Which SMP is the best option for me? Georgetown or EVMS

[mdtobe1111]

Been reading as many threads as possible about different SMPs and low-gpa threads and have decided on going to an SMP next year. SDN friends - need your help in assessing which SMP is best for me

Some info about me:

• CA resident, graduated from undergrad about 3 years ago with a low ugrad/sgpa 3.3 for both
• 31 on MCAT (expiring next year .. yikes!)
• Went to a certificate premed program last year and did not kill it as I hoped I would - bad first semester, 4.0 second (overall gpa 3.4) -- would really like the chance to demonstrate that my first semester at the program was not representive of the student I am now and that I can definitely cut it in medical school. Learned a lot about myself and my study habits unfortunately too late in the first semester. Definitely understand the amount of hard work that is required in the SMPs and am willing to put 110% in
• Decent EC - 400+ clinical hours, abstracts presented at national conferences, good leadership experiences, decent amount of volunteering
• Applied this year and got 0 interviews

I've been accepted to Georgetown SMP and EVMS MM and frankly cannot decide. Been researching both schools for the past few months and I feel like I'm still sitting right in the middle. I would definitely pick Cinci SMP but am waitlisted (so just sending updates for now; going to be frustrating waiting until June to see where I stand on the waitlist).
I have friends in both GT and EVMS who successfully matriculated to med school the following fall (GT MD for my friend at GT SMP and another allopathic MD for my friend at EVMS MM)

Georgetown:
Pros - well known/ respected program so maybe some schools will hold off on rejecting me right away and wait for 1st semester grades, seems to be well organized (as opposed to the certificate program I completed last year) .. basically my biggest "pro" for GT would be that it is well known so maybe certain schools that are receptive to GT SMPers will hold off on my application, I really like that it is block schedule (comulative final for physio was NOT the business at my certificate program)
Cons - large class (200), ultra competitive, entire class seems very qualified - I heard that while a certain GPA in the GT SMP program will help you get an interview, once you are interviewed, acceptance is based upon your entire application (as it should be) so I'm afraid I'll fall short to students who have done big things in cancer research or whatever else these ivy league kids seem to have under their belt

EVMS
Pros - smaller class size than GT, friend of mine who is graduating this spring says that the faculty is extremely supportive of students/ sending update letters to schools you are applying to (but with it being much less known than GT, would it even hold any merit?), the admin were very helpful in looking over my application and even asked why i was completing this program - said I should just apply to med school (yet EVMS sent me a rejection bleh)
Cons - not the same "feeder" program it used to be *dammit*. this upcoming fall, class is expected to be 70-80 students still competing for the same approx 30 seats that are historically given to MM (although NOT guaranteed), in addition, EVMS introduced a 2 year program to their med masters (around 20) and they will also be competing for the same seats so it seems like now the competition is about 100 for 30 seats, have heard on several forums that EVMS's MM admin are not the most transparent, heard that there is a possibility of them changing their curriculum which worries me - always problems arise first few years after curriculum changes

Always grateful to the SDN community.. I appreciate all input, comments, and suggestions. Don't forget to vote!!

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[GrapesofRath]

Youll get better responses on this in the post-bacc forum but here is what I can tell you

1) G-town isnt desgined to get you into their host MD school. It's designed to get you into an MD school in general. It is hard as hell and youre stats are average for the people in it. But they are well established and have "feeders" to other lower tier MD's. Almost half their grads who get into MD schools go to either G-town, EVMS, Drexel, GW, NYMC and one other lower tier Im forgetting. So the schools you should be targeting will know how to evaluate your G-town performance. There's a clear standard that defines success and if you achieve it youll be rewarded.
2) EVMS on the otherhand was designed to get people into EVMS specifically not so much other programs. So it doesnt have this established reputation and track record of getting grads into other lower tier MDs. Really search on here DrMidLife EVMS SMP and all she's written about it. There are tons of threads on it and she has detailed the changes its gone through the past few years. Basically yes, they take a far lower proportion of SMP grads into their host school all the while not having that reputation and history with other lower tier MDs G-town has. Not a good combination.

G-town to me is the easy pick. It'll be brutal but bottom line is the majority of grads get into US MD schools. When youre an SMP student all you can ask is if you do well youll be rewarded. G'town allows you to say that with much greater certainty than EVMS and all the turmoil and recent changes going on there.

And yes btw I agree that Cincinnati SMP is definitely your best option. Being able to establish Ohio residency after doing the program would really help you.

 

[piii]

The days of strong linkage programs are ending. Go to the school with the better reputation (GT>EVMS) and perform exceptionally: 3.7+ GPA, 33+ MCAT. Then target low-mid tier med schools.

 

[mdtobe1111]

Youll get better responses on this in the post-bacc forum but here is what I can tell you

1) G-town isnt desgined to get you into their host MD school. It's designed to get you into an MD school in general. It is hard as hell and youre stats are average for the people in it. But they are well established and have "feeders" to other lower tier MD's. Almost half their grads who get into MD schools go to either G-town, EVMS, Drexel, GW, NYMC and one other lower tier Im forgetting. So the schools you should be targeting will know how to evaluate your G-town performance. There's a clear standard that defines success and if you achieve it youll be rewarded.
2) EVMS on the otherhand was designed to get people into EVMS specifically not so much other programs. So it doesnt have this established reputation and track record of getting grads into other lower tier MDs. Really search on here DrMidLife EVMS SMP and all she's written about it. There are tons of threads on it and she has detailed the changes its gone through the past few years. Basically yes, they take a far lower proportion of SMP grads into their host school all the while not having that reputation and history with other lower tier MDs G-town has.

G-town to me is the easy pick. It'll be brutal but bottom line is the majority of grads get into US MD schools. When youre an SMP student all you can ask is if you do well youll be rewarded. G'town allows you to say that with much greater certainty than EVMS and all the turmoil and recent changes going on there.

And yes btw I agree that Cincinnati SMP is definitely your best option. Being able to establish Ohio residency after doing the program would really help you in your situation.

@GrapesofRath thanks so much! Didn't realize I posted in the wrong forum, I'm going to repost this on the post-bacc forum (is there a way to just change which forum this is under?? sorry #newbstatus)

1) Definitely getting the feel that GT is more geared towards helping applicants who bombed their ugrad gpa like I did (not really banking on getting into GT .. i would welcome ANY MD school). I'm planning on applying this upcoming summer and to have all of my secondaries completed before heading off to my SMP. As of right now, the schools I've noticed that tend to be more receptive to GT are: EVMS, NYMC, SLU, NYMC, Albany, Drexel, and a few others that I've noticed multiple students have been matriculating to based upon their website. GW would also seem like a good school that a lot of SMPers tend to matriculate to.
2) Another thing about EVMS that worries me is that they are shifting towards being like GT (accepting a larger class size, less acceptance % to their host school) but without the prestige/ recognition from other schools. IN addition with the curriculum change and addition of the 2 year program, I feel like now would be a good time for them to start lowering the # of students that they are accepting into their med school. And if history serves me correctly, they have a reputation of not letting their students know what exactly is going on. This could be completely paranoia on my part but who knows. I've definitely been tracking down all of DrML's posts about EVMS and definitely caught note of the fact that EVMS is not the feeder program it used to be. (shame).

Cinci please give me some love!!! Sent an email to Jeannie Cummins the program director but she seems to be pretty swamped with all the applicants so I'll probably send an LOI and maybe an update letter from the physician I am shadowing/ doing research with.

Thank you so much, you've been so helpful!

 

[mdtobe1111]

The days of strong linkage programs are ending. Go to the school with the better reputation (GT>EVMS) and perform exceptionally: 3.7+ GPA, 33+ MCAT. Then target low-mid tier med schools.

@piii thank you so much!! Since SMP 1st semester grades don't come out until Dec, seems like a lot schools will be rejecting me before first semester grades are over. Definitely going to start thinking about retaking the MCAT

 

[GrapesofRath]

I really wouldnt reapply this summer especially given you are a reapplicant and you had that bad semester in the post-bacc. It's why I brought up the Ohio residency thing which you wouldnt get if you applied the same cycle.

Youre the type of person esepcially being from CA who it's really best to have a full year's worth of SMP grades for. Borderline applicants(ie 3.35/33-34 1st time applicant types) are the ones who applying same year as SMP is fine. That's not you; the 0 IIs indicates you arent close enough to an MD acceptance.

Youll have to retake the MCAT by waiting but look at that as a way to enhance your app further with significant improvement on a retake. 31 as is for a CA SMP applicant, while passable, is probably more towards the lower end of what's desirable.

 

[piii]

@piii thank you so much!! Since SMP 1st semester grades don't come out until Dec, seems like a lot schools will be rejecting me before first semester grades are over. Definitely going to start thinking about retaking the MCAT

It it usually a very bad mistake to apply to med school during the first year of an SMP. You would be selling yourself short. If you are going to spend the time and money on a SMP, do it right and have an entire year of course work to show your academic improvements. If you really ace your SMP, you could realistically bump up your MCAT quite a bit.

 

[spiffysteve]

Cons - large class (200), ultra competitive, entire class seems very qualified - I heard that while a certain GPA in the GT SMP program will help you get an interview, once you are interviewed, acceptance is based upon your entire application (as it should be) so I'm afraid I'll fall short to students who have done big things in cancer research or whatever else these ivy league kids seem to have under their belt

Sorry that I'm a bit late to the party, but I'd go for GT. What you said above may have some truth to it, but everyone who is in the program will be in the same situation you are. Rockstar candidates who are super competitive won't be in an SMP, they'll be in med school.

Also, I did the EVMS MM program (graduated in 2014). I'd be happy to answer any questions you have about EVMS if you PM me.

 

[Cookiess]

Given that you already applied once and did not receive any interviews, I would highly caution you against applying during this upcoming cycle. You'll be a reapplicant and you won't be able to benefit from some of the perks of the SMP if you apply during this upcoming cycle. Plus you'd be juggling applications/interviews and your SMP classes at the same time. I think you'd be better off focusing your attention on and doing well in the SMP during this upcoming year, and then applying after you complete the SMP.

In deciding between Georgetown and EVMS for the SMP, I'd go with Georgetown. While there are notable disadvantages to GT's program (large class size, competitive environment), a good number of students end up accepted at various MD programs. EVMS MM students seem to end up at EVMS for the most part, but as you pointed out, the MM class size has increased while the MD spots for MM students has not.

 

[sunset57]

Agree with other posters that GT is the better choice.

May be too late, but have you considered the Tufts MS program?

http://publichealth.tufts.edu/Academics/MBS-Microsite

1 year of classes followed by 1 year of research (not limited to the Tufts medical system).

You'd have a year of classes when you apply ( I agree with previous poster that this would be an advantage), and time to attend interviews during your research year.

Good luck.

 

[Mansamusa]

I don't want to be discouraging, but are you sure you are ready to do well in a SMP?

How hard would it be to raise your GPA with post-bac classes?

You had a low GPA in undergrad, then a 2.6 and 4.0 in a pre-med program that was meant to redeem your grades. This is just my opinion, but if I were you, I would prefer to take a year of full time post-bac classes to establish that I can do well before risking a lot of money on a SMP. It would also give you time to retake the MCAT and then if you need a SMP still you can apply to Cincinnati's with a better application

 

[YogiMD]

Hi everyone! I'm in a similar boat to mdtobe1111! Does anyone know if you can hold multiple deposits at these schools for a little while until making a decision?

 

[mdtobe1111]

Hi everyone! I'm in a similar boat to mdtobe1111! Does anyone know if you can hold multiple deposits at these schools for a little while until making a decision?

Hi @YogiMD !
Yup you definitely can! As long as the money is not a problem! I deposited money to both EVMS and GT what about you?

 

[YogiMD]

Hi!! I will probably do deposits for both so I have more time to decide as well! Are you leaning towards one or the other?