AOA Launches Multi-Year "DO Awareness Campaign"

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Bea5T said:
This could go well or horribly wrong
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Honestly, public perception and knowledge of DOs is awful. The average person who thinks of DOs automatically thinks of either Mercola or Tenpenni who are both anti-science snake oil peddlers. Anything that helps advertise DOs as competency physicians is good.

What we really need to do is utterly prohibit the use of Doctor for non physicians in the public forum.
 
As an allo colleague, it would be nice if we could just merge, they are already merging residency programs. It would help strengthen the spotty clinical training at some of the DO schools and strengthen the brand of being a physician as a unified front.

The public is pretty uneducated on the vast difference between physicians and other medical practitioners. I fear that the thought of "another" doctor just as good as an MD will only give more traction and credibility to all the quacks and undertrained "providers" (nd, np etc). Highlighting a difference only draws attention to this and seems like a possible slight at MDs?
 
iwillnevergiveup said:
http://doctorsthatdo.org/doctors-that-do

http://www.osteopathic.org/inside-aoa/about/Pages/doctors-that-DO-campaign.aspx

AOA is about 100 years late, but better late than never?

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I remember some students at KCUMB made a better video mimicking the Apple vs Windows advertisement that used to run on TV several years ago, I'm a PC and I'm a Mac, changing it to I'm a DO and I'm an MD, its much better than what this current AOA campaign is attempting to achieve.
 
TwinsFan said:
As an allo colleague, it would be nice if we could just merge, they are already merging residency programs. It would help strengthen the spotty clinical training at some of the DO schools and strengthen the brand of being a physician as a unified front.

The public is pretty uneducated on the vast difference between physicians and other medical practitioners. I fear that the thought of "another" doctor just as good as an MD will only give more traction and credibility to all the quacks and undertrained "providers" (nd, np etc). Highlighting a difference only draws attention to this and seems like a possible slight at MDs?
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I don't see why Osteopathic Medical Schools can't adopt the MD degree, continue to teach OMM and osteopathic heritage and etc and move onto a united front. And I agree, merging could see the LCME and other organizations such as state programs allocate proper resources to supplement education and other deficits in opportunities.

I think whether we like it or not, we're moving towards closer work with the MD world.
 
serenade said:
I don't see why Osteopathic Medical Schools can't adopt the MD degree, continue to teach OMM and osteopathic heritage and etc and move onto a united front. And I agree, merging could see the LCME and other organizations such as state programs allocate proper resources to supplement education and other deficits in opportunities.

I think whether we like it or not, we're moving towards closer work with the MD world.
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That will never happen.
 
TwinsFan said:
As an allo colleague, it would be nice if we could just merge, they are already merging residency programs. It would help strengthen the spotty clinical training at some of the DO schools and strengthen the brand of being a physician as a unified front.

The public is pretty uneducated on the vast difference between physicians and other medical practitioners. I fear that the thought of "another" doctor just as good as an MD will only give more traction and credibility to all the quacks and undertrained "providers" (nd, np etc). Highlighting a difference only draws attention to this and seems like a possible slight at MDs?
Click to expand...

The other day I was trying to explain what a DO is to my brother in law. He started talking about a friend in his who "went the chiropractic route and was explaining the differences and how it's also basically the same as an MD except he got a little less chemistry so he can't prescribe medication."

People out there really have no idea how medicine and science work. They think MDs and DOs and Chiropractors and NDs are all just equally valid options with different 'opinions' on how to treat patients.
 
serenade said:
I disagree, as time goes on we will have more and more collaboration with the MD side because that's what our students and what our future DOs will want to do with their lives.
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I completely agree with this. I think the DO and MD worlds will collide once the old guard of DOs retires and younger generation DOs move into leadership positions. I'm just a first year, so I don't have any authority to say whether or not I believe in OMM yet, but I know I will not hide that I am a DO because that degree will allow me to be a physician. I hope that one day DO/MD will become the same as DMD/DDS - same UME standards, same GME standards (obviously already happening), same board certifications/specialty colleges, etc. (+/- OMT)
 
serenade said:
I disagree, as time goes on we will have more and more collaboration with the MD side because that's what our students and what our future DOs will want to do with their lives.
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Then I guess DO schools will be "assimilated" and purged of their OMM curriculum, and cease to exist as DO schools. Then there will be no need of the DO degree or the AOA or COCA. Whatever DO schools that exist will become community based MD schools. A lot of the older folks won't be too happy about this.
 
NurWollen said:
The other day I was trying to explain what a DO is to my brother in law. He started talking about a friend in his who "went the chiropractic route and was explaining the differences and how it's also basically the same as an MD except he got a little less chemistry so he can't prescribe medication."

People out there really have no idea how medicine and science work. They think MDs and DOs and Chiropractors and NDs are all just equally valid options with different 'opinions' on how to treat patients.
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Which is honestly disastrous in terms of outcomes for patients. When it comes down to it having a separate degree not only makes it difficult for people to understand that we are physicians, it makes it difficult to sort us out of the alternative group which is constantly being populated by obscure and fields that are only dedicated to the treatment of a fat wallet.
 
Seth Joo said:
Then I guess DO schools will be "assimilated" and purged of their OMM curriculum, and cease to exist as DO schools. Then there will be no need of the DO degree or the AOA or COCA. Whatever DO schools that exist will become community based MD schools. A lot of the older folks won't be too happy about this.
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Good thing is that we're going to have numbers. There graduate more pro-MD osteopaths in a few years than old guard DOs.
 
Just before the merger was announced I remember talking with the DME of a very large OPTI. He predicted that if merger went through, it would undoubtedly signal the end of the DO degree.

This well connected DME predicted that once a merger was established and all the dust settles, the natural next step would be a unification of undergraduate medical education and that LCME would absorb COCA for a unified accreditation body for all US grads.
 
meliora27 said:
Just before the merger was announced I remember talking with the DME of a very large OPTI. He predicted that if merger went through, it would undoubtedly signal the end of the DO degree.

This well connected DME predicted that once a merger was established and all the dust settles, the natural next step would be a unification of undergraduate medical education and that LCME would absorb COCA for a unified accreditation body for all US grads.
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So no more OMM. I am guessing this would still be a while.
 
Seth Joo said:
So no more OMM. I am guessing this would still be a while.
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No way COM's completely remove OMM.

Even if XYZ-COM were magically overnight LCME accredited, I'm sure OMM would still remain in their preclinical curriculum. LCME doesn't not mandate a specified curriculum per se. Take Duke for example, they do clinicals M2 and M4 with basically a research year M3. This is not the curriculum at UIC for example, but both are still LCME accredited.
 
meliora27 said:
No way COM's completely remove OMM.

Even if XYZ-COM were magically overnight LCME accredited, I'm sure OMM would still remain in their preclinical curriculum. LCME doesn't not mandate a specified curriculum per se. Take Duke for example, they do clinicals M2 and M4 with basically a research year M3. This is not the curriculum at UIC for example, but both are still LCME accredited.
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That is why they will not become LCME schools at least not for the next couple of decades, and that is why COCA will not merge with LCME, DO schools and MD schools will remain separate entities for a long time.

If they did become LCME schools, I am sure OMM would be removed from the curriculum with something else added in, maybe a more community medicine focus. I do not see the AOA folding its tent and DO schools ceasing to change their identities anytime soon regardless of what millennials want. If they want "MD" on their lab coat they are going to have to go offshore.
 
Cringeworthy. All of the attributes of a "DO" simply seem like personality traits. You can't train someone to be empathetic.

Edit: They use the word "distinct". i.e. "WE ARE SPECIAL AND SUPERIOR TO MDs :diebanana:" The fact that an "awareness campaign" is thought to be needed, is an embarrassment.
 
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meliora27 said:
No way COM's completely remove OMM.

Even if XYZ-COM were magically overnight LCME accredited, I'm sure OMM would still remain in their preclinical curriculum. LCME doesn't not mandate a specified curriculum per se. Take Duke for example, they do clinicals M2 and M4 with basically a research year M3. This is not the curriculum at UIC for example, but both are still LCME accredited.
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Which I think is reasonable. I don't think we need to excise OMM, hell we could 'export' it as an elective education option for other MD students too if we unified. Honestly, both parties can be happy, the old timers still keep their jobs, and the students and doctors benefit.
 
serenade said:
Which I think is reasonable. I don't think we need to excise OMM, hell we could 'export' it as an elective education option for other MD students too if we unified. Honestly, both parties can be happy, the old timers still keep their jobs, and the students and doctors benefit.
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I think this is already being done through CME, but I agree that it could probably easily be transformed into a medical school elective. Probably geared towards those interested primary care providers and PM&R (or other OMM-applicable fields). Rumor I've heard (granted from school leadership) is that there are some current ACGME residencies applying for osteopathic recognition or whatever the term is.
 
With the realistic realization that a total merger and/or abandonment is a fantasy that won't happen anytime soon... a campaign for visibility isn't the worst idea. We talk a lot on SDN about prejudice from MDs, but an equally big problem might be the fact that a lot of the public isn't aware that DOs are doctors at all-- it's not even a prejudice thing, they just don't realize we exist. A campaign to fix that aspect can't hurt.
 
I love this thread too much to stay lurking.

I'll be graduating in 2018, and IMO it is apparent that this a futile attempt by the AOA to maintain osteopathic medicine's identity, ie "treating the whole person" and "osteopathic principles" mantra in the midst of the ACGME merger.

As I've said before, the AOA is attempting to survive the merger by maintaining a "seperate, but equal" form of medical education. Most (All?) of the deans/leadership of osteopathic medical schools are AOA-trained and are members of osteopathic professional colleges.

In medical school, the only thing that distinguishes DO's from MD's is one two-hour class a week.
In practice, the two physicians are indistinguishable. Which leads to the point that if the distinguishing feature of DO schools, OMT, is not used by over 90% of DO school graduates, then why should there be a difference at all? Because the AOA is trying to keep their head above water and protect their brand. That's all we are- a brand that consistently funnels money into their system (COMLEX, osteopathic match, etc...)

Its gonna take ACGME trained DO's to propose the US Dept of Education to consolidate US undergraduate medical education under the LCME. Too bad we are too worried about our next exam/boards/clinicals to do anything about it!
 
CrocodilePancake said:
I love this thread too much to stay lurking.

I'll be graduating in 2018, and IMO it is apparent that this a futile attempt by the AOA to maintain osteopathic medicine's identity, ie "treating the whole person" and "osteopathic principles" mantra in the midst of the ACGME merger.

As I've said before, the AOA is attempting to survive the merger by maintaining a "seperate, but equal" form of medical education. Most (All?) of the deans/leadership of osteopathic medical schools are AOA-trained and are members of osteopathic professional colleges.

In medical school, the only thing that distinguishes DO's from MD's is one two-hour class a week.
In practice, the two physicians are indistinguishable. Which leads to the point that if the distinguishing feature of DO schools, OMT, is not used by over 90% of DO school graduates, then why should there be a difference at all? Because the AOA is trying to keep their head above water and protect their brand. That's all we are- a brand that consistently funnels money into their system (COMLEX, osteopathic match, etc...)

Its gonna take ACGME trained DO's to propose the US Dept of Education to consolidate US undergraduate medical education under the LCME. Too bad we are too worried about our next exam/boards/clinicals to do anything about it!
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Unfortunately that won't happen, as professions have the ability to self-direct. The DOA can't force programs to switch to a different accrediting body- the only way for that to happen is for either the accrediting body to willingly fold or become defunct. Unfortunately, the COCA and AOA leadership are largely composed of True Believers, so that will never, ever happen. If osteopathic principles and practices are so wonderful and self-evident, wouldn't the whole world be better served by the COCA and AOA being absorbed into the LCME and AMA, which would then offer such principles and practices to all willing students and residents, but not those that were unwilling?
 
I can see a merge between DO and MD happening. Hell, the ACGME already allowed AOA programs to continue with their osteopathic focus, I'm sure the lcme could do the same for the DO programs if it means a single unified accreditation. Of course it'll probably take one ahem, man handling just like what happened with the ACGME and AOA.
 
If the merger doesn't happen in our lifetime, instead of giving alumni support to my school, I'll raise the "DO/MD merge awareness" campaign on 142 E. Ontario St., Chicago.
Mad Jack said:
Unfortunately the powers that be stand to lose too much and gain very little in such a scenario. And many schools would close. Don't hold your breath for a merger in our lifetime bro.
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Bea5T said:
This could go well or horribly wrong
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FQuThVZ.jpg
 
Mad Jack said:
Unfortunately the powers that be stand to lose too much and gain very little in such a scenario. And many schools would close. Don't hold your breath for a merger in our lifetime bro.
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Most notably, all positions of AOA leadership and deans of the COMs are mostly (all?) DOs who went through AOA residencies. If there were to be a merger, there would only be increased competition for such positions with the inclusion of MDs as potential candidates.
 
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I don't know what I expect from SDN or the internet as a whole but this thread is so lacking in nuance that I find it hilarious. We're in a profession that actually has the capability and financial capital to paint us in a positive light in a time when physicians are almost globally misrepresented in all corners of media, and we're lamenting this as a last ditch effort to not fold and merge with the AMA? You realize that the company responsible for this marketing research and campaign is the same company that re-branded everything from Corona to Walmart? Seems a little more forward thinking than last-ditch to me.

Not to mention that while modern DO students certainly don't think we're better than MDs, we certainly don't think OMT is the next best thing, and we certainly don't think our education is better than that of our MD counterparts (almost all of us think it's in many areas much weaker): a large number of us are actually quite proud to be DOs. I know that's crazy talk on SDN but some of us actually identify with the history and principles of our profession and want to practice (some of) what it preaches.

And yes, we know that many MDs practice that way too and many DOs don't. That's a convenient truth for detractors but all it means in reality is that some physicians practice medicine the way patients wish they did and others don't. And don't come in with some little BS like patients (including you) don't want to be treated like osteopathic principles say they should, because the market research behind this campaign proves they absolutely do, or else the campaign would look much different.

inb4 everything,
A future non-NMM and non-FP DO.
 
ortnakas said:
With the realistic realization that a total merger and/or abandonment is a fantasy that won't happen anytime soon... a campaign for visibility isn't the worst idea. We talk a lot on SDN about prejudice from MDs, but an equally big problem might be the fact that a lot of the public isn't aware that DOs are doctors at all-- it's not even a prejudice thing, they just don't realize we exist. A campaign to fix that aspect can't hurt.
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I would totally agree with the need for awareness. There are many people who have no idea what a DO is. The problem isn't with the desire for a campaign, but the "attitude" it portrayed. Here is a tagline from the campaign:

Before you talk to a doctor, choose one trained to listen.
Doctors of Osteopathic Medicine practice their distinct philosophy in every medical specialty. A DO is trained to first consider the person within the patient

While I hope that's true, I feel that the campaign came off more than a little...adversarial. I get why the website is doctorsthatdo.com, and it's certainly catchy. But the whole concept says to me that if there are doctors that "DO", there are other doctors, namely MDs, who "DO NOT".

I'm just not sure that a campaign that seems to be touting our superiority is the best idea, especially considering that DO schools are historically (for a myriad of reasons) somewhat less competitive, and that we are supposedly beginning a new era of cooperation and hand-holding with the ACGME.

I want people to know what DO's do, and who are. I absolutely am grateful for the opportunity to go to medical school and become a DO. I just would probably have softened the edge of the campaign a bit. You don't want to tick off your new neighbors with a huge party the first weekend, especially if you're moving into their neighborhood.
 
skeletor06 said:
I want people to know what DO's do, and who are. I absolutely am grateful for the opportunity to go to medical school and become a DO. I just would probably have softened the edge of the campaign a bit. You don't want to tick off your new neighbors with a huge party the first weekend, especially if you're moving into their neighborhood.
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Beautifully said.
 
It seems like we (MDs) are the wrong people to go after with the implied we actually listen nonsense. I wish the campaign was about the positive side of DOs and how PHYSICIANS are different than mid levels. Some worthwhile public education instead of adding another group of "we are different and better" to the mix.
 
TwinsFan said:
It seems like we (MDs) are the wrong people to go after with the implied we actually listen nonsense. I wish the campaign was about the positive side of DOs and how PHYSICIANS are different than mid levels. Some worthwhile public education instead of adding another group of "we are different and better" to the mix.
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Something along those lines would be great. Something to the effect of, "Only DOs and MDs are fully trained physicians."

Does anyone remember that survey the AOA sent out a while back, presumably as they were planning this ad campaign? I started filling it out but stopped because I got frustrated that all the answer choices we so off base. They were asking all the wrong questions.
 
skeletor06 said:
I would totally agree with the need for awareness. There are many people who have no idea what a DO is. The problem isn't with the desire for a campaign, but the "attitude" it portrayed. Here is a tagline from the campaign:

Before you talk to a doctor, choose one trained to listen.
Doctors of Osteopathic Medicine practice their distinct philosophy in every medical specialty. A DO is trained to first consider the person within the patient

While I hope that's true, I feel that the campaign came off more than a little...adversarial. I get why the website is doctorsthatdo.com, and it's certainly catchy. But the whole concept says to me that if there are doctors that "DO", there are other doctors, namely MDs, who "DO NOT".

I'm just not sure that a campaign that seems to be touting our superiority is the best idea, especially considering that DO schools are historically (for a myriad of reasons) somewhat less competitive, and that we are supposedly beginning a new era of cooperation and hand-holding with the ACGME.

I want people to know what DO's do, and who are. I absolutely am grateful for the opportunity to go to medical school and become a DO. I just would probably have softened the edge of the campaign a bit. You don't want to tick off your new neighbors with a huge party the first weekend, especially if you're moving into their neighborhood.
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The inferiority complex is all too real
 
I don't see anything wrong with it. If you go to any city with big hospitals, you see billboards touting their own specialty US News ranked blah blah or why you should go to their hospital. It is pitting one hospital system against the other. The AOA campaign has the capacity to pit DO vs MD, but it seems more awareness oriented than us vs them. Its pathetic how people in my city are not aware of my school even though we have been around for ages. Our fault for not reaching out sooner.

My limited reactions when saying I go to an osteopathic school:
are either "ohhh wowww I love the whole body approach" or "are they bone doctors?"

The rest had no idea what a DO was
 
Reiterating how out of touch our 'leadership' is, the president of the AOA was at our school last week. Actual quotes: "Why would you want to take the USMLE?" and "There's no reason to take the USMLE" followed by the tired line about seventy-something percent of ACGME residencies accepting COMLEX scores. This is why we can't have nice things.
 
LOL man this profession is really going down the toilet. NPs will be doing surgery within the decade, trust me, and a lot of the reason will be because scum that run the AOA and the AMA are too stupid and out of touch and focus on sheer meaningless rubbish instead of important problems.
 
serenade said:
I don't see why Osteopathic Medical Schools can't adopt the MD degree, continue to teach OMM and osteopathic heritage and etc and move onto a united front. And I agree, merging could see the LCME and other organizations such as state programs allocate proper resources to supplement education and other deficits in opportunities.

I think whether we like it or not, we're moving towards closer work with the MD world.
Click to expand...
Because OMM is a non-evidence based modality, and hence does not belong in an allopathic medical institution. The osteopathic heritage is just as HL Mencken wrote about many decades ago:

... Both doctrines were launched upon the world by an old quack named Andrew T. Still, the father of osteopathy. For years the osteopaths merchanted them, and made money at the trade. But as they grew opulent they grew ambitious, i.e., they began to study anatomy and physiology. The result was a gradual abandonment of Papa Still's ideas. The high-toned osteopath of today is a sort of eclectic. He tries anything that promises to work, from tonsillectomy to the x-rays. With four years' training behind him, he probably knows more anatomy than the average graduate of the Johns Hopkins Medical School, or at all events, more osteology. Thus enlightened, he seldom has much to say about pinched nerves in the back. But as he abandoned the Still revelation it was seized by the chiropractors, led by another quack, one Palmer. This Palmer grabbed the pinched nerve nonsense and began teaching it to ambitious farm-hands and out-at-elbow Baptist preachers in a few easy lessons...​
 
cbrons said:
View attachment 197317

If you showed this to an M.D. or other M.D. students, would they find this insulting? Answer: Yes.
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They shouldn't feel insulted unless they do not practice humanism in medicine. Most probably do. I wouldn't feel insulted by an identical poster that said "MD" instead of "DO".
 
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GUH said:
They shouldn't feel insulted unless they do not practice humanism in medicine. Most probably do. I wouldn't feel insulted by an identical poster that said "MD" instead of "DO".
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The poster suggests that only DOs practice "humanism" in medicine. Hence why it says, "A DO is trained to consider the whole person, not just the symptom" (obviously implies that other physicians do not).
 
cbrons said:
The poster suggests that only DOs practice "humanism" in medicine. Hence why it says, "A DO is trained to consider the whole person, not just the symptom" (obviously implies that other physicians do not).
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You don't think MDs are trained to consider the whole person? They are. It is just something which is an historical part of osteopathic training and which is still emphasized, which we are proud of.
 
Aside from the insulting/adversarial aspect of it, which will not offend members of the public, this campaign does nothing to tell people wtf a DO is. People don't get that DO and MD are the same thing. They need to emphasize that DOs are fully licensed physicians just like MDs.

You could replace DO on these ads with ND and it would come across the same way.
 
cbrons said:
Because OMM is a non-evidence based modality, and hence does not belong in an allopathic medical institution.
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But it just did...with the merger.

Whether they truly believe it or not, when ACGME accepted AOA/AACOM as participating member organizations, there will be MDs vying for competitive subspecialty accepting offers at residencies with osteopathic principle.

Look. No modern day DO graduates hail OMM as the best thing ever since the sliced bread.
Most of the time, DOs use treatment modalities other than OMM....but to say OMM is completely devoid of evidence and without merit/benefit is going too far.

cbrons said:
LOL man this profession is really going down the toilet. NPs will be doing surgery within the decade, trust me, and a lot of the reason will be because scum that run the AOA and the AMA are too stupid and out of touch and focus on sheer meaningless rubbish instead of important problems.
Click to expand...

I'm totally with you on this one...We need a united voice when raising our concerns or we will eventually lose our profession to the govt/midlevels/insurance companies..

Sadly, AMA and AOA are both too busy fighting each other.
 
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CrocodilePancake said:
In medical school, the only thing that distinguishes DO's from MD's is one two-hour class a week.
In practice, the two physicians are indistinguishable. Which leads to the point that if the distinguishing feature of DO schools, OMT, is not used by over 90% of DO school graduates, then why should there be a difference at all?
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This is a point which repeatedly comes up in discussions with people who want to eliminate the osteopathic profession.

OMT is not used by most DOs in practice. So what? Neither is histology. That doesn't mean that it is not a relevant part of our training. If we eliminated everything from medical school curricula that was not used by most physicians, there would be a lot more than just OMT going out the window.

And applicants still have the option of attending a school without OMT if they feel that it is an unnecessary waste of time. The same cannot be said of the other things they teach which most doctors don't actually use.
 
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