Are these hem/onc clinical instructor salary numbers from AAMC accurate?!

[brokeasshemonc]

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Note: I've slightly changed some details about myself to preserve anonymity.

I'm a hem/onc research fellow at a solid but not upper echelon program in the Midwest, widely considered T25 but not T5. I was looking to continue as a clinical instructor for a few years before applying for tenure-track research positions. I was expecting this to pay about $130k per year (as was the case in prior years), but due to the current funding crisis, this has been slashed to the resident/fellow pay scale at my institution.

I don't have a K award, but I do have a Damon Runyon Postdoctoral Fellowship and an ASCO YIA.

From the 2024 AAMC Faculty Salary Report for FY2023, stats for clinical instructors in hem/onc were as follows:

• Count: 114
• 10th Percentile: $135,476
• 25th Percentile: $181,800
• Median: $242,822
• 75th Percentile: $274,310
• 90th Percentile: $334,500
• Mean: $245,802

These were much higher figures than I expected for clinical instructors, not assistant professors, and I can't figure out anything in the survey methodology to suggest why they would skew higher than expected. I also recognize that these are self-reported numbers, but I don't have any reason to believe clinical instructors would be more inclined to self-report favorable numbers than other positions.

If these are accurate, my compensation as a clinical instructor would be 1/3 of the reported median/mean of clinical instructors, a subset of academically oriented physician scientists who were already inclined to take lower compensation, despite the fact that I would be able to fully fund my external research effort. I can't justify continuing like this. On the other hand, if these numbers are completely skewed by a factor of 2-3x, then I would have to seriously contemplate what's important to me.

 

[MD46]

Just to give you an idea, clinical instructor salary in a mid tier academic program with a fellowship in 2018 was 185K with bonus = 210K , with 40-50k increase as you go up to assistant, associate and full professor.

We were at the lower end at the time, I would expect at least in the mid 200s by now to start with. Also places like dana farber, hopkins, MGH etc will never pay much.

Also just to clarify you are in Hematology/Oncology fellowship but in a research track? not a non physician PHD correct?

 

[gutonc]

These also assume 1.0 cFTE. If you're looking for a 0.2-0.4 cFTE, then the median would be in the $50-100K range. ~250K for 4 full clinic days, non-tenure, non-teaching (basically a meat moving note monkey) is probably reasonable for academics these days.

 

[brokeasshemonc]

Just to give you an idea, clinical instructor salary in a mid tier academic program with a fellowship in 2018 was 185K with bonus = 210K , with 40-50k increase as you go up to assistant, associate and full professor.

We were at the lower end at the time, I would expect at least in the mid 200s by now to start with. Also places like dana farber, hopkins, MGH etc will never pay much.

Also just to clarify you are in Hematology/Oncology fellowship but in a research track? not a non physician PHD correct?

Correct, I'm an MD/PhD.

Do you mind me asking, was the $185k total salary or from clinical effort only? What percentage clinical effort did that include (and what did it actually mean in terms of clinic days)?

 

[brokeasshemonc]

These also assume 1.0 cFTE. If you're looking for a 0.2-0.4 cFTE, then the median would be in the $50-100K range. ~250K for 4 full clinic days, non-tenure, non-teaching (basically a meat moving note monkey) is probably reasonable for academics these days.

That's less exciting but would make much more sense. But I assume the salary support from competitive funding sources would be added on top of that?

The offer I turned down was for 0.5 days of clinic per week. It would have represented $7k above the NIH postdoc salary (almost all of it covered by Damon Runyon).

 

[ONC2023]

I was looking to continue as a clinical instructor for a few years before applying for tenure-track research positions. I was expecting this to pay about $130k per year (as was the case in prior years), but due to the current funding crisis, this has been slashed to the resident/fellow pay scale at my institution.

I hope you'll permit me a slight digression to the thread as a fellow MD-PhD. I have two beautiful words for you that will change your life: "community practice."

 

[gutonc]

I hope you'll permit me a slight digression to the thread as a fellow MD-PhD. I have two beautiful words for you that will change your life: "community practice."

As a recovering physician-scientist (13 years clean), I second the motion.

 

[bobsmith]

I hope you'll permit me a slight digression to the thread as a fellow MD-PhD. I have two beautiful words for you that will change your life: "community practice."

Yeah, but then he'd have to get a new username 🙂

 

[MD46]

That's less exciting but would make much more sense. But I assume the salary support from competitive funding sources would be added on top of that?

The offer I turned down was for 0.5 days of clinic per week. It would have represented $7k above the NIH postdoc salary (almost all of it covered by Damon Runyon).

This was 2 full clinic days a week, about 12 weeks inpatient. Had to cover both inpatient team and consult services alternatively. So for clinical instructor only 0.5 clinic days doesnt suffice I would assume. That salary was all in, I am not sure about any grants etc. sorry.

 

[gutonc]

That's less exciting but would make much more sense. But I assume the salary support from competitive funding sources would be added on top of that?

The offer I turned down was for 0.5 days of clinic per week. It would have represented $7k above the NIH postdoc salary (almost all of it covered by Damon Runyon).

They're basically paying you for the clinical work at the clinical work rate and letting you pay yourself whatever you can get from grants. Again, not atypical. You need to decide if the potential benefit for your research career will be worth it in the end.

You've got 2 high profile grants already which suggests that you're very good at what you do and likely to be successful in doing impactful research and getting more grant funding (assuming NIH continues to exist and support cancer research). So if there's anyone I would encourage to have a go at it, it's someone like you. But there are now (and will be for your entire career) tradeoffs that you will have to make in order to do this, and money is the primary sacrifice. I'm not suggesting that this is fair, or good, but it is reality.

 

[brokeasshemonc]

They're basically paying you for the clinical work at the clinical work rate and letting you pay yourself whatever you can get from grants. Again, not atypical. You need to decide if the potential benefit for your research career will be worth it in the end.

Based on the numbers provided, I'm getting substantially less than the clinical work rate--about $10k per 0.5 days of clinic (although no inpatient). This gives me serious concerns about the ability of the cancer center to fund physician scientists in the future (or how they value me, which is not reassuring either).

 

[gutonc]

Based on the numbers provided, I'm getting substantially less than the clinical work rate--about $10k per 0.5 days of clinic (although not outpatient). This gives me serious concerns about the ability of the cancer center to fund physician scientists in the future (or how they value me, which is not reassuring either).

TBH, I didn't actually do the math, just went on feels. But if they're paying you less than 0.1 FTE for your clinical work, f*** them.

And no, the institution doesn't value you, or any other scientists (physician or otherwise), above the amount of indirects you bring in.