Any advice?

[medictoMDhopeful319]

---

Members do not see this ad.

During my undergrad I have obtained a 2.08 GPA. I initially started as a premed bio major. After my sophomore year I changed majors to emergency medical care and obtained my paramedic license. I decided to take sometime off and have been working as a paramedic for a 911 EMS service and recently started working in an emergency department at a local hospital as well. I’ve been out of school for two years now. I was really immature while I was in school and have decided to pursue medical school. Is it still possible? If I go back, should I finish my biology degree or emergency medical care degree (I would still have all premed prerequisites per the degree requirements)? Or both? Would a post-bacc help enhance my chances?

 

[petomed]

How many total credit hours are attached to that 2.08 GPA?

 

[medictoMDhopeful319]

Around 110 I think

 

[petomed]

Around 110 I think

I don't think med school is closed off for you but the route is long and nothing is guaranteed. Your experiences and story are likely to be good, just know that you have to make great grades and score very well on the MCAT when the time comes (see underdawg sections below).

I'll dip briefly into the GPA situation here. Having a 3.0 cGPA at the time of application would be great but I'm not sure you'll get there, as it would require just over 100 credits at straight A's from where you currently sit. You likely have ~30 more credits to finish your BS. This would put you in the range of 2.40 - 2.50 at that point. I sifted through the 2020-2021 underdawg thread and no one received an A at < 2.67 cGPA. That's not to say it can't be done or that it hasn't been done in years prior. Just a datapoint from a very limited dataset.

If a postbac gives you access to 30+ more credit hours then you could be in the range of 2.60 - 2.75. Talk with others and check further into the underdawg forums, but your chances keep improving the closer you can get to a cGPA of 3.0. Tack onto that a superb MCAT, which I'd pin at 90+ percentile and is not easy to do--then you have a real chance. I'd just do the math ahead of time and be sure you know where your chips could fall on cGPA ahead of time. It is unfortunately a very important aspect of your ability to gain acceptance.

As to which degree to pursue if you go back to school, I'll talk out of both sides of my mouth here. Admissions committees want to see you chasing your passions at 110% and acing your classes while you do it. This shows you've got the smarts and intrinsic motivation, which are crucial in medical school and beyond. To this end, you should choose whichever BS that you feel you can make the grades in and be happy with as a fallback career choice if medical school doesn't work out.

On the other side of things, you really do need a high MCAT score. I'm not familiar with the coursework involved with an emergency medical degree but I'm fairly certain a BS in Biology will force you to take some upper level coursework in topics that will be helpful when the time comes to take the MCAT. You'll need to look further into what the MCAT tests and weigh this against your fallback career choice if medical school doesn't pan out. Keep in mind people score high all the time on the MCAT by taking only the bare minimum of coursework but studying very well and paying $$ for review classes.

Underdawgs threads:
2021-22 Underdawgs Thread [in progress]
2020-21 Underdawgs Thread
2019-20 Underdawgs Thread
2018-19 Underdawgs Thread
2017-18 Underdawgs Thread


Sub 3.0 GPA results from 2020-2021:

• aduuubacsi: 2.92 cGPA / 2.92 sGPA/ 499 MCAT / Verified 7/24 / 0 Interview / 0 Acceptances / 3.78 SMP GPA, 4000+ hours of community service in underserved communities
• ampersandwich: 2.93 cGPA / 2.75 sGPA / 517 MCAT / Verified 7/14 / 4 Interviews (All MD) / 3 Acceptances / 3.58 SMP GPA, high research hours
• Calizboosted76: 2.67 cGPA / 2.97 sGPA / 506 MCAT / Verified 7-30 / 3 Interviews / 2 Interviews attended/ 2 Acceptances!/ Upward trend over 50+ credits of upper level sciences at a 3.8 GPA. Significant story.
• doctor_professor_cox: cGPA 2.93 / sGPA 2.93 / 511 MCAT / Verified 6/29 / 1 Interview / 1 Acceptance / Non-Trad with 4.0 graduate GPA (33 credits), EMT with 10,000 hours direct patient contact, 2 year D1 athlete. ACCEPTED! GOING TO BE A DOCTOR!
• DXU: cGPA 2.35 / sGPA 2.39 /SMP GPA 3.68/ 501 MCAT / Verified 7-15 / 2 Interviews / 0 Acceptances / 1 Waitlist / 15 year paramedic / Strong LOR / Major upward trend/ Rejected w/ No II from UIWSOM, CUSOM, NOORDA, ACOM, KYCOM, NYITCOM-AR, Rowan / Rejected from ARCOM post-interview / Waitlist for LECOM-SH / Awaiting II or R from PCOM-PA and LMU-DCOM
• Justice1071: cGPA 2.77 / sGPA 3.54 / 504 MCAT / Verified ~ OCT 24th / 3 interviews / 2 Acceptances / Non-trad, horrendous grades from 2005, decided on Medcine and went back to finish bachelors in 2015.. ~ 3.7 gpa last 120hrs.
• Shego: 3.0 cGPA, sub-3.0 sGPA / 513 MCAT / Verified July / 11 interview Invites (8 DO, 3 MD) / 4 Acceptances, 2 WL / IA, Re-applicant, Non-Trad-ish

A straightforward equation with your current cGPA, # credits, and theoretical GPA moving forward--produces the following GPA repair plot:

 

[medictoMDhopeful319]

I don't think med school is closed off for you but the route is long and nothing is guaranteed. Your experiences and story are likely to be good, just know that you have to make great grades and score very well on the MCAT when the time comes (see underdawg sections below).

I'll dip briefly into the GPA situation here. Having a 3.0 cGPA at the time of application would be great but I'm not sure you'll get there, as it would require just over 100 credits at straight A's from where you currently sit. You likely have ~30 more credits to finish your BS. This would put you in the range of 2.40 - 2.50 at that point. I sifted through the 2020-2021 underdawg thread and no one received an A at < 2.67 cGPA. That's not to say it can't be done or that it hasn't been done in years prior. Just a datapoint from a very limited dataset.

If a postbac gives you access to 30+ more credit hours then you could be in the range of 2.60 - 2.75. Talk with others and check further into the underdawg forums, but your chances keep improving the closer you can get to a cGPA of 3.0. Tack onto that a superb MCAT, which I'd pin at 90+ percentile and is not easy to do--then you have a real chance. I'd just do the math ahead of time and be sure you know where your chips could fall on cGPA ahead of time. It is unfortunately a very important aspect of your ability to gain acceptance.

As to which degree to pursue if you go back to school, I'll talk out of both sides of my mouth here. Admissions committees want to see you chasing your passions at 110% and acing your classes while you do it. This shows you've got the smarts and intrinsic motivation, which are crucial in medical school and beyond. To this end, you should choose whichever BS that you feel you can make the grades in and be happy with as a fallback career choice if medical school doesn't work out.

On the other side of things, you really do need a high MCAT score. I'm not familiar with the coursework involved with an emergency medical degree but I'm fairly certain a BS in Biology will force you to take some upper level coursework in topics that will be helpful when the time comes to take the MCAT. You'll need to look further into what the MCAT tests and weigh this against your fallback career choice if medical school doesn't pan out. Keep in mind people score high all the time on the MCAT by taking only the bare minimum of coursework but studying very well and paying $$ for review classes.

Underdawgs threads:
2021-22 Underdawgs Thread [in progress]
2020-21 Underdawgs Thread
2019-20 Underdawgs Thread
2018-19 Underdawgs Thread
2017-18 Underdawgs Thread


Sub 3.0 GPA results from 2020-2021:

• aduuubacsi: 2.92 cGPA / 2.92 sGPA/ 499 MCAT / Verified 7/24 / 0 Interview / 0 Acceptances / 3.78 SMP GPA, 4000+ hours of community service in underserved communities
• ampersandwich: 2.93 cGPA / 2.75 sGPA / 517 MCAT / Verified 7/14 / 4 Interviews (All MD) / 3 Acceptances / 3.58 SMP GPA, high research hours
• Calizboosted76: 2.67 cGPA / 2.97 sGPA / 506 MCAT / Verified 7-30 / 3 Interviews / 2 Interviews attended/ 2 Acceptances!/ Upward trend over 50+ credits of upper level sciences at a 3.8 GPA. Significant story.
• doctor_professor_cox: cGPA 2.93 / sGPA 2.93 / 511 MCAT / Verified 6/29 / 1 Interview / 1 Acceptance / Non-Trad with 4.0 graduate GPA (33 credits), EMT with 10,000 hours direct patient contact, 2 year D1 athlete. ACCEPTED! GOING TO BE A DOCTOR!
• DXU: cGPA 2.35 / sGPA 2.39 /SMP GPA 3.68/ 501 MCAT / Verified 7-15 / 2 Interviews / 0 Acceptances / 1 Waitlist / 15 year paramedic / Strong LOR / Major upward trend/ Rejected w/ No II from UIWSOM, CUSOM, NOORDA, ACOM, KYCOM, NYITCOM-AR, Rowan / Rejected from ARCOM post-interview / Waitlist for LECOM-SH / Awaiting II or R from PCOM-PA and LMU-DCOM
• Justice1071: cGPA 2.77 / sGPA 3.54 / 504 MCAT / Verified ~ OCT 24th / 3 interviews / 2 Acceptances / Non-trad, horrendous grades from 2005, decided on Medcine and went back to finish bachelors in 2015.. ~ 3.7 gpa last 120hrs.
• Shego: 3.0 cGPA, sub-3.0 sGPA / 513 MCAT / Verified July / 11 interview Invites (8 DO, 3 MD) / 4 Acceptances, 2 WL / IA, Re-applicant, Non-Trad-ish

A straightforward equation with your current cGPA, # credits, and theoretical GPA moving forward--produces the following GPA repair plot:
View attachment 346786

So the EMC degree consists of a paramedic program and some basic biology courses (A&P, Intro to Bio, etc.), Gen chem one and two, organic chem one and two, physics one and two, and a few other courses. Do you think it would be beneficial to complete the requirements for both degrees? Would it be more beneficial to complete one of the degrees and then complete a post-bacc?

 

[petomed]

So the EMC degree consists of a paramedic program and some basic biology courses (A&P, Intro to Bio, etc.), Gen chem one and two, organic chem one and two, physics one and two, and a few other courses. Do you think it would be beneficial to complete the requirements for both degrees? Would it be more beneficial to complete one of the degrees and then complete a post-bacc?

Just my opinion but I think you do need a postbac, for the credit hours of GPA repair, if for nothing else. With this being the case, I wouldn't recommend doing both the EMC and biology BS's. Not unless we're talking about a difference of only 1-2 extra classes with selecting only one of them vs. doing both concurrently. Choose whichever one that will be the most fulfilling fallback and ace the classes. Admissions committees are level-headed individuals and many times I was asked "what will you do if you don't get into medical school?". Selecting one of these degrees instead of both will make it pretty clear you were developing a solid plan B.

I would also look into postbacs before even going back for your BS. This is unfamiliar territory for me however I imagine at least some of them have GPA entry requirements. You need to be sure your application to postbacs isn't DOA due to a low GPA. Once this hurdle is cleared then I would pull the trigger on finishing the BS.

I strongly recommend clinical volunteering as soon as all this kicks into gear. Sustained volunteering will look great on your application. 1-2 hrs/wk is all, nothing crazy.

 

[stickgirl390]

You’d need to go back to school and get the GPA up to at least a 2.5, then re-evaluate your chances. A 2.0 gpa is a red flag to med schools that you’d be a high risk to fail boards and not graduate. You have to build an application powerful enough for a school to pick you over the literal thousands of 3.5+ applicants that apply each year.

 

[gramnegative]

Petomed has given you good advice but I wouldn't prioritize clinical volunteering - you are a medic. Get some shadowing in and nonclinical volunteering with the underserved can help.

I'd say go for the bio BS since that will prob have the most overlap with the prereqs you need. Given your gpa you will need to raise it by taking extra classes. I'd look for other threads here, but for sub 3.0 gpas, I think that you will have to contact the schools you are applying to in order to prevent getting screened out.

 

[DocJanItor]

As a sub-3.0 uGPA applicant and now resident physician, I'd like to say that a sub-3.0 uGPA is almost a death knell for med school applications, even to DO schools. Unless you're able to get a lot of those bad grades redacted by a retroactive medical diagnosis or you join the military, the reality is that additional school work has diminishing returns while still making you spend a lot of time, money, and effort. Oh, you can also move to Texas and use their academic fresh start program to wipe your gpa clean.

What worked for me was redoing my pre-reqs at a community college. This had the advantage of being flexible, quick, and cheap. Perfect 4.0 for 42 hours raised me from a 2.52 to a 2.86. Then I took the MCAT and scored very well. Then I did an SMP and did pretty well (probably not as great as I should've but hey, it worked). Most people recommend 3.7+. Then I was accepted that year by my SMP's medical school. From the time I started class to the time I started med school was 3.5 years, and I don't think I could've shortened it by much.

My suggestion is that you first determine if you can succeed in finishing your degree. There's no point in pursuing med school if you can't master your undergrad classes. Then after that you can find out what programs are available to you to re-do your prereqs. It's going to take a significant sacrifice and dedication from you for the next 10+ years of your life to get in, do med school, and do residency. Constantly re-evaluate and see if this is what you want to do.