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ArtsyArtist25 said:
I have 2 interviews, one of which is a top school, so I shouldn't really be complaining but this application cycle is just making me kinda sad.
🙁
Anyone else feel like this?
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Why are you sad? If it’s because you only have 2 interviews, be happy. There are thousands of applicants with no IIs. So find a hobby, add some new ECs, keep buffing up your application in case you have to reapply, keep yourself busy. It’s a long cycle and you don’t want to spend the next 8 months sad.
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
Idk I just feel weighed down, and so alone in this lol. I don't even know if they would take me post-interview.
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Just a little imposter syndrome. We all have it. Also, resist the urge to compare yourself to the SDN superstars. Something like 65% of applicants are going to be unsuccessful this cycle. Two IIs, including one top school, before the end of September is really extremely good. You should actually be pretty proud of yourself rather than feeling down! Just remember, you are not alone here!! 🙂
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
You are right.
I am trying sigh. I really hope I don't need to reapply.
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I do too. You’ll be fine. Are you still in school? Maybe go to,student services and get some counseling . What you are feeling is probably a bit of anxiety caused by the waiting. You’ll be fine but it’s good to talk about it to a non biased person. Good luck.
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
Thank you all🙂 I feel a little less alone. Yes, I am in school. Maybe I will go to counseling. That is a good idea. I feel like I really need to talk it out with someone. I can't really talk about it with friends because I am naturally quieter and have trouble speaking up in group situations, especially about myself. But, a counselor feels like a good idea.
Good luck to you all too!
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Or.. you can just talk it out with us, since 99%+ of us are going through exactly what you are. I clearly don't know you at all, so can't know whether or not you really need counseling. I just know that you should be very proud of yourself for making it to this point and having two IIs, so, if you're sad about it, maybe something else is going on? I also know you are not alone -- 65,000 applicants and 22,000 seats. Tons of anxiety, everywhere, including SDN.

This is my favorite post from 5 minutes ago. Hopefully it will cheer you up!:

forums.studentdoctor.net

2021-2022 University of Southern California (Keck)

Caught BU this morning, still standing here but we'll see for how long I caught both of them in the span of 12 hours lol
forums.studentdoctor.net forums.studentdoctor.net
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
Thanks friend! 🙂 I appreciate it. Idk I just have lots of pressure like everywhere to get through this cycle, and it is getting a bit overwhelming sigh.
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My pleasure! Again, come back anytime, or feel free to shoot me a DM. It's a long cycle, and most of us are here to try to support each other.

Just remember that all of us, other than those at the very top, are going through exactly what you are going through, and feeling exactly what you are feeling -- the anxiety, if not the sadness.
 
I just wanted to say that it is completely valid to feel sad/disappointed/anxious about the cycle regardless of how many interviews you've received!

Statistically speaking, I'm having a fairly successful application cycle so far but that doesn't mean I don't feel nervous about performing in interviews and getting accepted. Obviously, I am extremely grateful for these opportunities, but that doesn't mean I'm not allowed to feel sad and disappointed while I wait to hear from other schools.

Yes, having two interviews at this point is AWESOME and a lot more than most people will get, but that doesn't invalidate your other feelings!

This is an extremely drawn out, stressful, and draining process. I am feeling super burnt out myself these days and you are absolutely not alone in this.

Easier said than done, but remember to take care yourself and seek outside support if needed!
 
It’s definitely not unwarranted, especially if you came into the cycle hoping for better results. I’m kind of in the same boat. Got 3 in 1.5 weeks and nothing in almost 4 weeks.

I think that applicants in the middle have it the worst. Applicants with more invites than they know what to with can breathe easy. Applicants with none either weren’t expecting many or know they’ll have to begin preparing for next year.

edit: finally go another after posting in this thread. Maybe it was good luck
 
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ArtsyArtist25 said:
Thank you all🙂 I feel a little less alone. Yes, I am in school. Maybe I will go to counseling. That is a good idea. I feel like I really need to talk it out with someone. I can't really talk about it with friends because I am naturally quieter and have trouble speaking up in group situations, especially about myself. But, a counselor feels like a good idea.
Good luck to you all too!
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I think it has to do with the every day-ness of not hearing anything from so many schools. I have a few IIs and I also feel down (which I know is dumb but still). So much anticipation. So many days of nothing. I think if I had applied to less schools I would not feel quite this way.
 
itsjustme2021 said:
I think it has to do with the every day-ness of not hearing anything from so many schools. I have a few IIs and I also feel down (which I know is dumb but still). So much anticipation. So many days of nothing. I think if I had applied to less schools I would not feel quite this way.
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Nope. Trust me. If you applied to less schools, you'd feel even worse, questioning why you didn't apply to more schools, and whether it's too late to add more. If you don't believe me, just search both here and reddit, and see all the posts asking that very question.

Remember -- you applied to lots of schools to give yourself lots of shots. In the beginning, intellectually, you knew the odds at each school were low. Now it's just playing out in real time.

Some IIs are great. More are better, and none suck, although it is still early. No one really expects to get a lot when they begin, not even most of the stars. The thing now, at least for me, is the anxiety created by seeing all the IIs going out to others while I wait and nothing happens. Much more so than being sad because I applied to lots of schools and don't have lots of IIs.
 
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KnightDoc said:
Nope. Trust me. If you applied to less schools, you'd feel even worse, questioning why you didn't apply to more schools, and whether it's too late to add more. If you don't believe me, just search both here and reddit, and see all the posts asking that very question.

Remember -- you applied to lots of schools to give yourself lots of shots. In the beginning, intellectually, you knew the odds at each school were low. Now it's just playing out in real time.

Some IIs are great. More are better, and none suck, although it is still early. No one really expects to get a lot when they begin, not even most of the stars. The thing now, at least for me, is seeing all the IIs going out to others while I wait and nothing happens. Much more so than being sad because I applied to lots of schools and don't have lots of IIs.
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Well thought out and of course you are right. Thank you. I thought I was prepared for this, but ugh.
Good luck to you!
 
itsjustme2021 said:
Well thought out and of course you are right. Thank you. I thought I was prepared for this, but ugh.
Good luck to you!
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You too. The odds are high that we are going to be fine!! 🙂
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
Good luck to both of you. No amount of preparation would ever prepare us for this. 🙃
I guess we all just need to stay mentally strong.
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if someone cared enough to bring you in for an interview, it isnt to waste their time/yours. Its because they are strongly considering you, more than likely. You have gotten in the door so to speak, so that should reassure you that you are most definitely, good enough and have the potential.
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
Thanks, I really hope so. It is just that one of the schools that I interviewed at offers like 900 interviews so I only really have a 2/9 possibility of getting selected (its also MMI, so they don't really get to know me). The other interview is at a school that is a top one, and while I do have a ~50% chance of getting in as an in-state resident, I do have a 50% chance of not as well. I feel like I did well in both interviews, but my views might be overly positive, even though I felt like I established a connection with the interviewers in both cases.
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Are you sure you’re looking at acceptances and not matriculations. That looks low
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
I sent out a thank you note, and I only received a reply from the student interviewer. So, idk how that is being interpreted. Like, did they not like me? Was my impression that the interview went well false?
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It is gratuitous to thank you for a thank you note!
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
I see! So, it's not something I should really look into too much.
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NOT AT ALL!!! Someone said something about some old fart at Mayo actually caring about these, but even that is just an unsubstantiated rumor. All the adcoms say they don't matter AT ALL. Some schools actually discourage us from sending them.

The simple fact is, an evaluation of your performance is almost always drafted and submitted well before you'll send a thank you, unless you literally do it as soon as you sign off of Zoom. Sending them is the polite thing to do, and you should, but they do not impact admission decisions one way or the other.

Resist the urge to try to read tea leaves here. I cannot tell you how many friends were convinced their interviews went great and they had an A in the bag because an interviewer dropped a comment, either at the end of the interview or in response to a thank you note, telling them the interviewer hoped to see them on campus in the fall, only to receive WLs followed by Rs. The opposite also happens. Thank yous and the responses to them, or lack thereof, mean absolutely nothing here.
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
I was looking at matriculation. Idk about acceptances (all) in general.
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In general, acceptances run from around 1.5x to 2x or 3x matriculants, depending on the school, because everyone who is accepted cannot attend. Remember -- around half of all acceptees have more than one, and a lucky few have a ton of them! So, depending on the school, your odds are way better than 2 in 9! 🙂
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
Thanks, I really hope so. It is just that one of the schools that I interviewed at offers like 900 interviews so I only really have a 2/9 possibility of getting selected (its also MMI, so they don't really get to know me). The other interview is at a school that is a top one, and while I do have a ~50% chance of getting in as an in-state resident, I do have a 50% chance of not as well. I feel like I did well in both interviews, but my views might be overly positive, even though I felt like I established a connection with the interviewers in both cases.
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The particular school you're talking about turns about 40% of it's IIs into As, and you're way above it's median stats, so you should be fine!
 
KnightDoc said:
In general, acceptances run from around 1.5x to 2x or 3x matriculants, depending on the school, because everyone who is accepted cannot attend. Remember -- around half of all acceptees have more than one, and a lucky few have a ton of them! So, depending on the school, your odds are way better than 2 in 9! 🙂
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Really?? I had no idea. That brings me some rejuvenated hope!
 
itsjustme2021 said:
Really?? I had no idea. That brings me some rejuvenated hope!
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Totally. Everywhere. No one has a yield approaching 100%, no matter how intimidating it all seems now.

NYU has one of the highest yields in the country, since it's T5 and free tuition. Even they accept around 150 to fill around 90 seats (not including MD/PhD). Harvard, which probably has the highest yield in the country because, well, it's Haarvahd, typically accepts around 230 to enroll around 165. Most other schools have yields far below this, which means they have to accept way more than one person to fill every available seat (typically 2x to 3x, including people called off of WLs, which is a very significant number at some schools).
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
Thanks, I really hope so. It is just that one of the schools that I interviewed at offers like 900 interviews so I only really have a 2/9 possibility of getting selected (its also MMI, so they don't really get to know me). The other interview is at a school that is a top one, and while I do have a ~50% chance of getting in as an in-state resident, I do have a 50% chance of not as well. I feel like I did well in both interviews, but my views might be overly positive, even though I felt like I established a connection with the interviewers in both cases.
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Also, remember that those chances are aggregate over the whole season. At some schools your chances of acceptance are greater if you're in the first batch of interviews as compared to the last. So 50% over the whole season may lean higher if you have already interviewed there
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
I just don't really know what to believe, like idk this might sound silly, but I sent out a thank you note, and I only received a reply from the student interviewer. So, idk how that is being interpreted. Like, did they not like me? Was my impression that the interview went well false?
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sometimes people get busy/forget to reply. When I was on the selection committee for residency, this girl sent a really heartfelt thank you note. I remember thinking "oh wow, what a kind genuine person I like her". My brain got sidetracked..two weeks later..."did I reply to that note? ooops...well may be too awkward to reply now" lol.

they have a lot going on, its easy to forget things or get busy. I doubt they intentionally didnt reply because they didn't like you.
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
This really makes me feel better. I genuinely feel like I connected with my interview. The interview was supposed to end in 30 minutes, but we went on talking for an extra 20 minutes. So, I really sincerely hope that everything went fine.
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pro tip if a physician/admin talks to you past the alloted time, they're not doing it out of pity, its because they like you.
 
Posts like these are funny, while I sit over here with absolutely no interviews at all. Literally from only pod schools. Be happy, you worked hard and earned it. You have one last step. There is no reason for you not to get an acceptance if admissions likes how your interview goes. They clearly sent you an interview super early.
 
Sixen said:
Posts like these are funny, while I sit over here with absolutely no interviews at all. Literally from only pod schools. Be happy, you worked hard and earned it. You have one last step. There is no reason for you not to get an acceptance if admissions likes how your interview goes. They clearly sent you an interview super early.
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This is just not true. At most schools the deciding factor post II is not how the interview goes. Usually they rank all candidates after scoring their entire application. Interview is a small component of this score. Everybody is not equal coming into the interview. Many Adcoms have verified the step model of admissions
 
Sixen said:
Posts like these are funny, while I sit over here with absolutely no interviews at all. Literally from only pod schools. Be happy, you worked hard and earned it. You have one last step. There is no reason for you not to get an acceptance if admissions likes how your interview goes. They clearly sent you an interview super early.
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You applied to MD schools and podiatry schools? Dang, good planning ahead. I usually don't see people do both of those concurrently.
 
Sixen said:
Posts like these are funny, while I sit over here with absolutely no interviews at all. Literally from only pod schools. Be happy, you worked hard and earned it. You have one last step. There is no reason for you not to get an acceptance if admissions likes how your interview goes. They clearly sent you an interview super early.
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Did you apply the DO route as well?
 
I feel you. I had an interview at my top choice as well and I’m waiting to hear back. But as the cycle progresses I’ve been reflecting on the past few years - there are many things in my life I’ve neglected, like family and making meaningful memories and my mental health, just to get into medical school. And if I get accepted I’d have to uproot my life and where I live surrounded by loved ones and do this all over again in a totally different state. I think we feel this way right now because of fatigue and stress. This whole journey is a never-ending struggle. If we get accepted we’ll celebrate for a few months then go through this all over again working our butts off in medical school. Try to stay positive though. We worked hard and it’s all coming into fruition. Like others have said, getting an interview is a huge success by itself.
 
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My point still stands for everyone who doesn't like my comment lol. You should be happy. There's thousands of others who wish they got interviews. Celebrate yourself! There is no reason to feel sad about where you are. You've made it far and you obviously pique the interest of admissions.
 
voxveritatisetlucis said:
This is just not true. At most schools the deciding factor post II is not how the interview goes. Usually they rank all candidates after scoring their entire application. Interview is a small component of this score. Everybody is not equal coming into the interview. Many Adcoms have verified the step model of admissions
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My point is, those that get acceptances don't bomb interviews. Admissions likes them. Show up, present yourself well.. and if they take a liking to you this is how you get an acceptance.

Believe it or not, this is how it works everywhere in the world. More "qualified" applicants get jobs over others all the time based on mere personal interactions. Bottom line is, if you got an interview, they already deemed you qualified enough to attend their institution.
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
I just don't really know what to believe, like idk this might sound silly, but I sent out a thank you note, and I only received a reply from the student interviewer. So, idk how that is being interpreted. Like, did they not like me? Was my impression that the interview went well false?
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Not silly, but outright foolish to try to discern a hidden meaning in a note from someone being polite to you.
 
KnightDoc said:
NOT AT ALL!!! Someone said something about some old fart at Mayo actually caring about these, but even that is just an unsubstantiated rumor. All the adcoms say they don't matter AT ALL. Some schools actually discourage us from sending them.

The simple fact is, an evaluation of your performance is almost always drafted and submitted well before you'll send a thank you, unless you literally do it as soon as you sign off of Zoom. Sending them is the polite thing to do, and you should, but they do not impact admission decisions one way or the other.

Resist the urge to try to read tea leaves here. I cannot tell you how many friends were convinced their interviews went great and they had an A in the bag because an interviewer dropped a comment, either at the end of the interview or in response to a thank you note, telling them the interviewer hoped to see them on campus in the fall, only to receive WLs followed by Rs. The opposite also happens. Thank yous and the responses to them, or lack thereof, mean absolutely nothing here.
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This is dead wrong for Mayo. Please don't spread this advice. I was explicitly told by adcoms at Mayo to submit thank you notes and LOIs.
 
voxveritatisetlucis said:
I think that more people should try posting in this thread. Seems to be lucky. Received another one after posting in it again. Good luck thread!
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Haha, and you thought your cycle was over/winding down.

Idk about good luck because I got my first rejection today. Pritzker, which I honestly really liked. Oh well.

On the plus side, I got a T5 II a few days ago, so still riding on that high.
 
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Revan47 said:
This is dead wrong for Mayo. Please don't spread this advice. I was explicitly told by adcoms at Mayo to submit thank you notes and LOIs.
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Okay, but do they explicitly tell this to everyone? Or is this some secret thing you need to know by paying attention on SDN or by having direct contact with whoever told you?

Do you honestly believe they don't accept candidates who score highly on whatever matrix they use to evaluate candidates, but don't kiss their butts with thank yous and LOIs?

I totally get that neurotic people looking for an edge will do anything, but I really don't get that a T10 school is so into playing games that you need to comply with unwritten rules in order to be allowed to attend their esteemed institution. If they put this writing and put everyone on notice, like they do with prereqs, secondaries and application deadlines, that's another story. Do they?
 
KnightDoc said:
Okay, but do they explicitly tell this to everyone? Or is this some secret thing you need to know by paying attention on SDN or by having direct contact with whoever told you?

Do you honestly believe they don't accept candidates who score highly on whatever matrix they use to evaluate candidates, but don't kiss their butts with thank yous and LOIs?

I totally get that neurotic people looking for an edge will do anything, but I really don't get that a T10 school is so into playing games that you need to comply with unwritten rules in order to be allowed to attend their esteemed institution. If they put this writing and put everyone on notice, like they do with prereqs, secondaries and application deadlines, that's another story. Do they?
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Pretty sure they tell many of their interviewees this. I was told by three separate people at the end of each of my interviews/student sessions that, if I liked Mayo, I absolutely needed to send LOIs and thank you notes. Didn’t seem like they were trying to hide it or that it was an unwritten rule at all. Several others I know who interviewed at Mayo consistently got this message loud and clear. I believe the phrase they like to use is “Mayo highly values communication.” Maybe it’s not broadcasted to the whole public, but it was certainly a clear and recurring theme they present to interviewees.
 
KnightDoc said:
Okay, but do they explicitly tell this to everyone? Or is this some secret thing you need to know by paying attention on SDN or by having direct contact with whoever told you?

Do you honestly believe they don't accept candidates who score highly on whatever matrix they use to evaluate candidates, but don't kiss their butts with thank yous and LOIs?

I totally get that neurotic people looking for an edge will do anything, but I really don't get that a T10 school is so into playing games that you need to comply with unwritten rules in order to be allowed to attend their esteemed institution. If they put this writing and put everyone on notice, like they do with prereqs, secondaries and application deadlines, that's another story. Do they?
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Yea, I second both of the above commenters. Mayo is huge on Thank You letters and LOIs. One of very few schools that cares. The vast majority don't. One of my friends is currently an MS2 there, and often makes fun of how Mayo basically wants the applicants that beg the most to get in (he himself having begged and gotten in).

I'm not sure how much Penn cares, but they have a whole section on my portal dedicated to Thank You notes, and asks us to send copies of our thank you notes to the admissions office as well to add to our application packet.
 
ArtsyArtist25 said:
Thank you all🙂 I feel a little less alone. Yes, I am in school. Maybe I will go to counseling. That is a good idea. I feel like I really need to talk it out with someone. I can't really talk about it with friends because I am naturally quieter and have trouble speaking up in group situations, especially about myself. But, a counselor feels like a good idea.
Good luck to you all too!
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40% of students admitted to an MD program only had 1 interview. 2-3 is the average. You’re doing GREAT!!!
 
Amendres said:
40% of students admitted to an MD program only had 1 interview. 2-3 is the average. You’re doing GREAT!!!
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Absolutely not true!!! Relatively few schools admit half or more of all their interviewees. I go out of my way to be as supportive as anyone, but I make a concerted effort not to give false confidence. It's pretty rare to get an A with only one II. Nowhere near 40%. 22.7% in the 2019-20 cycle, and that will almost certainly have gone down last year with the 18% surge in applicants.

Obviously, the more IIs the greater the chance of an A, but there is no "average." The median for matriculants is 3, but the average is far higher, since a significant number of stars have 10+.

A little less than 60% of matriculants had 3 or fewer IIs, which means over 40% had 4 or more. 3 is the number where you can start feeling good about receiving an A, due to average admit rates at schools, but, even then, there are no guarantees. People with 5 IIs get shut out and, as mentioned above, it is possible to get in with one II. But the odds of that happening suck, and far less than 40% of med students only had one II.

As I said before, one II is really nothing to be sad about in the beginning of October, because it's an excellent leading indicator of more to come. Unless and until I received an A, however, I wouldn't relax. And I certainly would not be confident about converting a single II into an A. The odds are definitely against that happening, unless the II is at a school with a 70%+ post-II A rate.
 
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KnightDoc said:
Absolutely not true!!! Relatively few schools admit half or more of all their interviewees. I go out of my way to be as supportive as anyone, but I make a concerted effort not to give false confidence. It's pretty rare to get an A with only one II. Nowhere near 40%. 22.7% in the 2019-20 cycle, and that will almost certainly have gone down last year with the 18% surge in applicants.

Obviously, the more IIs the greater the chance of an A, but there is no "average." The median for matriculants is 3, but the average is far higher, since a significant number of stars have 10+.

A little less than 60% of matriculants had 3 or fewer IIs, which means over 40% had 4 or more. 3 is the number where you can start feeling good about receiving an A, due to average admit rates at schools, but, even then, there are no guarantees. People with 5 IIs get shut out and, as mentioned above, it is possible to get in with one II. But the odds of that happening suck, and far less than 40% of med students only had one II.

As I said before, one II is really nothing to be sad about in the beginning of October, because it's an excellent leading indicator of more to come. Unless and until I received an A, however, I wouldn't relax. And I certainly would not be confident about converting a single II into an A. The odds are definitely against that happening, unless the II is at a school with a 70%+ post-II A rate.
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Additional IIs generally mean that overall you're likely a stronger candidate too. If you get just 1 II, you are more likely to be an edge case at just that school. There are probably exceptions depending on personal ties, and II school selectivity, but generally speaking.
 
msummer said:
Additional IIs generally mean that overall you're likely a stronger candidate too. If you get just 1 II, you are more likely to be an edge case at just that school. There are probably exceptions depending on personal ties, and II school selectivity, but generally speaking.
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Yes and no. I don't mean to argue for the sake of arguing, but having more than 20% of the national med school class only having had one II suggests something other than most or all of them being a borderline case at a single school. First of all, a significant number of them are likely ED applicants.

In addition to that, a single II can be related to bad timing (late application) or bad luck, as well as a bad application, so I'd stay away from a conclusion that a single II makes you a weaker candidate. I'd just stick to the numbers sucking for someone with a single II who is not an ED applicant, and leave it at that! 🙂
 
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