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[penguinsfan71]

I'm not an adcom but I know my school will be doing them all online. Although they finish interviews by December, I wonder if schools who do a lot spring interviews will be able to do those in person.

 

[Goro]

Spoke with 2 schools who said yes!

Online at mine.

 

[MoTheGreatish]

This information is on MSAR. Several schools have decided on virtual interviews this cycle, but it's definitely not the majority. Toledo is one that I saw.

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

I doubt any school will do in-person. What about applicants from their own UG? Will they ask them to come for in-person since they are in city/campus?

 

[KnightDoc]

I doubt any school will do in-person. What about applicants from their own UG? Will they ask them to come for in-person since they are in city/campus?

I'm sure if they are doing them online, they will do so for everyone. Why go to the trouble to do otherwise?

It's not just about travel -- it's also about limiting exposure for interviewers, greeters, staff, etc. If they are not having the whole full day presentation, what's the value of bringing someone in for a 30 minute interview, even if they are on the same campus, when it can easily be done online, as it will be for the other 90%+ of interviewees?

 

[ducks_are _the best]

Do you guys feel that there will be more interviews because everything is moving online? Or the same amount of people?

 

[KnightDoc]

Do you guys feel that there will be more interviews because everything is moving online? Or the same amount of people?

There was a vigorous debate about this a few weeks ago, with no resolution.

More interviews are more work for schools, and, all things being equal, will just result in a lower percentage of people being interviewed receiving offers.

On the other hand, it will also be easier for people to attend online interviews, so there is a real chance that top candidates will take interviews they would have turned down in the past, which will crowd out people who would have otherwise received those interviews. Those top candidates will also likely receive more multiple As, which will ultimately cause yields to go down, and for schools to later go deep into their WLs if they don't do something to control for this on the front end. More interviews would be one answer. More yield protecting would be another. Stay tuned!!!

 

[Darrow O'Lykos]

I doubt any school will do in-person. What about applicants from their own UG? Will they ask them to come for in-person since they are in city/campus?

I can't imagine adcoms would willingly introduce bias into the applicant pool by allowing only a select few applicants to interview in-person.

 

[Goro]

Interesting! Whole cycle? Or are you guys transitioning to in-person possibly during 2021?

Impossible to answer. I figure online at least through end of semester.

 

[Goro]

I doubt any school will do in-person. What about applicants from their own UG? Will they ask them to come for in-person since they are in city/campus?

Why would they do that? People's safety is at risk here.

 

[Goro]

There was a vigorous debate about this a few weeks ago, with no resolution.

More interviews are more work for schools, and, all things being equal, will just result in a lower percentage of people being interviewed receiving offers.

On the other hand, it will also be easier for people to attend online interviews, so there is a real chance that top candidates will take interviews they would have turned down in the past, which will crowd out people who would have otherwise received those interviews. Those top candidates will also likely receive more multiple As, which will ultimately cause yields to go down, and for schools to later go deep into their WLs if they don't do something to control for this on the front end. More interviews would be one answer. More yield protecting would be another. Stay tuned!!!

There are only so many "top candidates"

And while schools have their favorite floors as to stats, more schools will resource protect, because they know from historic norms that it's a waste of precious interview time and effort to get people who will go elsewhere.

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

I can't imagine adcoms would willingly introduce bias into the applicant pool by allowing only a select few applicants to interview in-person.

Some medical schools tends to take certain percentage from their own UG, so in that sense it's not a bias.

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

There are only so many "top candidates"

And while schools have their favorite floors as to stats, more schools will resource protect, because they know from historic norms that it's a waste of precious interview time and effort to get people who will go elsewhere.

If you look at top candidates II vs IA, you see lot of them weren't doing all the interviews but that may change this cycle.

 

[Goro]

If you look at top candidates II vs IA, you see lot of them weren't doing all the interviews but that may change this cycle.

We'll see. Apps are way up this year.

 

[Darrow O'Lykos]

Some medical schools tends to take certain percentage from their own UG, so in that sense it's not a bias.

“Tends” does not equate to a quota or requirement. Correlation does not mean causation. Medical schools with undergraduate institutions are likely going to a have a handful of qualified, ambitious students whom will of course apply to their alma mater’s medical school.

Schools want to evaluate applicants on as even a playing field as possible. They wouldn’t want to purposely disrupt that more than virtual interviews already are doing.

 

[beachbum75]

We'll see. Apps are way up this year.

That's really surprising. I would have thought they would be down with more people deciding to take a gap year and apply next cycle when everything is (hopefully) calmer.

 

[Darrow O'Lykos]

That's really surprising. I would have thought they would be down with more people deciding to take a gap year and apply next cycle when everything is (hopefully) calmer.

I'm pretty sure I've seen @Goro say this a time or two, but when the economy tanks, apps will go up. Apps already go up year over year. Compound that with less available jobs in the economy, and academic bloat increases.

If anything, a tanking economy is even more of a deterrent to taking a gap year. Good luck to new grads with biology degrees getting jobs without any post-graduate experience. Applicants who otherwise were planning on taking their MCAT after graduation are feeling compelled to apply now that many schools announced that applicants will be reviewed without their MCAT score due to the COVID-19 disruption. Change that Summer 2021 MCAT date to January 2021, and they might be able to swing landing a seat before they otherwise felt they'd be able to.

 

[KnightDoc]

I'm pretty sure I've seen @Goro say this a time or two, but when the economy tanks, apps will go up. Apps already go up year over year. Compound that with less available jobs in the economy, and academic bloat increases.

If anything, a tanking economy is even more of a deterrent to taking a gap year. Good luck to new grads with biology degrees getting jobs without any post-graduate experience. Applicants who otherwise were planning on taking their MCAT after graduation are feeling compelled to apply now that many schools announced that applicants will be reviewed without their MCAT score due to the COVID-19 disruption. Change that Summer 2021 MCAT date to January 2021, and they might be able to swing landing a seat before they otherwise felt they'd be able to.

Yes, a bad economy ALWAYS leads to more people riding out the storm in all kinds of grad schools, but this usually takes place over a number of year rather than a number of months.

As everyone going through the process knows, it literally takes years to gather the experiences necessary to create a successful application. It is highly doubtful that someone who not already planning in March on applying this cycle will be in a position to rush a successful application out the door now due to the crisis.

In fact, it is more likely that someone who WAS planning on applying might have to push back a year due to postponed MCATs and inability to perform last minute ECs from March forward due to the situation.

 

[KnightDoc]

Some medical schools tends to take certain percentage from their own UG, so in that sense it's not a bias.

Bias, not a bias, doesn't matter. It's an interesting thought, but it's not going to happen.

Admissions offices aren't going to want to do it, and, once they open the door, why stop there? Same school? What about same city? Same state? ITA?

People are paranoid about misplacing a semicolon in an essay. Imagine how crazy they'd become if they thought someone else was receiving an advantage by having an in-person interview, and then they asked for the same! Lots of people would be willing to travel, and we'd be back where we started. No way any school is going to open that Pandora's Box.

You're forgetting that schools aren't only, or even primarily, doing this to relieve applicants the burden of traveling. They are mostly doing it to spare themselves the risk of having themselves and their staff dealing in close proximity with hundreds of strangers. Why would they care if those strangers are coming from across the quad or across the country?

 

[beachbum75]

Yes, bad economy ALWAYS leads to more people riding out the storm in all kinds of grad schools, but this usually takes place over a number of year rather than a number of numbers.

As everyone going through the process knows, it literally takes years to gather the experiences necessary to create a successful application. It is highly doubtful that someone who not already planning in March on applying this cycle will be in a position to rush a successful application out the door now due to the crisis.

In fact, it is more likely that someone who WAS planning on applying might have to push back a year due to postponed MCATs and inability to perform last minute ECs from March forward due to the situation.

That is what I thought would be the case but apparently not? I'm curious since @Goro said that apps are up if the quality of applicants is the same as previous years and how everything will play out this cycle.

 

[KnightDoc]

Interesting! Whole cycle? Or are you guys transitioning to in-person possibly during 2021?

I think it would be great if they made this change permanent. Assuming it works, think about how much time and money could be collectively saved across the applicant pool. I get why in-person is preferable, but still. Assuming this becomes the new norm, admitted candidates could still arrange for campus visits with no pressure, separate and apart from admitted student days, to get a closer look if they wanted to before making decisions, but a lot of trouble As will never be forthcoming.

 

[KnightDoc]

That is what I thought would be the case but apparently not? I'm curious since @Goro said that apps are up if the quality of applicants is the same as previous years and how everything will play out this cycle.

He's just speculating, because nothing has been transmitted to any school yet. He's citing a statistic that a large number of applications were started this year as of the first few days applications opened as compared to prior years. This could be because there are a lot more applicants this year, or because everyone was home in May, so more applications were started earlier than in prior years.

Nobody knows whether actual, completed submissions will be significantly higher than the last few years, because primary transmissions have not yet begun, and, every year, a significant number of applicants who submit primaries do not follow through with secondaries. Nobody knows whether that number will hold, or go up or down.

I personally think it's unlikely that applications will go up materially this year. And, if it's because people are applying because they are being shut out of planned gap year activities, it is unlikely that they will be competitive against applicants who have already completed gap year activities, or who were already planning to apply with strong applications (i.e., I believe it is unlikely many of the rushed, last minute applications will significantly impact the admission prospects of the people who were always going to apply this cycle).

 

[beachbum75]

He's just speculating, because nothing has been transmitted to any school yet. He's citing a statistic that a large number of applications were started this year as of the first few days applications opened as compared to prior years. This could be because there are a lot more applicants this year, or because everyone was home in May, so more applications were started earlier than in prior years.

Nobody knows whether actual, completed submissions will be significantly higher than the last few years, because primary transmissions have not yet begun, and, every year, a significant number of applicants who submit primaries do not follow through with secondaries. Nobody knows whether that number will hold, or go up or down.

I personally think it's unlikely that applications will go up materially this year. And, if it's because people are applying because they are being shut out of planned gap year activities, it is unlikely that they will be competitive against applicants who have already completed gap year activities, or who were already planning to apply with strong applications (i.e., I believe it is unlikely many of the rushed, last minute applications will significantly impact the admission prospects of the people who were always going to apply this cycle).

That's true. It makes sense that apps are higher than usual right now since people have been at home during May, and since apps can be submitted without MCAT scores, applicants that would have had to wait can submit earlier instead.

 

[KnightDoc]

That's true. It makes sense that apps are higher than usual right now since people have been at home during May, and since apps can be submitted without MCAT scores, applicants that would have had to wait can submit earlier instead.

And remember, the number quoted was applications initiated, not even submitted. Nobody is going to know what this year's number slook like until secondaries are submitted later this summer.

Again, they might very well go up from last year, but it just seems unlikely that last minute applicants as a group are going to be competitive with people planning to apply all along.

@Goro is right about history, but, historically, 10, 20, 40 years ago, applicants did not need the grades and ECs they do today. In 1982 a good student could say "the economy looks like crap, maybe I should study for the MCAT and apply to med school," and slap a competitive application together in a few months. Just cannot happen today. They might apply, but without the grades, MCAT and ECs it will be waste of time, just like it is for the rest of us! And how the hell is someone who wasn't planning for it in February going to be ready in July, during a pandemic????????

 

[Angus Avagadro]

That's really surprising. I would have thought they would be down with more people deciding to take a gap year and apply next cycle when everything is (hopefully) calmer.

Nope. When the economy tanks or jobs are tight, applications go up.

 

[Goro]

He's just speculating, because nothing has been transmitted to any school yet. He's citing a statistic that a large number of applications were started this year as of the first few days applications opened as compared to prior years. This could be because there are a lot more applicants this year, or because everyone was home in May, so more applications were started earlier than in prior years.

Nobody knows whether actual, completed submissions will be significantly higher than the last few years, because primary transmissions have not yet begun, and, every year, a significant number of applicants who submit primaries do not follow through with secondaries. Nobody knows whether that number will hold, or go up or down.

I personally think it's unlikely that applications will go up materially this year. And, if it's because people are applying because they are being shut out of planned gap year activities, it is unlikely that they will be competitive against applicants who have already completed gap year activities, or who were already planning to apply with strong applications (i.e., I believe it is unlikely many of the rushed, last minute applications will significantly impact the admission prospects of the people who were always going to apply this cycle).

Actually, for the past few years apps have been somewhat declining. This is due to a generational baby bust that happens periodically. I cna see it even at the level of the local schools here. My hometwon was making noise about needing a new middle school, and then poof, the students dried up and the local school system even started laying off teachers (all pre-COVID).

Imagine a pig swallowed by a snake. Peak student years are the big fat middle of the snake.

BUT, not any more. Med schools all report increasing apps....and this is just a few weeks into the cycle!

I believe that rushed and last minute apps are wishful thinking.

Another thing to consider is that Adcoms may want massive apps, full of stats and ECs, but we also like diamonds in the rough. There are people out there with compelling stories.

 

[Angus Avagadro]

My school is online interviews for the foreseeable future

 

[Small Cell Carcinoma]

Yeah they will probably all be online. And you should be thankful for that. Your chance of getting an interview is probably a bit higher since it takes less resources to interview a group of candidates on zoom and you save money in travel expenses

 

[KnightDoc]

Actually, for the past few years apps have been somewhat declining. This is due to a generational baby bust that happens periodically. I cna see it even at the level of the local schools here. My hometwon was making noise about needing a new middle school, and then poof, the students dried up and the local school system even started laying off teachers (all pre-COVID).

Imagine a pig swallowed by a snake. Peak student years are the big fat middle of the snake.

BUT, not any more. Med schools all report increasing apps....and this is just a few weeks into the cycle!

I believe that rushed and last minute apps are wishful thinking.

Another thing to consider is that Adcoms may want massive apps, full of stats and ECs, but we also like diamonds in the rough. There are people out there with compelling stories.

But, but, but ... how can med schools be reporting increasing apps a few weeks into the cycle when they haven't seen a single one yet? Is this DO only, or do MD schools get a view into apps a month before they are transmitted? All we saw publicly reported was that a huge number started apps the first few days that they were opened in early May, which might be a big deal or might mean nothing, since millions of people were sitting home with nothing to do at that point in time.

You know I love you, but while my speculation about rushed and last minute apps might very well be wishful thinking, you still haven't explained how, with the country going from the greatest economy in the history of mankind (at least in the view of one very prominent political leader ) to the worst economy since the Great Depression in the space of one month a mere 3 months ago, any uptick in apps in any way in response to that could be anything other than rushed and last minute.

I guess we'll just have to see how many diamonds in the rough whose devotion to serving mankind through the practice of medicine manifested itself overnight during one fateful day in March or April as the national unemployment rate hit 15% are chosen over people who have been working towards this application cycle for the past several years. My guess is it will be a very fortunate very few, who will not move the needle with respect to the success (or lack thereof) of the overwhelming majority of the people who were planning on applying this year since before last March.

Let's see if the apps even show up. I haven't seen any reference to apps being up 50% since the first week of May.

 

[Goro]

But, but, but ... how can med schools be reporting increasing apps a few weeks into the cycle when they haven't seen a single one yet? Is this DO only, or do MD schools get a view into apps a month before they are transmitted? All we saw publicly reported was that a huge number started apps the first few days that they were opened in early May, which might be a big deal or might mean nothing, since millions of people were sitting home with nothing to do at that point in time.

You know I love you, but while my speculation about rushed and last minute apps might very well be wishful thinking, you still haven't explained how, with the country going from the greatest economy in the history of mankind (at least in the view of one very prominent political leader ) to the worst economy since the Great Depression in the space of one month a mere 3 months ago, any uptick in apps in any way in response to that could be anything other than rushed and last minute.

I guess we'll just have to see how many diamonds in the rough whose devotion to serving mankind through the practice of medicine manifested itself overnight during one fateful day in March or April as the national unemployment rate hit 15% are chosen over people who have been working towards this application cycle for the past several years. My guess is it will be a very fortunate very few, who will not move the needle with respect to the success (or lack thereof) of the overwhelming majority of the people who were planning on applying this year since before last March.

Let's see if the apps even show up. I haven't seen any reference to apps being up 50% since the first week of May.

If we're seeing it in the DO world, the MD cycle will follow as well.

I suggest that you stop trying to fit the world into your preconceived notions.

 

[KnightDoc]

If we're seeing it in the DO world, the MD cycle will follow as well.

I suggest that you stop trying to fit the world into your preconceived notions.

Are you receiving transmissions already?

And, as if you didn't already know, you are quite perceptive with respect to my viewing things through my own perspective, for better or worse! I'm actually strongly considering pushing back another year, since I haven't even been able to take the MCAT yet while I was supposed to have a score by now, and all my ECs have been cut off since March, so I just can't see how someone not even planning on applying in February will compete.

How did we go from secondaries being a tax on the naive and uninformed to the pandemic providing an embarrassment of riches for you among all the diamond in the rough refugees from the recession? Maybe in a year or two, but, three months after the violent economic downturn, with very few meaningful EC opportunities, no live in-person advising, classes, test prep, etc.? Really?

 

[eigen]

You’re assuming that the only uptick would be in traditional applicants/people who weren’t otherwise interested in medicine.

Consider, for example, someone who was considering med school but planning on taking a few gap years to work. Pandemic and depression means working may no longer be a viable option. So, take the MCAT and apply now.

Or, say, someone who had already graduated and was working in a healthcare field. Maybe they lost a job, maybe they’re worried about supporting a family long term and looking at increasing their long term financial outlook.

Both could well field strong applications starting in March or April of this year.

 

[OfMiceAndWomen]

You’re assuming that the only uptick would be in traditional applicants/people who weren’t otherwise interested in medicine.

Consider, for example, someone who was considering med school but planning on taking a few gap years to work. Pandemic and depression means working may no longer be a viable option. So, take the MCAT and apply now.

Or, say, someone who had already graduated and was working in a healthcare field. Maybe they lost a job, maybe they’re worried about supporting a family long term and looking at increasing their long term financial outlook.

Both could well field strong applications starting in March or April of this year.

I'm somewhat in this boat. I was going to apply next cycle because I was planning to be abroad for the 2020-2021 academic year, but plans were postponed, so I suddenly had my summer and fall free. An extra gap year would have made my app somewhat stronger, but I feel like I have a solid footing already, so why not?


*If* there is an uptick in number of applications, I imagine it's because 1) covid wasn't actually that big of a deterrent for people who were set on applying already, and 2) fall-through of other plans gave people who were already somewhat prepared the opportunity to apply this cycle.

To the first point, the biggest issue that the pandemic caused is arguably MCAT cancellations, but most schools have made accommodations, and we know a ton of people have re-scheduled and are taking this summer. The next issue would be fall-through of clinical or volunteering opportunities, but that's maybe 2 months loss of time before applications are submitted? I feel like people who were already planning to apply won't find this loss to be substantial to their application.

To the second point, there are probably people who were hoping to take a gap year (or additional gap year) and get a research or clinical job, but can't because many institutions have a hiring freeze. I imagine many of these people wanted an extra year to boost their application, but they might already be competitive applicants (have taken MCAT already, have all the boxes ticked). So they thought might as well apply this year. What's the point of waiting next cycle if opportunities to boost your application will be scarce for likely months?

 

[BunnyMan17]

Not an adcom but I am one of the MS4s signed up to interview come September and we got an email earlier this week saying all interviews will be online. From previous years' patterns I highly doubt they will change II numbers right off the bat. The only thing I can really see them doing is extending the interview season.

I know when I was interviewing I definitely turned down a lot of interviews because of time/money but I also was a little paranoid and applied to a ton of DO schools. Also I got waitlisted from my #1 and accepted into my #2 early on, at which point I withdrew pretty much everything.

 

[JustAUser]

And for what it's worth, AAMC strongly encourages virtual interviews for this cycle, so I'm sure you'll see that list change as more medical schools settle on the best course of action and iron out the kinks.

 

[Catalystik]

Adcoms, are interviews going to be online this cycle at your school?

Spoke with 2 schools who said yes!

At this time in my state the two public med schools do not plan to conduct online interviews. The private med schools (MD and DO) mostly will be online, but one is not yet decided.

 

[KnightDoc]

At this time in my state the two public med schools do not plan to conduct online interviews. The private med schools (MD and DO) mostly will be online, but one is not yet decided.

Are you willing to disclose which state, or at least whether it's one where COVID cases are currently rising or falling? The answer to that might explain why public schools are bucking what is a best practices trend!

 

[gyngyn]

Are you willing to disclose which state, or at least whether it's one where COVID cases are currently rising or falling? The answer to that might explain why public schools are bucking what is a best practices trend!

We do not require advisors (or anyone) to reveal information that would tend to make them identifiable.

 

[KnightDoc]

We do not require advisors (or anyone) to reveal information that would tend to make them identifiable.

I totally understand and respect that, although he already narrowed the field down to states with two public medical schools! Also, I further asked whether it was a state where cases are presently rising or falling.

I certainly wasn't trying to compromise his anonymity. I was merely trying to ascertain whether in-person interviews at those schools was indicative of a potential trend for the upcoming cycle, or merely a product of political pressure in certain states to open up regardless of the COVID consequences.

 

[eigen]

I totally understand and respect that, although he already narrowed the field down to states with two public medical schools! Also, I further asked whether it was a state where cases are presently rising or falling.

I certainly wasn't trying to compromise his anonymity. I was merely trying to ascertain whether in-person interviews at those schools was indicative of a potential trend for the upcoming cycle, or merely a product of political pressure in certain states to open up regardless of the COVID consequences.

I'm not trying to compromise anonymity, I'm just going to try to figure out who they are based on hints and clues!

I'll go back to my point from last week: you're spending too much time trying to read tea leaves. Your sanity will be better if you do pretty much anything else.

 

[wysdoc]

But, but, but ... how can med schools be reporting increasing apps a few weeks into the cycle when they haven't seen a single one yet? Is this DO only, or do MD schools get a view into apps a month before they are transmitted? All we saw publicly reported was that a huge number started apps the first few days that they were opened in early May, which might be a big deal or might mean nothing, since millions of people were sitting home with nothing to do at that point in time.

You know I love you, but while my speculation about rushed and last minute apps might very well be wishful thinking, you still haven't explained how, with the country going from the greatest economy in the history of mankind (at least in the view of one very prominent political leader ) to the worst economy since the Great Depression in the space of one month a mere 3 months ago, any uptick in apps in any way in response to that could be anything other than rushed and last minute.

I guess we'll just have to see how many diamonds in the rough whose devotion to serving mankind through the practice of medicine manifested itself overnight during one fateful day in March or April as the national unemployment rate hit 15% are chosen over people who have been working towards this application cycle for the past several years. My guess is it will be a very fortunate very few, who will not move the needle with respect to the success (or lack thereof) of the overwhelming majority of the people who were planning on applying this year since before last March.

Let's see if the apps even show up. I haven't seen any reference to apps being up 50% since the first week of May.

@KnightDoc, sometimes you don't know when to stop belaboring a point or extending an argument. I would like to encourage you to do more reading and listening on SDN and less prognosticating, predicting, and advising.

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

I think @KnightDoc was a debater in HS and missing that

 

[wysdoc]

I think @KnightDoc was a debater in HS and missing that

Last year when he started posting so much I wondered if he was still in HS.

 

[KnightDoc]

I'm not trying to compromise anonymity, I'm just going to try to figure out who they are based on hints and clues!

I'll go back to my point from last week: you're spending too much time trying to read tea leaves. Your sanity will be better if you do pretty much anything else.

Excellent points regarding my sanity, and honestly, I was absolutely NOT trying to out whatever state @Catalystik works in, or who he is. I was trying to get a feeling for whether the no virtual interview observation from those two state schools was going to be representative, or an outlier.

Just using two states as random examples at this point in time, if the state was NY it would probably be more predictive of where schools will be this cycle than FL (and I am well aware it is neither of those states). Probably driving myself crazy again, but it's not a crazy thing to think about as the season starts, even though nobody knows where, or if, they will have IIs at this point.

For what it's worth, if that is coming from a state that has done a crappy job managing the situation and is seeing a COVID spike while half the states are seeing a significant downturn in new cases, those schools will be a huge disadvantage, particularly in pulling in strong OOS applicants for in person interviews when so many other schools are making it so easy and inexpensive to interview virtually this cycle.

 

[eigen]

I'm having a hard time believing that a school is suddenly going to be "at a huge disadvantage" in pulling in "strong applicants" just because they're doing in person interviews.

And I would say trying to figure out whether interviews in the future at schools where you might or might not have applied will be online or virtual is... reading tea leaves. We don't know where the pandemic is going to be, and I'd imagine some schools might well shift throughout the year depending on local circumstances.

And, again, thinking too far into the future does your sanity no good. When you get interview invites, you will know whether they are online or in person, and can at that point make the decision of whether you personally want to go to them or not.

 

[KnightDoc]

I'm having a hard time believing that a school is suddenly going to be "at a huge disadvantage" in pulling in "strong applicants" just because they're doing in person interviews.

And I would say trying to figure out whether interviews in the future at schools where you might or might not have applied will be online or virtual is... reading tea leaves. We don't know where the pandemic is going to be, and I'd imagine some schools might well shift throughout the year depending on local circumstances.

And, again, thinking too far into the future does your sanity no good. When you get interview invites, you will know whether they are online or in person, and can at that point make the decision of whether you personally want to go to them or not.

All of your points are very well taken, but you might want to go back a just browse posts in the specific school threads from the past few years. Everyone starts out anxious and a little desperate, not knowing what to expect. Then IIs start to flow in. A trickle at first, and then, more and more for top candidates.

After 10/15, when the first wave of As come out, tons of top candidates cancel tons of interviews after they know they are going to school next year. This is due to the time and expense involved in going on interviews.

With a ton, if not virtually all, IIs being online this year, an OOS state school, other than maybe UCLA or UCSF or Michigan, etc., will have a very difficult time convincing the OOS candidates they really want to make the trip, given how many virtual options these candidates will have. I'm not for minute trying to suggest that any school will not be able to fill a class due to this, but, yeah, this will be a big competitive disadvantage if the majority of schools don't follow suit.

I'm also not including IS candidates, because the cost and admission advantage conferred upon IS candidates at public schools will certainly force them to do whatever they school requires. And maybe the answer is these state school just don't care enough about OOS candidates to deviate from what they want to do.

 

[eigen]

After 10/15, when the first wave of As come out, tons of top candidates cancel tons of interviews after they know they are going to school next year. This is due to the time and expense involved in going on interviews.

And as far as I can see, in person vs. online interviews will have little to no effect on this. Students cancel interviews when they get accepted to a school they really want to go to. If they still have an interview at another school that is higher on their list, I highly doubt they will cancel that interview just because of the format of the interview.

Biasing your choices about where you want to spend 4 years of medical school based on the format of an interview seems highly unlikely to sway a competitive candidate from a school they are otherwise seriously interested in.

A school is going to make the call on interviews based on a judgement of the public health risks, not based on the perception of how the format of the interview is going to seem to prospective students, IMO. Virtual interviews are not likely to benefit either the school or the candidate, and fall under the "necessary adjustment for the time" category of changes.

 

[KnightDoc]

And as far as I can see, in person vs. online interviews will have little to no effect on this. Students cancel interviews when they get accepted to a school they really want to go to. If they still have an interview at another school that is higher on their list, I highly doubt they will cancel that interview just because of the format of the interview.

In the past, this was 100% true, not simply because all candidates are considerate of their fellow candidates, or didn't want to give a school a chance to wow them, or surprise them with a scholarship they might be able to use to leverage money from another school. It was because they had As from schools they liked, and they didn't want to spend time and money flying around the country.

This year they won't have to do that at many schools. Online vs. in person will have a tremendous impact post-10/15 on people with As. This isn't just a money and time thing, either. This involves spending time in airports, planes, hotel rooms, stranger's rooms, etc. Let's see. I'm betting if more schools don't go in person, those that are in person now will relent, or, as I said, lose some people that they might or might not care about losing.

Biasing your choices about where you want to spend 4 years of medical school based on the format of an interview seems highly unlikely to sway a competitive candidate from a school they are otherwise seriously interested in.

Maybe, but people already do this for a variety of seemingly superficial reasons -- the complexity and length of a secondary, how someone interacts with them during the interview, etc.

A school is going to make the call on interviews based on a judgement of the public health risks, not based on the perception of how the format of the interview is going to seem to prospective students, IMO. Virtual interviews are not likely to benefit either the school or the candidate, and fall under the "necessary adjustment for the time" category of changes.

Really? If so, given the availability of the technology, the fact that 1,000 people per day, every day, are still dying in the US, and the fact that no one knows what things are going to look like between now and the end of the next cycle, how the hell can any MEDICAL school justify flying people around the country to meet them in person, based on a competent judgment of the public health risks versus the alternatives? And yet, every school in the country has not, as of today, announced that the next interview cycle will be virtual.

It's not a perception; it's a reality. Some schools are making candidates travel for in person interviews and others are not. Some are making it easy to interview, and others are not. It's not the most superficial thing in the world to base a choice on, assuming one has options.

Forgive me for believing the schools will do what is in their best interests, without regard to the public anything. Honestly, as much as some folks might love to visit schools to get a feel for the place, which anyone could always do on their own under normal circumstances, what candidate who is already spending thousands of dollars during an application cycle would not think it is a benefit to avoid the time and expense of an in person interview? If people were given a choice, and there was no perception that a virtual interview would put someone at a disadvantage, I'd bet just about everyone would choose to avoid the time and expense of an in person interview, particularly with no guarantee of an A at the outset.

 

[OfMiceAndWomen]

In the past, this was 100% true, not simply because all candidates are considerate of their fellow candidates, or didn't want to give a school a chance to wow them, or surprise them with a scholarship they might be able to use to leverage money from another school. It was because they had As from schools they liked, and they didn't want to spend time and money flying around the country.

This year they won't have to do that at many schools. Online vs. in person will have a tremendous impact post-10/15 on people with As. This isn't just a money and time thing, either. This involves spending time in airports, planes, hotel rooms, stranger's rooms, etc. Let's see. I'm betting if more schools don't go in person, those that are in person now will relent, or, as I said, lose some people that they might or might not care about losing.



Maybe, but people already do this for a variety of seemingly superficial reasons -- the complexity and length of a secondary, how someone interacts with them during the interview, etc.


Really? If so, given the availability of the technology, the fact that 1,000 people per day, every day, are still dying in the US, and the fact that no one knows what things are going to look like between now and the end of the next cycle, how the hell can any MEDICAL school justify flying people around the country to meet them in person, based on a competent judgment of the public health risks versus the alternatives? And yet, every school in the country has not, as of today, announced that the next interview cycle will be virtual.

It's not a perception; it's a reality. Some schools are making candidates travel for in person interviews and others are not. Some are making it easy to interview, and others are not. It's not the most superficial thing in the world to base a choice on, assuming one has options.

Forgive me for believing the schools will do what is in their best interests, without regard to the public anything. Honestly, as much as some folks might love to visit schools to get a feel for the place, which anyone could always do on their own under normal circumstances, what candidate who is already spending thousands of dollars during an application cycle would not think it is a benefit to avoid the time and expense of an in person interview? If people were given a choice, and there was no perception that a virtual interview would put someone at a disadvantage, I'd bet just about everyone would choose to avoid the time and expense of an in person interview, particularly with no guarantee of an A at the outset.

I would fly out to an in-person interview to get a chance to get know a school. A lot of people are actually bummed that interviews are virtual this year, despite the costs.

Also, bruh, are you even applying this year? I’m a hella lot more worried about *getting* interviews than whether or not they’re online. It doesn’t matter to me the interview format, I’m gonna do whatever it takes to get me the best options for med school.