Whoot! Whoot! Whoot! Investors Plan New School In Valdosta Georgia

jkdoctor

5+ Year Member
Apr 29, 2013
893
791
Status
Fellow [Any Field]
Officials offer medical-school insights
Sep 3, 2016

The medical school is a new not-for-profit school looking to establish a campus here in South Georgia. The investors group chose Valdosta-Lowndes County, Georgia, because of several reasons: (click on the link)
***
The investors will establish a College of Osteopathic Medicine that will be accredited by the American Osteopathic Association Commission on Osteopathic College Accreditation. The investors group has an individual on the team that has prior experience in starting and serving as president of a Caribbean medical school, but there will be no affiliation with this school or any other school.

http://www.valdostadailytimes.com/opinion/columns/officials-offer-medical-school-insights/article_12021925-09a8-52f9-a5d0-8542630d32fc.html
 

hallowmann

Lifetime Donor
7+ Year Member
Mar 13, 2012
5,538
5,134
Status
Resident [Any Field]
Officials offer medical-school insights
Sep 3, 2016

The medical school is a new not-for-profit school looking to establish a campus here in South Georgia. The investors group chose Valdosta-Lowndes County, Georgia, because of several reasons: (click on the link)
***
The investors will establish a College of Osteopathic Medicine that will be accredited by the American Osteopathic Association Commission on Osteopathic College Accreditation. The investors group has an individual on the team that has prior experience in starting and serving as president of a Caribbean medical school, but there will be no affiliation with this school or any other school.

http://www.valdostadailytimes.com/opinion/columns/officials-offer-medical-school-insights/article_12021925-09a8-52f9-a5d0-8542630d32fc.html
Haha, I've missed your posts.
 
  • Like
Reactions: jkdoctor

Dr. Death

2+ Year Member
Feb 11, 2015
1,547
2,735
Officials offer medical-school insights
Sep 3, 2016

The medical school is a new not-for-profit school looking to establish a campus here in South Georgia. The investors group chose Valdosta-Lowndes County, Georgia, because of several reasons: (click on the link)
***
The investors will establish a College of Osteopathic Medicine that will be accredited by the American Osteopathic Association Commission on Osteopathic College Accreditation. The investors group has an individual on the team that has prior experience in starting and serving as president of a Caribbean medical school, but there will be no affiliation with this school or any other school.

http://www.valdostadailytimes.com/opinion/columns/officials-offer-medical-school-insights/article_12021925-09a8-52f9-a5d0-8542630d32fc.html
Too many "Whoot!"s you are off your game
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

Osteo Dullahan
7+ Year Member
Nov 10, 2009
16,123
5,373
Status
Medical Student
Honestly though, I do wonder how at this point in time some for-profit companies think that opening up a DO program is a good business endeavor. I mean post-merger it's only going to be a downhill tumble towards standards, requirements, etc being made higher and higher for DO schools. I mean between that, securing a class of students who can actually pass boards ( we're legitimately getting to the point that some bottom tier schools are pulling some real bottom of the barrel students), and then investing into medical infrastructure i.e schools are being required to open GME last time I checked, it seems like you're not going to be making any money and instead risking accreditation issues or potential closers.

That is to say unless COCA decides that irrespective of outcomes a school's accreditation status can be maintained in which case everything is fair game. Guess we will have to see what happens with LUCOM eh?
 

Shotapp

2+ Year Member
Jan 1, 2015
968
1,010
GA
Status
Pre-Medical
This is very interesting because Georgia only has GA-PCOM (a satellite campus to PCOM). If the deal for this new school takes off, what are some issues that need to be addressed so another LUCOM is not created?
 

user3

7+ Year Member
Jul 10, 2010
3,279
1,170
Status
Medical Student
Any word on lucom's comlex pass rate?
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

Osteo Dullahan
7+ Year Member
Nov 10, 2009
16,123
5,373
Status
Medical Student
Any word on lucom's comlex pass rate?
I doubt they'll release it honestly. There's a lot of talk about complications and issues at the school, however so I have no doubt it'll likely be one of the lowest in the nation. However what's more sad is that I doubt COCA will put them on provisional accreditation or look into issues regarding the school even if the pass rate is under an 80%.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Goro

Drrrrrr. Celty

Osteo Dullahan
7+ Year Member
Nov 10, 2009
16,123
5,373
Status
Medical Student
@Drrrrrr. Celty

I know. I am specifically talking about osteopathic schools.
Distinction was important why though? DO schools normally get bottom of the barrel access to rotations to begin with, combine that with having 5 other schools in a state that is largely rural with huge medical disparities and urbanized around Atlanta where most of the hospital have dibs, I don't imagine it being a good set up for the students.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 235009 and Shotapp

NurWollen

Strong with the Force
10+ Year Member
Dec 27, 2007
3,434
2,380
United States
Status
Resident [Any Field]
New theory: COCA members are just huge travel enthusiasts, so the real goal of OKing all these schools is to have a reason to travel to the exotic, rural continental US during site visits.
In that case, I want DO schools in Denali National Park, Alaska, Hawaii, and Puerto Rico. And with the current thaw in relations with Cuba, the latter can open a branch campus in Havana.
 

zero0

everything i hug dies
5+ Year Member
Jul 21, 2014
1,174
2,223
Status
Medical Student
Any word on lucom's comlex pass rate?
So far it's 84% but not everyone has taken it yet. Not bad for an inaugural class. No idea what Celty is talking about, the school is well on track to receiving full accreditation.
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

Osteo Dullahan
7+ Year Member
Nov 10, 2009
16,123
5,373
Status
Medical Student
So far it's 84% but not everyone has taken it yet. Not bad for an inaugural class. No idea what Celty is talking about, the school is well on track to receiving full accreditation.
Source?

Also I've heard they've got enormous amounts of remediation issues, lots of people left the school, and other admin issues. But essentially when the final score comes in they'll likely be under 80% then. Which is frankly terrible on a year when the pass rate is a 95.2%.
 

zero0

everything i hug dies
5+ Year Member
Jul 21, 2014
1,174
2,223
Status
Medical Student
Source?

Also I've heard they've got enormous amounts of remediation issues, lots of people left the school, and other admin issues. But essentially when the final score comes in they'll likely be under 80% then. Which is frankly terrible on a year when the pass rate is a 95.2%.
Yeah, unfortunately I've noticed a lot of misinformation circulating by people who dislike the school for political reasons. Things like the first year attrition being 10% instead of 10 people (out of 160). It's pointless to try and correct it because you can't fight trolls on the internet. It's their natural habitat.

The 84% quoted was straight from the mouth of the current AOA Speaker of the House and our very own Chief of Surgery, Dr. Morrison.
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

Osteo Dullahan
7+ Year Member
Nov 10, 2009
16,123
5,373
Status
Medical Student
Yeah, unfortunately I've noticed a lot of misinformation circulating by people who dislike the school for political reasons. Things like the first year attrition being 10% instead of 10 people (out of 160). It's pointless to try and correct it because you can't fight trolls on the internet. It's their natural habitat.

The 84% quoted was straight from the mouth of the current AOA Speaker of the House and our very own Chief of Surgery, Dr. Morrison.
I guess time will show. I still have my doubts that the school will persist and will likely go the way of Oral.
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

Osteo Dullahan
7+ Year Member
Nov 10, 2009
16,123
5,373
Status
Medical Student
Didn't ORU close because they ran out of money? Or was it quality of education problems too?
I think a combination of issues. In the end running a medical school probably wasn't profitable or didn't line up with extreme conservative values.




Sent from my iPad using SDN mobile
 

Goro

7+ Year Member
Jun 10, 2010
53,604
78,821
Somewhere west of St. Louis
Status
Non-Student
84% is on the par for a new school, but the real question now is how many students are left to take the exam. Most schools have their worst students take COMLEX as late as possible, and it usually doesn't help.

So if LUCOM's pass goes down even more, it wouldn't surprise me in the least.

A 6% attrition rate is not normal, even for a brand new school.


Yeah, unfortunately I've noticed a lot of misinformation circulating by people who dislike the school for political reasons. Things like the first year attrition being 10% instead of 10 people (out of 160). It's pointless to try and correct it because you can't fight trolls on the internet. It's their natural habitat.

The 84% quoted was straight from the mouth of the current AOA Speaker of the House and our very own Chief of Surgery, Dr. Morrison.
 

TheaterOfTheme

5+ Year Member
Mar 2, 2014
659
469
Status
Medical Student
"1. South Georgia Medical Center currently has no existing residency programs."

At least it is recognized that they must develop GME...
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

Osteo Dullahan
7+ Year Member
Nov 10, 2009
16,123
5,373
Status
Medical Student
84% is on the par for a new school, but the real question now is how many students are left to take the exam. Most schools have their worst students take COMLEX as late as possible, and it usually doesn't help.

So if LUCOM's pass goes down even more, it wouldn't surprise me in the least.

A 6% attrition rate is not normal, even for a brand new school.

Right, which is why it'll probably end up being around an 80%. But also mind you that this was a COMLEX exam with a high pass rate of 95.2% students passing.

6% attrition is pretty high. The question is how many ended up having to or took the option to remediate though.
 

Mr Roboto

5+ Year Member
Jul 31, 2013
1,009
1,583
A galaxy far, far away...
Status
Medical Student
Yeah, unfortunately I've noticed a lot of misinformation circulating by people who dislike the school for political reasons. Things like the first year attrition being 10% instead of 10 people (out of 160). It's pointless to try and correct it because you can't fight trolls on the internet. It's their natural habitat.

The 84% quoted was straight from the mouth of the current AOA Speaker of the House and our very own Chief of Surgery, Dr. Morrison.
Umm I'm good friends with quite a few students from LUCOM's first class, and with someone who worked in their admissions office. Multiple sources told me they'd lost 18/162 (as of last year, haven't asked for an update in +6 months), which is an attrition rate of 11%. Get your facts straight before making up claims of discrimination, 'kay?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Goro

Goro

7+ Year Member
Jun 10, 2010
53,604
78,821
Somewhere west of St. Louis
Status
Non-Student
I heard it was 10 repeating the year and one suicide :(. My heart breaks for the parents of the latter. Thus, an attrition rate of ~65.

An 11% rate would be disastrous.

An 80% pass rate would be even more disastrous, even for a brand new school. What's worse is something you don't see behind the curtain. The numbers of students who will have to repeat and then fail again, and eventually never become doctors. I do not know if LUCOM, like my school, has a limit on COMLEX retakes.

This is what you get when your class median MCAT score is 24, your faculty don't know what they're doing, and where doctrine is more important than scholarship. The poor students have to bear the brunt of this, alas.


Umm I'm good friends with quite a few students from LUCOM's first class, and with someone who worked in their admissions office. Multiple sources told me they'd lost 18/162 (as of last year, haven't asked for an update in +6 months), which is an attrition rate of 11%. Get your facts straight before making up claims of discrimination, 'kay?
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

Osteo Dullahan
7+ Year Member
Nov 10, 2009
16,123
5,373
Status
Medical Student
I heard it was 10 repeating the year and one suicide :(. My heart breaks for the parents of the latter. Thus, an attrition rate of ~65.

An 11% rate would be disastrous.

An 80% pass rate would be even more disastrous, even for a brand new school. What's worse is something you don't see behind the curtain. The numbers of students who will have to repeat and then fail again, and eventually never become doctors. I do not know if LUCOM, like my school, has a limit on COMLEX retakes.

This is what you get when your class median MCAT score is 24, your faculty don't know what they're doing, and where doctrine is more important than scholarship. The poor students have to bear the brunt of this, alas.
As a whole this is one of the major complications with DO expansion. Who are the students that are going to be filling in these classes? I'm not going to try to preach about medicine needing to be a prestigious field where only the best can enter. But I don't think filling a half a class up with people who got under 24s on their mcat or lowering the requirements for a background knowledge in biology is conducive to producing a class of students who can as a whole pass the rigors of COMLEX, let alone the USMLE.
 

hallowmann

Lifetime Donor
7+ Year Member
Mar 13, 2012
5,538
5,134
Status
Resident [Any Field]
As a whole this is one of the major complications with DO expansion. Who are the students that are going to be filling in these classes? I'm not going to try to preach about medicine needing to be a prestigious field where only the best can enter. But I don't think filling a half a class up with people who got under 24s on their mcat or lowering the requirements for a background knowledge in biology is conducive to producing a class of students who can as a whole pass the rigors of COMLEX, let alone the USMLE.
This concept gets thrown around a lot, but is there any actual evidence that the pool is less prepared/has less stats with new schools opening? I mean, I get it that new schools have lower averages, but are more people with lower scores actually getting accepted or are just more people that were previously getting into US MD schools (and now they can't) or previously would have gone Carib (the higher performers) now going DO?

Looking at the data (and unfortunately we don't have a ton of it) it actually seems like DO schools are accepting less students with lower MCAT scores. The number of DO matriculants with <20 went down from 48 in 2013 to 40 in 2015, despite a matriculant increase of 6184 (2013) to 6797 (2015). If you move a step up, those with scores from 20-24 actually went down from 1270 (2013) to 1114 (2015). Looking at GPA, the change is a bit more striking, especially at the top (2.8-4.0 range).

I suspect all that the new schools are doing is slowing the rate of increase of mean MCATs among all matriculants, and probably the increase in mean MCAT of the more established schools. Without them, I think DO matriculants would probably average well above 28 for MCAT, and probably a GPA mean above 3.6.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dustbowl12

zero0

everything i hug dies
5+ Year Member
Jul 21, 2014
1,174
2,223
Status
Medical Student
Speak of the devil...
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

Osteo Dullahan
7+ Year Member
Nov 10, 2009
16,123
5,373
Status
Medical Student
This concept gets thrown around a lot, but is there any actual evidence that the pool is less prepared/has less stats with new schools opening? I mean, I get it that new schools have lower averages, but are more people with lower scores actually getting accepted or are just more people that were previously getting into US MD schools (and now they can't) or previously would have gone Carib (the higher performers) now going DO?

Looking at the data (and unfortunately we don't have a ton of it) it actually seems like DO schools are accepting less students with lower MCAT scores. The number of DO matriculants with <20 went down from 48 in 2013 to 40 in 2015, despite a matriculant increase of 6184 (2013) to 6797 (2015). If you move a step up, those with scores from 20-24 actually went down from 1270 (2013) to 1114 (2015). Looking at GPA, the change is a bit more striking, especially at the top (2.8-4.0 range).

I suspect all that the new schools are doing is slowing the rate of increase of mean MCATs among all matriculants, and probably the increase in mean MCAT of the more established schools. Without them, I think DO matriculants would probably average well above 28 for MCAT, and probably a GPA mean above 3.6.
I mean LU has a 24, WCU has a 25, VCOM-CC * AL? are 24 etc. Most new schools are hitting it low. I've said it before, there's a bimodal distribution here, top schools are getting good strong premed applicants, low tier schools less, and the bottom rung is honestly the most distant from the population.

And even if we start shifting Carib students over, their averages aren't high and much inflation is due to Canadian students there.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Goro

hallowmann

Lifetime Donor
7+ Year Member
Mar 13, 2012
5,538
5,134
Status
Resident [Any Field]
I mean LU has a 24, WCU has a 25, VCOM-CC * AL? are 24 etc. Most new schools are hitting it low. I've said it before, there's a bimodal distribution here, top schools are getting good strong premed applicants, low tier schools less, and the bottom rung is honestly the most distant from the population.

And even if we start shifting Carib students over, their averages aren't high and much inflation is due to Canadian students there.
Fair enough. Is it really bimodal though? I have no idea. I guess some are in the 24-25 range and then a lot in the 27-30 range.
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

Osteo Dullahan
7+ Year Member
Nov 10, 2009
16,123
5,373
Status
Medical Student
Fair enough. Is it really bimodal though? I have no idea. I guess some are in the 24-25 range and then a lot in the 27-30 range.
Who knows, it's something I've noticed a while ago. It's probably not truly bimodal, but it's far from gaussian. Which can be expected due to the existence of older schools or those in desirable areas which essentially recruit heavily those students who are either borderline on getting into MD or high for DO and then there are some newer schools which are in rural areas which recruit a different population.
 

KBridg

2+ Year Member
Aug 19, 2015
4
3
Status
Medical Student
I doubt they'll release it honestly. There's a lot of talk about complications and issues at the school, however so I have no doubt it'll likely be one of the lowest in the nation. However what's more sad is that I doubt COCA will put them on provisional accreditation or look into issues regarding the school even if the pass rate is under an 80%.
I'm a third year at LUCOM and just got a 584 on my COMLEX-I (80th percentile). We don't have a class average yet but from my own experience at the school, my board scores, and my classmate's Board scores, I doubt it'll be the lowest in the nation.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DetectiveAlonzo

Drrrrrr. Celty

Osteo Dullahan
7+ Year Member
Nov 10, 2009
16,123
5,373
Status
Medical Student
I'm a third year at LUCOM and just got a 584 on my COMLEX-I (80th percentile). We don't have a class average yet but from my own experience at the school, my board scores, and my classmate's Board scores, I doubt it'll be the lowest in the nation.
I mean it's the lowest passing rate of any school this year. I.e your pass rate is lower 80s, the average was a 95.2. A few schools got close to 100% pass rates on COMLEX.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Goro

KBridg

2+ Year Member
Aug 19, 2015
4
3
Status
Medical Student
I mean it's the lowest passing rate of any school this year. I.e your pass rate is lower 80s, the average was a 95.2. A few schools got close to 100% pass rates on COMLEX.
Oh I think we may have misunderstood each other haha. I meant that my score was in the 80th percentile of students who took the COMLEX nationwide, according to the NBOME. LUCOM has not released a pass rate (that I know of) because many students from my class are still waiting on their scores. For what it's worth, I also took the USMLE and scored 225.
 

samac

2+ Year Member
Dec 11, 2014
1,816
2,435
Status
Medical Student
"The medical school is a new not-for-profit school looking to establish a campus here in South Georgia. The investors group chose Valdosta-Lowndes County, Georgia, because of several reasons:


1. South Georgia Medical Center currently has no existing residency programs.

2. The number of beds meets one of their qualifiers."


... No residency here? Sure lets go. What's another good reason? Well they've got enough beds in the hospital....
GREEN LIGHT THATS ALL YOU NEED. :smack:
 
  • Like
Reactions: Goro and Mr Roboto

Wjldenver

5+ Year Member
Mar 25, 2013
485
778
Denver, Colorado
Status
Non-Student
Officials offer medical-school insights
Sep 3, 2016

The medical school is a new not-for-profit school looking to establish a campus here in South Georgia. The investors group chose Valdosta-Lowndes County, Georgia, because of several reasons: (click on the link)
***
The investors will establish a College of Osteopathic Medicine that will be accredited by the American Osteopathic Association Commission on Osteopathic College Accreditation. The investors group has an individual on the team that has prior experience in starting and serving as president of a Caribbean medical school, but there will be no affiliation with this school or any other school.

http://www.valdostadailytimes.com/opinion/columns/officials-offer-medical-school-insights/article_12021925-09a8-52f9-a5d0-8542630d32fc.html
How do you find the time to keep up with all of these new DO school openings? What is the COCA strategic plan anyway? In my view, the proliferation of the DO degree may eventually dilute it's value (more) vis a' vis the MD degree. There may be a tipping point where the DO degree will become like a Pharm.D. or a glorified nurse practitioner degree. Top students will strive harder to get into MD programs or will pursue other career tracks all together. Maybe the COCA wants to increase the job opportunities for DO School professors. That will certainly happen... At least Goro will have a lot of opportunities career wise. I'm sure the COCA is looking to maximize the value of the DO degree but I do not have any insight in regard to that specific plan.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Goro

Roxas

Giggity!
Gold Donor
7+ Year Member
Jul 5, 2012
11,647
22,546
Twilight Town
Status
Resident [Any Field]
This is disconcerting
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

Osteo Dullahan
7+ Year Member
Nov 10, 2009
16,123
5,373
Status
Medical Student
How do you find the time to keep up with all of these new DO school openings? What is the COCA strategic plan anyway? In my view, the proliferation of the DO degree may eventually dilute it's value (more) vis a' vis the MD degree. There may be a tipping point where the DO degree will become like a Pharm.D. or a glorified nurse practitioner degree. Top students will strive harder to get into MD programs or will pursue other career tracks all together. Maybe the COCA wants to increase the job opportunities for DO School professors. That will certainly happen... At least Goro will have a lot of opportunities career wise. I'm sure the COCA is looking to maximize the value of the DO degree but I do not have any insight in regard to that specific plan.
I think that they've got both the AOA getting on their case to put out as many DOs as possible before another push occurs by the MD side and they want to believe that percentages will carry them through.
Honestly I think the most likely case is more simply they want to appear like a good investment, rejecting a school by a good investor may end up turning people off and ending DO expansion. Who knows.

I'm personally waiting for established schools to put their foots down.
 

muscarinic

2+ Year Member
Sep 8, 2016
11
4
Status
Medical Student
So far it's 84% but not everyone has taken it yet. Not bad for an inaugural class. No idea what Celty is talking about, the school is well on track to receiving full accreditation.
+1 I know a lot of students who go here and Ive to say the same thing. People bash LUCOM without knowing the facts. I had interviewed here and the facilities are awesome. The professors are very down to earth and some of them have years of experience serving at MD schools.

I'm a third year at LUCOM and just got a 584 on my COMLEX-I (80th percentile). We don't have a class average yet but from my own experience at the school, my board scores, and my classmate's Board scores, I doubt it'll be the lowest in the nation.
.... I also took the USMLE and scored 225.
Congratulations!
 

Mr Roboto

5+ Year Member
Jul 31, 2013
1,009
1,583
A galaxy far, far away...
Status
Medical Student
+1 I know a lot of students who go here and Ive to say the same thing. People bash LUCOM without knowing the facts. I had interviewed here and the facilities are awesome. The professors are very down to earth and some of them have years of experience serving at MD schools.

Congratulations!
"The facilities are awesome" doesn't mean a med school is any good.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Drrrrrr. Celty

muscarinic

2+ Year Member
Sep 8, 2016
11
4
Status
Medical Student
"The facilities are awesome" doesn't mean a med school is any good.
There we go again.
I know awesome facilities alone does not define a good medical school; ultimately the students have to work their bums off whether in lucom or pcom. I was just giving a general idea about the school and of course you can wait for a few more weeks to get an idea about their average comlex scores.
 

Mr Roboto

5+ Year Member
Jul 31, 2013
1,009
1,583
A galaxy far, far away...
Status
Medical Student
There we go again.
I know awesome facilities alone does not define a good medical school; ultimately the students have to work their bums off whether in lucom or pcom. I was just giving a general idea about the school and of course you can wait for a few more weeks to get an idea about their average comlex scores.
The facilities being "awesome" (they aren't) isn't a general idea about the school.
 

Drrrrrr. Celty

Osteo Dullahan
7+ Year Member
Nov 10, 2009
16,123
5,373
Status
Medical Student
The facilities being "awesome" (they aren't) isn't a general idea about the school.
Idk about you, but I'd take being taught in a broom closet for 2 years if it meant good 3rd and 4th year rotations.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mr Roboto

scpod

Moderator Emeritus
10+ Year Member
Oct 13, 2005
3,241
124
Status
Attending Physician
Idk about you, but I'd take being taught in a broom closet for 2 years if it meant good 3rd and 4th year rotations.
Keep mind that not too long ago all a medical school needed was a big lecture room with chairs and a blackboard in front. A second room held metal tables where cadavers would slowly be stripped of layers of skin, muscle, bone, etc. A third room had tables where you could use your microscope to look at slides and a light board at the end for x-rays. The last room had shelves with books on them... lots of books and places for you to read them. A lot of excellent physicians came out of that. Sure, the bells and whistles are nice to look at, but they don't matter in the least.
 

hallowmann

Lifetime Donor
7+ Year Member
Mar 13, 2012
5,538
5,134
Status
Resident [Any Field]
Keep mind that not too long ago all a medical school needed was a big lecture room with chairs and a blackboard in front. A second room held metal tables where cadavers would slowly be stripped of layers of skin, muscle, bone, etc. A third room had tables where you could use your microscope to look at slides and a light board at the end for x-rays. The last room had shelves with books on them... lots of books and places for you to read them. A lot of excellent physicians came out of that. Sure, the bells and whistles are nice to look at, but they don't matter in the least.
Have you read through the original Flexner report? Its amazing reading his descriptions of all the schools. So much has changed, but those bare essentials haven't. I also find his perspective hilarious because he includes so much commentary. Any way, back to work.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DoctorDingo