Which fellowship to choose?

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TJMAXX

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I know it is too early to ask, but i just wanted to get some idea. My program has surgical and cyto fellowship positions for 2014 for me to choose. Which one to choose if my goal is to find a private practice job. Which one is going to make me more popular in terms of job seeking. :confused:

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is the surg path a general one, or with a specialty focus? how much independence would you have in that position? another year of general surg path rotations acting like a residency probably isn't so helpful compared to a cyto fellowship. you also need to consider how comfortable you'd feel signing out routine cytology without doing a fellowship.
 
The Surgpath fellowship is actually a junior faculty position, we do independent general surgpath
sign out from day 1. Now what do you think? Thank you for your input.
 
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Do surgpath if you like examining tissue with reproducible findings/science. Do cytopath if you like staring at ambiguous blobs of cells and hallucinating gnomes and fairies out of it.
 
You sure you won't have any competition for either of those fellowship spots at the one institution you seem to be looking at?

Personally, I think it depends on you. I don't see those "junior faculty" surg path so-called "fellowships" as fellowships, but as just another way for academic programs to milk a suboptimal system -- even if it is perhaps the most effective version of a non-boarded "fellowship" available. You put in your CV you did a "fellowship," when maybe it's really more like a first year of real world experience and perhaps should be counted as such; of course, other surg path fellowships may be no more than PGY4.5 and calling them anything else may be misleading. You're the one who has to decide whether to try to sell your fellowship as a "junior faculty" position (if you can) when you apply for jobs, whether you want or need that additional year of "supervised" general surg path signout, or whether you'd rather spend a year doing something a little more specialized (selective path, or a boarded fellowship) because it interests you or maybe you feel weakest in it and want to strengthen that part of your training.

To be specific about private practice jobs, however, I think you'd need to know what every practice you'd like to land in needs or wants, and that's just going to be variable. I'm not in that side of the business, but personally I'd probably want the core of my group to be good generalists first and foremost, then sprinkle in some subspecialists who also have good core skillz. Cytology just happens to be a little to the outside edge of core -- probably common enough these days that most good generalists see enough to manage it just fine, unless your business is so loaded with cyto that you simply prefer a couple of people to be boarded in it. Ergo, with only those 2 choices I would lean towards doing "surg path".

Personally I don't get doing two widely different subspecialty fellowships, but people do it; everyone I -know- who went that route ended up not practicing one or the other of them, though, or doing so so rarely that it was probably a wasted year in retrospect. But I guess they didn't know what their first job would entail, and wanted to keep their prospects open. Heck of a way to make a career choice.
 
The Surgpath fellowship is actually a junior faculty position, we do independent general surgpath
sign out from day 1. Now what do you think? Thank you for your input.

If you are doing independent sign out, then that ain't no fellowship.
 
I know it is too early to ask, but i just wanted to get some idea. My program has surgical and cyto fellowship positions for 2014 for me to choose. Which one to choose if my goal is to find a private practice job. Which one is going to make me more popular in terms of job seeking. :confused:

Do you see yourself doing nothing but cytopathology? If not, I would do surgpath. Not that you couldn't do general sign-out with a cyto focus, but there will be oportunities to do nothing but cyto.
 
Do you see yourself doing nothing but cytopathology? If not, I would do surgpath. Not that you couldn't do general sign-out with a cyto focus, but there will be oportunities to do nothing but cyto.

I'd rather not signout cytopath/hemepath but am more interested in surgpath + subspecialty in terms of fellowship. Will this hurt my chances of getting a private practice position? I know there are many out there who have not done a cyto fellowship and did surgpath + subspecialty fellowships. How do these ppl remember how to signout cyto after being out of cyto for 2 years? Plus, I would bet most programs have 2-4 months of cyto suring training. Not sure if that makes you fully confident to signout cyto on your own without a fellowship.

Another question is do most practices require you to signout heme as well or is there usually a hematopathologist in each practice who does that? I'd rather not touch a bone marrow.

Thanks.
 
I'd rather not signout cytopath/hemepath but am more interested in surgpath + subspecialty in terms of fellowship. Will this hurt my chances of getting a private practice position? I know there are many out there who have not done a cyto fellowship and did surgpath + subspecialty fellowships. How do these ppl remember how to signout cyto after being out of cyto for 2 years? Plus, I would bet most programs have 2-4 months of cyto suring training. Not sure if that makes you fully confident to signout cyto on your own without a fellowship.

Another question is do most practices require you to signout heme as well or is there usually a hematopathologist in each practice who does that? I'd rather not touch a bone marrow.

Thanks.

Most private groups share the hemepath but usually have a guy you can take stuff to when you're stuck.
You learn cytopath on the job.
 
I have seen quite a few private job posts specially asking for Cytopathology training, which made me think maybe a fellowship is needed. I don't know, that is just my observation. Also a lot of the jobs need subspecialty training no matter what it is....... I am just so confused.
 
I did Cytopath, it has been fairly useful. In all honesty in retrospect I would have benefited from a surg path fellowship if it was intense and one got to sign material out as junior faculty. Those fellowships where you watch some bozo sign stuff would be just a waste of time unless there was some markedly good connections available through said bozo. Crappy thing about any additional boarded fellowship is you get to MOC, etc for that subspecialty board too, it such a scam. You should probably do what is in your best interests intellectually, you can't foresee what jobs/requirements will be there in 1.5 years when you get out, do the fellowship that will be rewarding personally over the next 20 or so years.
 
I'd rather not signout cytopath/hemepath but am more interested in surgpath + subspecialty in terms of fellowship. Will this hurt my chances of getting a private practice position? I know there are many out there who have not done a cyto fellowship and did surgpath + subspecialty fellowships. How do these ppl remember how to signout cyto after being out of cyto for 2 years? Plus, I would bet most programs have 2-4 months of cyto suring training. Not sure if that makes you fully confident to signout cyto on your own without a fellowship.

Another question is do most practices require you to signout heme as well or is there usually a hematopathologist in each practice who does that? I'd rather not touch a bone marrow.

Thanks.

KeratinPearls- You might drive yourself crazy with this line of thinking. I understand why you're asking these questions, but there is no uniform answer. Each group/practice setting is unique. Some groups have only boarded cytopaths doing cytology and/or boarded hemepaths doing heme. A group may have only 1 boarded hemepath with the expectation that you sign out "easier" heme cases, as has been mentioned. Another group may be willing to take the time to train you on the fly for cyto. As has been mentioned, it probably is best to just concentrate on what you are interested in. Be the best you can be, and let the job chips fall where they will. As you are younger (than me at least!) you hopefully have more geographic flexibility. I'm not a Pollyanna in this forum but I think this is the best way to approach our career search "adventure".
 
KeratinPearls- You might drive yourself crazy with this line of thinking. I understand why you're asking these questions, but there is no uniform answer. Each group/practice setting is unique. Some groups have only boarded cytopaths doing cytology and/or boarded hemepaths doing heme. A group may have only 1 boarded hemepath with the expectation that you sign out "easier" heme cases, as has been mentioned. Another group may be willing to take the time to train you on the fly for cyto. As has been mentioned, it probably is best to just concentrate on what you are interested in. Be the best you can be, and let the job chips fall where they will. As you are younger (than me at least!) you hopefully have more geographic flexibility. I'm not a Pollyanna in this forum but I think this is the best way to approach our career search "adventure".

Thanks for the advice. My interests are in surgical pathology and I enjoy all aspects of it, some areas more than others. I enjoy hemepath and cytopath but I dont think I love it as much as someone who would focus solely on it but more as a generalist. I dont feel confident signing out heme and cyto coming straight out of residency (with only a few months under my belt as a resident) and so I feel compelled to do a fellowship to makeup for that (if I would be required to signout in these areas in practice). Well, from what you mentioned, I feel like the surgpath + an additional year of a surgpath subspecialty may be the right route for me then since that is what I truly enjoy.

I think it's just me and the jitters I get about the first day of work in the real world. If I were to signout heme or cyto, I'd like to be good at it, not just marginally. So, I would do the fellowship. If I can learn cyto on the job then I am happy to hear that. I would rather not spend a year in a cyto fellowship if I don't need to. I guess it is also the fear of joining a practice and having a tray of bone marrows to sign out. I would feel much more confident approaching heme with a fellowship as it stands now.
 
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All I can say is that if you do a cytopath fellowship you had better damn sure like cytopath, or at least be able to stand it. Because if you join a private group and you have cytopath boards you are going to have to do it. And they may even make you run the cytopath lab.

Surg path is all well and good, that knowledge is kind of assumed though. If you don't know surg path you probably shouldn't be getting a job at all. Doesn't necessarily matter if you do a fellowship if you know your stuff though.
 
If I do cyto fellowship, does that mean I have more job opportunities?
 
Do surgpath if you like examining tissue with reproducible findings/science. Do cytopath if you like staring at ambiguous blobs of cells and hallucinating gnomes and fairies out of it.

I wish there was a "Like" button on SDN.
 
If I do cyto fellowship, does that mean I have more job opportunities?

Every IMG who is in a cyto fellowship or wants to do one would agree with that statement.

The truth is though that you will get more job opportunities if you are a good pathologist who can communicate well and who people want to work with. Fellowships help but they are not the most important thing.
 
If I do cyto fellowship, does that mean I have more job opportunities?

It means you have more of -those kinds- of job opportunities -- the ones that request a cyto fellowship. Some job opportunities/practices make no such request, or are looking for people with different fellowship training.

Personally, I suggest finding a focus that suits you. That may simply be general surg path, or cyto, heme, soft tissue, GI, or whatever. But if all you're doing is trying to pad for a job in anything anywhere, that desperation and lack of conviction will show through -- and no-one wants to hire someone floundering haphazardly and desperately at the bottom of the barrel, at least no reputable place you could feel secure working at. Having a personal focus and a particular set of personal interests doesn't mean you can't still be flexible and work your way through the employment food chain, it just means that you have a better chance of enjoying your work while doing so.
 
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