Yet another "apply early" thread?

[CarlyM]

I'm sorry, I know this has been done ten thousand times but I hope someone will humor me!

I am a liberal arts senior, BA in biology expected this May.
Cumulative GPA 3.79, Major GPA 3.89.

I just made the decision to apply to med school for fall 2009. Haven't taken the MCAT yet.

The problem: I want to apply as early as possible, but I haven't taken any physics yet. I need to take two physics classes this coming summer (May-July 2008). I was planning to take the MCAT in/around June so I'd have scores around July.

Will I completely bomb the MCAT without having taken physics/trying to teach myself? Can I even submit my application without having the physics grades on my transcript, or will it get bogged down until the grades are official? I don't want to sacrifice my MCAT score.

Any advice would be so greatly appreciated! Thanks.

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[Dendrite]

You can apply without taking a year of physics, although you have to have completed both Physics I and II w/lab before matriculation. Also, if you haven't been exposed to physics in high school or anytime else, IMO, it is difficult to teach yourself. It is possible, and it helps if you are very good at math; the reviews in one of the major MCAT study aids are good.

Good luck.

 

[Bond8204]

I'm sorry, I know this has been done ten thousand times but I hope someone will humor me!

I am a liberal arts senior, BA in biology expected this May.
Cumulative GPA 3.79, Major GPA 3.89.

I just made the decision to apply to med school for fall 2009. Haven't taken the MCAT yet.

The problem: I want to apply as early as possible, but I haven't taken any physics yet. I need to take two physics classes this coming summer (May-July 2008). I was planning to take the MCAT in/around June so I'd have scores around July.

Will I completely bomb the MCAT without having taken physics/trying to teach myself? Can I even submit my application without having the physics grades on my transcript, or will it get bogged down until the grades are official? I don't want to sacrifice my MCAT score.

Any advice would be so greatly appreciated! Thanks.

--It's possible to do well on the MCAT without having taken physics, but it's highly ill-advised. Physics takes up an entire half of the P section (physical sciences) of the MCAT. So, as has been oft talked about here, although it seems totally ridiculous, physics shows up as much on the mcat as gen chem, orgo, and biology do. If you've never had physics before, I don't think there's any way you can teach yourself enough to do satisfactorily on the test. If you had it in high school, I think you could try to get by, but would strongly advise you to take a Kaplan-type course to prepare (beginning in like February). I would do every single physical sciences practice problem and review available to you through them (they supply quite enough). After that, you'll have diagnostics to give you an idea of where you are. If your P score is good enough, take the mcat in June. If not, finish up the prep course, take physics, go nuts studying for the mcats again, and see how your P score has done.

My guess is that because you have such a good GPA and biology GPA, you won't have to study too badly for the Biological or Verbal sections. If that's true, that's good because you can devote almost all your time to the P section.

--Yes you can submit your primary application not having taken physics. You would list it as a "current/future course" under the college at which you're taking it. When you finish the courses, you'll send an official transcript from that school to the schools you're applying to to update your coursework and show them you've fulfilled the prereq.

And not to pile it on...but I'd be looking for a job (if you don't already know what you're doing with your year off) while you take physics that summer. I think med schools would be fine with you taking off the summer to do physics, but I have friends and have heard other stories of people who took the summer off and started looking for a job in September, and ended up going an entire semester with absolutely no activity (or maybe a little volunteering here and there). Med schools don't look kindly on that.

 

[Law2Doc]

Will I completely bomb the MCAT without having taken physics/trying to teach myself?

That depends a lot on you but for many the answer is a definative YES. Do not take the MCAT until you have taken the prereqs. In the med school application game you are far far far far far far far far far far far better off sacraficing a cycle (or even two) and getting a few more points on that test. Additionally, for a nonscience person to try and study for the MCAT while trying to get two semesters of physics in during a compressed summer schedule is pretty foolish. Do not rush so much to get into med school that you sacrifice your credentials. Take the time you need to do it right, and to get in on your first and only attempt. If you haven't taken physics until the summer, you shouldn't take the MCAT until sometime after that -- after you have had time to study for the test, and done well on practice tests and the like. Meaning either be a fairly late applicant, or you probably want to consider sitting out a cycle. Unless you are age 40+, I suggest the latter. Do something that will puff up your ECs. Maybe take biochem since it's a prereq for a handfull of schools these days. And take the MCAT only when you are ready and have adequately prepared. Rushing through and winging it having only partially completing the prereqs has ruined a few med school hopefulls dreams -- probably more than the number of folks who actually pull it off. Take the time you need.

 

[rms435]

I think you'll be fine doing the MCAT without taking physics at your college as long as you take some MCAT review course or have a tutor that can explain concepts to you. I took all my prereqs 5 years before I took the MCAT so I remembered nothing from the actual classes, but the review course I took taught me everything I needed to know. May not be the case with everyone, but I think you could do it if you're worried about timing.

 

[flaahless]

I agree with rms435. It is possible to do fine on the MCAT without taking physics at your college. If you have a good noncalculus based physics book and a lot of time, you can teach yourself the major concepts. After which, grab a review book and work as many problems as possible. It can be done, but it will take time. Goodluck with your application.

 

[Law2Doc]

I think you'll be fine doing the MCAT without taking physics at your college as long as you take some MCAT review course or have a tutor that can explain concepts to you. I took all my prereqs 5 years before I took the MCAT so I remembered nothing from the actual classes, but the review course I took taught me everything I needed to know. May not be the case with everyone, but I think you could do it if you're worried about timing.

There's no reason to worry about timing. Med schools will always be there a year later. Time is your friend, haste is your enemy. For a nonsci major who never took college physics before, the odds of self teaching or picking up enough through a review course to do well on the MCAT are simply not that good. Some can do it but that is a definite minority. Kudos to you for refreshing in this way, but it's really not the same thing as never having had college physics. OP- Let your MCAT practice tests dictate whether you are capable of doing adequately -- unless and until you are consistently scoring in a desired competitive range, you should not sit for the MCAT, period. I would plan on stretching things out a year.

 

[Law2Doc]

I agree with rms435. It is possible to do fine on the MCAT without taking physics at your college. If you have a good noncalculus based physics book and a lot of time, you can teach yourself the major concepts. After which, grab a review book and work as many problems as possible. It can be done, but it will take time. Goodluck with your application.

Time is what the OP doesn't want to spend. It's not like s/he's going to have a ton of time to study for an MCAT while taking compressed summer courses.

 

[Bond8204]

Let your MCAT practice tests dictate whether you are capable of doing adequately.

This is the short answer to this question. Take a review course this semester (there's no reason you can't take a review course before physics as was said above) and see where to go from there.

 

[CarlyM]

Thanks for the replies so far, everyone.

What if I took the MCAT this summer after my physics classes? Around the end of July, get scores in August, apply then?

Or should I really be applying much earlier than that?

 

[AlexMorph]

Thanks for the replies so far, everyone.

What if I took the MCAT this summer after my physics classes? Around the end of July, get scores in August, apply then?

Or should I really be applying much earlier than that?

you wanna get it in earlier than that. the earlier the better

 

[Law2Doc]

Thanks for the replies so far, everyone.

What if I took the MCAT this summer after my physics classes? Around the end of July, get scores in August, apply then?

Or should I really be applying much earlier than that?

You'd ideally want to apply before the scores came out or you'd no longer be applying early -- you'd want schools to already have everything in so that the second the scores hit you'd be complete. If you truly got apps in and complete in August you should still be okay. But again the question is are you going to simultaneously try to take a compressed summer physics class and study for the MCAT so that you could sit for it right after? You might be underestimating how much time those "full semester course plus lab in six weeks" classes tend to demand. Again if it's going to be the difference of a couple of points, it's totally worth it to wait a cycle. Unfortunately, a few points on the MCAT can be a huge difference in where you end up.

 

[lemon tree]

Thanks for the replies so far, everyone.

What if I took the MCAT this summer after my physics classes? Around the end of July, get scores in August, apply then?

Or should I really be applying much earlier than that?

you haven't been listening.

 

[Bond8204]

Thanks for the replies so far, everyone.

What if I took the MCAT this summer after my physics classes? Around the end of July, get scores in August, apply then?

Or should I really be applying much earlier than that?

You are talking about putting a lot on your plate--finishing up your current semester while studying for the MCAT, the hooplah of graduation (and trying to enjoy the moment and have fun in your last months in college), taking 2 physics classes with labs at the same time while studying for the MCAT in June, writing your personal statement and coordinating your letters of recommendation, submitting the AMCAS primary application (which trust me, takes much longer than you'd think), finishing the physics courses, taking the MCAT, and filling out secondary applications (which is a terrible long process).

ALL of that before August?

That's a ****load of work to be doing at the same time. Can it be done? Yeah. But it would involve a TON of organization and misery.

The point that Law2Doc continues to make here is that there's a lot of room to screw this plan up. e.g.:

--You're so tired by the end of physics that you put off the MCAT for another month. All of the sudden you're not complete until mid-end-September. You're late in the process and don't get any interviews.

--You burn out on secondaries. Again, late in the process.

--You rush the MCAT and don't do as well as possible.

Etc etc. Any of these could result in you having to apply again--which costs a lot of money, time, effort, heartache.

Here's an alternative: You decide to try to enter 2010. You enjoy your graduation with no worries. You take physics without having to worry about a looming MCAT and while looking for a good job (that will help you get into med school) for when you're done with physics. You start your job in August/September and begin an MCAT prep course. You take the MCAT somewhere in the winter (January?), gain some more clinical/volunteer experience a couple hours a weekend and get some killer recommendations from that and your job. Submit the AMCAS in early June and have your applications completely done by July 2009 (and you'll have the money to pay for them!).

Doesn't that alternative sound so much smarter than the traffic jam I summarized before? Reading over what I just wrote, I have to believe that you'd get into school easier and probably get into better schools by spreading this out a bit.

Applying to med school is not something you should rush, either. If you just decided you want to go, that probably means you don't have any clinical experience, right?? You'll NEED NEED NEED that type of stuff, not only for your application, but also to confirm to yourself that this is what you want to do.

 

[CarlyM]

Bond - I definitely see your point. It's so hard to think I won't go for another 2.5 years, but I guess that's what I get for deciding spring semester of my senior year!

I just read the "what are my chances" thread - does everyone really have so many outstanding ECs, or is it just SDN? Yikes. I've never been able to afford to volunteer, I have to make money to help fund my undergrad!

 

[Bond8204]

Bond - I definitely see your point. It's so hard to think I won't go for another 2.5 years, but I guess that's what I get for deciding spring semester of my senior year!

I just read the "what are my chances" thread - does everyone really have so many outstanding ECs, or is it just SDN? Yikes. I've never been able to afford to volunteer, I have to make money to help fund my undergrad!

Haha. Deciding your last semester of school I'd say qualifies you as a nontraditional applicant. That also sparked in my head that I bet your school has some sort of premedical advisor that will guide you through the process, even if you don't apply next cycle--try to look into that. See what he/she thinks about when you should apply--I'll bet they say for entering in 2010.

And yes, SDN tends to be heavy on the "Wow!" side of the application pool and the "Lower" side of the application pool. Though us tweeners do exist.

EC's are a definite must. Med schools are huge on seeing that you're a holistic, well developed person and not just some good statistic who's horrible with people. The good thing is that you have plenty of time to gain experience (I'd say if you have zero EC's, applying this summer is absolutely now ruled out). One EC that's absolutely required is gaining clinical experience. You don't have to travel to Africa for a summer to work on an Ebola outbreak to get this. A common example of this is volunteering at a health clinic 2 hours a week. Finding a cool position like this is doable with a little work--you end up working with patients and shadowing doctors, seeing how a clinical setting works, BSing with the doctors about medicine, etc). Some long-term clinical activity to show that you've thought through your decision to go into medicine is critical. (A job I might suggest considering your Biology background would be a research assistant/technician/technologist in a medical research lab). Whatever you get a job doing, make sure it's beneficial for applying to med school--an advisor at your school would again be good for ideas for this, and there's threads on SDN as well, though they're not that helpful on this topic.

After you take care of clinical experience, I recommend at LEAST 2 more activities that aren't necessarily related to medicine. Volunteering (even non-clinically) is a plus because it shows you're dedicated to service. But these activities can be something as simple as "Summer Softball League" etc...something to shed a little more light for them on who you are.

I know that it sounds lame to participate in activities for the sake of participating in them (and if you're not into something, don't continue it), but you'll thank me when you fill out the Extracurricular section of your AMCAS primary application and have more than 1 thing to write. (Any jobs you might have had to pay for school, btw, count as EC's and are looked upon well by Adcoms especially if there is any leadership involved). Good luck and talk to that advisor!

 

[TheRealMD]

Too much in a small amount of time. What is the reason not to spread this stuff out over year?

 

[kool aid kid]

I am going to second or third or whatever what everyone else has been advising you to do. This is coming from someone who took the MCAT in September (last possible day of the cycle) after finishing Orgo in the summer. I've received interviews and an acceptance but I definitely feel like being as late as I was hurt my shot at many schools. It can be done though, if you really want to (even later than you are planning). But what's the rush? I recommend taking your time and doing well on everything rather than race to the finish (much less stressful that way). Then just submit super early next time around.