does signing prematch still exist?

[threecoins]

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hey there,
I just had a quick question,does anybody know if signing prematch in surgery still exists or is it history? and if it is is it still legal ? I have heard that the NRMP was about to pass a rule on making it illegal but then delayed passing it under program directors pressure, is that true? I woudl really appreciate it if anybody has a link or URL to the most recent actual NRMP policy about this..thanks

 

[DoctorDoom]

hey there,
I just had a quick question,does anybody know if signing prematch in surgery still exists or is it history? and if it is is it still legal ? I have heard that the NRMP was about to pass a rule on making it illegal but then delayed passing it under program directors pressure, is that true? I woudl really appreciate it if anybody has a link or URL to the most recent actual NRMP policy about this..thanks

Illegal when I matched, and still illegal as far as I know...

 

[Idiopathic]

Depends on your letters (MD vs. DO) and if you are a rat...if someone offered me, I wouldnt turn it down. I believe (check that: I know) that offers are still made outside the match, but you could never ask for one. It would have to be offered.

 

[DoctorDoom]

No question that it happens, but I mean that it was "illegal" according to the NRMP. And nobody signed anything, that's for sure... but there are "understandings" reached...

 

[threecoins]

http://www.savethematch.org/news/news.aspx?NewsID=320886105
this is from teh NRMP afiliated site savethematch

please read this, it says :
Beginning with the 2004 Match, all sponsoring institutions participating in the NRMP Main Match must register and attempt to fill all their positions in the Match except for those specialties or programs participating in other national matching programs....

After hearing from more than 400 individuals and organizations, the Board voted at its May 2003 meeting not to implement the new rule with the 2004 Match so that it could study the potential effects of three major issues: (1) changes in the processing and timely acquisition of visas for international medical graduates, (2) limiting the rule to PGY1 positions, and (3) making the rule program-based rather than institution-based, e.g., all programs (not institutions) registered for the Main Match would be required to place all their positions in the Match.

this seems very confusing for me, this means somehow that the NRMP still allows it, I have heard someone saying that it was never allowed but what happens is that thr program registers all their spots then withdraw one of them after signing the premtach..others said that the program only goes to the match with 4 spots instead of 5 or so..

can anyone explain to me what does the above press realease mean exactly?

 

[DoctorDoom]

It's not pre-signing for the regular match, programs are giving spots to independent applicants (such as IMG's) outside of the match, they give positions that are not PGY-1 to independent applicants, and there are matches such as the San Francisco match that work outside of the regular match. It is illegal to my knowledge for them to prematch graduating allopathic seniors in the US.

 

[FliteSurgn]

I have heard someone saying that it was never allowed but what happens is that the program registers all their spots then withdraw one of them after signing the premtach..others said that the program only goes to the match with 4 spots instead of 5 or so..

can anyone explain to me what does the above press realease mean exactly?

This is exactly how it happens. They sign a contract with an "independent applicant" and then they pull that position out of the match. It is legal because there is no law against it. Once the NRMP policy alluded to above is in place, they will be contractually obligated to fill all of their PGY-1 spots through the match. As it sits now, the program can decide how many of their openings will be registered to fill through the match. The current agreement does however state that all spots offered to U.S. grads must be made through the match. Here's a link to the NRMP Match Agreements.

http://www.nrmp.org/res_match/policies/index.html

 

[FliteSurgn]

Here's a quote from the Save The Match website:

Second, those IMGs who enroll in the Match are bound by the same rules as U.S. students. They cannot commit to participate and then decide to withdraw, unless they do so prior to the rank order list certification deadline. The only difference is that programs participating in the Match have the option of securing binding commitments from these applicants prior to the rank order list certification deadline in February.

Some programs find that they must have binding commitments from IMGs prior to the Match because there is significant uncertainty, particularly since 9/11, about how soon IMGs can obtain the immigration visas necessary to commence their residencies and the necessary certification from the Educational Commission for Foreign Medical Graduates (over 1,700 had to withdraw in 2003 due to this issue). The number of IMGs who obtain positions in this manner is relatively small and does not affect the stability of the Match, precisely because the vast majority of Match participants are committed.

 

[threecoins]

Thank you so much for all your comments, so the final word is if I am an IMG then it is perfectly legal, and If I ask the program director for it then it would not be like I am asking for some illegal unethical thing or so..? I would really appreciate it if you can give me the link to the last quote from the save the match site. thanks

 

[FliteSurgn]

Here are the actual NRMP Guidelines.

http://www.nrmp.org/res_match/policies/map_main.html

I think that section 2.4.1 deals with this situation. Interestingly, it's not just IMGs that are considered "independent applicants." According to section 2.2.2, it also includes osteopathic students and physicians that have already graduated from a U.S. medical school.