crunchywhit

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Doing M-1 Orientation Survey. I have a Ph.D. in Chemistry. My form suggests that I should embroider my white coat as First Name MI. Last Name, Ph.D. I see arguments for inclusion of this title and for not. Thoughts?
 

Syncrohnize

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Doing M-1 Orientation Survey. I have a Ph.D. in Chemistry. My form suggests that I should embroider my white coat as First Name MI. Last Name, Ph.D. I see arguments for inclusion of this title and for not. Thoughts?
The atmosphere in medical school is too much like high school where pulling something like that may rub INSECURE people the wrong way. This especially applies to third year where perceptions really matter and how your fellow students view you will likely be tied to your overall happiness during rotations. I would say resist the urge (I know you deserve it and you should be proud and @OutRun is right in a way so if you want to be proud and disregard haters that's cool), but I would say hold out until residency.
 

ProfMD

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Don't do it.

After med school, by all means embroider as MD, PhD. Leave the doctorate off for now.
 

ProfMD

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Doing M-1 Orientation Survey. I have a Ph.D. in Chemistry. My form suggests that I should embroider my white coat as First Name MI. Last Name, Ph.D. I see arguments for inclusion of this title and for not. Thoughts?
The atmosphere in medical school is too much like high school where pulling something like that may rub INSECURE people the wrong way. This especially applies to third year where perceptions really matter and how your fellow students view you will likely be tied to your overall happiness during rotations. I would say resist the urge (I know you deserve it and you should be proud and @OutRun is right in a way so if you want to be proud and disregard haters that's cool), but I would say hold out until residency.
I'm surprised the school recommended it. Its almost like they want the upperclassmen to give him wedgies.
 

Crayola227

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DON'T do it, not worth it!!!!!
 

bc65

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I wouldn't do it.

Someone with a PhD in chemistry or history, for that matter, is entitled to be addressed as "doctor", but to do so in a hospital would be misleading.

So while are entitled to put PhD on your coat, I agree that you should not do it. It appears to imply an expertise that you don't have.

On a more practical level, you'll end up having to explain that PhD over and over again, and yes, you will be "that guy".


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Raryn

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I wouldn't do it.

Someone with a PhD in chemistry or history, for that matter, is entitled to be addressed as "doctor", but to do so in a hospital would be misleading.


So while are entitled to put PhD on your coat, I agree that you should not do it. It appears to imply an expertise that you don't have.

On a more practical level, you'll end up having to explain that PhD over and over again, and yes, you will be "that guy".


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Misleading... and potentially illegal depending on your state. Don't ever introduce yourself as Dr. Lastname in a clinical setting until you actually have that MD/DO. Student Doctor Lastname is borderline (but probably OK if your school doesn't outright forbid it).
 

The Anhedonia

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OMFS resident here finishing med school:
Agreed with the above, leave it off. Dont be that guy :)
On my med school coat i do not have my DDS even though it is a clinically relevant profession
And even though i have an NPI, DEA #, and hospital privileges, in the context of medical school I do not introduce myself as doctor either.
 
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crunchywhit

crunchywhit

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I'm surprised the school recommended it. Its almost like they want the upperclassmen to give him wedgies.
Why's it gotta be a "him"? :D

I would say consensus is that, although it would be legit, it is potentially misleading, also potentially alienating and/or problem-causing. Overall, it is less contentious to leave the title off of the lab coat. (And go with MD, PhD for residency).

Thank you wise SDN - I hope everyone has an excellent night.
 
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Psai

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Why's it gotta be a "him"? :D

I would say consensus is that, although it would be legit, it is potentially misleading, also potentially alienating and/or problem-causing. Overall, it is less contentious to leave the title off of the lab coat. (And go with MD, PhD for residency).

Thank you wise SDN - I hope everyone has an excellent night.
Because giving a girl a wedgie is an express ticket to sexual harassment city which is not a place to go if you like your job
 

ortnakas

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Don't be that one person...
Agree with... everybody. Technically you've earned it, but don't be that guy.
(At least not on your med student coat-- once you've got your long coat it won't come off as pretentious)
 

Goro

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You earned that PhD. Therefore, you're entitled to flaunt it.


Doing M-1 Orientation Survey. I have a Ph.D. in Chemistry. My form suggests that I should embroider my white coat as First Name MI. Last Name, Ph.D. I see arguments for inclusion of this title and for not. Thoughts?
 

Tenk

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Med students might care one way or the other. Residents might scoff. Attendings wouldn't notice/care unless someone told them to. Patients wouldn't understand. Overall, probably just leave it off for now.
 
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235009

I agree that you shouldn't put it on your coat but keep in mind that MD/PhD students at most schools complete their phd before 3rd year of med school so it's not like you'll be particularly unique in that sense.


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Crayola227

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You earned that PhD. Therefore, you're entitled to flaunt it.
I agree but I think if it's on the badge that should be enough. The white coat already gets med students in trouble for being mistaken for being docs, add on some initials after the name and the patients will be even more confused I think.
 

Amygdarya

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You earned that PhD. Therefore, you're entitled to flaunt it.
While I usually agree with your posts, I disagree with his one. A PhD by itself hardly ever has relevance in the clinical world - and I'm saying this as someone who completed PhD in a biomedical field (not chemistry) and one of whose graduate school papers was cited on UpToDate (so there actually was a bit of clinical relevance)*. Should JD be put on a student's white coat? One has to work hard to earn that, too. MBA? MS? No. Neither should PhD, as it's misleading and irrelevant. Wear your badge of honor after you've earned those MD letters.

* - in general, while my classmates know that I have a PhD, I tend not to disclose it on the wards, unless a resident/atrending etc takes an interest and asks about my life before medical school.
 

TheTao

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Depends on how well you want your life in med school to be. If you want it to be positive, definitely leave it OFF.

Signed, I future PhD who will NOT have it embroidered on my white coat until residency.
 
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Amygdarya

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I was not aware that medical students and residents were such children. I would do it. You earned a PhD, wear that ****
Like I said above, no clincal relevance. The Anhedonia above didn't put his/her DDS on his/her white coat even though it has a lot more relevance. Someone with a PhD is just as clueless as any other medical student the first time they're in the OR, on the wards etc. Many medical studens - especially at top schools - have outstanding achievements, such as participating in the Olympics, being a figure skating champion etc. - should they wear their medals to the hospital?
 

Goro

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My point is that relevance tot he clinical world is, well, irrelevant. It's simply that one did the work, one should be allowed to show it off.


While I usually agree with your posts, I disagree with his one. A PhD by itself hardly ever has relevance in the clinical world - and I'm saying this as someone who completed PhD in a biomedical field (not chemistry) and one of whose graduate school papers was cited on UpToDate (so there actually was a bit of clinical relevance)*. Should JD be put on a student's white coat? One has to work hard to earn that, too. MBA? MS? No. Neither should PhD, as it's misleading and irrelevant. Wear your badge of honor after you've earned those MD letters.

* - in general, while my classmates know that I have a PhD, I tend not to disclose it on the wards, unless a resident/atrending etc takes an interest and asks about my life before medical school.
 

Amygdarya

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My point is that relevance tot he clinical world is, well, irrelevant. It's simply that one did the work, one should be allowed to show it off.
As a medical student in the clincal world, showing off anything (even something totally legitimate) can be dangerous :) Keeping a low profile is much safer. I'm not saying it's good, just the way it is. I guess there are too many insecure individuals in medicine who will ding you if they perceive you to be superior in some way. Unfortunately, the impression we make on people has a big really impact on our clinical grades. As someone observed about success on clinical rotations, "It's not who you know, it's who you don't annoy"
 
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PharMed2016

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I would hesitate on leaving the PhD after my name. I left my PharmD off my white coat as a medical student. After medical school and in residency/fellowship, knock yourself out.
 
2

235009

I guess there are too many insecure individuals in medicine who will ding you if they perceive you to be superior in some way.
No physician will ever think a med student is "superior" but if you exude a sense of superiority or make them feel like you THINK you are superior then you might be in trouble. Putting phd on our white coat is one way of giving off that impression.


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jqueb29

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I usually agree with Goro, but I'm very much in disagreement here. Nobody cares about your PhD, and you'll just look like a try-hard dweeb if you get it embroidered. It's perfectly fine after graduation though.
 

Mad Jack

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Doing M-1 Orientation Survey. I have a Ph.D. in Chemistry. My form suggests that I should embroider my white coat as First Name MI. Last Name, Ph.D. I see arguments for inclusion of this title and for not. Thoughts?
Put it on your attending coat. Nothing good can come of it being on your medical student coat- other students might give you ****, attendings might take it as a challenge to show you how little you know, etc.
 

Amygdarya

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No physician will ever think a med student is "superior" but if you exude a sense of superiority or make them feel like you THINK you are superior then you might be in trouble. Putting phd on our white coat is one way of giving off that impression.
Yours is a better way of putting what I was trying to say.
 

Lost In Transcription

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I had no idea medical professionals and students alike were so incredibly insecure. Seems fairly idiotic to take someone's education as some sort of personal threat.

My friend left it off hers, for precisely this fear though, OP. I laughed at the time thinking she was being neurotic because of how much she worried about it.
 
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Petypet

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They hate us cuz they anus.....

Do what you want. No logical person in the hospital will call you doctor in a clinical setting with a PhD, and further you will never introduce yourself as doctor. Also, no doctor will introduce you as doctor to a patient based on seeing a phd, and if they do roll with it, it feels baller. More often then not they say this is double doctor XYZ.

Every attending I told or that found out about my PhD made for an easy conversation starter. Do what you want and give yourself every opportunity to stand out. Just don't be a d-bag about it.
 

Cyal

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While I usually agree with your posts, I disagree with his one. A PhD by itself hardly ever has relevance in the clinical world - and I'm saying this as someone who completed PhD in a biomedical field (not chemistry) and one of whose graduate school papers was cited on UpToDate (so there actually was a bit of clinical relevance)*. Should JD be put on a student's white coat? One has to work hard to earn that, too. MBA? MS? No. Neither should PhD, as it's misleading and irrelevant. Wear your badge of honor after you've earned those MD letters.

* - in general, while my classmates know that I have a PhD, I tend not to disclose it on the wards, unless a resident/atrending etc takes an interest and asks about my life before medical school.
I was also a science PhD before med school. Agree completely.
 

Cyal

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Put it on your attending coat. Nothing good can come of it being on your medical student coat- other students might give you ****, attendings might take it as a challenge to show you how little you know, etc.
I actually had this issue with a resident during MS3. My attending (an MD/PhD) took some interest in what I did prior to medical school and we talked about the PhD experience. He later told the residents just casually, and it appeared an insecure resident, in a rather passive aggressive way, tried to show me how much he knew about the specialty. Crazy stuff. Lots of egos in medicine.
 

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No matter how genuine of a person you are, it will rub some staff and colleagues the wrong way, even if just 5%.

You have to ask yourself: what's more important, that you have "PhD" on your coat and 5% of people are rubbed the wrong way, even if they don't say anything, or you don't have PhD on your coat and you don't rub anyone the wrong way.

The same is true if you have a stud in your ear. No one has to speak to you to make a judgement against you. Because it's never about us in a healthcare setting. So anything that could be construed as self-inflating or -focused, no matter how seemingly trivial, is best to be avoided.
 

chipwhitley

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I've seen nurses and administrators wearing white coats with a whole slew of "degrees" on them, so why can't OP put his Ph.D. in chemistry, which is a legit degree, on there?
 

Amygdarya

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I've seen nurses and administrators wearing white coats with a whole slew of "degrees" on them, so why can't OP put his Ph.D. in chemistry, which is a legit degree, on there?
Because nurses and administrators are employees, and medical students are the lowest on the totem pole.
I don't know how to attach pictures to posts from my phone but check out the link below - it describes the position of medical students in hospital hierarchy just perfectly:
http://doccartoon.blogspot.com/2012/12/seating-rank-order.html
(And if you're a resident you should know this already.)
 
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TheFutureFatMan

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Degrees are degrees. If you've earned them, I don't see the issue putting the letters. There are plenty of medical students with a bachelors that carry themselves pompously. I think a regular laid-back student, wouldn't have a problem with a PhD at the end of their name. No one cares. I wouldn't be offended. NOW...if the student was acting like they were better than everyone else in the world because they have a PhD...then there's an issue.
 

chipwhitley

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Because nurses and administrators are employees, and medical students are the lowest on the totem pole.
I don't know how to attach pictures to posts from my phone but check out the link below - it describes the position of medical students in hospital hierarchy just perfectly:
http://doccartoon.blogspot.com/2012/12/seating-rank-order.html
(And if you're a resident you should know this already.)
Why do med students love to put themselves down? No other health profession student I've seen does this.
 
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OP, do what you want. You earned it, put it on there - agree with some above posters that its also all about your personality and whether or not you offer up the fact that you have a doctorate to everyone all the time. I personally put my masters degree after my name because i earned that ****. Im in my clinical years and nobody has ever cared. Being a thorough, genuine, prepared med student gets noticed a hell of a lot more.
 
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Kpw101

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Doing M-1 Orientation Survey. I have a Ph.D. in Chemistry. My form suggests that I should embroider my white coat as First Name MI. Last Name, Ph.D. I see arguments for inclusion of this title and for not. Thoughts?
Would like to say wear it with pride, you earned it. But I just realized this might make a few people (insecure people as someone mention) annoyed.
 

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Would like to say wear it with pride, you earned it. But I just realized this might make a few people (insecure people as someone mention) annoyed.
Consider whether it is this very attitude that represents putting one's own perspective above that of others. Can guarantee you the nay votes on this thread have nothing to do with insecurity.
 

TheTao

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I was not aware that medical students and residents were such children. I would do it. You earned a PhD, wear that ****
You're also assuming that people grow up and that professional jealousy doesn't exist.

IT DOES.
 

TheTao

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Because nurses and administrators are employees, and medical students are the lowest on the totem pole.
]

Seems to me that the people who insist on coming up with excuses for why they should wear all their earned letters on their 3rd year med student SHORT coat are very likely the ones who think they'll know more than the nurses/admins they work with. In that case, f*** 'em they'll learn the hard way that a good nurse/admin is your best friend in 3rd year.

BTW, I'll have THREE sets of letters beyond the Bachelors degree that "could" go on my coat and NONE of them will be there until Residency. Ego = checked!
 

neuroplastic

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So this is super late, but for future students reading this post I'm an med student who came in to medical school with a PhD and had it on my 3rd/4th year white coat and it was fine. It didn't rub people the wrong way because I'm not an egotistical jerk who rubs people the wrong way. I agree with the poster above who said that 'being a thorough, genuine, prepared med student' is so much more important. For classmates (to my knowledge), it never bothered anyone because during pre-clinical courses, when my degree was relevant, I was a helpful peer-tutor, so it benefitted a bunch of people. For attendings who were basic science inclined or just noticed it, it piqued their interest and it was a great conversation starter, and I felt like it let them get to know me more as an actual person. Same thing for patients who were researchers or just friendly & talkative. I never introduced myself as 'Dr', because that would be intentionally misleading and inappropriate in a clinical setting, and if a patient ever asked 'oh should I call you Dr?' my response would be a joking 'oh no, only my mom calls me that ;) ' (which is true)

Getting a PhD takes blood, sweat, and tears. It can be a rewarding, but it is often an isolating and emotionally tolling experience. Even if you don't plan on continuing research, it'll always be part of who you are. For me, it was part of my identity, it helped me get into medical school in the first place, and ya know, I'm pretty darn proud of it.
 

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