MD 3.35 GPA, 516 MCAT2015 (~35)

[biopoet]

Hello,

I am applying to 30 MD schools (two-thirds lower tier, one-third mid tier) with a 3.35c/3.45s GPA from a very good school, with a generally upward trend in grades but some serious kinks.

I scored a 516 on the new MCAT, which is in the 95th percentile (~35 old MCAT).

Other details:

• Strong one-year research experience (ongoing) that will result in a quite-high impact authorship (submitted) and a couple of other OK papers.
• Lots of clinical volunteering and community service/outreach
• Physician shadowing a bit limited (only as a perk in one of my service experiences)
• Good writer, strong personal statement.
• Primary App Submission date July 7

I have a diverse & interesting background as an immigrant (US permanent resident), but white.

What are my chances?
Thanks!

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[biopoet]

Also - econ major!

 

[Faha]

Which schools have you applied to and where is your state of residence ?

 

[GrapesofRath]

Your chances are defiintely tied to some extent to your state of residency. If you happen to live in one of the luckier states(and these days you could say almost half the states in the US are lucky) your odds go up way more so than if you live in CA. Note schools and their 10th percentile GPA. Your cGPA is below the 10th for many schools(although your sGPA does cross the 10th percentile threshold at many lower tiers).

To maximize chances at acceptance apply to ALL lower tiers you can have a shot at(this is probably 25 or so schools in addition to the state schools). I can't recommend many mid tiers unless they are of the Hofstra type with lower GPA averages and higher MCAT averages. Give us your list we can probably help you add a couple more lower tiers to maximize those odds.

Edit: You'll also need a handful of DO schools regardless of where you end up applying.

 

[Goro]

The GPA is going to hurt. Ditto on request of school list.

 

[biopoet]

Your chances are defiintely tied to some extent to your state of residency. If you happen to live in one of the luckier states(and these days you could say almost half the states in the US are lucky) your odds go up way more so than if you live in CA. Note schools and their 10th percentile GPA. Your cGPA is below the 10th for many schools(although your sGPA does cross the 10th percentile threshold at many lower tiers).

To maximize chances at acceptance apply to ALL lower tiers you can have a shot at(this is probably 25 or so schools in addition to the state schools). I can't recommend many mid tiers unless they are of the Hofstra type with lower GPA averages and higher MCAT averages. Give us your list we can probably help you add a couple more lower tiers to maximize those odds.

Edit: You'll also need a handful of DO schools regardless of where you end up applying.

Thanks for the reply. I am a Maryland resident.

School list:

Albany
Cooper (Rowan)
Drexel
Eastern Virginia
Geisel (Dartmouth)
GWU
Georgetown
Hofstra
Howard
MC Wisconsin
NYMC
OHSU
Quinnipiac
Rosalind Franklin
Rush
Jefferson
Temple
Commonwealth
University of Miami Miller SOM
Tufts
Tulane
UCF COM
University of Louisville
University of Maryland
University of Rochester
University of Wisconsin
VCU
VTech
Wake Forest
Warren Alpert (Brown)

 

[md-2020]

Maryland is rough (I'm in MD as well). Cut Brown (unless you went to Brown), Dartmouth (big reach, 85% non-trad), Ohio State (OOS, big reach), and these OOS unfriendly schools: Louisville, UCF, Cooper, and Wisconsin. Note that Howard is a mission based HBCU.
Rochester and Tufts are your biggest remaining reaches.
Add Loyola and WVU.

But know that your GPA is an issue at all MD schools, but you might have a shot by applying broadly.

 

[GrapesofRath]

I can't recommend Howard, Ohio State, UCF, Louisville, Wisconsin or Brown. Dartmouth's only worth it if you are a non-traditional(note their average 1st year age is over 25).

Add: Western Michigan, Saint Louis, Creighton, Penn State, Vermont, Loyola, Oakland, maybe Wright State and WVU. If you want a big name MAYBE throw in Boston U. Note you are below the 10th percentile GPA wise for some of these schools (although sGPA should be above 10th for these schools) but to maximize your odds of acceptance apply anywhere you got a shot at, including lower tiers your GPA might be just below the 10th percentile for.

Gotta add DO's also; you should be fine for just about any.

 

[biopoet]

Maryland is rough (I'm in MD as well). Cut Brown (unless you went to Brown), Dartmouth (big reach, 85% non-trad), Ohio State (OOS, big reach), and these OOS unfriendly schools: Louisville, UCF, Cooper, and Wisconsin. Note that Howard is a mission based HBCU.
Rochester and Tufts are your biggest remaining reaches.
Add Loyola and WVU.

But know that your GPA is an issue at all MD schools, but you might have a shot by applying broadly.

I can't recommend Howard, Ohio State, UCF, Louisville, Wisconsin or Brown. Dartmouth's only worth it if you are a non-traditional(note their average 1st year age is over 25).

Add: Western Michigan, Saint Louis, Creighton, Penn State, Vermont, Loyola, Oakland, maybe Wright State and WVU. If you want a big name MAYBE throw in Boston U. Note you are below the 10th percentile GPA wise for some of these schools (although sGPA should be above 10th for these schools) but to maximize your odds of acceptance apply anywhere you got a shot at, including lower tiers your GPA might be just below the 10th percentile for.

Gotta add DO's also; you should be fine for just about any.

Are you recommending to cut Brown because of the acceptance rate? Their 10th percentile GPA seems to stretch down quite a bit (3.4 overall, 3.1 science). I didn't notice Dartmouth's non-trad trend - good to know.

Saint Louis seems to be very stringent (GPA 10th percentile 3.6c,3.5s). WVU, Penn State, BU, and Oakland are all 3.5c/3.4s. Vermont is 3.5c/3.5s. Western Michigan is 3.4c/3.3s but tiny class. Do you think these are worth it? Creighton requires physiology coursework unfortunately. Loyola & Wright State look a little more realistic.

I will reconsider DO schools.

As a side question, what steps are best to strengthen my credentials at this point? I recognize that my biggest weaknesses are GPA and not much shadowing. What's the best way to address the "smart but lazy" trait that high MCAT / low GPA suggests?

Lastly, how far does a demonstrated dedication to a particular school go?

 

[md-2020]

Are you recommending to cut Brown because of the acceptance rate?

As a side question, what steps are best to strengthen my credentials at this point? I recognize that my biggest weaknesses are GPA and not much shadowing. What's the best way to address the "smart but lazy" trait that high MCAT / low GPA suggests?

Lastly, how far does a demonstrated dedication to a particular school go?

Brown favors it's own undergrads heavily, in addition to a large chunk of PLME carry-overs. Shadow+volunteer are all that you can do at this point.

High MCAT/low GPA does not suggest "smart but lazy," unfortunately. It suggests that you lucked out/did well on a test. Applying to undergrad, my interviewer from Stanford said "you're a mold-perfect SEC athlete who somehow crushed the SAT." Now he was a huge d*ck, but my academic stats (3.3-3.4/2400) did match his point. I didn't get in, BTW.

Demonstrated dedication will not make a significant difference IMHO. Don't quote me on this one though.

Edit: Now real talk: you have a DO application w/ a high MCAT, so do not forget to do DO apps.

 

[biopoet]

Brown favors it's own undergrads heavily, in addition to a large chunk of PLME carry-overs. Shadow+volunteer are all that you can do at this point.

High MCAT/low GPA does not suggest "smart but lazy," unfortunately. It suggests that you lucked out/did well on a test. Applying to undergrad, my interviewer from Stanford said "you're a mold-perfect SEC athlete who somehow crushed the SAT." Now he was a huge d*ck, but my academic stats (3.3-3.4/2400) did match his point. I didn't get in, BTW.

Demonstrated dedication will not make a significant difference IMHO.

Thanks for the reply. I have to disagree with you that a 2400 SAT or a 35 MCAT suggests lucking out... talking to admissions people I've gotten the impression that the MCAT is an understated factor. Not that it excuses a bad GPA.

Aside from that, in your (and anyone's) opinion does a 3.35 GPA warrant extra coursework/a masters?

 

[GrapesofRath]

Are you recommending to cut Brown because of the acceptance rate? Their 10th percentile GPA seems to stretch down quite a bit (3.4 overall, 3.1 science). I didn't notice Dartmouth's non-trad trend - good to know.

Saint Louis seems to be very stringent (GPA 10th percentile 3.6c,3.5s). WVU, Penn State, BU, and Oakland are all 3.5c/3.4s. Vermont is 3.5c/3.5s. Western Michigan is 3.4c/3.3s but tiny class. Do you think these are worth it? Creighton requires physiology coursework unfortunately. Loyola & Wright State look a little more realistic.

I will reconsider DO schools.

As a side question, what steps are best to strengthen my credentials at this point? I recognize that my biggest weaknesses are GPA and not much shadowing. What's the best way to address the "smart but lazy" trait that high MCAT / low GPA suggests?

Lastly, how far does a demonstrated dedication to a particular school go?

Let's do this in order

1) Yeah your below the 10th percentile at those schools I listed. But them's the breaks. You still aren't out of the running necessairly just because of that. You're in a spot where you need to apply anywhere and everywhere you have an outside shot at. If you want to apply to 30 schools like you said, you are inevitably going to end up at schools where your GPA is below the 10th percentile. That's just how it is. 35 MCAT is an outstanding score; you have a shot at an MD. But you want to maximize your chances and that includes some schools where your GPA is just below the 10th but your MCAT is well above the median. Much better to apply to Oakland or Vermont than Ohio State or Rochester.
2) You are going to need DO schools. Pick a handful and give it ago.
3) The best thing you can do to improve your app is to take a gap year and improve your GPA. That's not going to happen so do two things a) write your most thoughtful essays possible and practice interview techniques b) try and take some post-bacc classes(even if it is DIY style) because there is a chance you'll be a reapplicant next year and you want an improved app if you are one. Doing some post-bacc classes on the side and acing them will help with that GPA and create an upward trend.
4) Demonstrated interest won't compensate for low GPA's. And what do you mean by demonstrated interest?

 

[NewHorizons]

Thanks for the reply. I have to disagree with you that a 2400 SAT or a 35 MCAT suggests lucking out... talking to admissions people I've gotten the impression that the MCAT is an understated factor. Not that it excuses a bad GPA.

Aside from that, in your (and anyone's) opinion does a 3.35 GPA warrant extra coursework/a masters?

Your chances of getting an outlier score on the MCAT once is higher than getting good grades for multiple years.

There are tons of people with similar MCATs to yours but with a higher GPA. You need at least a years worth of full year courses to lift it respectably.

 

[GrapesofRath]

Thanks for the reply. I have to disagree with you that a 2400 SAT or a 35 MCAT suggests lucking out... talking to admissions people I've gotten the impression that the MCAT is an understated factor. Not that it excuses a bad GPA.

Aside from that, in your (and anyone's) opinion does a 3.35 GPA warrant extra coursework/a masters?

Masters won't do jack squat for you. To raise your GPA you need post-bac or SMP work. I wouldn't advise for an SMP with a 3.4. A year of post-bacc either DIY or formally if aced will help alot and not only boost for GPA to 3.5 territory(which despite the 0.1 difference is a MUCH better bet for MD admission) and give you an upward trend as well which in some ways is kind of a de-facto requirement for someone applying with a low GPA.

But I think it is worth taking a stab this cycle. 3.4/35 has worked for others in the past and is probably a 50-50 kind of proposition; you just really need a broad list and to nail whatever II's you might get. My advice would be just to work on your GPA while you are applying if possible so if you are a reapplicant you don't have to waste another year and can just apply next year with a higher GPA.

Note you are fine for DO's. If that is something you are willing to consider there's no post-bac discussion necessary.

 

[biopoet]

Let's do this in order

1) Yeah your below the 10th percentile at those schools I listed. But them's the breaks. You still aren't out of the running necessairly just because of that. You're in a spot where you need to apply anywhere and everywhere you have an outside shot at. If you want to apply to 30 schools like you said, you are inevitably going to end up at schools where your GPA is below the 10th percentile. That's just how it is. 35 MCAT is an outstanding score; you have a shot at an MD. But you want to maximize your chances and that includes some schools where your GPA is just below the 10th but your MCAT is well above the median. Much better to apply to Oakland or Vermont than Ohio State or Rochester.
2) You are going to need DO schools. Pick a handful and give it ago.
3) The best thing you can do to improve your app is to take a gap year and improve your GPA. That's not going to happen so do two things a) write your most thoughtful essays possible and practice interview techniques b) try and take some post-bacc classes(even if it is DIY style) because there is a chance you'll be a reapplicant next year and you want an improved app if you are one. Doing some post-bacc classes on the side and acing them will help with that GPA and create an upward trend.
4) Demonstrated interest won't compensate for low GPA's. And what do you mean by demonstrated interest?

Thanks for the thorough response! Very helpful. By demonstrated interest I mean that I studied there (undergrad), a significant portion of my work & activities were there, and family ties (though not med).

 

[md-2020]

Thanks for the thorough response! Very helpful. By demonstrated interest I mean that I studied there (undergrad), a significant portion of my work & activities were there, and family ties (though not med).

I also have this for Maryland (minus the undergrad @ UMD), and don't expect too much out of it.

 

[GrapesofRath]

Thanks for the thorough response! Very helpful. By demonstrated interest I mean that I studied there (undergrad), a significant portion of my work & activities were there, and family ties (though not med).

The going to undergrad there can help to some extent depending on school. Other stuff doesn't mean squat. If we are talking going to U of Maryland for undergrad and applying to their med school sure it might be worth the application(especially IS) but realize Maryland's average GPA is 3.8+ territory now days. They are a school that has a higher GPA and lower MCAT average relatively speaking; not something that favors your strengths. A school like Hofstra is one that does favor your statistical strengths.

 

[Banco]

Your activities are good. Yeah your GPA is going to be below the 10%ile at a lot of schools, but your MCAT is in the upper ranges. I think you have a shot at MD but you will have to apply broadly. ~65% of applicants with your numbers end up getting accepted.

Hofstra and VTech seem to like high MCATs and have lower GPA medians.

 

[biopoet]

The going to undergrad there can help to some extent depending on school. Other stuff doesn't mean squat. If we are talking going to U of Maryland for undergrad and applying to their med school sure it might be worth the application(especially IS) but realize Maryland's average GPA is 3.8+ territory now days. They are a school that has a higher GPA and lower MCAT average relatively speaking; not something that favors your strengths. A school like Hofstra is one that does favor your statistical strengths.

Not talking UMD but yes I realize that stats are far more significant than "demonstrating interest." I'm not banking on it lol