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Which states don't require any residency to practice medicine?

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sarorah

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Question stated as above. As in, after obtaining a medical degree and passing all 3 steps of the USMLE exam, a person may go on and practice medicine without specializing?

Thanks,
Sarah
 

Blue Dog

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Board certification is not a licensing requirement in any state that I'm aware of.

It is frequently a condition of employment, however, and is also commonly required for insurance company credentialing, hospital privileges, etc.
 

DrMom

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Question stated as above. As in, after obtaining a medical degree and passing all 3 steps of the USLME exam, a person may go on and practice medicine without specializing?

Thanks,
Sarah

Every state requires that you complete at least one year of residency in order to be fully licensed. Some require 2 or 3. Your best source for state to state information is the Federation of State Medical Boards (fsmb.org). They have a page listing the initial licensure requirements for each state.
 

mamadoc

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Note that states vary as to when, and under what conditions, you may submit your Step 3 scores in order to get a permanent license. Just about everyone I know had to be in a training program - i.e. an intern - in order to be able to take Step 3. And everyone I've known, in various states, has had to at least complete an intern year before they could apply for an unconditional license.

Why do you ask?
 

sarorah

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Thanks guys! Just wondering if it was necessary, that's all. I visited:

http://www.fsmb.org/usmle_eliinitial.html

And most have 1 year requirement, and I guess since mamadoc says that you have to have 1 year internship training before taking Step 3, then that year is covered?

And if someone practiced medicine without specializing for years, but later wanted to specialize, do they still have to do a residency in that department years later?

And if someone wanted to practice medicine after 1 year intern and passed all 3 steps of the USMLE, are there good jobs available for them, can they still work as a general doctor in a hospital for instance?

ANd, are there programs that offer only 1 year internships without the rest of the residency? Once someone is certified to practice medicine, do they need to be recertified each time they move to a different state?
 

cool_vkb

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Note that states vary as to when, and under what conditions, you may submit your Step 3 scores in order to get a permanent license. Just about everyone I know had to be in a training program - i.e. an intern - in order to be able to take Step 3. And everyone I've known, in various states, has had to at least complete an intern year before they could apply for an unconditional license.

Why do you ask?

hey where can one complete the intern year. Can a IMG complete just complete 1yr intern program. Virgin islands require 1yr of Internship from an AMA accredited hospital. What does this mean. Can you shed some light.
 

sarorah

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hey where can one complete the intern year. Can a IMG complete just complete 1yr intern program. Virgin islands require 1yr of Internship from an AMA accredited hospital. What does this mean. Can you shed some light.

I guess you have to train for a year in an AMA accredited hospital to be certified to practice medicine in the virgin islands...for most of the US states, at this website, it says how many years of training each state requires to practice medicine in their state, usually 1 for US graduates and more for International Medical Graduates.
 

sarorah

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Here was my plan for the next 6 years of my life:

I'm a very bright student and currently am 17 years old, about to receive my HS diploma and very close to receiving an associate's degree in science from a local college. I wasn't originally born here but am a US citizen, but was planning to transfer to a medical school overseas where I was initially born that train students directly after high school, and graduate from them with a medical degree in about 5-6 years. With the associate's degree that has covered a lot of the basic college courses, I'm fairly certain I can graduate in 5 years. However, since the school is overseas, I'm considered a foreign graduate, which makes it a little harder to practice in the US...I'm not really interested in specializing, so I thought that I could transfer to a medical school here in the states in my last year of graduate school, do 1 year internship and take step 3 of the USMLE and hopefully pass, and be a full practicing physician by the time I'm 23.

What do you guys think, have I overlooked any potential problems?

The reason for doing this is because I do not like studying unnecessary subjects that I have no use for in my life (which is the general undergrad in the US), and education in the states is this long convoluted process that is very expensive. Over there, as a citizen of that country too, education can be 6k or less a year, and I finish much faster and only have to study courses that I enjoy and perform well.
 

cool_vkb

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Here was my plan for the next 6 years of my life:

I'm a very bright student and currently am 17 years old, about to receive my HS diploma and very close to receiving an associate's degree in science from a local college. I wasn't originally born here but am a US citizen, but was planning to transfer to a medical school overseas where I was initially born that train students directly after high school, and graduate from them with a medical degree in about 5-6 years. With the associate's degree that has covered a lot of the basic college courses, I'm fairly certain I can graduate in 5 years. However, since the school is overseas, I'm considered a foreign graduate, which makes it a little harder to practice in the US...I'm not really interested in specializing, so I thought that I could transfer to a medical school here in the states in my last year of graduate school, do 1 year internship and take step 3 of the USMLE and hopefully pass, and be a full practicing physician by the time I'm 23.

What do you guys think, have I overlooked any potential problems?

The reason for doing this is because I do not like studying unnecessary subjects that I have no use for in my life (which is the general undergrad in the US), and education in the states is this long convoluted process that is very expensive. Over there, as a citizen of that country too, education can be 6k or less a year, and I finish much faster and only have to study courses that I enjoy and perform well.

Sorry to say, but you you shud do some research on US medical practice. You have very limited knowledge. I dont understand what makes you think you can graduate in 5yrs just bcoz u have taken so many courses in CC.

Here's the bottom line:

If you are going to india or pakistan, then they dont give a damn of what u studied in undergrad, they just see ur High school diploma. And its total 6yr program. No concessions available

In USA:
90 undergrad credits (many do BS) and then 4yr medical school and then 3yrs residency.

There is no way in the world you can do one subject and leave all others bcoz u r not going to practice them.

My advise, look into dentistry, Optometry or Podiatry. if you are looking for a specialized course of study. and looking for shorter educational commitment.ofcourse they are not MD. but these are also well respected professions.

MD is a long way, i highly doubt u can settle down in ur life by 23. Thats nearly impossible.
 

sarorah

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Sorry to say, but you you shud do some research on US medical practice. You have very limited knowledge. I dont understand what makes you think you can graduate in 5yrs just bcoz u have taken so many courses in CC.

Here's the bottom line:

If you are going to india or pakistan, then they dont give a damn of what u studied in undergrad, they just see ur High school diploma. And its total 6yr program. No concessions available

In USA:
90 undergrad credits (many do BS) and then 4yr medical school and then 3yrs residency.

There is no way in the world you can do one subject and leave all others bcoz u r not going to practice them.

My advise, look into dentistry, Optometry or Podiatry. if you are looking for a specialized course of study. and looking for shorter educational commitment.ofcourse they are not MD. but these are also well respected professions.

MD is a long way, i highly doubt u can settle down in ur life by 23. Thats nearly impossible.

No it's possible because there are schools in Sudan (where I was born) that graduate high school graduates in 5 years (my parents attended a 6 yr one and were finished fairly early in life). Who said I was going to India? And sudan schools will look at my college diploma, even if not, they still graduate students in 5 years at some schools, 6 in others, 5 years is my aim.

The US's system of education is just extremely long and unnecessary, the whole undergraduate system is just general, you don't even need it for medical school most of the time. And I'm not leaving any subjects out, since I want to become a general doctor, I obviously need to know the entire human body fairly well if I want to treat patients. If I transfer to a med school in the states the last year, I'll get my medical degree from a US school, and hence only need to do 1 year of internship...

Doesn't that seem plausible?

Honestly nothing is impossible, my sister is 11 and she's taking college courses, same as that guy who graduated as the youngest doctor in the world, he started taking college courses at 9 yrs old, my own parents both finished with an MD degree when they were 25 or so.
 

DrMom

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You're not likely to transfer from a foreign school to a US medical school. You'd just have to apply & do 4 years like everyone else.

The role of "general practitioners" is shrinking in the US. It is not a good route for new graduates. You could do urgent care work, but you're unlikely to be able to get any contracts with managed care insurance companies which will limit your patient base for having a standard private practice. If you want to have a more general practice in the US, you really need to complete a Family Medicine residency.

On top of all of that, a huge percentage of medical students change their mind about specialty choice in the course of medical school, so you don't want to plan this out too specifically as the specifics will likely change.
 

core0

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You're not likely to transfer from a foreign school to a US medical school. You'd just have to apply & do 4 years like everyone else.

The role of "general practitioners" is shrinking in the US. It is not a good route for new graduates. You could do urgent care work, but you're unlikely to be able to get any contracts with managed care insurance companies which will limit your patient base for having a standard private practice. If you want to have a more general practice in the US, you really need to complete a Family Medicine residency.

On top of all of that, a huge percentage of medical students change their mind about specialty choice in the course of medical school, so you don't want to plan this out too specifically as the specifics will likely change.

I have never heard anyone transferring from a foreign medical school to a US one. You could apply to a US medical school and get in just like anyone else. Also note the number of states that require 3 years for an IMG to practice if you graduate outside the US.

David Carpenter, PA-C
 

sarorah

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No, I know it's definitely possible to transfer, give me a few moments and I'll supply you with a list of medical schools that accept foreign medical college students in the last year. If I do a residency, it'll be in internal medicine, because I do want to finish as soon as possible.

And I'm not really interested in private practice, can't general practitioners just work in a hospital and do shifts?

Say the transfer idea doesn't work for whatever reason, yet someone practices general medicine with only 1 year intern, at say, Wisconsin. And let's say that person practices for several years...if they wanted to move to a different state, do they have to go back and complete the residency program after all those years to be allowed to practice?
 

DHMO

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DHMO

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If I transfer to a med school in the states the last year, I'll get my medical degree from a US school, and hence only need to do 1 year of internship...
Doesn't that seem plausible?

Honestly nothing is impossible, my sister is 11 and she's taking college courses, same as that guy who graduated as the youngest doctor in the world, he started taking college courses at 9 yrs old, my own parents both finished with an MD degree when they were 25 or so.

Sorry dude, but this ain't gonna happen. I have had 2 friends that have tried to transfer medical schools. The first was trying to transfer from a school in Ohio to a school in Oregon. They told her no way, even though she had adequate statistics. The second tried to transfer UCI to UCD (two schools within the same state, both funded by the UC Regents, and of similar quality). They told him that the only time he can attempt to transfer is after 2nd year, and even so, the liklihood that he will be successful was very slim because he could only be accepted if a student from UCD dropped out of school (which happens very rarely in US schools). My point is that it is extremely difficult for US med students to transfer between schools. The probability of a medical student from Sudan transferring in is infintesimally small.

Also, as others have pointed out, just doing an internship then going to practice is no longer a viable option in the US healthcare system. No one would hire you and no insurance companies will work with you. Your only patients would have to be paying out-of-pocket. Good luck attracting those patients without any board certification.

Give it up and stop looking for shortcuts!
 

fantasty

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Sorry dude, but this ain't gonna happen. I have had 2 friends that have tried to transfer medical schools. The first was trying to transfer from a school in Ohio to a school in Oregon. They told her no way, even though she had adequate statistics. The second tried to transfer UCI to UCD (two schools within the same state, both funded by the UC Regents, and of similar quality). They told him that the only time he can attempt to transfer is after 2nd year, and even so, the liklihood that he will be successful was very slim because he could only be accepted if a student from UCD dropped out of school (which happens very rarely in US schools). My point is that it is extremely difficult for US med students to transfer between schools. The probability of a medical student from Sudan transferring in is infintesimally small.

I also never had to deal with this, but a friend (US citizen attending a Caribbean school) also mentioned this wouldn't fly. According to him, even those school that DO allow transfers are only going to accept LCME accredited schools.
 

sarorah

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lol okay, I just looked it up, the transferring idea is called a "fifth pathway" and although not used extensively, it's still a viable option I think. Anyway, so the idea is still possible and yeah a person wouldn't have many priveleges in the hospital like transferring patients to the ICU etc without board certification, but he'd still be able to practice medicine, albeit being the lowest rank of a doctor there is. So I wasn't wrong, it's all possible even today, it's just not the ideal path to go.
 

DHMO

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lol okay, I just looked it up, the transferring idea is called a "fifth pathway" and although not used extensively, it's still a viable option I think. Anyway, so the idea is still possible and yeah a person wouldn't have many priveleges in the hospital like transferring patients to the ICU etc without board certification, but he'd still be able to practice medicine, albeit being the lowest rank of a doctor there is. So I wasn't wrong, it's all possible even today, it's just not the ideal path to go.

Yes, all of this is technically possible. What you don't seem to grasp is that none of what you propose is realistic. Go ahead and try it (you have nothing to lose but some money and time), but you are setting yourself up for disappointment if you believe this will work out for you. Make sure you have a good back-up plan in place.
 

Doc Oc

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Some US med schools have programs where undergrads are accepted conditionally into that university's med school, and they complete their undergrad and med school in 6 or 7 years. I didn't do this, but I have heard of it. I think Brown, Minnesota-Duluth, Michigan State, perhaps a few others have these 7-year pathways. That seems to be a viable option for you as well, and although it doesn't shorten med school, it does eliminate the undergrad classes that you wish to not take.

As others have said, transferring schools is very hard within our system, and probably worse for foreign students. It might be a good idea to contact schools that you would be interested in transferring to and discussing this with them, get info from the horse's mouth. This is too risky a plan to rely on guesses from other well-meaning SDNers.

Understand that if your best laid plans fail, it will take you LONGER to get into practice as a hospitalist (which is what it sounds like you want to do), possibly many many years longer.

If you can't transfer, you become a foreign grad. Check out some threads on the challenges facing foreign grads when getting residency invites, let alone getting matched.

You're 17. I agree that it is important to be proactive about your future. I think that's great. But take the right steps to get information that you need, and don't poo-poo the advice that may not be what you want to hear. Accept it as a challenge, and add it to your list of information that you need to gather.

Best of luck to you.
 

cool_vkb

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No it's possible because there are schools in Sudan (where I was born) that graduate high school graduates in 5 years (my parents attended a 6 yr one and were finished fairly early in life). Who said I was going to India? And sudan schools will look at my college diploma, even if not, they still graduate students in 5 years at some schools, 6 in others, 5 years is my aim.

The US's system of education is just extremely long and unnecessary, the whole undergraduate system is just general, you don't even need it for medical school most of the time. And I'm not leaving any subjects out, since I want to become a general doctor, I obviously need to know the entire human body fairly well if I want to treat patients. If I transfer to a med school in the states the last year, I'll get my medical degree from a US school, and hence only need to do 1 year of internship...

Doesn't that seem plausible?

Honestly nothing is impossible, my sister is 11 and she's taking college courses, same as that guy who graduated as the youngest doctor in the world, he started taking college courses at 9 yrs old, my own parents both finished with an MD degree when they were 25 or so.

Those good old days of foreign medical graduates and partying are over. now its stiff competition and survival of the fittest. Dont compare ur parents era with present day.Now FMGs have to face more hardship.

See the problem with you is you are so overconfident, why dont u do some research bfore u write. FIFTHWAY PROGRAM IS FOR US CITIZENS WHO HAVE COMPLETED THEIR PREMEDICAL COURSE WORK FROM USA. Not for someone who did some courses from a Community College. you need to have BS in premedicine or something related. and on that top, Fifthpathway is offered only by 2 schools. When getting in so many US medical schools is itself so hard, what makes u think u cud get in a Fifthpathway medical program. Its tooth biting competition.

Lets see even if all u say happens and u bcom a practioner with 1 yr internship. Who in the world wud show up at ur hospital. I wudnt want my sick wife or mother to go to a Physician who meets minimum qualification when there is a entire bunch of Physicians who are board certified. even insurance will not pay u. thats like a bare qualification. No one does that. Ur income wud be very limited. There is no such thing as a General Doctor in USA. i mean even Family practice or Internal medicine also requires 3yrs residency.

iam sorry to be so discouraging but its better we face reality rather than just dreaming.

And more than that, no offense to any country. i myself trace my origin from a thirdworld country. But going to SUDAN sounds like a risky venture:laugh: . dont u read any news . Its not a good time in the world to end up in african nations. Thousands are fleeing from there and you wanna go there. Wow! iam suprised. Sudan is having so much political problems and fighting. Forget abt graduating, you have to worry there abt ur basic survival :laugh:. No person in sane mind wud even think abt going for medical education to a country that is having so much political turmoil.

My advise, go for europe. they have good 5-6 yr programs. You will have a good life and good education.
 

gutonc

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    lol okay, I just looked it up, the transferring idea is called a "fifth pathway" and although not used extensively, it's still a viable option I think. Anyway, so the idea is still possible and yeah a person wouldn't have many priveleges in the hospital like transferring patients to the ICU etc without board certification, but he'd still be able to practice medicine, albeit being the lowest rank of a doctor there is. So I wasn't wrong, it's all possible even today, it's just not the ideal path to go.

    The 5th pathway is only available to people who have graduted from a US undergraduate program and then completed all but the final clinical year of a foreign medical education so you would not qualify for it w/o going to college in the US. See the AMA page about the 5th pathway here: http://www.ama-assn.org/ama/pub/category/9306.html. There are also only 3 programs in the country, 2 in NY and 1 in PR.

    As for practicing w/ only 1 yr of post-grad training, it has been discussed to death on this board and the short answer is that you will not find a hospital to hire your or an insurance company to pay you. For better or worse (better in my opinion), there is a well-definted training path to practicing medicine in the US. if you want to be a physician and practice in the US you have to follow that path. If that's what you really want to do w/ your life, then this is the path you'll have to take.

    Don't focus too much on how long it will take you or how old you'll be when you start practicing. I'll be 40 when I finish my training and I'm not even close to being the oldest one on the board. If medicine is what you want to do then you'll do what it takes. Good luck.
     

    group_theory

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    Go back to this website that you said you visited already
    http://www.fsmb.org/usmle_eliinitial.html


    if you follow through with your plan for medical education in Sudan, you will be an International Medical Graduates ... all except one state (Wisconscin) requires more than 1 year of postgraduate training for IMG ... so if you go through with your plan of 1 year internship, then you are limited to one state ... and not only that, but you will have a difficult time working in a hospital ... and even if you stay on the outpatient side, you won't have any hospital priviledges (which is determined by a hospital committee made up of physicians)


    but besides that, do you think only 1 year of residency is enough to feel confident to manage patients? Esp if you only spend 1 year in a US healthcare setting? will you be confident to deal with a sick kid (rash, vomit, failure to thrive, etc)? Or a pregnant woman with pain or bleeding or emesis? Or an elderly gentleman who complains of worsening low back pain? Will you be able to recognize a surgical abdomen from a benign abdomen?

    Also remember, if you are ever in court, your qualifications are fair game to lawyers ... and your treatment of patients will be held to the same community standard of care
     

    Gatorgal

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    I am not going to belabor the point that your suggested path will restrict your career options considerably (if it works out at all).

    With your motivation, you should strongly the accelerated pathways offered at some US medical schools. University of Miami offers a 6-year path (2 yrs undergrad + 4 yrs med) that you apply to your senior year of high school. Northwestern offers a similar 7 yr path (3 + 4) you apply to while in high school. There are, of course, many more than just these.
    I chose to go through University of Florida's 7 year path. I applied during sophomore year of college. During the junior year I took small group seminar courses with the college of medicine faculty and did research (if you haven't already, you have to finish the premed reqs by the end of your 3rd year). Then started med school instead of a senior year of college. With this plus a 3 year residency, I will be a practicing physician by 26. This path is not a good fit for most people, but if length of training is that important to you, you should look it into it.
     

    angel80

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    Why are you in such a hurry to graduate? If you go into medicine, that is what you will be doing for the rest of your life. These are the last few years in your life where you will get to do something different. Undergrad can be one of the best experiences of your life. It's a good time to make friends, travel, have fun, and learn about things that aren't medicine. I wouldn't trade the 4 years undergrad + 4 years med school for a 6-year track in a million years. So what if I would have been 23 instead of 25 when I graduated. In the end 2 extra years of practicing medicine and making money means nothing compared to all of the memories I had in my undergrad training. Plus, you may end up changing your mind about medicine, and then you'll be stuck.

    If you are really set on finishing early, a friend of mine got his bachelor's degree in 2 years (he'd taken a lot of AP and community college classes during high school). He finished med school at age 23, and got into a top residency field. It is possible to do. I could have finished in 3 years, but I chose to take fewer classes for the last 2 years and work and make money instead. There are plenty of people though, who did undergrad in 3 years and went to med school.
     

    southerndoc

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    There are very few states that allow you to practice without doing residency or internship. I think Florida is one such state, unless things have changed recently.

    However, I must strongly add two points:

    1. You are unlikely to be credentialled by a hospital or HMO if you do not complete a residency, and

    2. You are extremely naive if you think that medical school alone will prepare you for clinical practice. There is a reason that residencies were developed and are required by nearly all states.
     

    lateness

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    There are very few states that allow you to practice without doing residency or internship. I think Florida is one such state, unless things have changed recently.

    However, I must strongly add two points:

    1. You are unlikely to be credentialled by a hospital or HMO if you do not complete a residency, and

    2. You are extremely naive if you think that medical school alone will prepare you for clinical practice. There is a reason that residencies were developed and are required by nearly all states.

    i agree with tthe above. i heard even florida you still have to have a year of residency..
     

    JungleBoy

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    I'm an IMG did Internal medicine in the US and I'm currently doing subspecialty training. You sound like a smart and enthusiastic young man, but I think you should spend more time thinking about what you really want in life. If you really love medicine and if you've had enough exposure to the medical field to know you want to be a doctor, than you'll go for it, no matter what it takes. I feel you're trying to plan exactly how many years it'll take till you get a job and make some cash as a doctor, when this should be the last thing you should be thinking about at this point in your life. If you do start you medical training, you'll change your career plans so many times till you're finished, that all your efforts to figure things out so many years in advance will be totally worthless. It will happen, I promise.
    About your situation, I agree that undergrad is of limited value for your medical career. The only thing it does for you is make you an older, hopefully a more mature person once you start med school, which is also of argueable value. Medical training in some countries is superior than training in the US, in my opinion, because it's much longer (usually 6 yrs) and you're given more responsibility and have more practical exposure. However, this is certainly not true for every country and you must consider the specific situation of Suddan. While you can certainly get great medical training in many places in Africa, this is not true for most of the continent. I say this because I have many friends who graduated from institutions in several parts of Africa, and I have been there myself.
    Before going to med school overseas also consider the following: 1- you will have a hard time finding a residency spot in the US, most international applicants never get a residency spot, although many do (check statistics on this website); 2- In many countries, getting into med school can be even more competitive than in the US (eg. Pakistan, India, Brazil), especially if you're talking about the larger, more prestigious (which are oftern cheap or even free of charge); 3- when, and if you get a residency position in the US, you'll have to adapt to a whole new medical system.
    As far as working without completing a residency, while it may be theoretically possible, in practice it is not. If you go to a foreign school, you'll have to do what every FMG does, complete your residency (none are less than 3 yrs) and then get a job. No short cuts exist in real life.
    If you decide to be a general doctor, here are the options: 1- internal medicine - 3 yrs- work as a hospitalist (hospital shifts), as a primary care (outpatient physician), or a combination of the two; 2- family practice - 3 yrs - work mostly in outpatient clinics seeing adutls, peds, gyn etc. For virtually everything else, the training is longer.
    Hope this helps, good luck with everything.
     

    DocBrown

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    Here was my plan for the next 6 years of my life:

    I'm a very bright student and currently am 17 years old, about to receive my HS diploma and very close to receiving an associate's degree in science from a local college. I wasn't originally born here but am a US citizen, but was planning to transfer to a medical school overseas where I was initially born that train students directly after high school, and graduate from them with a medical degree in about 5-6 years. With the associate's degree that has covered a lot of the basic college courses, I'm fairly certain I can graduate in 5 years. However, since the school is overseas, I'm considered a foreign graduate, which makes it a little harder to practice in the US...I'm not really interested in specializing, so I thought that I could transfer to a medical school here in the states in my last year of graduate school, do 1 year internship and take step 3 of the USMLE and hopefully pass, and be a full practicing physician by the time I'm 23.

    What do you guys think, have I overlooked any potential problems?

    The reason for doing this is because I do not like studying unnecessary subjects that I have no use for in my life (which is the general undergrad in the US), and education in the states is this long convoluted process that is very expensive. Over there, as a citizen of that country too, education can be 6k or less a year, and I finish much faster and only have to study courses that I enjoy and perform well.
    Wow--you're way off on many points.

    First of all, any person here who has actually lived will tell you that you can't make these types of plans for 6 years. That's an immense amount of time. A lot can and will change in those 6 years, especially since you're still technically a child (17 years old).

    Secondly, if you end up in med school overseas, you're not going to transfer into a med school here in the US--period. No medical school in the USA will accept a transfer from a student who graduated high school in the USA and decided to go to medical school overseas. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

    Third, college isn't an obstacle to medical school. What if medicine just isn't right for you? What if there's something that's a much better fit? And what if you just want to get hammered, wander the bars, black out, and wind up in some unknown chick's bedroom and then stumble across campus to class the next morning? (j/k about that one---personally though, I had a lot of fun doing that).

    Anyhow, it sounds like you're under a lot of parental pressure to be in medicine. I can't help you with that. I don't mean to be harsh, but that's how I see it.
     

    TUCOMSam

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    this girl/guy is so in for a rude awakening... i try to imagine myself 8 years ago... i was as driven to practice medicine (if not more), but I really don't think I was that clueless or against taking advice from those who are so far ahead of me in experience! seriously, you need to close your mouth and open your ears to what people are trying to tell you because it just aint gonna work! Sudan, India, Ghana, France, whatever... you'll be IMG anyway you slice it dice it or julianne it.

    The greater, underlying question I have is, why the rush??? If your (undergarments) are tied up this tight right now, I hate to see what you have to say in 10 years from now. A good first step would be to ask why you HAVE to finish medical school and internship by the time your in your early 20's?? Your parents finished when they were 25 you say? Well I have news for you... I have cut NO corners and I'll be 25 when I graduate this spring. Guess I'm just lucky my birthday was in the summer. But even so... gaining some strong life experience is better than anything else you could wish for when it comes to choosing your life-path. I guarantee whatever you THINK you may know about yourself at 17 will be at least somewhat different by the time you're 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, etc...
     

    skypilot

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    Don't try to skip residency. Just think of it as your first paid job as a doctor. Believe me the more senior residents get respect and do a lot as a doctor. Sometimes they do more than they will do when they get out into practice.

    Good luck on your journey, I don't think the foreign med school is a crazy idea just pick the best med school possible no matter where you go. Look at the schools in English speaking countries like England, Ireland, Australia and Canada. Good luck.
     

    hef

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    The greater, underlying question I have is, why the rush???
    Because of this:
    sarorah said:
    Honestly nothing is impossible, my sister is 11 and she's taking college courses, same as that guy who graduated as the youngest doctor in the world, he started taking college courses at 9 yrs old, my own parents both finished with an MD degree when they were 25 or so.
    "I want to be a genius too!" :)
     

    ekydrd

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    This young person is saddly misguided... and apparently no longer wants to listen to sage advice. I haven't seen a response from him for a while. I hope he reads the above advice. We do need life experience in order to best apply our medical knowlege, and to establish relationships with our patients. At 17 you are in a big hurry to grow up. Stop and smell the roses and enjoy your youth. Despite what you think now it doesn't last forever.

    As for the "unnecessary" undergraduate classes you mention. It was some of those classes, which do not have any bearing on medicine that I enjoyed the most, and training from a couple of them I still use as destressors (one was an art class, the other a mythology class). Besides, most medical schools like well rounded medical students. There are several schools (as mentioned previously) that have intergrated undergrad and med school cirricula.
     

    Miami_med

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    There are very few states that allow you to practice without doing residency or internship. I think Florida is one such state, unless things have changed recently.

    However, I must strongly add two points:

    1. You are unlikely to be credentialled by a hospital or HMO if you do not complete a residency, and

    2. You are extremely naive if you think that medical school alone will prepare you for clinical practice. There is a reason that residencies were developed and are required by nearly all states.

    You still need internship in Florida.
     

    Tired

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    All that work to blast through undergrad, suffer through the med school admissions process, get beaten over the head in med school, and get killed you intern year, so that you can . . .

    What? Do insurance physicals the rest of your life? Treat runny noses in one of those Walmart urgent care clinics?

    Seems like a lot of work to end up with a pretty mundane career.

    If that's what you want, go get an NP. Hell, NPs can do more than GPs these days, depending on your specialty.
     

    atomi

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    Question stated as above. As in, after obtaining a medical degree and passing all 3 steps of the USMLE exam, a person may go on and practice medicine without specializing?

    Thanks,
    Sarah

    To quickly answer your question, you need to complete a residency program.


    For some things to consider (thoughts that your posts brought to my mind):

    I wish I could be 17 again. Those were the best years of my life. Sadly I am only 22-23 now, but I think I can offer you some advice. First, you sound a lot like me, someone who doesn't like to be forced to do things that he doesn't want to do -- especially course requirements. So I hope I can offer you some advice (coming at the end of this reply)...

    I studied hard in h.s. and college and graduated in 3.5 years (the average length was 4.5 for my degree). What did all that hurrying and rushing do for me? Nothing. Because in the end, it doesn't matter that you graduated early. There is no light at the end of the tunnel as an adult - the only thing there is retirement (if you make it) and even that's no picnic. If you spend all of your time rushing towards life goals, eventually one day you're just going to realize that you've hit a road block -- you've passed over all those little annoying stepping stones on your life journey and now there's only one left - death. That's a pretty depressing thought. You work and you work getting your degrees and then all of the sudden - BOOM!! It's all over and you get to do the same job day in and day out until you die. And then all of the sudden your life will feel incredibly pointless. You'll realize that busting your ass to 'get through it' didn't really make a difference because you would have ended up in the same place anyway. And I believe that's why the ultra-achievers who are naturally attracted to high-paying professions like medicine and law suffer so much from depression and substance abuse.

    Life is not about 'sucking it up' and paying your dues while you go to med school, vet school, astronaut school, garbage man training academy, whatever. The only way you will ever have any chance of being happy is to live each day as much as you possibly can. That means making time for family, friends, and incorporating new and exciting things into your life. Your 'plan' doesn't much sound like that. Instead it reads like 'mom and dad say I have to be a doctor and I hate learning about things not related to being a doctor so I just want to be a doctor as fast as possible and then everything will all of the sudden be ok.' Sorry, I don't mean to patronize you, but that is how your situation reads.

    >>>>My advice to you is this: GO TO COLLEGE (In the U.S.). At age 17, it is very difficult to comprehend lengths of time. An extra two or three years may seem like a lifetime to you, but believe me they are not, they will fly by. You can't understand this because you haven't been an adult very long. 5 years ago you were a child. 5 years from now you will still be an adult. And the experiences and personal growth you can gain in college more than make up for a year or two of lost income as a 24 year old doctor. They are PRICELESS. You sound like you are probably top of your class in high school and can probably go to a very good college on full scholarship (although it sounds like you have rushed high school and it might be too late to apply to some schools for next fall).

    Why should you go to college? Because college is not about being forced to learn a bunch of random crap that you don't care about. The point of college is to educate a person, and I mean educate in a very broad sense. Being college educated means you have been taught critical thinking skills, writing/communication skills, and analytical skills. You will have been broadened culturally as well as academically. You learn to grow socially outside of the classroom (albeit this requires initiative on your own part - something I failed at and am paying for now). Your thought processes will be forever changed and you will be able to see things and make decisions about things much more wisely. Yes, I was just like the way you seem at 17 - narrowly focused on goals. After going through college, I'm more able to see the 'big picture.' If you go straight to medical school, you won't be educated. You'll be trained. Go to college, take some b.s. liberal arts classes, play sports, make friends and party with them, study abroad, pick a major that interests you the most academically, and above all enjoy the ride. If you just keep your eyes on the end goal and neglect everything else in life just so you can get there, the time will fly by and all of the sudden you will have met your goal but your life will feel very empty. I know because it happened to me. Luckily I have realized this at 22 and not 45, so I've got some time, but it's no joke when people tell you college is the best four years of your life (it was hell for me but only because I made it). It is. Anybody who tells you they wouldn't want to be 19 again is either lying or mentally ill. You are much more envied as a 17 year old with the world open to them than a 45 year old doctor with $100k in debt. Enjoy your time. If you think you're ready for the real world, you're not, trust me -- a teenager's world is a lot more fun anyway. Sorry I think I have gotten on a rant, but I think you see the point I am trying to make.

    Don't try to take shortcuts. Don't live your life on the narrow. That's not living at all. Experience as much as you can. Go to college, take those pre-med classes (if you haven't already), but don't be gung-ho about it. If you're hating your time at college, you're doing something wrong. If, after your first few years, you still want to be a doctor, do it. You'll never regret it. Go to Sudan and try to shortcut it? I wouldn't take that bet. Seriously considering doing something like that shows some real immaturity on your part, and that is exactly why you should go to college. Either that or the military.
     

    MOHS_01

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    I believe that it is your age speaking -- wisdom and useful knowledge comes from having your a** handed to you by life, which you have not experienced yet. If you pursue this route, you will either wind up practicing in the foreign land where you go to school or will have to start over again and prolong your training.

    Go to college, get the prereq's out of the way. As soon as you do, start applying. There is little need to graduate college if you can be accepted prior to graduation. You should graduate med school by 24 or 25 by doing it this way. I enjoyed my college years, and if I had it to do all over again, I would have spent another year in college taking courses that I liked. As it was, I graduated in four years and went straight into med school. Still managed to graduate at 25.

    Good luck, and don't look for the easy way out. It makes you appear lazy. Do your training here.
     

    Bitsy3221

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    Anybody who tells you they wouldn't want to be 19 again is either lying or mentally ill.


    Whoa.....not everyone wants to be 19 again. I certainly don't, and I am neither lying nor mentally ill. I liked being in college and running around making stupid decisions, but I love that I have my s**t together now, a little money and great friends and family and about to start an amazing career.

    But what the heck do I know? I'm just an over the hill 30 year old with more perspective and experience than some 22 year old over achiever! ;)

    (Actually given the choice I'd rather be 19 than 22 again so take that for what it's worth!)
     

    Tired

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    Whoa.....not everyone wants to be 19 again. I certainly don't, and I am neither lying nor mentally ill. I liked being in college and running around making stupid decisions, but I love that I have my s**t together now, a little money and great friends and family and about to start an amazing career.

    Personally, I enjoyed 22. College senior, minimal course load, partying every night with the future doctors/lawyers/engineers of America in New Orleans . . .

    No matter how satisfying my life is now, nothing will ever compare in terms of sheer fun to 22.
     

    Bitsy3221

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    Personally, I enjoyed 22. College senior, minimal course load, partying every night with the future doctors/lawyers/engineers of America in New Orleans . . .

    No matter how satisfying my life is now, nothing will ever compare in terms of sheer fun to 22.

    Yeah, see when I was 22 I was working like a dog, had no money yet, lived in a tiny apartment and driving a crappy car.

    Now 19........ah, that was fun


    But still not as much fun as I've had in the past couple of years.
     

    atomi

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    Whoa.....not everyone wants to be 19 again. I certainly don't, and I am neither lying nor mentally ill. I liked being in college and running around making stupid decisions, but I love that I have my s**t together now, a little money and great friends and family and about to start an amazing career.

    But what the heck do I know? I'm just an over the hill 30 year old with more perspective and experience than some 22 year old over achiever! ;)

    (Actually given the choice I'd rather be 19 than 22 again so take that for what it's worth!)

    Well, yeah. I haven't reached your age yet, so I don't know what that's like. But all I know is 19 blows 22-23 out of the water. Thanks for giving me something to look forward to. I figured it was all downhill from here,
     

    Winged Scapula

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    Well, yeah. I haven't reached your age yet, so I don't know what that's like. But all I know is 19 blows 22-23 out of the water. Thanks for giving me something to look forward to. I figured it was all downhill from here,

    Its not...at least for most of us! I really enjoyed my 30s, BTW.:p
     

    delphynium

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    Dear OP,

    If you have a Bachelor's degree from an American college than you can go to a Foreign Medical School and transfer back in your last year of Medical School before you have completed the final year of Med School abroad i.e. before you have finished say the "internship year" which is part of the Medical education in a lot of European medical schools. Go to the AMA web site:
    http://www.ama-assn.org/ama/pub/category/9306.html
    There is a detailed description about the process and the names of the 3 Universities in the USA which accept transferring Fifth Pathway Students. Apparently thousands of American citizens have got their MD degrees through this program in the last 30 years.
    Good luck to you
    Keep up your ambition and motivation. :luck:
     
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