Why does UMICH's residency reputation not agree with their top 3 match rate?

[Bodybuilder]

I apologize to those of you who hate USNEWS rankings, but UMICH has one of the highest rankings for residencey director reputations(around 6), but it is about 40th in top 3 residency match rate category.

Why is there such a huge descrepancy? Are Michigan students just on average applying to more competitive residencies or is the residency reputation rank misleading.

I would love to hear your opinions.

Best regards.

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[MedApp2003]

in my opinion, i think the answer is a little of both.

first, i think that the rating by the residency directors really doesn't mean that much.

second, i think that the rating of how many students get their top three picks doens't mean that much. it definitely matters WHAT they are choosing as their picks.

so when i evaluate how a proram does in residency matching, i just look at the list. if students are getting great residencies, then the school does well. for example, i think that michigan's placement is fine, but nothing unbelieveable. and some schools have surprisingly amazing residency placements (like Yale -- their match list is incredible).

so just look at the list. i wouldn't bother with either the residency director's rating or the % getting top picks number.

 

[Bodybuilder]

Originally posted by MedApp2003
in my opinion, i think the answer is a little of both.

first, i think that the rating by the residency directors really doesn't mean that much.

second, i think that the rating of how many students get their top three picks doens't mean that much. it definitely matters WHAT they are choosing as their picks.

so when i evaluate how a proram does in residency matching, i just look at the list. if students are getting great residencies, then the school does well. for example, i think that michigan's placement is fine, but nothing unbelieveable. and some schools have surprisingly amazing residency placements (like Yale -- their match list is incredible).

so just look at the list. i wouldn't bother with either the residency director's rating or the % getting top picks number.

Thanks for the input.

 

[atsai3]

I would have to agree with the previous poster. The "percentage of students getting one of their top 3 residency choices" isn't a terribly helpful statistic. It's important to realize that it incorporates two probabilities: 1) the probability that a student applies to these programs, and 2) the probability that the student is accepted by these programs. So the "percentage of students getting one of their top 3 residency choices" isn't strictly a measure of quality.

For example, this statistic also incorporates the quality of the medical school's career advising. For example, career advisers may be able to accurately gauge a medical student's competitiveness and steer him/her towards ranking only those programs at which s/he has a reasonable chance of getting in. Even if the medical school produces poor quality medical students, because the career advisers are able to accurately match the students' expectations with that of potential residency training programs, the "percentage of students getting one of their top 3 residency choices" would be greater.

-AT.

 

[laviddee]

Look at the match list michigan has for 2002.
It's pretty impressive!!!
Who cares about those numbers.. michigan grads try to go for the best residencies in a whole variety of fields!

So what if I'm biased and I'll be going there!
haha.

check out the match list here..
http://www.medicineatmichigan.org/magazine/2002/summer/match/match.asp

 

[geromine]

Hmmm...
At the interview the speaker said that Michigan has a 96% top three choices residency matches.

 

[atsai3]

No. "Ninety-six percent of U-M Medical School students who participated in the National Resident Matching Program were successfully matched with one of their choices for specialty at a specific institution, higher than the national match rate of just over 94 percent."

See: http://www.medicineatmichigan.org/magazine/2002/summer/match/default.asp

Cheers
-AT.

 

[gotgirth]

Originally posted by geromine
Hmmm...
At the interview the speaker said that Michigan has a 96% top three choices residency matches.

Although I don't put a *lot* of credit into the stat itself, I also remember hearing this on interview day. Perhaps everyone that was accepted to a residency was accepted into one of their top 3 choices?

 

[mws99]

I remember hearing that stat as well, but I don't think it is true. Also, how do they figure they are ranked third by residency directors? If I look at US News, they look tied for fifth to me.

 

[marakah2]

I have a question...

When you look at a school's match list how do you know which residencies are the "great" ones. I have no concept of what residency ratings are, any help???

 

[Bodybuilder]

Originally posted by geromine
Hmmm...
At the interview the speaker said that Michigan has a 96% top three choices residency matches.

Why does USNEWS list their top three match rate at 76.8%?

That is a pretty huge descrepancy - 20%.

Now, does this 20% difference mean that 20% of the class did not participate in residency match as atsai3 implied or the more ominous meaning of 20% not being accepted to one of their top 3 choices?

 

[kreno]

Umich is ranked third for residency directors...they're just fifth on the list. You see, they tied for third place with some other school (too lazy to go look) and another school tied for second. So it's kinda stupid... it's like what's the point of having a "third" place if two schools are both third?

 

[bluegill]

When you look at schools' match lists, keep this very important point in mind...

Matching to Internal Medicine does not necessarily indicate a "bad" or even "neutral" match. Often, a top medical student decides he or she wishes to go into a medical (ie, non-surgical) specialty such as Cardiology or GI. In order to get there, he or she must first complete residency training in Internal Medicine.

And you will find out in med school that many - probably MOST - of the brightest and best docs in your hospital started their training with Internal Medicine.

So, when pre-meds are sizing up match lists they shouldn't just look for Ortho, Derm, etc to decide whether a list is "amazing." Look more deeply at those Internal Med matches. Are they heading to Mass General and Hopkins for Internal Med? If so, you can bet those students are on their way to awesome careers.

The docs who truly dictate the direction of health care in the U.S. are not going to be dermatologists who pull up to their suburban office at 9 AM and leave at 4 PM. Those of us who are busting our butts to LEARN medicine (not just succeed on multiple choice tests) and are heading into Internal Med will be shaping the future.

 

[chef]

*percentage of students getting one of their top 3 residency choices*

This # is very misleading b/c this list is made after all the interviews.. so if u apply to 40 programs and get 6 interviews, u fill out your list among the 6 schools - and those 6 may be ones that were on the bottom of your preference list initially.


That 2002 match list is truly FANTASTIC.. pay attention to plastic surgery(integrated PS has 60 spots nationwide/yr: michigan sent 4), derm, rad onc, urology, IM(U of M IM is #5 in the country, and the new Dean Dr.Lippman will most likely put it higher), ophthy(12 matches!!)

Derm is most competitive specialty in the nation right now. For comparison, Hopkins (which I consider the best medical school in the US IMHO) sent 3 to derm last yr, NYU, U Cinninati, and SUNY.

 

[bluegill]

Originally posted by chef
"IM(U of M IM is #5 in the country, and the new Dean Dr.Lippman will most likely put it higher."



Just FYI, Marc Lippman is the new CHAIR of Internal Medicine. He is not a Dean. He will, as you stated, likely inspire new levels of achievement here at U-M, particularly in moving the latest bench research to clinical application as quickly as possible.

The Dean of the U-M Medical School, Allen Lichter, is himself a visionary who will lead U-M towards the top of the list of the very best medical centers in the world.

 

[chef]

Originally posted by bluegill

Just FYI, Marc Lippman is the new CHAIR of Internal Medicine. He is not a Dean. He will, as you stated, likely inspire new levels of achievement here at U-M, particularly in moving the latest bench research to clinical application as quickly as possible.

The Dean of the U-M Medical School, Allen Lichter, is himself a visionary who will lead U-M towards the top of the list of the very best medical centers in the world. [/B]

hehe.. yeah thanks for clarifying that bluegill.. i meant to say that dr.lippman is the new chair of IM but i guess @ 3AM last nite i was a bit out of it.. lol

i also agree that Dr.Lichter is a superb interim Dean and I'd add that he is quite dedicated into putting UMMS into top5 on us news rankings!!