Anyone familiar with Toledo's SMP?

[StudyShy]

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I'll have a gap year inbetween the time that I complete my pre-med requirements and finish my masters degree in history. I have a good GPA, however my bachelor's degree is in nursing, and I know that adcoms do not feel that a degree in nursing demonstrates adequate preparation for medical school compared with other degrees. I feel like I could strengthen my application by taking my year "off" to pursue more graduate work and perhaps get some first year medical courses out of the way.

As such, I'm thinking about applying to University of Toledo's special masters program in the spring of 2012. I live very close to this school, and it would be my top choice of medical schools at the moment because of proximity and for other reasons.

I see from their site that it looks like they have interviews for med school in the spring of their one year program. Apparently they have a 60% linkage rate and guarantee an interview for each SMP particpant. Does anyone know if those interviews for the spring are for the following year's admissions? It seems like this would be so, but I thought that I would ask you guys before I e-mail the school.

This is a visual from part of the web site:

 

[StudyShy]

Bump. 🙄

 

[DrMidlife]

I'll offer generic advice to help prime the pump.

I'll have a gap year inbetween the time that I complete my pre-med requirements and finish my masters degree in history.

Two potential problems I see here.
1. You need an MCAT score to get into the SMP, and you need that score a long time before the SMP starts - such as maybe 6 months before, if the program is at all competitive.
2. If you have responsibilities to attend to for your masters, that's going to hurt your SMP performance. SMPs in general are 2/3 of med school. In particular, if you will have schedule conflicts between history and the SMP, that's not going to fly. I would suggest that if your history program is going to take more than 10-15 hours a week, that's too much.

I have a good GPA, however my bachelor's degree is in nursing, and I know that adcoms do not feel that a degree in nursing demonstrates adequate preparation for medical school compared with other degrees.

I don't buy it. As I've said elsewhere, the bias is against an air of entitlement combined with a low GPA. There are tons and tons of former nurses in med school and in practice. There are also tons and tons of philosophy/music/psych majors in med school and in practice. Your performance in the prereqs and on the MCAT is going to settle any argument. If you haven't practiced at all as a nurse, that's weird, but no different than an accounting major who never works as an accountant.

I feel like I could strengthen my application by taking my year "off" to pursue more graduate work and perhaps get some first year medical courses out of the way.

SMPs are inherently risky. Any med school that is considering you, or that accepts you, is going to require you to report your performance. An average performance in an SMP is a non-asset: it does nothing to help you get into med school.

That said, this program is cheap enough and useful enough that if you're well prepared to succeed, then it's a reasonable thing to do.

I see from their site that it looks like they have interviews for med school in the spring of their one year program. Apparently they have a 60% linkage rate and guarantee an interview for each SMP particpant. Does anyone know if those interviews for the spring are for the following year's admissions? It seems like this would be so, but I thought that I would ask you guys before I e-mail the school.

At EVMS, the interview is for the next class. So if you interview in March 2012, then an acceptance would be for August 2012.

Now, you should know that a March interview (same at EVMS) is an interview for a waitlist spot. You have to wait it out. Which is nerve-wracking. At a lower-tier school, people give up a lot of acceptances, so you'll probably be fine.

It's completely appropriate to apply early and broadly to med schools before you start an SMP. You should be able to get support from your SMP for letters, transcripts and potentially rescheduled exams as you get interviews elsewhere. And if you get accepted elsewhere, you should be able to use that as leverage to get faster consideration for the host school.

Best of luck to you.

 

[StudyShy]

I'll offer generic advice to help prime the pump.

Two potential problems I see here.
1. You need an MCAT score to get into the SMP, and you need that score a long time before the SMP starts - such as maybe 6 months before, if the program is at all competitive.
2. If you have responsibilities to attend to for your masters, that's going to hurt your SMP performance. SMPs in general are 2/3 of med school. In particular, if you will have schedule conflicts between history and the SMP, that's not going to fly. I would suggest that if your history program is going to take more than 10-15 hours a week, that's too much..

I'll be done with history in a year from now. I'm taking advantage of this summer to get ahead in my courses so that I can concentrate on my thesis in the fall of this year (2011). I'll be given four months to complete my thesis so I should be done in December of 2011. Yay! 🙂

Applications for Toledo's SMP are taken from March 1st to May 1st. I was planning to take the January MCAT. Would this plan be cutting it too close?

I don't buy it. As I've said elsewhere, the bias is against an air of entitlement combined with a low GPA. There are tons and tons of former nurses in med school and in practice. There are also tons and tons of philosophy/music/psych majors in med school and in practice. Your performance in the prereqs and on the MCAT is going to settle any argument. If you haven't practiced at all as a nurse, that's weird, but no different than an accounting major who never works as an accountant.

I've been a nurse for almost seven years and have worked in many different areas within my hospital. I definitely don't feel that I am better than anyone. There are so many things for me to learn. So far, I've done well in the prereqs which hopefully, like you said, will help settle some of the argument in my case. I just want to be viewed on a similar level to everyone else and not be looked down upon for having an easier degree.

SMPs are inherently risky. Any med school that is considering you, or that accepts you, is going to require you to report your performance. An average performance in an SMP is a non-asset: it does nothing to help you get into med school.

If I am fortunate enough to get into an SMP, I'm going to be busting my balls to do well. I don't think that I could let myself do poorly with so much at stake. Afterall, nontraditionals can't just fart around.

At EVMS, the interview is for the next class. So if you interview in March 2012, then an acceptance would be for August 2012.

Now, you should know that a March interview (same at EVMS) is an interview for a waitlist spot. You have to wait it out. Which is nerve-wracking. At a lower-tier school, people give up a lot of acceptances, so you'll probably be fine.

I'm glad that it is probably for the next year. Being on a waitlist scares me, though. It looks like in 2009, Toledo had 75% of the SMP students matriculate. That's pretty good. 👍

It's completely appropriate to apply early and broadly to med schools before you start an SMP. You should be able to get support from your SMP for letters, transcripts and potentially rescheduled exams as you get interviews elsewhere. And if you get accepted elsewhere, you should be able to use that as leverage to get faster consideration for the host school.

I can imagine it will be difficult to travel around the country while doing an SMP. That is definitely one of my concerns if I apply for the average 10-20 schools and attend interviews.

I'm really excited. I've never heard anyone talk about SMPs at my hospital. It seems like a wonderful opportunity for me to get my feet wet a little in some more sciences, work toward another master's degree, and be productive in my year in waiting.

If I don't get into Toledo's SMP, I'll probably just take some higher-level science courses during my gap year. I still need to look into Wayne State's SMP, but that is an hour drive from me.

Thanks for responding, Dr.Midlife! 🙂

 

[DrMidlife]

Applications for Toledo's SMP are taken from March 1st to May 1st. I was planning to take the January MCAT. Would this plan be cutting it too close?

January should be great. I suggest planning on MCAT prep being a part time job starting in maybe September. I really want to encourage you to focus on taking the MCAT once and only once.

I just want to be viewed on a similar level to everyone else and not be looked down upon for having an easier degree.

Anybody who's paying attention at all knows that nursing isn't easy. I see a whole lot of unprepared bio majors who skated on their upper div requirements.

I'm glad that it is probably for the next year. Being on a waitlist scares me, though. It looks like in 2009, Toledo had 75% of the SMP students matriculate. That's pretty good. 👍

I agree, those are good odds. I suggest asking the SMP folks if you can meet with a current SMP student, maybe over this coming spring break. Better yet, ask to meet with a former SMP student who is now an M1 at Toledo. If they're anything like EVMS, they know EVERYTHING about the previous year's class and can account for the story behind each individual in that 25%. Get the skinny - which current students will be staying at Toledo, what other schools did folks get into, which faculty are retiring, which building is being remodeled, how much is tuition going up etc.

I think you're doing good prep. I love it when people ask questions before it's too late to do anything. Don't be afraid to be talked out of doing an SMP - look into CDC internships and whatnot as well.

Best of luck to you.

 

[Isoprop]

I was considering Toledo's SMP. Did some research and talked to someone from their office. My information may be out of date or inaccurate from bad memory.

But if I remember correctly, you have to apply to Toledo (via AMCAS) to be offered an interview there. Also, SMP admissions isn't rolling so they make decisions after May. Getting your application in early doesn't help so a Jan MCAT will totally be appropriate for Toledo.

It's a well known, well respected SMP in Ohio. IMO, better than Cinci's program if you don't mind staying in Ohio. And it's much cheaper than other SMPs.

 

[StudyShy]

I was considering Toledo's SMP. Did some research and talked to someone from their office. My information may be out of date or inaccurate from bad memory.

But if I remember correctly, you have to apply to Toledo (via AMCAS) to be offered an interview there. Also, SMP admissions isn't rolling so they make decisions after May. Getting your application in early doesn't help so a Jan MCAT will totally be appropriate for Toledo.

It's a well known, well respected SMP in Ohio. IMO, better than Cinci's program if you don't mind staying in Ohio. And it's much cheaper than other SMPs.

I am so glad that it sounds like it is a good program. The tuition didn't appear to be that bad which makes the decision even more appealing. I actually live in Michigan, however Monroe county residents receive reciprocity with the University of Toledo. Thank goodness that MCO and UT merged.

Did you end up doing an SMP? What made you decide against Toledo?

January should be great. I suggest planning on MCAT prep being a part time job starting in maybe September. I really want to encourage you to focus on taking the MCAT once and only once.

That will give me exactly a year to study. Yay! I definitely only want to take it once. I've been going through the EK material so far, and I just purchased TPR's Hyperlearning books on ebay. Since I work FT, I need to begin the preparation now. I'm taking the "slow and study wins the race" approach. I'll have to see if there are any review courses that I can take that don't conflict with my work schedule that I can do in the fall of 2011.

I agree, those are good odds. I suggest asking the SMP folks if you can meet with a current SMP student, maybe over this coming spring break. Better yet, ask to meet with a former SMP student who is now an M1 at Toledo. If they're anything like EVMS, they know EVERYTHING about the previous year's class and can account for the story behind each individual in that 25%. Get the skinny - which current students will be staying at Toledo, what other schools did folks get into, which faculty are retiring, which building is being remodeled, how much is tuition going up etc.

That definitely sounds like a good idea. I'm so outgoing about some things and shy at others. I'm going to set up a tour of the campus. I want the dirt on everything. 🙂

I think you're doing good prep. I love it when people ask questions before it's too late to do anything. Don't be afraid to be talked out of doing an SMP - look into CDC internships and whatnot as well.

I had never thought of doing a CDC internship. Thank goodness for having a variety of opportunities!


Thank you for answering my questions! 🙂

 

[Isoprop]

Did you end up doing an SMP? What made you decide against Toledo?

Due to the high risk nature of SMPs, I decided to give a post-bacc a chance before doing an SMP. I wanted the SMP to be my last shot at getting an acceptance. If I didn't get in this year, I'd be applying to Toledo and Cinci with Toledo ranked first.

Luckily I gained an acceptance.

 

[StudyShy]

Due to the high risk nature of SMPs, I decided to give a post-bacc a chance before doing an SMP. I wanted the SMP to be my last shot at getting an acceptance. If I didn't get in this year, I'd be applying to Toledo and Cinci with Toledo ranked first.

Luckily I gained an acceptance.

Congratulations! I'm glad that everything turned out. Good luck! 🙂