whats the difference between ethnicity and race?

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
W

whattodowithmys

Member
10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2004
Messages
67
Reaction score
0
whats the deal... can you mark down one, and leave the other blank?
i didnt even know there was a difference until looking at amcas
Members don't see this ad.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
ok- I can be Irish ethnically and Caucasian racially
Jamacian ethinically and African American racially
Japanese ethnically and Asian racially

get it?
 
whattodowithmys said:
whats the deal... can you mark down one, and leave the other blank?
i didnt even know there was a difference until looking at amcas
Click to expand...

Race is a biological term determined from the amount of melanin in one's skin. You have no control over it and it is with you for the rest of your life.

Ethnicity is a cultural term that describes language, religion, symbols you consider important, and practices you undertake. Ethnicity is typically accompanied by race, however, it can be changed and many do.

sequencer is slightly mistaken, but in the right track because African American is considered an ethnicity, not a race; the proper term as I have mentioned is Black.

So, even though by race I am Black, ethnically I am Nigerian. My friend who was born in Jamaica and is a Rustafarian is by race Black, but ethnically, Jamaican. Lastly, my good friend born in Toronto is also Black, but is ethnically Canadian. Get the idea?
 
There's a plethora of research related to this question in anthropology (especially since now we argue that race has nothing to do with biological differences, even though certain things can be seen at different levels across "races" after controlling for socioeconomic status). But, I digress. It basically boils down to this: Race is a geographically distinct group characterized by certain physical features. Ethnicity, on the other hand, encompasses cultural beliefs and social practices shared traditional among members of a particular group. However, in today's society, these definitions can be particularly troublesome due to the rate of migration and intergroup mixing that occurs. Ultimately, the difference is becoming much more one of semantics than anything else.
 
akinf said:
Lastly, my good friend born in Toronto is also Black, but is ethnically Canadian. Get the idea?
Click to expand...

Not quite - Nationality of birth does not equal ethnicity. A better example of all three would be, say, a white italian-american, who would have race = caucasian, ethnicity = italian (perhaps more specifically sicilian), and nationality = american.
 
sequencer said:
ok- I can be Irish ethnically and Caucasian racially
Jamacian ethinically and African American racially
Japanese ethnically and Asian racially

get it?
Click to expand...

:thumbup: That's what I always figured. My ethnicity is Jamaican, so I always mark race on standardized tests as Black, Non Hispanic.
 
whattodowithmys said:
whats the deal... can you mark down one, and leave the other blank?
i didnt even know there was a difference until looking at amcas
Click to expand...
I think that race denotes a "biological subspecies with distinct anatomical features" as one website put it. That would be asian, white, black, hispanic, etc. However, hispanic from Mexico is very different from hispanic from Spain or hispanic from Dominican Republic. Those differences (I think) would be further qualified by "ethnicity."

According to that analysis, my race would be 'white' but my ethnicity would be eastern-European. That is just my guess though, and it would be a fine distinction then between ethnicity and nationality. However, if ethnicity is supposed to encompass the differences in cultures within the same race then I think the above interpretation is consistent. Does that make 'Australian' a different ethnicity from 'Russian'? I'm not sure. But they are definitely the same race.

This is really the first I've heard of there being two separate questions on this. Usually (and I think perhaps largely so in the past), these terms have been used interchangeably.

Then again, this government website seems to make some serious distinctions:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/fedreg/race-ethnicity.html
According to this site, there are approximately four races: white, black, asian, and American Indian or Alaskan Native. Hispanic is included but clearly distinguished in later discussion as an 'ethnicity' and not a race, although it is acknowledged that many Hispanics do consider it as its own race, at least when reporting race on documents. The consensus in the .gov document seems to indicate that Hispanics as an ethnic group can still be either white or black racially (i.e. Mexicans would be considered white and Dominicans black), but concedes that there are problematic classifications: An example is given of people who live in "Equatorial Guinea, who are geographically Africans but who speak Spanish" and that they would be considered as Hispanic ethnically, but they are racially black.

Apparently, it's a complicated issue!

I guess if you are white/American your race would be 'white' and your ethnicity would be 'non-Hispanic', at least according to the "combined race/ethnicity" reporting format of the "Standards for the Classification of Federal Data on Race and Ethnicity."
 
Law2Doc said:
Not quite - Nationality of birth does not equal ethnicity. A better example of all three would be, say, a white italian-american, who would have race = caucasian, ethnicity = italian (perhaps more specifically sicilian), and nationality = american.
Click to expand...

As said before race is based on a set of biological markers, and does not change over the course of a persons life.

Ethnicity can be completely non biological, although it is often closely associated with race. Generally it has cultural aspects that a person identifies themselves with. for this reason ethnicity may change for the same person over time, and may vary between siblings!

Ethnicity in many health care surveys is self reported, at least i believe it is on NHANES.
 
sequencer said:
ok- I can be Irish ethnically and Caucasian racially
Jamacian ethinically and African American racially
Japanese ethnically and Asian racially

get it?
Click to expand...
But in that case there is little distinction between ethnicity and nationality.

Unless I suppose you are a Nazi who fled post-WW2 Germany to a non-extradition country like Argentina and now you are ethnically German, nationality Argentinian, and racially white.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
Law2Doc said:
Not quite - Nationality of birth does not equal ethnicity. A better example of all three would be, say, a white italian-american, who would have race = caucasian, ethnicity = italian (perhaps more specifically sicilian), and nationality = american.
Click to expand...

Canadian is a recognized culture and therefore an ethnicity; so yes, Canadian is a nationality and ethnicity. The exact same way you said Italian is an ethnicity.
 
sequencer said:
ok- I can be Irish ethnically and Caucasian racially
Jamacian ethinically and African American racially
Japanese ethnically and Asian racially

get it?
Click to expand...

wouldn't the second be "Jamacian ethinically and Black racially"?
 
Noway said:
wouldn't the second be "Jamacian ethinically and Black racially"?
Click to expand...

Yes.
 
Law2Doc said:
If you don't know, just say so. :)
Click to expand...

I'm sorry. I'm just waiting for the whole crazy edifice of race profiling and affirmative action to collapse under the weight of its own absurdity.
 
as somenoe mentioned in a previous post, race is about how others see you, in other words your outside appearance as defined by the color of your skin. your ethnicity is what you feel you are most closely related to through culture.

Race= East Asian
Ethnicity= Taiwanese-Chinese-American
 
akinf said:
Canadian is a recognized culture and therefore an ethnicity; so yes, Canadian is a nationality and ethnicity. The exact same way you said Italian is an ethnicity.
Click to expand...

Perhaps, but Toronto is an ethinically diverse cosmopolitan city, much like most of the States. Perhaps I should have said mediterranean instead of italian for clarity's sake. So if you were a white person of mediterranean descent born in toronto you would be race = caucasian, ethinicity = mediterranean, nationality = canadian. Better?
 
The differences between nationality, ethnicity, and race can get blurry. To give a personal example, this is how I would describe myself:

Nationality: American (even though I find the term silly, since it belongs to 2 continents, not just our country... but I digress).
Ethnicity: Italian, African of unknown origin (gee, thanks slavery), with a pinch of English and a dash of Native American
Race: Black and White. Multiracial.

But this is a bit much, so I just say that I'm brown. According to my L'Oreal makeup, I'm 'creme cafe,' so I think I will start writing that on official government forms.
 
Panda Bear said:
I'm sorry. I'm just waiting for the whole crazy edifice of race profiling and affirmative action to collapse under the weight of its own absurdity.
Click to expand...

Amen.
 
Thundrstorm said:
The differences between nationality, ethnicity, and race can get blurry. To give a personal example, this is how I would describe myself:

Nationality: American (even though I find the term silly, since it belongs to 2 continents, not just our country... but I digress).
Ethnicity: Italian, African of unknown origin (gee, thanks slavery), with a pinch of English and a dash of Native American
Race: Black and White. Multiracial.

But this is a bit much, so I just say that I'm brown. According to my L'Oreal makeup, I'm 'creme cafe,' so I think I will start writing that on official government forms.
Click to expand...

So it seems that the consensus is that ethnicity is a "sub-race" category, more biological than cultural.
 
Schaden Freud said:
So it seems that the consensus is that ethnicity is a "sub-race" category, more biological than cultural.
Click to expand...
In some ways, it's a "sub-race" thing, but it's cultural as well. My family partakes in Italian traditions and cooking. That makes me feel Italian-American more than the fact that my mother contribued half of my genes.
 
Thundrstorm said:
In some ways, it's a "sub-race" thing, but it's cultural as well. My family partakes in Italian traditions and cooking. That makes me feel Italian-American more than the fact that my mother contribued half of my genes.
Click to expand...

Plus, you have that filovirus. Still my favorite avatar. :)
 
Panda Bear said:
I'm sorry. I'm just waiting for the whole crazy edifice of race profiling and affirmative action to collapse under the weight of its own absurdity.
Click to expand...

what would you suggest as an alternative to AA?
 
Law2Doc said:
Perhaps, but Toronto is an ethinically diverse cosmopolitan city, much like most of the States. Perhaps I should have said mediterranean instead of italian for clarity's sake. So if you were a white person of mediterranean descent born in toronto you would be race = caucasian, ethinicity = mediterranean, nationality = canadian. Better?
Click to expand...

Not really because being Canadian has a culture, symbols, certain practices that unite people. All of this qualify as being an ethnicity. Someone mentioned it earlier as well, race is present on the outside, but ethnicity comes from within.
 
Schaden Freud said:
So it seems that the consensus is that ethnicity is a "sub-race" category, more biological than cultural.
Click to expand...

That is the farthest from the truth. Ethnicity and race are completely unrelated the way you describe it. Race often determines ethnicity, but race does not act as a parameter to ethnicity. It is important to realize that ethnicity is about a feeling and race is about what is seen. Race, you have NO CONTROL over, whereas, with ethnicity you do.
 
BAM! said:
what would you suggest as an alternative to AA?
Click to expand...
NOOOOOO!! This is not an AA thread. Please do not turn it into one.




Now back on topic, what do you guys think? Does my self-classification as "creme cafe" count as an ethnicity or a race?
 
akinf said:
Not really because being Canadian has a culture, symbols, certain practices that unite people. All of this qualify as being an ethnicity. Someone mentioned it earlier as well, race is present on the outside, but ethnicity comes from within.
Click to expand...

Okay. Then put down your ethnicity as Canadian. As long as you are being honest and not seeking to get into a category you aren't entitled to claim, I really don't think any adcom will care.
 
So is it OK to check off an ethnicity and NOT a race? (i.e. Hispanics who do not consider themselves black or white?)
 
Thundrstorm said:
NOOOOOO!! This is not an AA thread. Please do not turn it into one.




Now back on topic, what do you guys think? Does my self-classification as "creme cafe" count as an ethnicity or a race?
Click to expand...
Definitely race.
I'm all for starting your own race.
You go girl!
 
Thundrstorm said:
Nationality: American (even though I find the term silly, since it belongs to 2 continents, not just our country... but I digress).
Ethnicity: Italian, African of unknown origin (gee, thanks slavery), with a pinch of English and a dash of Native American
Race: Black and White. Multiracial.
QUOTE]


Me too!

Nationality: American
Ethnicity: Italian, African of unknown origin with a lil Russian
Race: Black and White. Multiracial.
Click to expand...
 
Me too!

Nationality: American
Ethnicity: Italian, African of unknown origin with a lil Russian
Race: Black and White. Multiracial.
Click to expand...

Hey! *high five* Wanna join my "creme cafe" race? :D


Have you ever noticed how many multiracial/biracial kids have a black and an Italian (or Italian-American) parent? Those Italians like a little chocolate in their milk... a little pepper on their pasta. haha. Okay, let me stop.
 
dustinlevengood said:
aren't we just the human race? we can be italian or swiss or nigerian but we're always the human race..
Click to expand...
Well, that's a very beautiful, original thought. Let's hold hands and skip through fields of daisies. The fact is, whether race exists on a biological level or not, it is a social construct, and it has mattered to enough people for enough time that we can't suddenly embrace and declare that we're all human, and let's just be colorblind! There's a little problem called reality that stops that thought dead in its tracks.
 
Thundrstorm said:
Well, that's a very beautiful, original thought. Let's hold hands and skip through fields of daisies. The fact is, whether race exists on a biological level or not, it is a social construct, and it has mattered to enough people for enough time that we can't suddenly embrace and declare that we're all human, and let's just be colorblind! There's a little problem called reality that stops that thought dead in its tracks.
Click to expand...

Quite a defeatist attitude, no?
 
Schaden Freud said:
Quite a defeatist attitude, no?
Click to expand...
Well, don't misunderstand me. I think race relations can continue to improve, and that race can become less important. I just hate that "we're all human" colorblind crap because that kind of attitude tries to ignore the problem, not fix it. You can't just wave a magic wand and make race (or racism) disappear. The concept of race affects my life; therefore, to me, it exists. That doesn't change because scientists suddenly decide race is not real.
 
You know I never really thought about it but I do know quite a few LOL! I'll have to ask my mom whats up with that!
 
Thundrstorm said:
Ethnicity: Italian, African of unknown origin (gee, thanks slavery), with a pinch
Click to expand...


:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
 
rajad10 said:
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Click to expand...
Glad you appreciate my humor. Maybe I should've included the bit about where that pinch of English came from (gee, thanks slave owner).
 
dustinlevengood said:
aren't we just the human race? we can be italian or swiss or nigerian but we're always the human race..
Click to expand...

Not exactly sure why you put that comment, it's out of context.
 
I think this thread has gotten off track, the OP wanted to know the difference between race and ethnicity and I think that has been provided. The idea that racism still exists is true, but for those who are blatant racists (yes, closet racists do exist, and they are the worst kind of racist) they are found at the low levels of the social ladder. Exposing your racist beliefs is a sign of unintelligence and backward thinking. Inherent racism passed down from our families is something that society has a problem attacking because there is no way to measure it, thus no way to know whether it is still a problem or not.
 
Law2Doc said:
Okay. Then put down your ethnicity as Canadian. As long as you are being honest and not seeking to get into a category you aren't entitled to claim, I really don't think any adcom will care.
Click to expand...

What's that supposed to mean? Is this some sort of attempt at a rant at URM who use it to their advantage when applying? It souns like you are bordering on it because I have heard similar arguements from people. You clearly didn't understand the distinction between race and ethnicity, and that was proven. I don't know why you would say "...As long as you are being honest and not seeking to get into a category you aren't entitled to claim...".
 
akinf said:
What's that supposed to mean? Is this some sort of attempt at a rant at URM who use it to their advantage when applying? It souns like you are bordering on it because I have heard similar arguements from people. You clearly didn't understand the distinction between race and ethnicity, and that was proven. I don't know why you would say "...As long as you are being honest and not seeking to get into a category you aren't entitled to claim...".
Click to expand...

I read this thread and I don't think he meant it like that at all. Chillax, just have a good time here :thumbup:

Everyone gets so defensive in these types of threads it's kind of crazy.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Next unread thread

Similar threads

J
Ethnicity/Race
Replies
6
Views
818
Mr.Smile12
Mr.Smile12
S
Difference between PTE and CTE Deadline
Replies
21
Views
892
Sandman23
S
Mr.Smile12
[NPR] New race/ethnicity identification format proposed for US Census and federal data keeping
Replies
2
Views
265
Mr.Smile12
Mr.Smile12
P
How do adcoms make the difference between good, bad, and excellent clinical experience
Replies
2
Views
682
LizzyM
LizzyM
P
Help deciding between non-clinical and clinical volunteering!
Replies
11
Views
513
quintapov
Q
Top