Advice on Starting a New Practice

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digitlnoize

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Hello all,

I am starting med school this fall, and for a variety of reasons am interested in FM. I've done alot of Google-ing and SDN-ing on this subject but have found little good information.

I know some of you will say that it's too early to ask these questions, but I'm also debating attending a DO school over MD, so my choice of specialty is (somewhat) relevant now...

Ok. Questions:

If I pursue FP, I would like to start my own medium sized practice in a small-medium sized community. 2-3 FP's and mid-levels.

How much start up would be required to do this? I may have one MD/DO partner, but would prefer to be the sole owner, and pay everyone else on salary.

What's the limit for how many mid-levels per doctor? Is this state dependent? I'm thinking two PA's for each doc...

I'm not really interested in expensive toys like xray machines...I am considering some spa-type services too...massage, etc...but I don't wanna get all new agey...

Any advice? Numbers or links would be greatly appreciated too!
 
How do you plan to find the capital for this? Do you have family members with serious cash who would lend it, do you have a home pretty much paid off you can harvest the equity out of?

If you are going to finance it yourself (which I strongly recommend - when you owe others you are their slave, and you don't want non-medical people - ESPECIALLY family members owning you) than I would recommend not going with PA's initially, not until you built it up. If being in control is really important to you than I would not have a partner either - I would bring them in later.

Everyone has slightly different ideas of a small to medium community - I am guessing you mean 80,000 give or take 20,000.

Rent : if you want a facility large enough to eventually house several FP's with 2 PA's each, than you will need at least 3,000 sq feet. With triple net this may run $4,000 to $6,000 a month - if you can hear a train from the office it may run less, if you can see a McDonalds from the door it will run more. If you start small , like 1000 sq feet planning on moving as the business grows (not as hard as it sounds) than you can plan on $1000 a month in a small town, and perhaps $2,000 in a mid sized town - more or less depending on train tracks or McDonalds.

Front desk - if they ONLY answer the phone and schedule patients, not other tasks you can get by paying them just a little over minimum wage to begin with (I am going to cover this under the thread of 16 years of practice tips), by hiring someone with lots of intelligence and ambition but no experience - with the promise of significant pay raises within the first year as they gain experience in your office. You will need to teach them scripts for what to say when answering the phone, when someone wants to cancel and appointment, when someone is going to be late, when a potential patient calls to ask about fees etc. So consider a 30-40 hour week paying $8.50 - 10 an hour or $270-400 a week.

You might want to put your wife at the front desk phone to save money, but unless she has had experience being a waitress and was good (often can be determined by how well she was tipped) or some other job that teaches people to really get strangers to like you - hire someone and not let your wife do it.

Fixed start up costs. Exam tables, EKG, spirometer, stethoscopes, reflex hammers, tape measures, pinwheels, cotton swabs, goniometers, manila files, copying machine, fax, urine dip sticks, toilet paper, computers, waiting room chairs, carpet, etc etc etc - You can figure $10,000 to $30,000 if you are not overly extravagant. This is assuming you have an office or house you can automatically use as a doctors office (front desk window and sinks built into patient rooms already) - if you have to build out the office, and you cannot install a sink - then you are also going to need to hire a carpenter.

make sure any office or house you buy is ADA ready - doors to bathrooms wide enough for wheelchairs, handicap rail in bathroom so people can get off toilet, backlit door exit signs at front and rear entrance etc - or that is more build out.

This is also if you want to paperchart your office visits. I am not familiar with the newest computerized medical computer SOAP notes etc - add that cost if you are going computerized notes from the beginning. Some MD friends of mine designed their own templates, with very routine visits so they can just use pulldown charts to write their notes - they did it on their own and never bought anyone elses software. However alot of software keeps track of procedures and services you sell - I had this in my chiropractic offices - the really nice thing is, you can hit a button and find out how much money you collected for everything you do. I found that although I offered a ton of various services, 80% of my money was generated by 4 things. Software that keeps track of things like that will tell you what services you do that are really unprofitable and which ones are really profitable.

Marketing in a town that size is important. A real small town (<20,000) is a cinch. Mid size to big cities require much more. The best marketing I ever did was talks. I will cover these but basically there are 2 types : one is talks you do - on various health topics. They can be done at libraries, rotary clubs, optimist clubs, PTA meetings, book clubs, outdoor clubs - any place people gather and will listen to you speak. The other is having other speakers come and give talks - the one I did that generated the most interest was having a psychologist talk about DEALING WITH YOUR TROUBLED TEEN. These talks you want to have in your office, and have enough seats for perhaps 20 people. By having them in your office, they come to hear these other speakers but new people will get familair with your office. Other topics are : losing weight, relationships, finding better employment. You do not even have to prepare a talk - you have other experts come and talk on these things, you just let them use your office. You can often get the local paper to run an ad for the talk for free in small to mid-size towns as a PSA - reads something like : Dr. Digitalnoize is sponsoring a free talk on growing a garden. The speaker is agriculture specialist, Tom Ato, from the University of SDN. The lecture is at Dr.Digitalnoiz' office Wednesday from 7-8 PM. RSVP to 477-777-7777 as seating is limited.

I think yellow page advertizing is always needed. Small town - a few hundred a year for a credit card sized ad that lists your name, location and special things that niche you from the other doctors in town. Medium sized town a couple thousand a year. Big city will cost several thousand a year or more depending on how big an ad.

If you are accepting insurance - that money won't b
e coming in for 3 to 4 months. So you need to plan on at least 6 months operating capital :

Rent X 6, your salary X 6, Staff salary X 6, Yellow pages X 6, fixed start up costs, plus an extra 20,000 for the crap you did not plan on. 1000 sq foot facility with only front desk help in small town : $60,000-90,000. But by month 6 you had better be bringing in the money - I did internal billing for 16 years in my office, and do not think I would want to tackle that again when/if I start a medical office. I am pretty sure I would outsource my billing for the first couple of years at least - although it is much cheaper to internal bill. Once you add other FP's - than its profitable to internal bill - you can bill for them and charge them, and get another slice of the pie that way. But if you have never billed - you cannot afford to make mistakes that delay your payments another 4 months - let someone who really knows billing to do it the first 6 months to year, so that it is billed correctly the first time, so that you are getting your money 3-4 months after you open your office.

If you are starting from scratch with no patients - do you really want a couple of PA's on salary when you are only going to have a trickle of patients - unless you are moving to your hometown, or have been doing lots of PR work months before you open your doors? And I myself would shudder at having another FP on salary from the get go - at first I want EVERY new patient who comes in the door. I would rather be tired from overwork than stressed from too little work (and money) for all the employees I have.

A massage therapist is a great addition from the first day. They bring in cash (no waiting for insurance) are happy to get paid per client (charge $60 an hour and give them $30). You can make money from day one, they generate their own salary and you do not have to be paying them out of your savings or loan money. Any cash service can help you through the first hump months of financial drought.
 
How do you plan to find the capital for this? Do you have family members with serious cash who would lend it, do you have a home pretty much paid off you can harvest the equity out of?

A massage therapist is a great addition from the first day. They bring in cash (no waiting for insurance) are happy to get paid per client (charge $60 an hour and give them $30). You can make money from day one, they generate their own salary and you do not have to be paying them out of your savings or loan money. Any cash service can help you through the first hump months of financial drought.

Thanks for all the info. That's the type stuff I'm looking for.

I am not independently wealthy. Capital would have to come from banks or angel capital...I do know lots of rich people...

My wife is a dental hygienist...no receptioning for her.

You were pretty much spot on with the town size. 60-100k sounds about right...

Again, this is very preliminary, I'm just exploring some options...but I do like the concept of FP, and I do have a good business sense, having worked in it for 10 years prior to deciding to go med school...

I'm just really ignorant about the running of a medical practice, and there are surprisingly few resources. I've scoured the AAFP website pretty well...

There's very little hard data about how much each provider produces for an office. How much gross revenue can 1 MD or PA generate? What does outsourcing billing cost?

These are all the types of numbers one needs to draw up a business plan, but I cannot find them anywhere...I can make guesses based on what little data is available.

I saw one article that said that the PA salary of 70k is 28% of what they produce for the office. That percentage seems a little low to me. Do they really produce that much?

How much does malpractice cost? PA's vs. MD's?

Thanks for the help. Anyone else got any advice?
 
Thanks for all the info. That's the type stuff I'm looking for.

I am not independently wealthy. Capital would have to come from banks or angel capital...I do know lots of rich people...

My wife is a dental hygienist...no receptioning for her.

You were pretty much spot on with the town size. 60-100k sounds about right...

Again, this is very preliminary, I'm just exploring some options...but I do like the concept of FP, and I do have a good business sense, having worked in it for 10 years prior to deciding to go med school...

I'm just really ignorant about the running of a medical practice, and there are surprisingly few resources. I've scoured the AAFP website pretty well...

There's very little hard data about how much each provider produces for an office. How much gross revenue can 1 MD or PA generate? What does outsourcing billing cost?

These are all the types of numbers one needs to draw up a business plan, but I cannot find them anywhere...I can make guesses based on what little data is available.

I saw one article that said that the PA salary of 70k is 28% of what they produce for the office. That percentage seems a little low to me. Do they really produce that much?

How much does malpractice cost? PA's vs. MD's?

Thanks for the help. Anyone else got any advice?

Outsource billing can charge a percentage or a set fee per claim. Percentage is often 7-10% - my information is a few years old, so this may be a bit different. If I had a choice it would be a set charge per claim - I have heard of a few unscrupulous billing companies who altered levels of service etc to increase the amount billed, resulting in a large percentage for them. A set amount per claim eliminates this, since it does not matter how much the charges are.

Its not hard to bill insurance - or rather billing as a chiropractor was not hard since there was only about 30 CPT codes used. As well the ICD (diagnosis) codes were limited to about 20-40 different diagnosis. FP could have several times that - but even in that case, its the same old junk just more variables.

Electronic billing to Medicare is great - you know as you try to transmit it if you have everything in order. If you have not crossed a T or dotted an i, the electronic transmission would not complete. Usually we got paid by Medicare within 2-3 weeks of billing. I myself liked Medicare - the patients (senior citizens ) rarely have anything to conflict with their visits, low deductible, many have secondary (this is different than a supplemental), and the pay is not too bad.

A secondary insurance to Medicare is one that pays everything medicare does not ALLOW - in chiropractic Medicare only allowed the manual adjustment. Up until about 2003 it required an x-ray in order to pay for the manual adjustment (spinal manipulation), but did not pay for the x -ray. As well Medicare did not allow therapies or exams. Secondaries pay for all of that. Medicare may only pay for one prostate exam per year for example (I do not know what the current rule is on this, they change the rules with regularity), and lets say you do a second one for a justifiable reason - the secondary is likely to pay for it (even though Medicare won't).

A Medicare supplemental pays for the deductible and co-payment portion of what Medicare allows. So in the example I used above, the supplemental will pay the patients portion for the allowed prostate exam but not a second one (if my example is correct and Medicare only allows one prostate exam per year).

A billing service could be a viable second stream of income once you have your internal billing mastered. In other words you could bill for other practitioners and charge 10% to do so. If you open a multi-disciplinary practice, or simply take on some FP partners - you could bill their services for a 10% fee - otherwise let them bill their own.

But at first , the first year or so, outsourcing billing is my recommendation. Just make sure the insurance money comes in for the work you do - even if it is just 90%, just make sure you have a positive cash flow. Once you are stable, learn billing inside and out and do it yourself. Then do it for others.
 
How much does malpractice cost? PA's vs. MD's?

Malpractice varies based on geographical location and what services you offer. The general surgeon I rotated with in medical school was going to add some minor cosmetic services like Botox or Restylene. However here in Arizona it increased her malpractice so much it was not worth it. Instead she added ultrasound to US suspicious breast masses - good ROI (return on investment) and did not increase her malpractice.

In some states malpractice for FP's to do vasectomies is very high and in other states its not too bad.

If you deliver babies its a vastly different story than if you don't.

As well by the time you are in practice these numbers could change quite a bit. Malpractice may be one of the more varied economic factors, and variable from year to year.
 
how much does malpractive go up if you add cosmetic services? any solid figures you can share?

a handful of general practitioners do add these services to supplement income, and I think I'd want to do the same in the future.

one FP doc in my hometown does exclusively cosmetics. some of them make quite a killing.
 
I can't give you any hard figures on that. From what I understand Illinois is a harsh state for malpractice and Wisconsin is very good state for malpractice.

Plus who the insurance company is makes a difference. When I was a chiropractor I found 2 different insurers who differed by almost 100% for approximately the same coverage.

You could probably get some quotes online.

I know alot of FP and IM here in Arizona who do cosmetics. The surgeon I mentioned is also in Arizona, so perhaps how much of a rate increase one would experience also depends on specialty - more for surgeons and less for FP. The surgeon has never had a single malpractice claim in 18 years - but felt it increased their rates too much. I should have asked for some hard dollar amounts, and I am surprised I did not, since I am usually very interested in such statistics.

The service that I was excited about adding, from a business point of view was simply freezing skin lesions. After you buy the large container, the dispensers and liquid nitrogen the profit margin is huge. At the time I did dermatology rotation (2 years ago), Medicare was paying about $210 to freeze 3 actinic keratoses. I mean its just : schpritz, schpritz, schpritz and kaching - $210.
 
Not sure if you've seen any of these yet, but some good, basic info:

Starting a practice: The first steps, one year out (Article)
http://medicaleconomics.modernmedic...ear-out/ArticleStandard/Article/detail/108847

On Your Own: Starting a Medical Practice from the Ground Up (Book)
http://www.aafp.org/online/en/home/practicemgt/specialtopics/newpractice.html

Starting a Medical Practice - A Practical List of Things to Do (Article)
http://www.virtualmedicalgroup.ba.ttu.edu/VMG/ResourceLibrary/PRACTICE%20START UP CHECKLIST.pdf

Starting a Concierge Medicine Practice (Blog)
http://www.myconciergedoc.com/

Starting Your Own Medical Practice (Article)
http://hekmangroup.com/articles/Article_StartingYourOwnBusiness.pdf

Start It Up - How to Launch a Practice (Article)
http://www.physicianspractice.com/index/fuseaction/articles.details/articleID/1130.htm
 
Starting a Medical Practice - A Practical List of Things to Do (Article)
http://www.virtualmedicalgroup.ba.ttu.edu/VMG/ResourceLibrary/PRACTICE%20START%20UP%20CHECKLIST.pdf

I have not read the others yet. I read this one fairly carefully, and thought it was a great step by step guide - but I COMPLETELY disagree that someone needs $200,000-400,000 to start a new practice. That is insane. Has the guy ever heard of buying equipment wholesale, or used. I mean even if you bought a colposcope, sigmoidoscope/colonoscope, EKG, spirometer, US etc it should not cost you that much. The only way this would be the case is if you are starting it from day one as a multi-practitioner, multi-discipline office in Manhatten with a in-office surgical suite.

I have an aquaintance that has a multi-discplinary chiropractic/medical clinic with c-arm to do epidurals and an MRI - and that is the type of money he initially invested. Actually he did about twice that(mostly because of the MRI) - but you can pick up used C-arms for like $15,000 (that is very low end but they are there and they do the job).

There is absolutely no way someone out of med school should tack on another quarter to half million dollar of debt.
 
Well, there's a reason more people aren't doing it.

You might find this interesting: http://www.thevillagedr.com/practice/busplan.php

The guy's a friend of mine. He's doing just fine, BTW.

Pretty good write up. Thanks for your links. I am surprised that his first month with 30 new patients he did not bill and collect more. Right now, after reading that, I am thinking my medical preceptors were correct when I told them I gave up chiropractic to do medicine and they said "Are you crazy?".
 
I am thinking my medical preceptors were correct when I told them I gave up chiropractic to do medicine and they said "Are you crazy?".

I think you're overestimating the success of the average chiropractor.

Accurate figures are difficult to come by, but here's one reference:

In 2002, the average annual income for chiropractors on salary was $65,330. Salaried chiropractors generally receive a smaller income than those who are self-employed. When including both types of income in 2000, the average was around $81,000.

Another reference is here: http://mdsalaries.blogspot.com/2007/02/chiropractor-salaries.html

Chiropractic incomes are far below that of primary care physicians.
 
I think you're overestimating the success of the average chiropractor.

Accurate figures are difficult to come by, but here's one reference:



Another reference is here: http://mdsalaries.blogspot.com/2007/02/chiropractor-salaries.html

Chiropractic incomes are far below that of primary care physicians.

Maybe and maybe its the guys I know - I am older and all have had time to learn the ropes and build their businesses as opposed to guys out 2 or 3 years. Salaried chiropractic positions do suck. MD employee salaries have it ALL OVER chiropractic employee salaries.

MD employee salaries by comparison are much better. Having such a high employee salary is one of the big plusses of ever getting an MD (no stress of opening your own business - just take a job and get paid $200K). When looking at the salaries listed for MD's how many are employees and salaried , versus self-employed?

Most chiropractors, at least that I know (but that is quite a few) are self employed - which means many things are not reported as income. They are self employed, but incorporated so they are listed as an employee - so their health insurance is a write off and not an expense, not part of their income but an employee benefit. Many take a cruise on which there is a lecture on chiropractic - their wife is listed as an employee of the corporation, so they take a cruise together, its a business expense and not listed as income. Their car may be an employee benefit, and not part of their income (is a business expense, not part of their taxable income). For most people, they pay car payments out of their income - so they pay taxes on their income, and with part of that they pay for a car - which cuts that money out of their income. When it is a business expense, that part of their income does not have to be spent on a car. And many other things that are legal write offs- so I feel for self employed chiropractors their income is probably listed as $70,000 plus a non-taxable business expense $7,000 seminar/vacation (or 4 vacations a year), plus health insurance, plus $6,000 of car payments not listed as income but business expense etc. Soon that $70,000 is a six figure "positive cash flow", that goes to directly benefit them and their families - although only $70,000 of it is taxable as personal income legally. This is how many if not most chiropractors I know do it legally.

I know that salaried MD's also often get paid vacations/seminars, cars (wait thats Mary Kay), etc as employees - but compared to the average person who makes a salary and has to pay for any vacations out of their salary (which is reduced by taxes), and pay for all sorts of junk out of their salary, where as for self-employed chiropractors its a job perk. So when I say most chiropractors I know make $100-200, including myself at one time, I am talking positive cash flow and not taxable income. But its still discretionary, its cash flow that is not already earmarked for something like office rent, that they could elect to spend on something else (cruise or trip to China to learn acupuncture?)

When you are in business for yourself, many things are part of a positive cash flow, but not taxable personal income. A great reason to be in business for yourself. I never hid one dollar of money that came into my office - I am way too afraid of the IRS - but my accountant (I have used the same one since 1992) is GREAT at making sure I get the most legitimate deductions possible. I have been audited by the IRS once - no probs. But there is a huge difference between a positive cash flow and taxable income. Positive cash flow is discretionary income that is not going for fixed business expenses like rent etc. Being self-employed means taking a cruise that you do not have to pay taxes on the money you spent. I do not have a link to statistics but I am pretty darn certain most chiropractors are self-employed.

When you are a salaried employee, your taxable income IS your positive cash flow. A self employed DC making $70,000 a year taxable income, may have the discretionary buying power of a MD employee making $120,000 a year (or more depending on the DC's overhead and accountant and business needs).
 
Most chiropractors, at least that I know (but that is quite a few) are self employed - which means many things are not reported as income.

I'm no accountant, but I'd strongly recommend consulting a tax professional before doing any of the things that you just mentioned. 'Nuff said. 😉
 
I'm no accountant, but I'd strongly recommend consulting a tax professional before doing any of the things that you just mentioned. 'Nuff said. 😉

Of course we always used a tax consultant.

We haver never had a problem, even with an IRS audit (those can be tense) - actually they owed us money when we were done. There were some receipts we failed to claim , so at the audit we turned them in and they owed us money.

When I was in rural Missouri, around 1996, a chiropractic friend of mine needed to move some equipment to his office. He needed a truck to do it. Instead of renting it he bought a truck that would do it. he told me that his accountant had him write off the cost of the truck, instead of depreciating it over time - so buying the truck was like $20,000 taken off any taxable income that year.

I am guessing you have never been self-employed or owned a business, but costs associated with operating the business are all tax deductible - certainly seminars and continuing education, and there is no law against attending continuing ed in Las Vegas or Hawaii etc. There is nothing illegal about employing family, although you need certain paperwork and proofs, and business perks of all sorts are legal business expenses : gym memberships for all employees, insurances, uniforms, etc. Mary Kay is probably the best example of cool employee perks for meeting certain production levels - the best known is the Cadillac (which of course is a business expense for the Mary Kay corp), but they also offer all sorts of other perks for lower levels.

Some employers offer those luxury bonus' to staff - glamour shots pictures, small trips/vacations , gift certificates, etc.

What you can deduct varies from year to year, and so yes, always have a tax consultant who does business'.

Some people I know who are having really good years, have special pow-wows with the tax consultant in the fall so as to know how its best to spend the increased business profits by the end of the year, to maximize tax law allowances for the sake of bettering the business.

Turning a hobby into a side business can be a good thing. I would like to perhaps do some photography as a side business some day - lots of cool camera equipment. And many photogs make decent money.
 
One note : the money your business collects that you spend on business expenses is still taxed, just not at as high a rate as personal income. The government offers tax incentives for business', to help them be profitable, to hire people etc - so business expenses are taxed less than if you made the same purchases with personal income.
 
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