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Past advice
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Did you follow through with advice given you? Are you going after a PhD (for the NIH IRTA)?

You received a list before
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After 4 gap years, your purpose, accomplishments, mission fit, and communication/application didn't sound aligned with the schools on your lists. A few on your list should have given you an interview if you did match missions.
 
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Mr.Smile12 said:
Past advice
forums.studentdoctor.net

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forums.studentdoctor.net forums.studentdoctor.net

Did you follow through with advice given you? Are you going after a PhD (for the NIH IRTA)?

You received a list before
forums.studentdoctor.net

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forums.studentdoctor.net forums.studentdoctor.net

After 4 gap years, your purpose, accomplishments, mission fit, and communication/application didn't sound aligned with the schools on your lists. A few on your list should have given you an interview if you did match missions.
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Not interested in pursuing a PhD. I thought doing a NIH IRTA could help with getting pubs.
 
Hey! I’m not an expert by any means but I think a lot of people would say that your school list is a bit top heavy. Plus your school list also includes a decent amount of out of state schools that have heavy in state biases. How would you describe your writing?
 
Without knowing your specific purpose as a physician, I don't see going to "get more pubs" as a plus unless you are focused on a research-oriented program or career.

Your master's in health data sciences likely didn't satisfy concerns that you wanted to be a physician if balanced against your track record in clinical/non-clinical settings (can't tell the chronology from the description). Frankly your activities look good though a precise breakdown would be nice (hours in homeless shelter vs. tutoring)... though they may be low given the range of schools you applied to.

Your undergrad GPA doesn't look like it warrants an SMP. Your MCAT is high enough to be considered by many programs, but you may have overshot your target range. I think a few UC schools may offer reapplication chats. I would be interested in their suggestions regarding your activities (if there is anything really obviously missing).

Many of us have posted we want to see a narrative that is supported by your activities and reflections towards a health professional career. The aspect we can't assess is your application materials, and getting zero II's at this time suggests this wasn't enough to move adcoms to an II. Maybe this could change tomorrow or in a month, but you need more critical feedback, especially from your undergrad prehealth advisors (if they issued a committee letter, at least with an update).
 
Could be the school list which is a mix of top heavy and low yield. And/or the LoRs being a mix of an old committee letter and individual letters that may not meet LoR guidelines for many schools. Were you not able to get your committee letter’s date updated? Or get individual undergrad letters updated? For updates to schools, a more targeted update to specific schools may have been better.

Unless your mcat expired, not sure retaking is worth it, same about the additional masters. Do the NIH if it interests you but not for the purpose of getting into a school. Reading between the lines, are you wanting to improve your profile to target the same school list? If so, consider rethinking that approach. I think you will get better mileage cleaning up your application and the school list.

Added: based on the advice you received in the previous thread, did you do 50 hours of primary care shadowing?
 
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Smart-hair said:
I applied to 30+ medical schools in June and submitted all secondaries between late July and early August. So far, I’ve only gotten 1 pre-II hold and nothing else. I sent an update letter back in November to all the schools that accept pre-II updates.

Stats: CA Resident (non-URM) Ivy undergrad cGPA/sGPA: 3.74/3.71 Master’s Degree in Health Data Science: 4.0 MCAT: 513 (lowest section: CARS - 126) Gap Years: 4

LOR: 1 undergraduate committee letter (written in 2021) 2 master’s professors, 1 PI, 1 volunteer coordinator (all written in 2024)

Experience: Paid Clinical Work: 5,000 hours (Medical Assisting, Clinical Research) Clinical Volunteering: 200 hours (Hospice, Free Clinic) Non-Clinical Volunteering: 300 hours (Homeless Shelter, Tutoring) Research: 700 hours (Basic Science; no pubs) Shadowing: 25 hours (3 specialties)

School List: Albert Einstein, Arizona Phoenix, Arizona Tucson, Brown, Case Western, Colorado, Dartmouth, Drexel, Emory, Kaiser, Loyola, Massachusetts, Miami, Mount Sinai, NYMC, Penn State, Rosalind Franklin, Rush, Rutgers RWJ, Saint Louis, SKMC, Temple, Tufts, UC Davis, UC Irvine, UCLA, UCSD, USC Keck, USF, UVA, Wake Forest.

I’m planning my next gap year and exploring these options:
  1. Retake the MCAT
  2. Apply for a 1-Year Master’s in Biomedical Sciences
  3. Apply for a 1-year NIH Postbac IRTA Program
I’d appreciate any advice on which option might help me most for a re-application. Or, if you think there’s something else I should consider, please share your thoughts. Thanks.
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There's being competitive at your target schools. And there's presenting your qualifications effectively.

Regarding the former, it seems to me also that your list is a little top-heavy with perhaps too many stretch programs in it. I would recommend changing the programs you are applying to over retaking the MCAT (unless it's expiring or you really think you can do better ) or going for another masters degree.

Regarding presenting yourself effectively, I can't comment on your app obviously, but I recently reviewed an app and was amazed at how poorly this highly intelligent applicant had presented himself. Reflection on your experience including impact on you and others is critical. Are you demonstrating the qualities that med schools value? Are you showing "mission alignment" with the specific schools you are applying to? Or are you secondaries generic reruns? Is there congruence between what you say in important to you and what you've invested your time in?

The last few questions were raised in my most recent interviews with med school admissions directors, one of which was published this week. The other will be up in a bit.

Hope this helps.
 
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As mentioned already, your school list had many options that were unrealistic for multiple reasons.

Albert Einstein, Arizona Phoenix, Arizona Tucson, Brown, Case Western, Colorado, Dartmouth, Drexel, Emory, Kaiser, Loyola, Massachusetts, Miami, Mount Sinai, NYMC, Penn State, Rosalind Franklin, Rush, Rutgers RWJ, Saint Louis, SKMC, Temple, Tufts, UC Davis, UC Irvine, UCLA, UCSD, USC Keck, USF, UVA, Wake Fore

That's about a dozen appropriate schools out of the the 30ish you applied to. And Einstein, UCI, UCD and Colorado are already on the more competitive side.

You had about 6 months from your post last year to get shadowing and non-clinical volunteering. It appears you only got half the amount suggested for shadowing and I assume a minimal amount of the 300 was at the homeless shelter.
 
Mr.Smile12 said:
Without knowing your specific purpose as a physician, I don't see going to "get more pubs" as a plus unless you are focused on a research-oriented program or career.

Your master's in health data sciences likely didn't satisfy concerns that you wanted to be a physician if balanced against your track record in clinical/non-clinical settings (can't tell the chronology from the description). Frankly your activities look good though a precise breakdown would be nice (hours in homeless shelter vs. tutoring)... though they may be low given the range of schools you applied to.

Your undergrad GPA doesn't look like it warrants an SMP. Your MCAT is high enough to be considered by many programs, but you may have overshot your target range. I think a few UC schools may offer reapplication chats. I would be interested in their suggestions regarding your activities (if there is anything really obviously missing).

Many of us have posted we want to see a narrative that is supported by your activities and reflections towards a health professional career. The aspect we can't assess is your application materials, and getting zero II's at this time suggests this wasn't enough to move adcoms to an II. Maybe this could change tomorrow or in a month, but you need more critical feedback, especially from your undergrad prehealth advisors (if they issued a committee letter, at least with an update).
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I am interested in a research-oriented career. I would like to become an academic physician.
 
Smart-hair said:
If I end up re-applying, I will likely re-apply to the same school list, but with some extra schools added on.

I tried reaching out to primary care clinics, but they wouldn’t allow shadowing. The hours That I got we’re from a mix of different specialties (physiatry, ortho, pulm)
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Why would you not make some adjustments to your current school list? You have gotten some excellent advice but it seems you really aren’t interested in the advice. You have a few schools on your list that value high levels of service to the unserved in the community. They expect and get hundreds if not thousands of hours of service from their applicants.
If you have to reapply will you wait and apply in 2027 or will you apply right away for 2026? Maybe consider rebuilding your entire application. Read everything, move things around, carefully read expectations for specific schools and make sure you have met those expectations. I think this will this be your third application cycle. Is that correct? What significant improvement did you make between your first and second cycle? IMO It’s time to revamp your application.
 
Smart-hair said:
My clinical and non-clinical volunteer hours are much higher now since I submitted my primary. This will help me with applying to the volunteer focused medical schools. I plan to complete a few publications by May, with one being first author, which will help me with applying to the research focused medical schools.

If I have to take another gap year, my top choice would be to do the NIH IRTA and volunteering/shadowing on the side.
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Your clinical volunteer hours don't matter. You had thousands of hours from working clinical jobs to get patient exposure. I don't know how many more hours you got at the homeless shelter since applying, but Loyola and Rush typically expect hundreds of hours. The publication is not going to make schools like Sinai and Case interested, and none of these factors change the fact that RWJ and Arizona Tuscon are predominantly for in-state residents, with many of the others either attending high school or undergrad in those states.
 
Smart-hair said:
Since starting, I have now accumulated about 250 volunteer hours at the homeless shelter, which I am plan to continue into next year.

I’m planning to submit one first-author and a couple co-author papers for publication by May and hopefully get some more through the NIH IRTA program next year.
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Those hours gained are good. If you are reapplying this summer, those publications aren’t likely to be accepted by journals by that point. Your best bet is to apply to the list provided in your previous WAMC and include a handful of extra schools you particularly like (I assume they are probably the CA ones).
 
Smart-hair said:
For my personal statement, I used Dr. Ryan Gray’s approach (planting a seed + watering events + reflections)

For my work and activities section I used a mixture of story, learning, and impact for each activity.
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Unfortunately, the full use of Dr. Gray's approach often makes an application somewhat painful to read.
 
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Med Ed said:
Unfortunately, the full application Dr. Gray's approach often makes an application somewhat painful to read.
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Is Dr. Gray the one who has applicants writing a PS composed of individual anecdotes, each supposedly illustrating why the applicant would be a good doctor, each anecdote followed by an annoying conclusion like "that quality is essential for a good physician"? Because if he is, he is the applicant's worst enemy. Those PS come off as really fake.
 
LunaOri said:
Is Dr. Gray the one who has applicants writing a PS composed of individual anecdotes, each supposedly illustrating why the applicant would be a good doctor, each anecdote followed by an annoying conclusion like "that quality is essential for a good physician"? Because if he is, he is the applicant's worst enemy. Those PS come off as really fake.
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The fluorescent lights gleamed on the pale white enamel of the bedpan. It was the third hour of my half-day shadowing experience on the geriatric ward.
 
Smart-hair said:
So right these are my top three choices for next gap year:

NIH IRTA
Master’s in biomedical sciences
Post bacc with guaranteed linkage
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You dont need to do a Post-bac..your grades and MCAT are fine. Just get whatever job youre happiest with. Keep volunteering and overhaul every single essay.
 
Smart-hair said:
But I could send schools update letters if I do get publications.
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You are placing a lot more value on these things. It is a nice addition on top, but none of the 30+ schools you applied to interviewed you. You've already seen that an update letter did not lead to anything this cycle either. Taking more classes or doing the NIH are not the best bang for your buck. If you need a certain amount of money, then you can take an NIH or other research job.
 
Mr.Smile12 said:
Depending on execution, the approach makes it pretty easy to screen a candidate out, though it may work for a few screeners.
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Can you elaborate on why this approach makes it easy to screen candidates out?
 
forthejoy5 said:
Can you elaborate on why this approach makes it easy to screen candidates out?
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🙄 is not a good response that my screeners give when they say, "not another one of these essays." When you read a few hundred essays, you see all the tricks people use to write their essays. If anything, adhering to these crutches/strategies too much just waters down the impact of your essays because it makes you sound like a subset of other essays that don't accomplish the task for passing the screening rubrics.

I usually pass the PS whenever I see, "To whom it may concern."
 
LunaOri said:
Is Dr. Gray the one who has applicants writing a PS composed of individual anecdotes, each supposedly illustrating why the applicant would be a good doctor, each anecdote followed by an annoying conclusion like "that quality is essential for a good physician"? Because if he is, he is the applicant's worst enemy. Those PS come off as really fake.
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A bit off-topic but I used Dr. Gray's method when writing my PS and W/A section, I also read his book. I tried to keep two goals in mind when answering the PS, let the reader know how I came to understand why I wanted to be a physician and inform them of moments where that desire was reaffirmed through my clinical experiences. I don't think Dr. Gray advocates for applicants to tell the reader why they would make a good physician, just to include anecdotes and reflections that show why these anecdotes drew the applicant closer to medicine.

Edit: I think a lot of people misunderstand this method and it can come across as flowery or miss the mark in terms of how you reflect. I hope the applicant in this thread was able to authentically convey their thought process and desire for a career in medicine. If not, they should most definitely start from scratch.
 
stew_md said:
A bit off-topic but I used Dr. Gray's method when writing my PS and W/A section, I also read his book. I tried to keep two goals in mind when answering the PS, let the reader know how I came to understand why I wanted to be a physician and inform them of moments where that desire was reaffirmed through my clinical experiences. I don't think Dr. Gray advocates for applicants to tell the reader why they would make a good physician, just to include anecdotes and reflections that show why these anecdotes drew the applicant closer to medicine.

Edit: I think a lot of people misunderstand this method and it can come across as flowery or miss the mark in terms of how you reflect. I hope the applicant in this thread was able to authentically convey their thought process and desire for a career in medicine. If not, they should most definitely start from scratch.
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I can't say for all applicants, but many forego the key step of journaling before starting their essay drafts.

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Practicing the Art of Reflection with a Prehealth Journal (or Podcast, or Online Blog) | SDN

This article focuses on reflective practices for health professional education and training. This advice can apply to developing a prehealth journal,
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I will state my opinion very strongly: anecdotes do not belong in W/A. The fewer characters you have in any secondary essay prompt, the less appropriate "setting up a scene/context" becomes. No humor, and don't describe yourself as a tragic character.
 
Smart-hair said:
I’m not sure how I can re-write my personal statement from scratch. I feel like my fundamental experiences for wanting to go into medicine and structure of my narrative would have to be the same.
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It could be that the narrative conveyed in your personal statement came across as inauthentic. I would start from scratch.

For example. I read a personal statement recently where the opening paragraph asserted his experiences growing up in a rural foreign country with low healthcare access made them want to do everything they could to address those disparities. They then followed that paragraph up with anecdotes of working and shadowing with orthopedic surgeons coupled with weak reflections on those experiences. It made me question their motivations. Did they want to be a doctor to help address healthcare disparities? Or do they want to become a surgeon? It didn’t make sense to me and it came across as unauthentic.

At the end of your ps, what you have laid out needs to make sense! You need the reader to walk away understanding your motivations for a career in medicine.

Additionally, it’s possible that your ps on its own is strong, but maybe it doesn’t make sense in the context of the rest of your application.

For example, if you talk about in your ps about wanting to serve underserved populations in your community, but only have 50 hours of non-clinical volunteering, I would question your motivations.

You need to make sure each component of your written application looks good on its own, and also when viewed side-by-side.

I hope this makes sense.
 
Smart-hair said:
I’m not sure how I can re-write my personal statement from scratch. I feel like my fundamental experiences for wanting to go into medicine and structure of my narrative would have to be the same.
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The best applicants I know that a PS is just one story of many. They usually have 3 or 4 drafts because they have confidence talking about their experiences individually and deeply. Again: journaling is a first step.

I forewarn anyone applying to UCSD that their secondary essay is basically, "Thank you for your AMCAS personal essay. Can you write us a completely new one without repeating anything? Same character constraints."

The AAMC pre-professional competencies are a great tool. Organize vignettes that highlight each of the competencies, knowing that each experience you have addresses at least 2 or more of them at a time. Which combination of competencies show me that you have what it takes to be an outstanding physician to my family? That helps me score your essay on the rubric.

Read
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How to Assess Your Pre-Professional Competencies | SDN

In 2023, AAMC revised the AAMC Premed Competencies to align with the PREview situational judgment test, incorporate changes in medical education after the
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