Who can I ask for letters of rec?

[nolee]

Hi guys! I was referred over from the main pre-med forum, where I posted this question initially. Since I'm a nontrad, I haven't really talked with any of my professors for a looong time (4+ years), and I'm not sure any of them remember me. I have 3 PIs that I'm positive will know who I am, but would they count for the academic letters? My impression is that the letters have to be from professors that have taught you in a classroom context. I've taken a "course" (officially appearing on my transcript) with each of my PIs, but they weren't classroom courses in the traditional sense--more like labs where we would discuss ideas and write exploratory papers (and there would only be 4 of us). Would this be enough to count them as academic instructors?

Long story short -- should I stick with my PIs and possibly have the letters not count, or ask some of my old professors (but have the letters be semi-generic)? I'd obviously love to ask my supervisors, but I'm just worried that certain schools will tell me "Nope!" This issue is making me pull me hair out! Thanks so much everyone, and hope you all have a great afternoon.

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[mspeedwagon]

I'm not an expert in this field, but I think of academic letters being from bio, chem or physics prof in a classroom context.

I'd suggest taking a class if possible.

I have 3 PIs that I'm positive will know who I am, but would they count for the academic letters? My impression is that the letters have to be from professors that have taught you in a classroom context. I've taken a "course" (officially appearing on my transcript) with each of my PIs, but they weren't classroom courses in the traditional sense--more like labs where we would discuss ideas and write exploratory papers (and there would only be 4 of us). Would this be enough to count them as academic instructors?

 

[Esquire]

Check your specific schools.

Most require 3-4 letters, of which 2-3 MUST be from profs. If you can't get great LORs from former profs, take a bunch of science classes and ask your new profs.

Not all profs will come through for you -- a fair share are flakey and can't meet deadlines. It's very important to request more LORs than you actually need in order to cover for the profs that don't come through. Rule of thumb: if you need 3 LORs, ask 6 profs.

Get on it now so your LORs will be in time to apply early in the app cycle.

 

[dublindp]

At what point do you ask for the letter? When you take the class or when you apply?

 

[DocVapor]

Personally I don't see why letters from PI's in a graduate level program wouldn't count, especially if it is a science-based program. I would certainly try and get a letter from 1 or two of your old professors if you can, but again schools may realize they are old as well. Since you are a non-trad some programs MAY give you leeway. It might be best to cover your bases by submitting an extra 1 or 2 (AT MOST) letters.

But it all depends on the situation. You might consider applying to both med programs as well as some post-bacc programs this year as a fall-back.

I went the formal post-bacc route as a non-trad, so I'm not an expert in the least, but figured I would give you a differing opinion than what has already been said.

 

[Dr2017]

At what point do you ask for the letter? When you take the class or when you apply?

I just went through this recently. I would highly recommend asking your professor while you are still in their class or very soon after. They often limit how many letters they write each term and it is best to ask while your outstanding qualities are fresh in their memory. Make sure you are not just a grade in their books and actively attend office hours or make yourself stand out in some other way. Use a site like interfolio.com to store the letters. There is a marginal charge per year for the account but it allows you to distribute letters much more easily when you apply.

 

[dsoz]

First, I agree with the interfolio statement above. It is a good way to store your letters.

I am more than fifteen years out from my undergrad. When I decided to change careers and go to med school I got two letters from my current employer. One from my current supervisor and one from a person that used to supervise me, but has moved to a different job.

I also took a couple of classes. Intro to immunology at a CC, biochem at a university, and a year of A&P at a CC. I had the A&P profs write me my science letters (A's for each term). I got a letter from the lecture prof and the lab prof.

I also had three clinical letters. One from my hospital volunteer gig. I had over 300 hours when they wrote my letter. One from an MD that I shadowed for over 140 hours. And one from a DO that I shadowed for 16 hours (only sent DO letter to DO schools).

To answer your question, I would try to take a night class at a college near you. Even if it is a community college. Once you have a degree proving you can do the sciences, additional courses at a CC won't harm your application. Ask for a letter from the prof when you are greater than half way through the class. Make sure you are getting an A in the class so he/she can write about how you are such a stellar student.

Also do things that will get you additional letters. Job, volunteer, etc.

There was only one school that I had trouble with my LORs. PCOM wanted a Dean's letter. I tried calling my undergrad institution several times and was never able to talk to a real person in the Dean's office about a letter. PCOM did not waver on the requirement so I did not finish that secondary or send in the secondary fee.

I was accepted to three of my top five schools. I guess I did just fine this application cycle.

Good luck to you
dsoz

 

[NTF]

Having at least 1 LOR from a science professor who can evaluate you as their student is essential for most schools. The LOR from your PI will be good, but schools are often concerned about academic worthiness (ie can you make it through M1/M2 and pass step1) and they want letters that can attest to that. So while supervisor LOR's are good they don't fulfill that need for adcoms. If you can't find a professor from 4 years ago who'd be able to write you a good LOR (ie something with specifics), I highly suggest taking a ugrad science course and trying to score an LOR that way.

A lot of schools require more than 1 LOR from a professor who taught you, but many of them are sympathetic to non-trad situations. It's never a bad idea to email or call admissions offices at schools you're likely to apply to gauge whether there's flexibility in their policies.

Also, find out if your ugrad institution where you got your degree does pre-med committee letters for medical school applicants. It was a long arduous process but I went through my committee at my ugrad and got around the professor LOR requirement because many schools will accept a committee letter. My pre-med committee did make me get 1 professor LOR but many schools that required 2 accepted the committee letter instead.

Best of luck.