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On occasion, I will lurk the pre-med forum on Reddit and it appears to be the polar opposite of SDN. In fact, it seems that majority of people have a major hatred for SDN. Here are a couple things I have noticed:
  • The average poster seems to fall way below the median for most schools. If you look at the WAMC thread or MCAT forum, it looks like most posters fall around a 3.2 GPA and low-500s MCAT.
  • The average poster seems to have a sincere hatred for people who are very competitive applicants. Any time I've seen someone post that they have above a 3.7 or 515, it seems like posters are quick to attack them for "humblebragging," despite having legitimate questions.
  • The average poster seems to be completely misinformed about the concept of URM. I see a fair amount of the "they took our spot" mentality from posters here, but it seems that Reddit genuinely thinks that URM classification is racist and that medical schools discriminate against Asians and Indians.
  • The average poster seems to be forced into applying to medical school by their family. One of the most common themes I see is the subject about dealing with overbearing parents. Again, that happens here too, but to a much greater extent on Reddit.
  • The forum seems to act as a sort of support group for below-average applicants. Like pre-meds anonymous. This contributes to a toxic hivemind mentality where anyone who has a better application than the average gets attacked. Every now and then a post will be made about how an outlier somehow got in with a 3.0/25 and provides more false hope.

Are these posters indicative of the majority of the pre-med population? Or much like SDN, are they a self-selected group? So really, what is the scoop with the people on this forum and did SDN hurt their feelings?
 
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Horse Apiece

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I enjoy the MCAT sub though. Learned a lot from the sidebar on there, and answering peoples questions helps solidify the concepts for myself.
 
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Just don't go on it if you don't like it. I'm sure you can find threads on here that say stuff about them.
I will say though, a lot of them have average application stats (sure there are some lower ones). But SDN makes you feel like everyone has a LizzyM of 75+ sometimes, so that's why they can seem below-average.
 
S

Sardinia

Normal people without >95th percentile MCAT scores? I'd say yeah probably.
I wasn't even talking about the numbers. More so the fact that someone would trash another website when they know they are preaching to the choir of an entirely separate audience.
 

redsox93

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I wasn't even talking about the numbers. More so the fact that someone would trash another website when they know they are preaching to the choir of an entirely separate audience.
Whoops sorry quoted the wrong post haha
 
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May 21, 2016
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On occasion, I will lurk the pre-med forum on Reddit and it appears to be the polar opposite of SDN. In fact, it seems that majority of people have a major hatred for SDN. Here are a couple things I have noticed:
  • The average poster seems to fall way below the median for most schools. If you look at the WAMC thread or MCAT forum, it looks like most posters fall around a 3.2 GPA and low-500s MCAT.
  • The average poster seems to have a sincere hatred for people who are very competitive applicants. Any time I've seen someone post that they have above a 3.7 or 515, it seems like posters are quick to attack them for "humblebragging," despite having legitimate questions.
  • The average poster seems to be completely misinformed about the concept of URM. I see a fair amount of the "they took our spot" mentality from posters here, but it seems that Reddit genuinely thinks that URM classification is racist and that medical schools discriminate against Asians and Indians.
  • The average poster seems to be forced into applying to medical school by their family. One of the most common themes I see is the subject about dealing with overbearing parents. Again, that happens here too, but to a much greater extent on Reddit.
  • The forum seems to act as a sort of support group for below-average applicants. Like pre-meds anonymous. This contributes to a toxic hivemind mentality where anyone who has a better application than the average gets attacked. Every now and then a post will be made about how an outlier somehow got in with a 3.0/25 and provides more false hope.

Are these posters indicative of the majority of the pre-med population? Or much like SDN, are they a self-selected group? So really, what is the scoop with the people on this forum and did SDN hurt their feelings?
You're really polarizing r/premed. I frequent that forum over this one because in all honesty there are less trolls and gunners.

Your points about them being largely under-qualified is incredibly incorrect. 90% of us are competitive for some school MD or DO. Most are in my opinion overqualified. Hell, my secondary partner blew my GPA/ MCAT out of the water with a 3.9/518.

We do not hate qualified applicants, however collectively we do not like humble-bragging. By that I mean we got on average 6-10 posts per week of "I have a 3.99 and. 520, what are my chances for acceptance?" That is either the worst case of neuroticism ever or a obvious humble-brag.

The URM thing is something I am guilty of. Personally I do not agree that URMs should have very lax admissions, and believe we should all be held to the same standards regardless of race. To do anything else is patronizing. However, I know that a "URM taking my seat" isn't what will keep me from getting admissions. For the most part I do this to get the softie SJW types riled up. In reality URM admissions are barely on my radar of things a give a modicum of **** about.

I will agree that r/premed gets a lot of posts about parents forcing them to medicine. They want advice, and probably avoid from posting their advice here to avoid the dozens of trolls, gunners and jerks that dwell here.

In all honesty I tend to avoid the pre-allo forum here because aside from a few select amazing people, the majority of you all are trolls, gunners and mean spirited sh*tposters. Because of this reason I tend to direct people towards the pre-osteopathic forum here and r/premed over the pre-allo forum for this exact reason. Most of you aside from the Adcoms, mods, and a few amazing individuals are generally mean-spirited and unhelpful.

This forum is the pre-med version of 4chan.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
 
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reports of my assimilation are greatly exaggerated
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Probably still at work
You're really polarizing r/premed. I frequent that forum over this one because in all honesty there are less trolls and gunners.

Your points about them being largely under-qualified is incredibly incorrect. 90% of us are competitive for some school MD or DO. Most are in my opinion overqualified. Hell, my secondary partner blew my GPA/ MCAT out of the water with a 3.9/518.

We do not hate qualified applicants, however collectively we do not like humble-bragging. By that I mean we got on average 6-10 posts per week of "I have a 3.99 and. 520, what are my chances for acceptance?" That is either the worst case of neuroticism ever or a obvious humble-brag.

The URM thing is something I am guilty of. Personally I do not agree that URMs have very lax admissions, and believe we should all be held to the same standards regardless of race. To do anything else is patronizing. However, I know that a "URM taking my seat" isn't what will keep me from getting admissions. For the most part I do this to get the softie SJW types riled up. In reality URM admissions are barely on my radar of things a give a modicum of **** about.

I will agree that r/premed gets a lot of posts about parents forcing them to medicine. They want advice, and probably avoid from posting their advice here to avoid the dozens of trolls, gunners and jerks that dwell here.

In all honesty I tend to avoid the pre-allo forum here because aside from a few select amazing people, the majority of you all are trolls, gunners and mean spirited sh*tposters. Because of this reason I tend to direct people towards the pre-osteopathic forum here and r/premed over the pre-allo forum for this exact reason. Most of you aside from the Adcoms, mods, and a few amazing individuals are generally mean-spirited and unhelpful.

This forum is the pre-med version of 4chan.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
You honestly feel that the majority of people here are gunners, trolls, or mean spirited? I feel that the majority of new accounts/low contributers might be this way, but certainly not the majority of contributors are this in any way at all.

I don't understand this feeling about pre-allo at all. I have heard others say it but I feel it simply isn't true. I feel all of the help that is distributed here genuinely overcomes the obvious trolls and fake accounts.
 
OP
idontwatchgreysanatomy
Dec 9, 2015
488
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You're really polarizing r/premed. I frequent that forum over this one because in all honesty there are less trolls and gunners.

Your points about them being largely under-qualified is incredibly incorrect. 90% of us are competitive for some school MD or DO. Most are in my opinion overqualified. Hell, my secondary partner blew my GPA/ MCAT out of the water with a 3.9/518.

We do not hate qualified applicants, however collectively we do not like humble-bragging. By that I mean we got on average 6-10 posts per week of "I have a 3.99 and. 520, what are my chances for acceptance?" That is either the worst case of neuroticism ever or a obvious humble-brag.

The URM thing is something I am guilty of. Personally I do not agree that URMs have very lax admissions, and believe we should all be held to the same standards regardless of race. To do anything else is patronizing. However, I know that a "URM taking my seat" isn't what will keep me from getting admissions. For the most part I do this to get the softie SJW types riled up. In reality URM admissions are barely on my radar of things a give a modicum of **** about.

I will agree that r/premed gets a lot of posts about parents forcing them to medicine. They want advice, and probably avoid from posting their advice here to avoid the dozens of trolls, gunners and jerks that dwell here.

In all honesty I tend to avoid the pre-allo forum here because aside from a few select amazing people, the majority of you all are trolls, gunners and mean spirited sh*tposters. Because of this reason I tend to direct people towards the pre-osteopathic forum here and r/premed over the pre-allo forum for this exact reason. Most of you aside from the Adcoms, mods, and a few amazing individuals are generally mean-spirited and unhelpful.

This forum is the pre-med version of 4chan.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
I suppose we just have two different experiences. From what I've seen, people of this forum have been beyond helpful yet I've seen people on Reddit get torn apart because they didn't adhere to the hivemind groupthink. Different strokes...
 
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DocMcMommy

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I think any internet forum is going to have a mixture of overly-unhelpful/unkind users, very helpful users, and people in between. I think SDN is overall an excellent resource and I'm sure the reddit forum is helpful to its users as well. I haven't really gotten an overwhelming negative or mean vibe from SDN and I usually frequent the pre-allo, pre-osteo, and MCAT forums.

I think the most cut-throat internet forums I've ever seen are "mommy" boards. Things can get pretty brutal on those forums really quickly. :corny: Maybe that's why I think SDN is so mild? :thinking:
 
Aug 19, 2016
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You're really polarizing r/premed. I frequent that forum over this one because in all honesty there are less trolls and gunners.

Your points about them being largely under-qualified is incredibly incorrect. 90% of us are competitive for some school MD or DO. Most are in my opinion overqualified. Hell, my secondary partner blew my GPA/ MCAT out of the water with a 3.9/518.

We do not hate qualified applicants, however collectively we do not like humble-bragging. By that I mean we got on average 6-10 posts per week of "I have a 3.99 and. 520, what are my chances for acceptance?" That is either the worst case of neuroticism ever or a obvious humble-brag.

The URM thing is something I am guilty of. Personally I do not agree that URMs should have very lax admissions, and believe we should all be held to the same standards regardless of race. To do anything else is patronizing. However, I know that a "URM taking my seat" isn't what will keep me from getting admissions. For the most part I do this to get the softie SJW types riled up. In reality URM admissions are barely on my radar of things a give a modicum of **** about.

I will agree that r/premed gets a lot of posts about parents forcing them to medicine. They want advice, and probably avoid from posting their advice here to avoid the dozens of trolls, gunners and jerks that dwell here.

In all honesty I tend to avoid the pre-allo forum here because aside from a few select amazing people, the majority of you all are trolls, gunners and mean spirited sh*tposters. Because of this reason I tend to direct people towards the pre-osteopathic forum here and r/premed over the pre-allo forum for this exact reason. Most of you aside from the Adcoms, mods, and a few amazing individuals are generally mean-spirited and unhelpful.

This forum is the pre-med version of 4chan.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
I used to think that way regarding URM admissions. But then I met a black girl at my college who described what it was like academically for her. Her school was in a predominantly AA neighborhood, and there was basically no instruction whatsoever. Her teachers either wouldn't do anything in class, or they would leave for long periods of time. The majority of students didn't care about learning either. Why would they, when they had no guidance from the staff? She had to learn by herself ALL the material. Her parents had no clue about homework, and they worked a few jobs in between them, something that apparently was common in her neighborhood. She said that people would be outside her apartment complex dealing drugs and there were shootings all the time. I can't imagine how difficult it must be to study in those conditions. She didn't know what the SAT/ACT was, and there was no way she could afford prep books, courses etc. And when students who have no guidance and teaching during high school get to college, adcoms have to think about how they have to learn it all, instead of growing up with it like many Asians/whites. They overcome this additional barrier. Not saying all URMs have this, but there are a lot that do.
 
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Sardinia

I'm sorry. I couldn't help myself. I'm a good boy today. A good boy.
 

The Broccoli Industry

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Jan 24, 2016
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By the US Census there are more than double the amount of white children living in poverty than all URMs. Where's the affirmative action for them?


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Lost In Transcription

reports of my assimilation are greatly exaggerated
2+ Year Member
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By the US Census there are more than double the amount of white children living in poverty than all URMs. Where's the affirmative action for them?
The Disadvantaged section.
 
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By the US Census there are more than double the amount of white children living in poverty than all URMs. Where's the affirmative action for them?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
White people + Asians make up about 70% of the population, so I would assume there would be more people living in poverty. As a white person I know not all white people have access to good schools, outside resources etc. But there are reasons why schools employ URM admissions stats.
 
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ChymeofPassion

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LizzyM

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By the US Census there are more than double the amount of white children living in poverty than all URMs. Where's the affirmative action for them?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
White people are not underrepresented in medicine (URM). And AMCAS does classify applicants as EO-1 and EO-2 (socio-economic background of parents) and applicants can self-identify as "disadvantaged". What's your beef?
 

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reports of my assimilation are greatly exaggerated
2+ Year Member
Apr 2, 2016
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Probably still at work
I don't understand how so many users can miss the obvious stickies about URM debates.
I guess this is a prime example of Reddit's arguments against us.

The point of URM admissions is to increase the number of black and Mexican physicans. Why? Because patients feel more comfortable with a physician like them in background/race/etc. It improves the physician patient relationship. And, believe it or not, the AAMC values patients' feelings over some undergrad kids' feelings about how they DESERVE to be in medical school.

Now can we stop talking about this? Totally not productive or on topic... (or is it on topic lol).
 

Horse Apiece

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Can't summon the Megazord without the red, black, blue, yellow, and pink rangers.
I think this is the funniest dark post, which fits my sense of humor that I've seen on here in awhile.
 
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ChymeofPassion

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I don't understand how so many users can miss the obvious stickies about URM debates.
I guess this is a prime example of Reddit's arguments against us.

The point of URM admissions is to increase the number of black and Mexican physicans. Why? Because patients feel more comfortable with a physician like them in background/race/etc. It improves the physician patient relationship. And, believe it or not, the AAMC values patients' feelings over some undergrad kids' feelings about how they DESERVE to be in medical school.

Now can we stop talking about this? Totally not productive or on topic... (or is it on topic lol).
Just to play devil's advocate, would it be okay for a white person to not feel comfortable with a black or Mexican physician (because they are unlike them in background/race/etc)?
 
S

Sardinia

Just to play devil's advocate, would it be okay for a white person to not feel comfortable with a black or Mexican physician (because they are unlike them in background/race/etc)?
I'd trust them more if I had a GSW or laceration.
 

Horse Apiece

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Just to play devil's advocate, would it be okay for a white person to not feel comfortable with a black or Mexican physician (because they are unlike them in background/race/etc)?
On a serious note. I'm sure old grandpa clan member is okay thinking whatever they want. There are more than enough white doctors to accomodate their bias. The problem arises in lack of options for certain minorities. Are racially based biases good from a societal sense? No. Do they exist? Oh yeah.
 

LizzyM

the evil queen of numbers
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Just to play devil's advocate, would it be okay for a white person to not feel comfortable with a black or Mexican physician (because they are unlike them in background/race/etc)?
Have you had an experience of being treated in a condescending way or marginalized by Blacks and Mexicans in general BECAUSE you are white?
 

ChymeofPassion

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Have you had an experience of being treated in a condescending way or marginalized by Blacks and Mexicans in general BECAUSE you are white?
No? The original post said that minorities choose URM's because they are familiar in background and race, I'm just exploring the double standard and reason for it. Nothing was ever mentioned about condescension or marginalization in the post I quoted.
 
S

Sardinia

If Trump becomes president, will the wall extend to medical admissions. In the middle ages, a castle wall would wrap around not only the outside perimeter, but also have folds within to protect the citizens from foreign invaders.
 
May 21, 2016
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I used to think that way regarding URM admissions. But then I met a black girl at my college who described what it was like academically for her. Her school was in a predominantly AA neighborhood, and there was basically no instruction whatsoever. Her teachers either wouldn't do anything in class, or they would leave for long periods of time. The majority of students didn't care about learning either. Why would they, when they had no guidance from the staff? She had to learn by herself ALL the material. Her parents had no clue about homework, and they worked a few jobs in between them, something that apparently was common in her neighborhood. She said that people would be outside her apartment complex dealing drugs and there were shootings all the time. I can't imagine how difficult it must be to study in those conditions. She didn't know what the SAT/ACT was, and there was no way she could afford prep books, courses etc. And when students who have no guidance and teaching during high school get to college, adcoms have to think about how they have to learn it all, instead of growing up with it like many Asians/whites. They overcome this additional barrier. Not saying all URMs have this, but there are a lot that do.
Sounds like my high school. The county public school teachers in my state are paid like 25K tops, and put forth zero effort. The guidance counselor forced you to to take courses like auto-body or car mechanics over biology, chemistry, or AP courses because "it will give you a marketable skill when you fail out of college"(she legit said that to me when I tried to switch auto-body for biology 2). I graduated high school unable to do basic math, and others graduated unable to read, we had kids dealing meth and Stolen pills in the parking lot of high school. Yet because I am white I am compared to private school kids who had private ACT tutors and every available resource. I succeeded in spite of my background, so I have zero sympathy for others who need a handicap to make it through admissions. If I can do it, so can you. You make it happen, not your background or skin color. If you need a handicap to get into the field, you do not need to be in the field.


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Lost In Transcription

reports of my assimilation are greatly exaggerated
2+ Year Member
Apr 2, 2016
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2,271
Probably still at work
Sounds like my high school. The county public school teachers in my state are paid like 25K tops, and put forth zero effort. The guidance counselor forced you to to take courses like auto-body or car mechanics over biology, chemistry, or AP courses because "it will give you a marketable skill when you fail out of college"(she legit said that to me when I tried to switch auto-body for biology 2). I graduated high school unable to do basic math, and others graduated unable to read, we had kids dealing meth and Stolen pills in the parking lot of high school. Yet because I am white I am compared to private school kids who had private ACT tutors and every available resource. I succeeded in spite of my background, so I have zero sympathy for others who need a handicap to make it through admissions. If I can do it, so can you. You make it happen, not your background or skin color. If you need a handicap to get into the field, you do not need to be in the field.


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No one has had it worse than you, for certain.

Again you missed the point of URM admissions.
 

Lost In Transcription

reports of my assimilation are greatly exaggerated
2+ Year Member
Apr 2, 2016
2,515
2,271
Probably still at work
No? The original post said that minorities choose URM's because they are familiar in background and race, I'm just exploring the double standard and reason for it. Nothing was ever mentioned about condescension or marginalization in the post I quoted.
Why do you think those minorities feel uncomfortable? You missed the underlying context of why they prefer someone of their own background/race to treat them.

Also, as someone else pointed out, white people uncomfortable with a minority physician can choose one of the myriad of white physicians available- that luxury doesn't exist so easily for many minorities.

Also what "double standard" did you explore?
 

Horse Apiece

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If Trump becomes president, will the wall extend to medical admissions. In the middle ages, a castle wall would wrap around not only the outside perimeter, but also have folds within to protect the citizens from foreign invaders.
We'll need it to. Otherwise who is going to treat all the communicable diseases that fester in that sort of enclosed environment? Then again, the two general conventions got by in that diseased state...
 
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May 21, 2016
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No one has had it worse than you, for certain.

Again you missed the point of URM admissions.
You missed the point of my post. No one deserves lax admissions into medical school. Even black people. By making admissions easy for URMS You are essentially saying "you barely passed college, and did terrible on the MCAT but it's okay because you're black." If you don't see anything wrong with this, you should. By all means admit more URMs, but we should be holding everyone to the same standards regardless of race. There are human lives at stake here we need to be kind of choosy.

To begin to fix this, work needs to be done on the societal level. This is something medical admissions have very little control over. And rightly so because they have a bad way of fixing it. But I'm not getting into a sociological argument with you so I'll leave it there.


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S

Sardinia

We'll need it to. Otherwise who is going to treat all the communicable diseases that fester in that sort of enclosed environment? Then again, the two general conventions got by in that diseased state...
I thought Donald Trump put on the orange spray to mask his necrotizing fasciitis, but it turns out it was his lack of character that was eating at him away from the inside.
 
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