AMC Comparison (Envision, TeamHealth, NAPA, USAP, etc)
Started by N0PAINN0GAIN
Every amc is different with all these little side entities.
So Envison at site A is run differently than Envison site B. Even in the same city.
Same with team health site A vs site B
Your question is too broad to answer.
You need to ask us specific locations
It’s really depends on local leadership as well and how they run the practice. A shady leader may favor his own schedule and dump more work to others
Pm me if you’d like to connect. I can be more straightforward offline.
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The organization doesn't matter. It's just a name on the paycheck.
What matters is the local hospital anesthesia structure. Schedule, call, pay rate, case type, fairness
If nearly every local job in the area from these AMCs is posted on gaswork for years, it comes off like every single one is a red flag. Would it be better to just set up your own LLC/SCorp and do locums at all of them for better pay since the chance of them filling any of these positions is unlikely.
Do locums if you are single and or no kids.
I keep a w2 job with lots of vacation plus do locums. But once my kids are out of the house (won’t be another 3-5 years). I’m not gonna to keep a w2 job.
But remember even if the amc has openings. It doesn’t necessarily mean you can stroll in and get a 1099 hours.
Many of them can fill the shortage with internal w2 extra shift work for their existing staff. Most of w2 docs who work these 500-550k w2 jobs /9-10 weeks off. Usually end up making 650k ish due to extra shifts they pickup internally.
But if u are flexible and willing to travel and be flexible. Definitely do 1099 locums.
If you can do 1099 locums with your social situation you should. The market is so good and the flexibility and write offs are priceless depending on your situation. I would LOVE to be 1099…..
Seems low
I think 500-550k is standard w2 pay (at least in Florida).
My last (3) w2 in the state of Florida have ranged from 450-510k w2
But the devil is in the details
Workload
Time off
Benefits
1. One job had 11 weeks off and free health care and great benefits (80-90% supervision) no nights or weekends (35 min from my house)
2. Other job had 30 weeks off (with ob solo call) (45 min from my house)
3. Current job has 20 weeks off (no ob/ crna on call with me) 15 min from my house
All working an average of 40 hrs
30 weeks off is full time? 🤔🤔
San Antonio? Who’s least evil?
One week on, one week off. Local job has 26 weeks off, 750 annual. Small community hospital. 7 days of straight call is probably very annoying.
Especially if it’s all nights…
Rads did something similar during their poor job market. 1 on/1 off. But most are now 1 on/2 off.
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Well technically 0.8 but with bull benefits because no one wants 620k w2 with 13 weeks off with 4 docs traditional model. 5 docs is the key for 30 weeks off and 500k. The 120k gets taxed at 35%. Vs doing ur own locums work and paying around 15-18% effective tax rate.
600k each for 4 doc (2 docs each 2 weeks alternating days ) is the more reliable model. ). That’s what Georgia pays. 1099 (u gotta carry ur own malpractice). Slow ob service. Not about of call backs.
So 750k 14 calls is not good. Should be around 1.2 million if one doc is doing 14 days of calls
Arizona envision? Thoughts?
It’s a goofy time. Banner is working on employing all their envision anesthesia staff. They’ve started at a few hospitals and the plan is to do it system wide. Honorhealth is also trying to move away from them at some sites. Not sure what the big picture outlook is on the group but tons of transitioning right now.
Just about every hospital system is moving away from AMCs. They are seen as no value added, with exceptional cost particularly with locums utilization on the CRNA side. This is particularly true at ASCs.
The gig is up on "we will come in and do this for less stipend" only to be hit with a massive overage cost bill 6-9 months into the contract. Hospitals want to concretely see what they are paying for on the balance sheet, and large outlays to AMCs or even to private practices with staffing troubles raises eyebrows in the board room. So even if it costs them more in the short-medium term, they are willing to suck it up to fully grasp and control the cost.
The gig is up on "we will come in and do this for less stipend" only to be hit with a massive overage cost bill 6-9 months into the contract. Hospitals want to concretely see what they are paying for on the balance sheet, and large outlays to AMCs or even to private practices with staffing troubles raises eyebrows in the board room. So even if it costs them more in the short-medium term, they are willing to suck it up to fully grasp and control the cost.
I think just about all of them in ATL have disappeared. Most (not all) are either hospital-employed or academic institution affiliated.
I don’t know where AZ stands as far as noncompete, nor how aggressive Envision would be in going after docs. But you’d be geographically pretty limited in Phoenix since Envision is dispersed all around the city if the noncompete turns into an issue. I’d guess they would have to put on an aggressive front, at least initially, so the hospitals would take them seriously and provide handsome buy outs.
That’s 100% true.
But remember it takes good hospital admin along with trust worthy anesthesia “leaders” to make in house w2 anesthesia work.
Too often either the hospital admin doesn’t know what they are doing or u get a corrupt chief who’s really out for themselves.
A hospital I used to be on recently and went backwards. Meaning they kicked out an an AMC 6 years ago went in house w2. But now going going back to AMC. So much mismanagement by hospital admin. But all locums docs making 1099 1 million plus and locums Crnas making 450k plus hardly doing any calls either.
Now the hospital is kicking out the in house w2 hospital run anesthesia for another management company. lol. U can’t make this up.
That’s what I mean by it takes local leadership to know how to run in house w2 anesthesia
I'm very satisfied with my Envision job in Phoenix as a generalist. We can make $1MM a year.
I can definitely tell you more about the job and the what the outlook looks like going forward here regarding hospitals and AMC negotiations, of which I am involved in to a degree. Despite others here saying hospitals would like to get away from AMCs, that's not very easily doable currently (more challenging for some hospitals than others). Also, Envision does not enforce their noncompetes here, as I don't think anybody has been able to successfully do that here in AZ. There are people switching jobs all over the place and working across the street shortly after quitting.
Yes please can you tell me more about the job? If you’re not comfortable posting here, feel free to DM. Thanks so much
DM'd!
