Advice on undergrad studies

[zzmondo1]

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I am currently a high school senior looking into cognitive psychology for graduate school and getting a bachelor's in psychology for my undergrad and am considering an English minor. I'm looking to stay in the Midwest (or anywhere else close to Ohio) for my undergrad studies. The big thing for me right now is being able to do research with the professors that is related to cognition.
My primary concerns in the way of my undergrad is preparation for grad school as well. What courses should I take or look into at other schools that would help for grad school? If you also happen to know the names of schools that do have a good undergrad program and have done research related to cognition that would be worth mentioning as well. Also, what are the most important factors to consider during my undergraduate years that will give me an advantage when applying for cognitive psychology in grad school?

 

[lt1196]

I admire your ambition. You will succeed if you want to.

For college in general:

1) Sit in the front row. Don't take this lightly, I'm serious. There are advantages - you get the grade, and you get the recognition from your prof. Ultimately, those are the two things you need most, and sitting in the front row is probably the best statistical correlation to them that we have.

2) GET the recognition from your profs. Shake each prof's hand on the first day and introduce yourself. No need to say anymore than, "Good to meet you, I'm Ryan. Looking forward to the class. (pause) Take care." 5 seconds - but so valuable. Participate in class discussion. If you have a question that you are genuinely curious about, and that propels the discussion forward, (rather than, "Can you repeat that?"), pull the trigger.

3) When you do this with profs in relevant psychology classes, and you turn in the best work, you become one of few students who are the REASON they teach. They will bend over backward to help you when you need it.

4) Find out who is doing what research. Find the Cognitive prof. whose research you'd like to contribute to. Take his class, shake his hand, and get the best grade in the class. How do you get the best grade in the class? You study more than anyone else for that class. That class is worth more than several of your other classes, so study as much as you would for several classes. Be the student who knows the answers ahead of time. Your professor used to be that student.

5) Discuss research with him sometime during the semester, after you have established yourself. I promise, s/he'll love to have your company.

6) Start research early - that's how you get published.

7) Start studying for the GRE WAY, WAY ahead of time. I gave myself 5 months to study. I started three months ago and went from 1350 to 1480, and I still have 2 months left to study. Get Barron's essential 800 words to learn right now. Why not? Most people try to learn them in a month or two, and they learn some. But you - just learn them all over the next two years, and you'll still have a year and a half left to study. The GRE SINKS great, smart, and capable students. The four hours you spend taking that test are just as important as the average of every single grade you make throughout college.

8) The first seven are all you need. But I personally suggest a few more things: consider placing out of basic classes with CLEP. I learned about CLEP tests one morning, studied for 24 hours and placed out of sociology the next day. Just get a CLEP study guide off amazon or from a bookstore like me. That test cost me $70. about 1/10 what I would have payed for the class. Also consider summer school. You can shave off YEARS by combining these techniques. With that extra time, consider adding an extra major or minor in Biology. It's definitely not necessary, but you may wind up pursuing the very similar field of neuroscience if you like it. If you know you don't like it, just ignore that. Apply to graduate school early. You'll be one of very few, and they do notice.

GO TO MYEDU DOT COM. It tells you exactly what grades every professor has given for the past few years, and students review them. Don't choose a random prof. and get into a class where the average test grade is consistently below 65 with a prof whose accent you cannot decipher.

Good luck.

 

[paramour]

I'd be careful selecting profs based on rating sites.

And it's not uncommon for my average exam grade to be a D. FTR, my students can understand me well enough (for those who bother attending 😉). Students earn the grade they receive. Many do not put the time and effort into it for the grade that they want, so they gosh well deserve the grade that they earned. Too many expect psych to be an easy subject and find out otherwise.

As for sitting in the front row? C'mon, give me a break... I have students sleeping in the front row, many of them with Cs, Ds, and Fs. Yes, there are "good" students there, but there are also poor students. Sit wherever you darned well please. Just make sure you pay attention, express an interest, and do your work. This isn't rocket science.

Otherwise, now that I've gotten off track from the OP's original request . . . I think that IT's other advice is fairly on-par.

Take whatever cognitive and research/experimental courses are offered (and do well in them). Take an interest in and participate in research. Rock your GREs, giving yourself plenty of study time.

Find an undergrad program that has a well-developed psych program that allows active research participation. This will make it easier when you wish to apply to grad school. Although you may be able to major in psych everywhere, not all psych programs are created equal. Some may not be heavily involved in research. Check their faculty profiles to see if any of them express an interest in areas that overlap with your interests. Contact them to see if they're doing any research with which you may be able to help out in any capacity.

Check the course catalog. What's the variety like? Do they have experimental/research methods and lab courses? If you're interested in pursuing grad studies in cognitive, you're really going to want some hands-on experience here. The more options, the better.

Although most programs assign students a faculty advisor or students meet with a faculty member for advising purposes prior to registration, find a faculty member in the psych department whose interests overlap with yours and/or you connect with (this may take a year or two ... ), Meet with them to discuss your interests in and plans to attend graduate school and ask if they would be willing to "mentor" you. This will allow you another party advocating for you as you go through your undergraduate studies and as you apply for grad school. The more, the merrier!

Oh, and research. Research, research, research.

G'luck!

 

[wigflip]

I think there's a lot of good advice above. I'd like to provide a few other perspectives.

1) Sit in the front row. Don't take this lightly, I'm serious. There are advantages - you get the grade, and you get the recognition from your prof. Ultimately, those are the two things you need most, and sitting in the front row is probably the best statistical correlation to them that we have.

Absolutely. But when you do, be aware that you are hypervisible to the prof. It really only takes one side conversation, late entry to class, mid-class text, note scribbling on friend's page (in lieu of talking) to become a nuisance. That said, I'm guessing pointing this out is not necessary, since OP is the type of person who is still in high school and already planning for graduate studies.

2) GET the recognition from your profs. Shake each prof's hand on the first day and introduce yourself. No need to say anymore than, "Good to meet you, I'm Ryan. Looking forward to the class. (pause) Take care." 5 seconds - but so valuable. Participate in class discussion. If you have a question that you are genuinely curious about, and that propels the discussion forward, (rather than, "Can you repeat that?"), pull the trigger.

I think this is pushy and overdoing it. I had a student do this to me once, and he came off as arrogant. The first day of class is incredibly hectic, and it's a bad time to bother profs or even TAs with "trying to make your mark." Most UGs are just treading water--it's easy to distinguish yourself by doing good work, not being a nuisance, and showing up to scheduled office hours once or more during the term. Be prepared with something to say/ask. Remember profs aren't all the same, and the more prestige they command, the less likely they are to understand themselves as "teachers" (as opposed to researchers whose job description regrettably includes teaching undergrad classes). Don't take it personally if they are unresponsive, and don't act entitled to their attention. But do show up to office hours, develop relationships early. The last thing you want is to graduate and realize that all you have for letter writers are a bunch of TAs.

4) Find out who is doing what research. Find the Cognitive prof. whose research you'd like to contribute to. Take his class, shake his hand, and get the best grade in the class. How do you get the best grade in the class? You study more than anyone else for that class. That class is worth more than several of your other classes, so study as much as you would for several classes. Be the student who knows the answers ahead of time. Your professor used to be that student.

5) Discuss research with him sometime during the semester, after you have established yourself. I promise, s/he'll love to have your company..

Additionally, take stats classes early and often, checking other departments for their offerings as well. You can get also a sense of the broader field by reading original journal articles from the authors in your cognitive textbook. Use Web of Science to trace citations of particular articles. Eventually you'll start to narrow down your research interests and develop a short list of possible grad schools and mentors.

Good luck!

 

[paramour]

Additionally, take stats classes early and often, checking other departments for their offerings as well. You can get also a sense of the broader field by reading original journal articles from the authors in your cognitive textbook. Use Web of Science to trace citations of particular articles. Eventually you'll start to narrow down your research interests and develop a short list of possible grad schools and mentors.

I especially like this one. 👍 I've also found that my connections in those "other" depts were particularly valuable for networking. Who would've thunk it? And here the profs in my dept were looking at me like I was nuts for going out in the wide blue yonder... 😀 Although I acknowledge that I may be a wee bit out there, I find that there are many more folks out there who appreciate an interdisciplinary approach. Being exposed to different fields (repeat after me) is a good thing. If you can work with a multidisciplinary team, that's grand and all, as well, but if you also have the exposure to be able to bring those perspectives from your own background into your own work, that makes it even peachier! (Even if it does drive your own primary dept batty at times... )

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I think this is pushy and overdoing it. I had a student do this to me once, and he came off as arrogant. The first day of class is incredibly hectic, and it's a bad time to bother profs or even TAs with "trying to make your mark." Most UGs are just treading water--it's easy to distinguish yourself by doing good work, not being a nuisance, and showing up to scheduled office hours once or more during the term. Be prepared with something to say/ask. Remember profs aren't all the same, and the more prestige they command, the less likely they are to understand themselves as "teachers" (as opposed to researchers whose job description regrettably includes teaching undergrad classes). Don't take it personally if they are unresponsive, and don't act entitled to their attention. But do show up to office hours, develop relationships early. The last thing you want is to graduate and realize that all you have for letter writers are a bunch of TAs.

I generally agree. While I wasn't bothered when students introduced themselves to me on the first day, I would say that attending office hours once or twice is a very, very solid way to make your presence known. If you just have a brief comment, question, etc., you could try approaching the instructor immediately after class as well. This definitely seems to go over better with grad students than it does actual faculty, but it's always worth a shot. Additionally, if the professor has his/her grad student conduct office hours on his/her behalf, this might be your only way of actually interacting with 'em.

My undergrad advisor also happened to be my research lab supervisor, and when I went to apply for an RA spot with him, he remembered me from his class the previous semester. That's likely the main reason I got the offer to join.

Also, this likely doesn't need to be said, but when you do secure an RA spot, do all of your assigned work and do it well. Show up early for your shifts, contribute when possible during meetings, avoid whining/complaining, etc. I'm sure the other posters here will agree with me when I say that a solid, dependable, intelligent RA is worth his/her weight in gold; you will be appreciated (whether it be by the professor, the grad students, or both).

 

[wigflip]

I generally agree. While I wasn't bothered when students introduced themselves to me on the first day, I would say that attending office hours once or twice is a very, very solid way to make your presence known. If you just have a brief comment, question, etc., you could try approaching the instructor immediately after class as well. This definitely seems to go over better with grad students than it does actual faculty, but it's always worth a shot. Additionally, if the professor has his/her grad student conduct office hours on his/her behalf, this might be your only way of actually interacting with 'em.

My undergrad advisor also happened to be my research lab supervisor, and when I went to apply for an RA spot with him, he remembered me from his class the previous semester. That's likely the main reason I got the offer to join.

Also, this likely doesn't need to be said, but when you do secure an RA spot, do all of your assigned work and do it well. Show up early for your shifts, contribute when possible during meetings, avoid whining/complaining, etc. I'm sure the other posters here will agree with me when I say that a solid, dependable, intelligent RA is worth his/her weight in gold; you will be appreciated (whether it be by the professor, the grad students, or both).

I think the best advice (with regards to when to approach profs/TAs) is to pay attention to them as well as your own needs. It should go without saying, but I can't tell you how many times I've obviously been burdened with heavy things to carry, been in a rush, told my students I can't stay after, and still, here they come! "I came in late--what's the assignment again?" "I wasn't here Tuesday, did I miss anything?" (Reply: "Nope, just dickin' around, like usual."). It's a great way to make precisely the wrong impression. If they seem open to talking afterwards on a particular day, that's a great time, but look for body language and do be respectful if they tell you they're running to a meeting. Not that you wouldn't, but it's worth noting.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I think the best advice (with regards to when to approach profs/TAs) is to pay attention to them as well as your own needs. It should go without saying, but I can't tell you how many times I've obviously been burdened with heavy things to carry, been in a rush, told my students I can't stay after, and still, here they come! "I came in late--what's the assignment again?" "I wasn't here Tuesday, did I miss anything?" (Reply: "Nope, just dickin' around, like usual."). It's a great way to make precisely the wrong impression. If they seem open to talking afterwards on a particular day, that's a great time, but look for body language and do be respectful if they tell you they're running to a meeting. Not that you wouldn't, but it's worth noting.

👍

Another general note: please read each course syllabus carefully. I tend to be fairly laid back in general, and this didn't often irritate me, but even I had my limit for the number of times I could stand being asked questions (particularly if it occurred late in the semester) that were directly answered in the syllabus (e.g., when make-up exams were offered, dates for tests and assignments, what chapters said tests covered).

Although don't take what's being said to mean that all instructors are too busy and irksome to speak with you. Some might be, but in general, instructors appreciate having students who are genuinely interested in the material, and are often more than willing to talk with you when their schedules allow it.

 

[mewtoo]

Absolutely. But when you do, be aware that you are hypervisible to the prof. It really only takes one side conversation, late entry to class, mid-class text, note scribbling on friend's page (in lieu of talking) to become a nuisance. That said, I'm guessing pointing this out is not necessary, since OP is the type of person who is still in high school and already planning for graduate studies.

I think this is pushy and overdoing it. I had a student do this to me once, and he came off as arrogant. The first day of class is incredibly hectic, and it's a bad time to bother profs or even TAs with "trying to make your mark." Most UGs are just treading water--it's easy to distinguish yourself by doing good work, not being a nuisance, and showing up to scheduled office hours once or more during the term. Be prepared with something to say/ask. Remember profs aren't all the same, and the more prestige they command, the less likely they are to understand themselves as "teachers" (as opposed to researchers whose job description regrettably includes teaching undergrad classes). Don't take it personally if they are unresponsive, and don't act entitled to their attention. But do show up to office hours, develop relationships early. The last thing you want is to graduate and realize that all you have for letter writers are a bunch of TAs.

To the first point, I've seen the sitting in the front row thing backfire on a classmate before. She would send texts sometimes in class and one day the professor just freaked out on her and went on to tell the whole class that texting would not be tolerated and made a point of mentioning you are on the freaking front row- I can see everything you do! I've always had good experiences sitting in the front row (of course I actually pay attention in class). I even had a professor from a different department remember me a year later from the one class I took with him (geology for BS requirements FTW) simply because I sat in the front row and answered questions and the such.

To the second point, I think professors at my department would be put off by a student coming up and shaking their hand, etc. I've never done so and pretty much all the professors (and even the office staff- ah, the joys of checking out lab keys every day for a year 🙄) know my name at the very least. I've always just showed up to class, participated in class discussions, and produced quality work/got some of the highest grades in the class. If you are a good student they will figure it out without you shoving it in their face. I think it should be noted to treat all the faculty and staff like you would your mentor too, respect wise. Professors discuss their students with other professors. I've seen this go both ways. For me its been good. I've had professors I've never taken classes with (or even talked to, really) that know my name and always act like they know it for a good reason (e.g., they ask me about my research with my mentor, how my classes are going, what I'm planning for grad school). I have a friend who abused the "I'm sick/vomiting so I can't take the test/turn in my test today" excuse and was flaky with her lab (eventually getting kicked out and having a blow out with her mentor) and, believe me, the professors know her name. In her case this actually crossed department/college and has contaminated her relationships with the biology department too. And I agree- treat the TAs right. Their boss is your professor and so your professor hears everything.

Also, as others have said, try to get into research as early as possible! I wish I had started in my sophomore year rather than my junior year. Also, research your schools psych departments before picking which uni you want to go to. I went to the Uni I am at because I would be able to commute from home and I've become disappointed with my psych department. Its not the professors I'm disappointed with, but rather the size and classes offered. I am starting my senior year tomorrow and I think the only psych classes I haven't taken are the I/O ones and a 2 sophomore level classes. I actually only have 3 classes left for my degree to take this year so I'm kind of freaking out about what in the world I'm going to take this spring besides my one required class. This is the bad side of taking summer classes. I've taken them each year and it actually created a problem for me. I either had the option of shoving a few more classes in this past year and that summer and graduating a year early (which would have screwed me up for applying to grad school, would have left me with less research experience, and a weird limbo year) or stretching it out into my senior year and gaining more research experience (but having to take a bunch of BS classes to fill up- I see more creative writing classes in my future...).

I think resources like ratemyprofessor are actually valuable. I always take everything with a grain of salt, but when there is 50 reviews all saying the same negative comment its usually safe to assume its true. Just ignore the, "OMG I hate him because his class is hard and he didn't give me an A I was a A student in HS and I can't believe I failed even though I didn't show up to class until finals!!!!!!1!!11 🙁😡😡🙁"

 

[BlackSkirtTetra]

Don't be the student who dyes your hair blue and wears duct tape across your mouth to bring awareness to the plight of XYZ minority. I did that in undergrad and in retrospect I'm sure I looked very stupid!

I like all of the advice above!

 

[wigflip]

good post, mewtoo.

To the first point, I've seen the sitting in the front row thing backfire on a classmate before. She would send texts sometimes in class and one day the professor just freaked out on her and went on to tell the whole class that texting would not be tolerated and made a point of mentioning you are on the freaking front row- I can see everything you do! I've always had good experiences sitting in the front row (of course I actually pay attention in class). I even had a professor from a different department remember me a year later from the one class I took with him (geology for BS requirements FTW) simply because I sat in the front row and answered questions and the such.

I can see what folks in the back row are doing too, but screwing around in the front row is just so blatantly disrespectful it's extra hard to tolerate. Unless you have a partner about to give birth, a family member in surgery, or are waiting for a donated organ, there's no reason you need to have your cell phone on in class no matter where you sit.

To the second point, I think professors at my department would be put off by a student coming up and shaking their hand, etc. I've never done so and pretty much all the professors (and even the office staff- ah, the joys of checking out lab keys every day for a year 🙄) know my name at the very least. I've always just showed up to class, participated in class discussions, and produced quality work/got some of the highest grades in the class. If you are a good student they will figure it out without you shoving it in their face. I think it should be noted to treat all the faculty and staff like you would your mentor too, respect wise. Professors discuss their students with other professors. I've seen this go both ways. For me its been good. I've had professors I've never taken classes with (or even talked to, really) that know my name and always act like they know it for a good reason (e.g., they ask me about my research with my mentor, how my classes are going, what I'm planning for grad school). I have a friend who abused the "I'm sick/vomiting so I can't take the test/turn in my test today" excuse and was flaky with her lab (eventually getting kicked out and having a blow out with her mentor) and, believe me, the professors know her name. In her case this actually crossed department/college and has contaminated her relationships with the biology department too. And I agree- treat the TAs right. Their boss is your professor and so your professor hears everything.

Yeah, introducing oneself seems more collegial. Show profs/TAs you're worth paying attention to, don't come right out and tell them. Good students stand out--period.