Why is Verbal so hard for so many

[medic170]

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Ok, now, I do NOT mean this to be condescending. I just wondered why verbal seems to be such a pain to so many people. Personally, I always had trouble with physics and gen chem because of the math and formula memorizing and such. Verbal was my best section when I took the mcat, got a 12. I was just curious what it is that give so many people a hard time? What exactly is this thing measuring. Now, I was not a science major, and maybe that had something to do with it. Anyway, just curious, and maybe this thread will help people see why this section troubles so many people.

 

[blz]

Ok, now, I do NOT mean this to be condescending. I just wondered why verbal seems to be such a pain to so many people. Personally, I always had trouble with physics and gen chem because of the math and formula memorizing and such. Verbal was my best section when I took the mcat, got a 12. I was just curious what it is that give so many people a hard time? What exactly is this thing measuring. Now, I was not a science major, and maybe that had something to do with it. Anyway, just curious, and maybe this thread will help people see why this section troubles so many people.

Why do you find physics and gen chem troubling? I find them so freaking easy....what's wrong with you?

Go ask your best friend why she's fat....I mean..just stop eating right?

Some people just have faster metabolisms than others.

 

[Shades McCool]

Why do you find physics and gen chem troubling? I find them so freaking easy....what's wrong with you?

Go ask your best friend why she's fat....I mean..just stop eating right?

Some people just have faster metabolisms than others.

How's that taste? Hmmm bitter??

 

[flighterdoc]

Ok, now, I do NOT mean this to be condescending. I just wondered why verbal seems to be such a pain to so many people. Personally, I always had trouble with physics and gen chem because of the math and formula memorizing and such. Verbal was my best section when I took the mcat, got a 12. I was just curious what it is that give so many people a hard time? What exactly is this thing measuring. Now, I was not a science major, and maybe that had something to do with it. Anyway, just curious, and maybe this thread will help people see why this section troubles so many people.

For me (v11), I found the passages painfully dull and boring, nothing I'd read for any reason other than the damned MCAT. I'd tear up a technical piece, but don't give a crap about philosophy or art history or the g-d theater.

 

[Pinkertinkle]

It's cuz we're a buncha stupid immigrants.

 

[dhoonlee]

.

 

[Medikit]

Verbal was my lowest and I was getting 8s and 9s on the practice. I think it's because I read at an average speed which leaves me just enough time to do the questions without being able to go back. I analyze the questions in depth and usually find all the answers to a be a bit wrong, or two answers to be kind of right and I have difficulty choosing between the two. I haven't done much reading other than textbooks, or writing other than a few classes here and there for which I didn't really try that hard.

My advisor told me that people from my school do very poorly on this section, two of my friends got 6s last August. One got a 9 and a 10 in the other sections, the other got a 12 and an 11.

 

[PhysicsDoc]

For me (v11), I found the passages painfully dull and boring, nothing I'd read for any reason other than the damned MCAT. I'd tear up a technical piece, but don't give a crap about philosophy or art history or the g-d theater.

No kidding... if the passage involves ANYTHING from the sciences I won't miss a single question, whereas I'll miss 2-3 if it's on art just because my attention wavers every five seconds or so...

 

[stoleyerscrubz]

I'm a former engineering major so physics and chemistry do not seem hard for me and physics without calculus just seems like a joke. Since the 12th grade i hated verbal standardized testing. I would argue with my teacher "how am i supposed to know what the author is thinking? Did the person who wrote this test ask the author?" I guess I'm not that comfortable 'guessing' what someone means. So I'm learning to get over it.

 

[Medikit]

Since the 12th grade i hated verbal standardized testing. I would argue with my teacher "how am i supposed to know what the author is thinking? Did the person who wrote this test ask the author?" I guess I'm not that comfortable 'guessing' what someone means. So I'm learning to get over it.

That's exactly how I felt, even moreso for the Kaplan verbal tests. I'm inclined to think that there is in fact something we're missing given that there are a number of people out there who regularly own this section.

 

[UCLAstudent]

My problem with verbal: I'm a perfectionist. When I am reading a passage, I want to remember and understand every tiny detail, and that gets in the way of seeing the "bigger picture." Being a biology major does not help my problem; whenever I'm reading something for biology, it's always with the mindset that I need to remember even the most detailed stuff because that's what is going to be asked by the professor on an exam. I came out of the MCAT with a 10 on verbal, but it could have easily been an 8 or 9, based on my practice exams.

 

[medic170]

Since you gave me such an aggressive response, I feel compelled to answer you with equal aggression my friend.

Why do you find physics and gen chem troubling?

Well, I said in the original post:

I always had trouble with physics and gen chem because of the math and formula memorizing and such.

So, I got to thinking, perhaps you got so defensive when I asked about people having trouble with verbal because you, yourself, have trouble with verbal comprehension, as evidenced by the fact that you asked a question in your response that was clearly already answered in the original post. Why ask a question which I have already answered?

I find them so freaking easy....what's wrong with you?

I never said, or even implied, that something is "wrong" with anybody. I even clarified that at the beginning of my post, when I specifically said I did not mean the question in a condescending way. I thought I was asking a valid question. I guess something I said sure struck a nerve with you, why?

What is wrong with me? I don't think anything is. You are probably just smarter, more educated, or both in the physcial sciences than I am. I am glad they come easy for you. I am not the smartest guy out there, plus I am not a science major. 👍

Go ask your best friend why she's fat....I mean..just stop eating right?
Some people just have faster metabolisms than others.

Although my best friend is not fat, I'll take a shot at this one anyway. She would indeed lose weight if she would stop eating, regardless of the speed on her metabolism. So, what is your point with this example?


Now, before you get all upset and angry, I am just having some fum with you. I am just kidding around and I am sure your intelligence is above average, so please do not get upset. I am screwing around. 😛 😍

About my post, it is well documented that Verbal is the section most people find the most difficult. I was just curious to find out what it is that gives people trouble. Who knows, maybe by exploring it, perhaps somebody could help out 🙂

 

[HawkeyeBFP]

Disclaimer: absolutely no condescension is intended or implied.

Further disclaimer: I'm one of those who "owned" the Verbal section.

Even further disclaimer: I teach the MCAT, so this is at least partly based on experience.

From all I've seen, people do poorly on the Verbal section because they suddenly start treating it differently than all the other sections. They start thinking they have to read in-depth, they spend too much time on the passage and panic when they haven't got enough time for the questions, and they over-analyze the questions.

I always tell my students that the only things you need to know after reading a passage--any passage, biology or physics or verbal or orgo--is generally what the passage is about, why the author wanted to write it, and where the key ideas or concepts are to be found. Anything else is a waste of time. (The course I teach for has specific terms for these tasks and I'm sure all the others do as well.)

For Verbal particularly, the way people trip themselves up is by talking themselves into answers that aren't really being asked for, or by falling for answers that use phrases from the passage to say something that the passage clearly isn't implying. (If the passage is about murder mysteries and says Agatha Christie is the greatest mystery writer ever, an answer that includes a choice like "Murder on the Orient Express is flawed novel" is not right, unless the question is what would the author NOT agree with.) pre-meds don't usually fall for this on science passages (they won't agree with a statement that gravity is a repulsive force), but for some reason they change mental gears with Verbal and talk themselves out of right answers.

It's a 100% open-book test where the Verbal is concerned. There's no reason to do worse on this section than any other. In fact, the reason the curve is so tight is that overall people do BETTER on Verbal in terms of absolute numbers of right and wrong answers.

The thing that does bother me a little is that students often say "well, I don't care about these subjects". I'm a non-trad with an arts background, and it makes me sad that anyone would want to cut whole big sections of human endeavor out of their life. (That said, yes, some of those philosophy and history sections are pretty d@mn dull. 😴 😴 )

😀

 

[medic170]

My problem with verbal: I'm a perfectionist. When I am reading a passage, I want to remember and understand every tiny detail, and that gets in the way of seeing the "bigger picture." Being a biology major does not help my problem; whenever I'm reading something for biology, it's always with the mindset that I need to remember even the most detailed stuff because that's what is going to be asked by the professor on an exam. I came out of the MCAT with a 10 on verbal, but it could have easily been an 8 or 9, based on my practice exams.

That's an intersting anaylsis.

 

[medic170]

I'm a former engineering major so physics and chemistry do not seem hard for me and physics without calculus just seems like a joke. Since the 12th grade i hated verbal standardized testing. I would argue with my teacher "how am i supposed to know what the author is thinking? Did the person who wrote this test ask the author?" I guess I'm not that comfortable 'guessing' what someone means. So I'm learning to get over it.

that's intersting too. Thanks for the replies. I never thought about it like that, but it makes sense.

 

[blz]

Since you gave me such an aggressive response, I feel compelled to answer you with equal aggression my friend.


Well, I said in the original post: So, I got to thinking, perhaps you got so defensive when I asked about people having trouble with verbal because you, yourself, have trouble with verbal comprehension, as evidenced by the fact that you asked a question in your response that was clearly already answered in the original post. Why ask a question which I have already answered?





I never said, or even implied, that something is "wrong" with anybody. I even clarified that at the beginning of my post, when I specifically said I did not mean the question in a condescending way. I thought I was asking a valid question. I guess something I said sure struck a nerve with you, why?

What is wrong with me? I don't think anything is. You are probably just smarter, more educated, or both in the physcial sciences than I am. I am glad they come easy for you. I am not the smartest guy out there, plus I am not a science major. 👍




Although my best friend is not fat, I'll take a shot at this one anyway. She would indeed lose weight if she would stop eating, regardless of the speed on her metabolism. So, what is your point with this example?


Now, before you get all upset and angry, I am just having some fum with you. I am just kidding around and I am sure your intelligence is above average, so please do not get upset. I am screwing around. 😛 😍

About my post, it is well documented that Verbal is the section most people find the most difficult. I was just curious to find out what it is that gives people trouble. Who knows, maybe by exploring it, perhaps somebody could help out 🙂

MOASDATHEREEREEERFUICCCCGGERKKKER!!#@(#*($#$#!!!!!!!!!!!!!

lol just kidding....all is well

straight up..i hate reading about boring crap.

 

[IndyZX]

i did ok in verbal (11), but i have to agree with hawkeye above... on my practice tests, the more i tried to hone in on technique, the more i screwed up. you just gotta go with the flow.

 

[Pinkertinkle]

Yep, like amateur tennis, and investing, the verbal section is a loser's game. And how does one win a loser's game? By not trying!

 

[ken37]

i think blz is right on the money on this one. everyone has their strengths and weaknesses, but i'd like to add that verbal has the nastiest curve of all the sections on the MCAT

Aren't all the curves standardized so that a given percentile will make the same score? How could one sections curve be harder? I think the explanation is doing worse on a section = "nasty curve".

 

[HawkeyeBFP]

The curve for Verbal is less forgiving of mistakes. You can miss a bunch on the science sections and still score 10+, and can usually even miss one or two and still get a 15.

On Verbal, the usual thing is you miss one, you go to a 14, miss two, you go to a 13, miss three, go to a 12...

This is just how it comes out. You can check the AMCAS site, which is where I got this information--though I'm not sure if you need to pay for the test access to get the scoring data.

 

[LauraMac]

verbal was definitely my easiest section. i ended up getting the same thing on each section, but i never studied anything for verbal, and i spent a lot of time studying the other stuff. the only "studying" i did for verbal was taking a couple practice verbal sections just to get the timing down. i can understand how people can do poorly on verbal - you know, if you just suck at reading comprehension or whatever. what i don't get is how people improve their verbal scores. there is nothing to study. what do you do, just read a lot and do a lot of practice passages?

 

[dhoonlee]

.

 

[OnMyWayThere]

It's cuz we're a buncha stupid immigrants.

I agree

 

[flighterdoc]

Yep, like amateur tennis, and investing, the verbal section is a loser's game. And how does one win a loser's game? By not trying!

I think AAMC keeps the english or communications major losers that read the writing samples employed through the long Iowa winters coming up with crap for us to guess about in the verbal section. AAMC is NOT my friend.

But, the verbal section is the only part of the MCAT that has any correlation with Med School performance.

 

[ChemMN]

I keep hearing that the verbal section on the MCAT has such a strong correlation with med school performance. Can anyone post a link to some statistics to back this up?

I'm not trying to say that the correlation doesn't exist, I am just genuinely curious.

 

[KNightInBlue]

Ok, now, I do NOT mean this to be condescending. I just wondered why verbal seems to be such a pain to so many people. Personally, I always had trouble with physics and gen chem because of the math and formula memorizing and such. Verbal was my best section when I took the mcat, got a 12. I was just curious what it is that give so many people a hard time? What exactly is this thing measuring. Now, I was not a science major, and maybe that had something to do with it. Anyway, just curious, and maybe this thread will help people see why this section troubles so many people.

Disclaimer: I am going to assume there's no condescension in this post.

I think one of the biggest reasons for verbal being such a challenge - TIME. For avid readers, verbal is relatively easy (or atleast it should be) mostly cuz s/he can zip through from practice. W/o having read a book in ages, mere practice 3 months ahead of the test is far from sufficient to ace the section. Most of the ppl I know taking the test are science majors whose last reading assignment was Goldilocks and the Three bears (JUST KIDDING!!!! 🙂 so dont bombard this thread w/ replies telling me to STFU)
This is NOT to say that ppl who dont read bomb the verbal section cuz they suck. It just means that they spend a whole lot more TIME reading thru the passages. Practically all the ppl I know who scored 7 or lower said that they couldnt finish on time and had to guess on a significant amnt of questions.

Another problem I have seen is that once ppl realise that time is against them, they try to solve the problem by setting time limits per passage and if they are falling behind, rush thru the rest, thus ending up w/ the same result.


If you can beat the clock ( and I mean PROPERLY beat it, not just rushing thru so you can sit out the last 10 min twiddling ur thumbs), you should be able to hit a 10, maybe even an 11. For scores above that, analytical reasoning comes into play. That, in my opinion, is incredibly hard to teach. You either have it or you don't.

 

[RayhanS1282]

I have trouble reading words without pictures. 😕

 

[Persistence101]

It's cuz we're a buncha stupid immigrants.

perfect explanation.

 

[Persistence101]

Disclaimer: I am going to assume there's no condescension in this post.

I think one of the biggest reasons for verbal being such a challenge - TIME. For avid readers, verbal is relatively easy (or atleast it should be) mostly cuz s/he can zip through from practice. W/o having read a book in ages, mere practice 3 months ahead of the test is far from sufficient to ace the section. Most of the ppl I know taking the test are science majors whose last reading assignment was Goldilocks and the Three bears (JUST KIDDING!!!! 🙂 so dont bombard this thread w/ replies telling me to STFU)
This is NOT to say that ppl who dont read bomb the verbal section cuz they suck. It just means that they spend a whole lot more TIME reading thru the passages. Practically all the ppl I know who scored 7 or lower said that they couldnt finish on time and had to guess on a significant amnt of questions.

👍 so true...

 

[bigdan]

I think there is some difficulty with the unknown - you don't really ever KNOW if the answer is correct. With the sciences, you, to an enormous degree, control the outcome of the question. You know the formula or you do not. You have memorized the hormone and its action, or you have not. In verbal, it's very difficult to have confidence or draw from your memory banks "what the author implies..."

dc

 

[Samoa]

Whoever pointed out that the basic approach is really no different between Verbal and Science was completely correct. You're still taking things apart, and figuring out how they work, and what would happen if.... only in Verbal it's figurative, while in the science sections it's more mechanical.

 

[R_C_Hutchinson]

the answer is one of the fundamental differences between science and humanities:

with science, you are playing a full-information game. if you knew the contents of every science text, journal etc. before taking the MCAT, you'd get a 15 on both PS and BS. no questions.

the moment you throw human judgement into the equation, you are playing a partial-information game. if you'd read every book, magazine etc. you would NOT be guaranteed a 15 on the VR. it is not your knowledge but your ability to synthesize new knowledge that is being tested. throughout our lives we are constantly cooking up rubrics and weighted scales etc. by which to judge the world. the VR tests the rubric you've created throughout your life with respect to discerning the meaning of written text. This means that this portion of the MCAT will be comparatively easier with respect to the average human than the BS/PS, since all answers rely on partial knowledge of the question being asked. (by this i do not mean that the section is easy, i mean that the average person walking down the street would score much higher on the VR than the PS or the BS sections if given the MCAT cold.)

This is also why it's so damn hard to get your VR score up. the test looks at your ability to evaluate written text- a skill that takes so long to learn that even 3 months of hard cramming will help comparatively little. It's like trying to learn to pick stocks or play poker like a pro in three months; sure you can get good with the fundamentals, but the advanced stuff (like being able to pick up on subtle irony or a single scarcastic sentence in the middle of a dull passage), where it really matters, takes a lifetime to master.

"wow, R_C_, you're a jerk- i hate you and will kick your dog"
hold on there a minute, there is hope:
1. realize that VR will be hard to change, then go from there
2. realize what will have the highest returns for you. if you're getting 4-5 in VR, work on the basics, 6-9, work on the stuff the test-prep companies specialize in: rubrics and tricks to help with passages, 10+ dive into the real hard stuff- new yorker/economist esque stuff. especially the stuff you hate and the stuff that bores you. this is the kind of writing in the kind of diction (east coast academic) you'll experience, so get used to it.

hope everyone does well on the VR, i know it's hard,
R_C_

 

[Samoa]

With all due respect to the above poster, who seems very well informed on the subject, science is also a matter of judgment and inference.

The ability to look at a set of experimental results and deduce the thing that ties them all together in a consistent fashion is the same thought process that the Verbal section is testing. What students think of as a "fact" in a science course is simply human interpretation of experimental results, a scientist's opinion of how the world is structured and what that means to us, based on the data at hand. A correct interpretation will stand the scrutiny of many scientists, and many experimental methods.

Likewise, a verbal passage has structure and coherence, regardless of the topic, and the questions are testing your ability to identify that. And what's more, you can make a good score on the other sections with much less factual knowledge in your head, if you have this skill.