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WSJ Health Blog - CRNA salaries

Discussion in 'Anesthesiology' started by traxtar511, Jun 18, 2008.

  1. traxtar511

    traxtar511 Junior Member 10+ Year Member

    Mar 9, 2006
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  3. Strength&Speed

    Strength&Speed Need more speed...... 10+ Year Member

    Dec 26, 2004
    Anesthesia $336,000 per year
    CRNA $185,000 per year

    that's pretty damn good for a CRNA, i agree. I also heard about an NP in the state I live in just signed a contract for the exact same amt of money. 185,000/year. (this is from the horses mouth-no pun intended) ;)

    but since ive seen some folks say a CRNA does a lot of the same stuff an Anesthesiologist does...why do you guys get paid 150 grand better? I don't mean this to be inflammatory, by the way.
  4. amyl

    amyl ASA Member 10+ Year Member

    that is an inflammatory statement on a DOCTORS forum even if you put some b.s. line about not meaning to be inflammatory and thus I will not bite and won't dignify it with a response. there is a seperate place on this site to discuss crna issues, bring it up there.

    in which state is this that an NP makes 185k? my mother in law would like to move there. I don't think she breaks into six figures with TONS of experience.
  5. Consigliere

    Consigliere 7+ Year Member

    May 28, 2008
    Neither here nor there
    Oh.....I don't know, perhaps the ability to diagnose, prescribe and medically direct. Oh yeah, and those 8 years of medical school and residency. Hey pal, here's a quarter - go buy yourself a clue.:cool:
  6. jetproppilot

    jetproppilot Turboprop Driver 10+ Year Member

    Mar 12, 2005
    level at FL210
    I qualified for the extra money by making the top twenty in a WSOP no-limit tournament last year.

    I think Noy qualified by pulling off a triple lutz on his board, and Mil was just a second behind Valentino Rossi in a race last month, which put him in the money too.
  7. nvshelat

    nvshelat Senior Member 7+ Year Member

    Mar 8, 2005
    These numbers really vary so much. Allied physician survey says 275k... these recruiters are quoting 330... I expect some variance in surveys, but that much!
  8. Strength&Speed

    Strength&Speed Need more speed...... 10+ Year Member

    Dec 26, 2004
    lol Jet. I should have known people would get pissed. I am NOT trying to be inflammatory. I understand that doctors are smarter than nurses, don't get me wrong. I would much rather have an anesthesiologist than a CRNA. Jesus Christ almighty. I was curious, where the f'in rubber meets the road financially where you are getting paid 150 more. What services are they actually paying you more for because you are an MD. It actually is a valid question since you have some overlap in job responsibility. I AM NOT SAYING THEY ARE AS SMART AS YOU. I will take my question to the CRNA forum.
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2008
  9. Bertelman

    Bertelman Maverick! 7+ Year Member

    Feb 11, 2006
    Had a Cooch
    Enjoy your time there.

    G'head and ask them if they think they should make as much as physicians.
  10. Strength&Speed

    Strength&Speed Need more speed...... 10+ Year Member

    Dec 26, 2004
    Sorry if I offended you. But there are CRNA's working independently in some areas, and I'm pretty sure they are diagnosing, prescribing, and medically directing. As above, I do not consider them equivalent to MD's in either training or knowledge. But since they are doing some of the same things, I was curious how the reimbursement is different. Ok, hoss? I'll take it to the CRNA forum.
  11. 2ndyear

    2ndyear Senior Member 10+ Year Member

    Jul 11, 2002
    New England
    You're right, for a case, reimbursement is the same whether its MD or CRNA. My CRNA friends don't really take any call. They might work a few late shifts now and again, the occasional Saturday, but not real call. Now those jobs are out there for CRNA's, the q2-3 overnight call, and they are reimbursed well. But they're rare. Now for MD's, when I looked at jobs no call is too good to be true. The real high dollar jobs were q3 or a4.

    MD's can make more by- taking a lot more call for one thing, blocks, covering the ICU if need be, pain rounds, pain procedures, as well as just being the doctor around. When I'm at my outpatient center, rules say an MD must be around until the last patient is out the door. Period. It probably ain't gonna be the ortho guy...
  12. jetproppilot

    jetproppilot Turboprop Driver 10+ Year Member

    Mar 12, 2005
    level at FL210
    I think the question should be the other way how did nurses salaries get so high?

    Why do they make more than a primary care doctor? I think thats much more disturbing than your quoted amount of an anesthesiologist getting paid "150" more.
  13. Coastie

    Coastie Junior Member 10+ Year Member

    Oct 17, 2005

  14. Strength&Speed

    Strength&Speed Need more speed...... 10+ Year Member

    Dec 26, 2004
    Got my answer: call, being the supervising MD, blocks, ICU coverage, pain procedures. That seems to be the answer.

  15. ecCA1

    ecCA1 Member 10+ Year Member

    Dec 1, 2005
    Looking at what you've written, it appears that you already knew the answers to your question.

  16. Strength&Speed

    Strength&Speed Need more speed...... 10+ Year Member

    Dec 26, 2004
    i had a suspicion, but I don't make life-altering decisions based on suspicions.
  17. amyl

    amyl ASA Member 10+ Year Member

    as one of the surgeons i know says:
    you are a nurse, you are paid to do, not think. just follow orders.

    -- btw, the nurses LOVE him :)
  18. Consigliere

    Consigliere 7+ Year Member

    May 28, 2008
    Neither here nor there
    Please do
  19. Arch Guillotti

    Arch Guillotti Senior Member Administrator Physician Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

    Aug 8, 2001
    That a CRNA can make more than any physician is nauseating. Move this garbage.
  20. Planktonmd

    Planktonmd Moderator Emeritus Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

    Nov 2, 2006
    The South
    So, you seem to introduce yourself as a surgery resident or something like that, am I right?
    I am curious why would a surgery resident ( a form of physician last time I checked) would find it strange that a physician is paid more than a nurse?
    Are you trying to imply that the pay should be based on the number of technical procedures one can do?
    If that is the case then I can train a chimpanzee to do surgery and give him the same pay of a surgeon, would that be OK?
    I bet the chimpanzee would be fun to have in the OR.
  21. amyl

    amyl ASA Member 10+ Year Member

    or a robot?
  22. Strength&Speed

    Strength&Speed Need more speed...... 10+ Year Member

    Dec 26, 2004
    I replied to Plankton via PM to his questions. First of all, I apologize for asking the question in the inflammatory way I did. I didn't mean to offend anyone, and I have immense respect for Anesthesiologists. Second, yes, you can teach NP's and PA's to do surgeries, but the problem arises when there are complications or things outside their scope. therefore, its probably impractical and dangerous to have them doing too many surgeries.

    My question wasn't whether CRNA's can do everything you do, but rather whether they are capable of doing cases. Since this is a decent amount of what anesthesiologists do (doing cases) I was merely asking where the extra pay came from, was it from perioperative medicine/ICU/or whatever, since reimbursement for cases is the same. That's all I wanted to know.

    Plankton was kind enough to inform me that there is more to anesthesiology than just getting the patient off the table alive. I'm sure you impact length of time in recovery, patient morbidity, etc in ways that I failed to appreciate. I already knew you were the experts in perioperative medicine, which the CRNA's cannot do.

    I'm sorry for offending anyone.
  23. lfesiam

    lfesiam Regional Guy for Hire! 10+ Year Member

    Feb 2, 2005

    Supply and Demand in society.

    Decreased General Practice MD Supply = Increased NP and PA Supply.
    Decreased Anesthesiologists = Increased CRNA and AA Supply.

    So...increase the supply of anesthesiologists by increasing more residency spots to balance out the dichotomy. But...

    Increased Residency spots = Decreased faculty per resident.

    So in the end, we have to increase support for Academia :banana:

    Teaching is more rewarding than $$$ in my opinion.
  24. MSU spartan

    MSU spartan New Member 10+ Year Member

    Mar 27, 2003
    In regards to Anesthesiologist making more it is because we usually put in more hours to the JOB. Also, there are many PA's and NP's who do the exact same job as a Family medicine doc and Internist 's and they get paid less so how is this different from a CRNA and Anesthesioogist's pay difference.
  25. Tenesma

    Tenesma Senior Member 10+ Year Member

    Jun 11, 2002
    am i wrong? i thought medicare only reimburses CRNAs at 85% of what a physician gets paid for the same amount of RVU?

    also, there is a reason why anesthesiologists can ask for more income - they generate more income than CRNAs do...

    it is all about what gets generated that dictates reimbursement - pediatricians see a lot of well child checks and sore throats - those E/M visits don't pay very well...

    an orthopedic PA does a lot of joint injections - those pay better than E/M visits


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