where can you do clinicals

[judd_b_2000]

i am trying to find out if anyone here is going to University of Health Sciences Antigua. if so where can you get clinicals in the US, if it is possible. they said they don't give out that information. also, i live in western PA, where can i get a residency near here.

thanks for all your help,

jb

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[Andre]

Judd:
It is about time you wake up and smell the coffee.
There are absolutely no guarantees with any of the Caribbean schools.
Even with the 2-3 top schools like St Georges or AUC, you must accept the fact that you will get whatever clinical & residency available (read: left over from US grads)
My wife just finished Basic sciences @ AUC, and now we are ready to accept whatever they offer us. Possibly NJ, IL, MI, MD, etc. Forget PA, as they are not IMG friendly.
I also say go only to one of the schools mentioned, or maybe to SABA.
I further say, anyone who can not enter into one of these 3, should change careers.
Good luck
Andre

 

[cbc16]

Judd, you've got to be nuts if you're thinking about going to a school that wont even tell you where their clinicals are. Listen to Andre, stick with the well known offshore schools. If you cant get in really think twice about going to these other schools.

 

[bobo]

You also have to be nuts to listen to Andre!

 

[Robb1818]

If you absolutely must do your clinicals in the US then go to school in the US. I was at an AUC open house a few weeks back (a friend of mine in considering them) and the speaker told us that 2/3 of all AUC students do their "core" clinicals outside of the US. Maybe Andre can correct me if i'm wrong...He is definately right about one thing...there are no guarantees. I guess the trick is to be flexible. Good luck.

 

[Andre]

CLINICALS:
Robb1818 is correct, more than half of AUC grads go to UK for 1-year of CORE clinicals.
Then they come to USA for 1-year electives.
Issue is NOT USA versus England.
Issue is "Teaching Hospitals" for licensing later.
AUC & St Georges: they both send you to ONLY teaching hospitals; hence you have no problems getting licensed. USA or UK is at exactly the same level as far as the residency directors see it.
With the new small schools, you may be doing clinicals in small clinics or even nursing homes.
So what if it is in USA?? Look at Grace: A lot of fools transferred there hoping US clinicals, and now they are all screwed big time with nowhere to go...
If you insist on staying in one city in USA for clinicals, the Caribbean is NOT for you.
Good luck... Andre
PS. Bobo, thank you for your compliments. You are real nice guy.

 

[srose]

You could try asking the school if they have certain places that they will set you up for clinicals. Some have a "relationship" with certain clinics and hospitals and most students attending will go to those.

 

[judd_b_2000]

thanks to everyone for your help. the reason i want to stay in the US for clinicals is that i have a wife and two young children, so i hate the thought of dragging them all over the world in a 2-3 year time period. any other suggestions would be great.

rose,

you said you can ask where they have relationships with clinics? they said they wouldn't tell me the name of any particular place. also they said i could do clinicals in a private practice, such as my family doctor (do hospital rounds with him etc.), what do you know about this. they said it's called a "non-traditional" approach to clinicals.

 

[Taylor DO]

I think everyone who is considering going to a caribbean school should know this.

In order to secure unrestricted licensure, and more importantly, to gain a competitive residency slot you must complete your clincical "core" requirements at the "Green Book" institutions. In plain english, this means you must do you clinical surgery rotation at a hospital that offers a residency in surgery. You must complete your IM rotation at a teaching hospital with an IM residency....etc, etc...

You can do "elective" rotations at places such as doctor's offices, family practice clinics, nursing homes, and other health care settings.

However, and I can not stress this enough, you should certainly make every attempt to find out if you can complete your core requirements at teaching hospitals in the United States. Otherwise, you will have a MD degree with absolutely no place to practice.

 

[srose]

Judd,

I am not sure what to tell you if they are not giving you ideas upfront. I am starting Saba in a couple weeks, and one of the things that they list in their catalog and in other references is which hospitals and clinics they have a connection with. They tell you the state as well as the hospital. Now I know that you can deviate a little from the list, but it requires your own effort. Is it UAG that won't tell you? You should try for Saba. They have (I think) 11 states they work in conjunction with and around 27 clinincs and hospitals. So, I knew upfront where my clinical opportunities lie. Hope this helps a little.
Shelby

 

[judd_b_2000]

srose, and Taylor DO,

thank you so much for your replys! you have been a lot of help.

srose,

the school i am looking at is University of Health Sciences Antigua. They do not have a student loan program, so the student is on their own. but they have a "flexable medical curriculum for health care professionals, such as PAs, RNs, Pods, DDS, PTs, and even DOs that want the initial MD after their name. I hear it's a hell hole of an island, but the flex program is very appealing. it is expensive also, but i would like to have an MD to have a wide range of treatment modalities to choose from. i already practice (solo) and they are flexable enough to allow me to keep my practice going enough to keep it open.

Taylor DO,

thanks for your comments. you said that you can do clinicals in a private practice, but surgical and IM has to be at a hopital, is that correct? also you mentioned that core clinicals should be done in a US hospital that has a residency program, is that what you meant? also, you said you can deviate from the clinics/hospitals, but it's up to the individual to get the ball rolling, is that correct? have you ever heard of anyone going to offshore MD school and then tranferring to DO school? that may be a weird question, because most people transfer to a US MD school or from DO to MD, but in my opinion DOs and MDs are on the same ground regardless of one persons opinion. I have DO friends that get equal respect as their counters.

please reply,

thankyou,

judd

 

[Taylor DO]

Judd,

Let me explain further. To begin with, I am a Pennsylvania Osteopathic Physician. I think I can offer a little insight into medical education in PA, as I am also a faculty member for an allopathic training program.

For starters. You CANNOT do a single rotation be it a core rotation or an elective in the state of Pennsylvania if you are an IMG from a caribbean school. Current law prevents you from doing ANY rotations in this state. I urge you to call the Pennsylvania Medical Board in Harrisburg to confirm what I am telling you.

To answer some of your other questions.

1. As a medical student you will have 48 weeks of rotations that are considered your "core" rotations. These are usually Surgery, Internal Medicine, Peds, Ob/Gyn, Family Med, and Psych. Each of these rotations must be completed at hospital that offer residency programs in each area. In addition to these 48 weeks, you do have 32 more weeks of electives to chose from. For the remaining 32 weeks you can have experiences in Physician offices, Nursing homes and other various health care settings.
If you are a PA resident and want to return to this state some day to practice, I cannot highlight this enough. YOU CANNOT DO A SINGLE ROTATION IN THE STATE OF PENNSYLVANIA. The board of medicine will not give you any credit for a rotation done in this state.

2. US Osteopathic programs WILL NEVER accept a transfer student from a caribbean school. Let me clarify. You can enter into a caribbean school and spend two years on an island, but you will never be given any advanced standing into an osteopathic medical school. If you apply to a DO school, and are accepted, you will have to start as a first year all over again. There are many reasons for this. Transferring to a US Osteopathic School is not a viable option for any caribbean medical student.

3. I have a question for you. Why the school in Antigua? This so called "flex' program" is a bill of goods. Having an MD after your name opens no more doors than having a DO after your name. As someone who reviews application for a residency program, I can tell you this. A school such as the one you described has some serious questions attached to it. Why did you chose that school? I am not recommending one school over another, but I will say this. You should look at St. George's, AUC, Ross, Saba, and IUHS before sending your check in. Just a thought.

Let me know if you have any additional questions.

Taylor

 

[judd_b_2000]

Taylor DO,

You have been a great deal of help. I did call the Pen. Med. and you are correct. You sound like someone we can highly trust. what you are saying makes perfect sense. believe it or not many of the carribean schools offer a "flex program" for other health care professionals. and you are correct a MD will not have anymore doors opened than a DO, but there are not, that i know of, any DO schools off shore. and the flex program looks appealing. As far as PA is concerned, if i had a MD and passed USMLE I,II,III; i don't feel compelled to stay here, could take a position anywhere. the reason i would like to keep my practice, is to pay bills, etc. i like the idea of FP, and from what i heard, you can get a FP position in many places, more so than specialties.

you have been a great help and i hope that you continue to stay in touch with this message board.

Thanks you guys and gals,

jb

 

[srose]

Judd,

Are you set on Antigua? Why not some of the other schools. Most of the others offer loans at least. I will admit that I haven't read every word of this board, just skimmed, so I could have missed it, but schools like AUC...American Univ. of Carib. had stafford loans, Saba has Teri loans, and they aren't all islands with much to be desired. I think that if you want to be an MD, and you are interested in the Caribbean, look into those other schools. At least they give you more information up front. I am not saying Antigua is not a good school, frankly, I don't know that much about it, but there are other schools that may interest you as well.

AUC: www.aucmed.com (or .edu)
Saba: www.saba.org

check them out.
Good luck,
Shelby

 

[abbeydesert]

What about non-Caribbean IMG's, i.e., Western Europe? Are they allowed to do rotations in Pennsylvania? What are states have these strict restrictions on IMGs across the board?

 

[Taylor DO]

All IMG's CANNOT do a single rotation in the state of Pennsylvania. This is Medical Act 165 of the commonwealth that prevents IMG's from doing so.

Any school telling you the have affiliations in PA is lying to you. Period.

Taylor DO