely shed some important light to the issue.

    And I just resurrected a year or two old thread, does this mean I get the boot? :smuggrin:
     
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