Why do people keep reapplying instead of going to the Caribbean?

doctaroo

New Member
10+ Year Member
Jul 14, 2006
119
3
Status
Medical Student
Hey everyone,

I consistently see people applying year after year and avoid going to the Caribbean, but if you end up with the same job in the end, what's the point of waiting?

Yes, I realize some of you are interested in competitive residencies, and I totally understand in these cases it is important where you go to school.

The cost of tuition in US vs Caribbean is very similar and waiting a year is equivalent to at least 150K in a doctor's life anyways. So, you are losing money every year you wait.
 

Timmythemic22

Beep Beep Ribby Ribby
10+ Year Member
Dec 28, 2004
1,209
24
37
NJ
Status
In before the chaos...
 

175961

Guest
10+ Year Member
Nov 15, 2007
2,787
1
The Shadow Gallery
Status
Pre-Medical
Hey everyone,

I consistently see people applying year after year and avoid going to the Caribbean, but if you end up with the same job in the end, what's the point of waiting?

Yes, I realize some of you are interested in competitive residencies, and I totally understand in these cases it is important where you go to school.

The cost of tuition in US vs Caribbean is very similar and waiting a year is equivalent to at least 150K in a doctor's life anyways. So, you are losing money every year you wait.
You sort of answered your own question there, bub.
 

nu2004

10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
Mar 7, 2008
861
4
Los Angecagoveland
Status
Medical Student
people have enough legitimate risk of illness here, why compound it by going to an environment in which there are foreign diseases and where running water and electricity are not always guaranteed?

furthermore, i'm sure there are plenty of people who will stand up and say "rah rah we get the same education in the Caribbean," but i don't believe it, and i don't have a lot of faith in for-profit educational institutions.
 

LindsayRein1

: )
10+ Year Member
Feb 15, 2008
63
2
Status
Pre-Medical
In before the chaos...

That was a rather useless comment


OP: People choose to reapply to US MD school for various reasons. Many people may not want to relocate outside of the United States, as they have strong connections to family/friends/ or loved ones here. Others may be interested in research, and while that is available abroad, it is not in the same magnitude or prestige. And... well, speaking of prestige: Many people will not go to the carib. because they believe no matter what, in the end, a US school is better. Several people are also concerned about residency matching, and the quality of education abroad. I have to agree with you though, if you can't get in after three tries in the US, it might be time to look at other options. But in the end... everyone has to do what makes them happy!
 

Timmythemic22

Beep Beep Ribby Ribby
10+ Year Member
Dec 28, 2004
1,209
24
37
NJ
Status
That was a rather useless comment


OP: People choose to reapply to US MD school for various reasons. Many people may not want to relocate outside of the United States, as they have strong connections to family/friends/ or loved ones here. Others may be interested in research, and while that is available abroad, it is not in the same magnitude or prestige. And... well, speaking of prestige: Many people will not go to the carib. because they believe no matter what, in the end, a US school is better. Several people are also concerned about residency matching, and the quality of education abroad. I have to agree with you though, if you can't get in after three tries in the US, it might be time to look at other options. But in the end... everyone has to do what makes them happy!
Good job with the hard work there, sweetheart. Now considering this isn't a blatant attempt at trolling, the OP could have just as easily used the search function provided by our well-meaning admins to find the desired information. But your precious diatribe has enlightened us all, especially ending with such a trite sentiment.

Or I could just say "tl: dr"
 

Law2Doc

5K+ Member
Moderator Emeritus
10+ Year Member
Dec 20, 2004
30,981
9,887
Status
Attending Physician
Hey everyone,

I consistently see people applying year after year and avoid going to the Caribbean, but if you end up with the same job in the end, what's the point of waiting?

Yes, I realize some of you are interested in competitive residencies, and I totally understand in these cases it is important where you go to school.

The cost of tuition in US vs Caribbean is very similar and waiting a year is equivalent to at least 150K in a doctor's life anyways. So, you are losing money every year you wait.
The surest path to a US residency is attending med school in the US. In the 2008 match there were 28,737 applicants for 20,940 slots. In the match, 94% of the US allo med students matched or 14,359 of 15,242. So it should be easy to see that there aren't as many US slots left for non-US applicants as there are non-US applicants. Not to mention that the attrition at US schools is pretty negligible, less than 5%, while it can be quite high at some of the offshore schools. So in the caribbean, you have less likelihood to make it to your senior year, and those who do, have a lower percentage likelihood to match. Pretty obvious to see why people do what they can to get into the US schools, even if it takes an extra year or two.
 

Character

10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
Apr 24, 2008
2,467
1
Status
Other Health Professions Student
The surest path to a US residency is attending med school in the US. In the 2008 match there were 28,737 applicants for 20,940 slots. In the match, 94% of the US allo med students matched or 14,359 of 15,242. So it should be easy to see that there aren't as many US slots left for non-US applicants as there are non-US applicants. Not to mention that the attrition at US schools is pretty negligible, less than 5%, while it can be quite high at some of the offshore schools. So in the caribbean, you have less likelihood to make it to your senior year, and those who do, have a lower percentage likelihood to match. Pretty obvious to see why people do what they can to get into the US schools, even if it takes an extra year or two.
well, im assuming that the op was talking about carribbean schools, such as the big 3...sgu,auc and ross....these kids match very high into us residency spots, mostly in the northeast though bc that is where the 3rd and 4th years rotate. but taking all other non us schools into account, the percentages will be alot lower
 

LindsayRein1

: )
10+ Year Member
Feb 15, 2008
63
2
Status
Pre-Medical
The surest path to a US residency is attending med school in the US. In the 2008 match there were 28,737 applicants for 20,940 slots. In the match, 94% of the US allo med students matched or 14,359 of 15,242. So it should be easy to see that there aren't as many US slots left for non-US applicants as there are non-US applicants. Not to mention that the attrition at US schools is pretty negligible, less than 5%, while it can be quite high at some of the offshore schools. So in the caribbean, you have less likelihood to make it to your senior year, and those who do, have a lower percentage likelihood to match. Pretty obvious to see why people do what they can to get into the US schools, even if it takes an extra year or two.
:thumbup:
 

LindsayRein1

: )
10+ Year Member
Feb 15, 2008
63
2
Status
Pre-Medical
Good job with the hard work there, sweetheart. Now considering this isn't a blatant attempt at trolling, the OP could have just as easily used the search function provided by our well-meaning admins to find the desired information. But your precious diatribe has enlightened us all, especially ending with such a trite sentiment.

Or I could just say "tl: dr"

No need to be angry or bitter. It's just an online forum for resourceful information : )
 

Law2Doc

5K+ Member
Moderator Emeritus
10+ Year Member
Dec 20, 2004
30,981
9,887
Status
Attending Physician
well, im assuming that the op was talking about carribbean schools, such as the big 3...sgu,auc and ross....these kids match very high into us residency spots, mostly in the northeast though bc that is where the 3rd and 4th years rotate. but taking all other non us schools into account, the percentages will be alot lower
Those schools do better than their peers, but still poorly compared to US counterparts. And they all have higher attrition than US schools.
 

Terpskins99

Fear... The Stig
10+ Year Member
Mar 8, 2005
3,435
7
Status
Resident [Any Field]
well, im assuming that the op was talking about carribbean schools, such as the big 3...sgu,auc and ross....these kids match very high into us residency spots, mostly in the northeast though bc that is where the 3rd and 4th years rotate. but taking all other non us schools into account, the percentages will be alot lower
Heading to the caribbean is fine, so long as you understand what is ahead of you.

If you are a caribbean med student and plan to return to the states, most residencies will expect you to perform better than the average US medical student on national boards (otherwise, why would they consider you over another american grad?). This is a lot harder than it sounds since EVERYONE studies hard for boards.

On the flip side, if you're comfortable going into a non-competitive specialty (eg peds, medicine, psych), I think the caribbean route is ok.
 

Isoprop

Fascinating, tell me more
10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
Oct 15, 2007
4,197
34
Status
Medical Student
On the flip side, if you're comfortable going into a non-competitive specialty (eg peds, medicine, psych), I think the caribbean route is ok.
also keep in mind that there are competitive residency programs in non-competitive fields. this is an important factor for people considering subspecializing in a competitive field.
 

Terpskins99

Fear... The Stig
10+ Year Member
Mar 8, 2005
3,435
7
Status
Resident [Any Field]
also keep in mind that there are competitive residency programs in non-competitive fields. this is an important factor for people considering subspecializing in a competitive field.
Absolutely true. And it is one of the reasons why statistics can be a little misleading with regard to average board scores of various specialties.

I met this one guy that matched Internal Medicine (a residency whose combined Step 1 average is roughly the same as the national average). But he didn't match just anywhere, he matched at Johns Hopkins and his board score was through the roof (two standard deviations above the national average).
 

dilzmega

10+ Year Member
Feb 22, 2008
34
0
Status
Pre-Medical
During UG I played football and our Ortho specialist was from a Carib school AUC to be exact and I thought ortho is pretty competitive since he is pretty successful with a partnership in a practice. If 14,500 out of 15,500 match from the US then that leaves about a good 9,000 spots open for USIMG's and FMG's to match in. I've been researching some of the carib school and the top four (SGU AUC ROSS some include SABA) have pretty high match rates. If you goto some of their web sites you can see that they match into some pretty competitive fields. or you could goto valuemd.com and view some of the threads where people are reporting their match. So the Carib is not that bad if you do the research and pic the right school. Also the carib could be somewhat cheaper.
 

BigRedPremed

Senior Member
10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
Jul 20, 2005
1,437
2
Status
Pre-Medical
During UG I played football and our Ortho specialist was from a Carib school AUC to be exact and I thought ortho is pretty competitive since he is pretty successful with a partnership in a practice. If 14,500 out of 15,500 match from the US then that leaves about a good 9,000 spots open for USIMG's and FMG's to match in. I've been researching some of the carib school and the top four (SGU AUC ROSS some include SABA) have pretty high match rates. If you goto some of their web sites you can see that they match into some pretty competitive fields. or you could goto valuemd.com and view some of the threads where people are reporting their match. So the Carib is not that bad if you do the research and pic the right school. Also the carib could be somewhat cheaper.

The numbers don't lie. US allopathic med students pass the USMLE's at a roughly 94% rate and match at nearly the same rate. Foreign medical students pass at a much lower rate (~60% or so) and of the ones who do pass, only 50% match anywhere. What those Carib numbers don't show you is the huge attrition rate even before the residency match.
 

8744

Guest
15+ Year Member
Dec 7, 2001
9,322
170
Status
Non-Student
Hey everyone,

...I consistently see people applying year after year and avoid going to the Caribbean, but if you end up with the same job in the end, what's the point of waiting?
Because most people don't want to live in a third-world **** hole for two years. That's why I'd never go to medical school in Canada, by the way.

Not to mention that if you go to the Caribbean, you will be something of a nomad when it comes to rotations as you may not be able to do them all in the same hospital or even the same city or state.

US medical school: Move once.

Caribbean: Move to a foreign country for two years, move back to the states, and then move two or three times before graduation.
 

Depakote

Pediatric Anesthesiologist
Moderator Emeritus
Lifetime Donor
10+ Year Member
Nov 2, 2004
20,811
102
SOCMOB
Status
Attending Physician
Yes, you can succeed in the carib, but will you? As mentioned above, you face significant attrition rates and the USMLE.

Medical school is not easy, do you want to be somewhere where you will be helped along the way or somewhere that will just assume you're part of the chunk that won't make it and take your money for the opportunity to try if you start to struggle.

Everyone knows someone or has heard of someone that matched into some outrageous field coming out of the carib. Of course it's possible. These people most likely were top of their class and rocked the boards. Do you want to rock the boards and be in the top of your med school class? Of course. I want to do it to. But it isn't something everyone is capable of.

Don't limit your later options by heading down what seems to be the easier path.
 

dilzmega

10+ Year Member
Feb 22, 2008
34
0
Status
Pre-Medical
Because most people don't want to live in a third-world **** hole for two years. That's why I'd never go to medical school in Canada, by the way.

Not to mention that if you go to the Caribbean, you will be something of a nomad when it comes to rotations as you may not be able to do them all in the same hospital or even the same city or state.

US medical school: Move once.

Caribbean: Move to a foreign country for two years, move back to the states, and then move two or three times before graduation.
In the carib in the top 4 schools your core rotations are at one hospital and when you finish your cores you have the choice of doing electives in the same area or at hospitals you might want to put on your match list. just like in some if not all US schools that let you visit diffrent hospital during your fourth year.

Everyone knows someone or has heard of someone that matched into some outrageous field coming out of the carib. Of course it's possible. These people most likely were top of their class and rocked the boards. Do you want to rock the boards and be in the top of your med school class? Of course. I want to do it to. But it isn't something everyone is capable of.

Don't limit your later options by heading down what seems to be the easier path.
I agree with you totally but the carib is a total last resort as some people even apply to some European Schools as well before the carib. Anything other than US would be last resort because if applied to carib for Jan and got accepted to US for the following fall I would wait then go US no question. Their are some people in the carib who never tried US and just went to the carib just cause they wanted to(don't know why) but I am going to wait my options out. The carib is also a place where a lot of non-trads go as well when they are in the early to mid 30's. so their is a lot of reasons why people go carib.
 

diosa428

SDN Angel
10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
Feb 24, 2005
2,662
9
Status
If you go to the carib, and you want to match into a residency in the US, you have to be amazing, every step of the way. If you go to school in the US, you just have to be average. All things considered equal, a residency program will choose the US grad over the carib grad, so if you go carib, you have to be better than the US grads to be equally as competitive. It's not that you can't do it, it's how much extra work you're going to have to do to get there. I would say that if you're a decent applicant and didn't get in b/c of one bad MCAT score, or b/c you're lacking something that can be fixed in a year, then it's worth fixing it and reapplying to US schools. If you didn't get in b/c your entire application is below par and it would take several years and thousands of dollars in education to fix, then it might make sense to consider carib. However, if you're already at the bottom of the pile in terms of ability, going to a school that's going to take your money and then weed you out might not be the best place for you, and you need to be willing to work your a** off for 4 years.
 

kronickm

even par.
10+ Year Member
Feb 20, 2007
1,643
2
Status
Medical Student
Because most people don't want to live in a third-world **** hole for two years. That's why I'd never go to medical school in Canada, by the way.
enough said. :laugh: at canada.