Can I still get into a good residency if...

[HipHopDoc23]

I don't do anything medically related between my 1st and 2nd year?

I really really wanted to do research but now I have missed almost all the deadlines. I know it seems careless but in truth, I have been trying to apply since last semester. But my school didn't even put their prospective projects up until January. Then I was interested in another program to which I applied but then was rejected. Then classes and tests got cancelled due to the weather and I fell behind in my school work and as you know getting behind in medical is like taking a punch to the gut and trying to catch your breath.

So now I am here emailing physicians like crazy and I probably wont get funding but I just want to get onto a project. But if I can't... does this mean I can't get a competitive residency? I mean I plan to do research during the school year next year if I have to. But having a summer (my only free summer) with nothing to show will look awful won't it? As you can probably tell I am really freaking out. Anyway, any advice would be greatly appreciated!

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[RySerr21]

I don't do anything medically related between my 1st and 2nd year?

I really really wanted to do research but now I have missed almost all the deadlines. I know it seems careless but in truth, I have been trying to apply since last semester. But my school didn't even put their prospective projects up until January. Then I was interested in another program to which I applied but then was rejected. Then classes and tests got cancelled due to the weather and I fell behind in my school work and as you know getting behind in medical is like taking a punch to the gut and trying to catch your breath.

So now I am here emailing physicians like crazy and I probably wont get funding but I just want to get onto a project. But if I can't... does this mean I can't get a competitive residency? I mean I plan to do research during the school year next year if I have to. But having a summer (my only free summer) with nothing to show will look awful won't it? As you can probably tell I am really freaking out. Anyway, any advice would be greatly appreciated!

you can always take a year off to do research. I know a lot of students who are doing/have done that. Dont do research during your 2nd year that will be miserable. I didn't do anything on my summer off ( i went out of the country for 8 weeks and enjoyed my last vacation). I'm interested in primary care, so thats a little different story if you are trying to derm or something. But yea, if you feel you really need the resesarch, then take a year off.

 

[ijn]

Is research really worth taking a year off for? From the 2007 NRMP: "... Neither the number of research experiences nor the number of publications was a significant predictor of match success for U.S. seniors who preferred either a highly competitive or other specialty."

 

[DarknightX]

It really doesn't matter what you did between M1 and M2. If you want to get research done, you still have the rest of medical school. The only thing programs care about from your first 2 years is your Step 1 score. If you get some publications, that always looks good, but nobody is going to care when you did it.

 

[JokerMD]

asdf

 

[da8s0859q]

i don't think it'll matter as long as you eventually do a research project.

Maybe I'm mistaken, but my understanding was that research isn't a de facto requirement until you hit higher-end specialties in terms of competitiveness -- like radiology and up.

OP, what field are you thinking?

 

[JokerMD]

asdf

 

[hot sauce]

The importance of research varies a lot from field to field. Of course it is never a bad thing to have on your application but in some areas it matters a lot more than others. Also the type of research that they care about is field dependent. Some fields don't care about your impressive basic science research - to them it is 😴.

The summer between 1st and 2nd years of medical school was probably the best of my life and it wasn't because I was in the lab or doing anything that went into ERAS. So if you don't do research do something memorable you probably won't have another break like that for a long time.

You can still do research if you don't do any this summer but it is a good time to do research as well. If you have an idea of what field you want to pursue I would contact that department and see if you can get involved in a project either this summer or next year.

Bottom line to your question it depends what field. There are some (like radiation oncology) that zero research will be a problem and in others it won't be.

 

[Rollo]

Try doing some research in 2nd year. Clinical research like chart review is definitely possible in 2nd year. I know you got school and boards to prepare but early in your 2nd year, you can afford to set aside 5-10 hours a week for clinical research.

 

[DrJosephKim]

One of the best ways to make yourself more competitive for residency is to take a year and do some meaningful research. Get something published in a peer-reviewed journal. Invest that one year for the rest of your career.

 

[BPlaysItCool]

One of the best ways to make yourself more competitive for residency is to take a year and do some meaningful research. Get something published in a peer-reviewed journal. Invest that one year for the rest of your career.

What? That's ridiculous. hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt at 9 points. Clinical training primed for an internship. And you're saying spend a year jerking off a phd.

If I do that. Somebody have the compassion to shoot me in f'n head with a high calibur pistol.

 

[Law2Doc]

What? That's ridiculous. hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt at 9 points. Clinical training primed for an internship. And you're saying spend a year jerking off a phd.

If I do that. Somebody have the compassion to shoot me in f'n head with a high calibur pistol.

It's unfortunately not ridiculous. It's a tried and true method for giving you that extra something to land one of the more highly competitive residencies. Truth of the matter is that some fields are so competitive that everyone applying has high Step 1 scores, rave evals, is tops in their class and has good LORs. What do you do to distinguish yourself from that pack if you really want that rad onc spot? You get some meaningful research and a peer reviewed article, and maybe a presentation at a national meeting into your CV. You can't really accomplish this in a short summer, so some people who are gung ho for certain paths will take some time off to do this. Yeah it's expensive and time consuming, but if you are hell bent on a certain field and want to give yourself maximum changes, it helps.

And it doesn't stop here. Lots of residencies are going to expect you to continue publishing along the way. Certain fields (eg some surgery subspecialties) will expect you to extend your residency a year or two to do some meaningful research along the way. So you may be "jerking off a phd" for quite some time on certain paths. It may be a pain, and it's not for everyone or every path, but it's not ridiculous to consider this option for research.

 

[BPlaysItCool]

It's unfortunately not ridiculous. It's a tried and true method for giving you that extra something to land one of the more highly competitive residencies. Truth of the matter is that some fields are so competitive that everyone applying has high Step 1 scores, rave evals, is tops in their class and has good LORs. What do you do to distinguish yourself from that pack if you really want that rad onc spot? You get some meaningful research and a peer reviewed article, and maybe a presentation at a national meeting into your CV. You can't really accomplish this in a short summer, so some people who are gung ho for certain paths will take some time off to do this. Yeah it's expensive and time consuming, but if you are hell bent on a certain field and want to give yourself maximum changes, it helps.

And it doesn't stop here. Lots of residencies are going to expect you to continue publishing along the way. Certain fields (eg some surgery subspecialties) will expect you to extend your residency a year or two to do some meaningful research along the way. So you may be "jerking off a phd" for quite some time on certain paths. It may be a pain, and it's not for everyone or every path, but it's not ridiculous to consider this option for research.

Fair enough. I won't be on that boat. Glad of it. But Dr. Kim didn't say Rad Onc. He seemed to indicate it's just a good way to get some kicks. Thus my exagerated response.

 

[metallica81788]

I don't do anything medically related between my 1st and 2nd year?

I really really wanted to do research but now I have missed almost all the deadlines. I know it seems careless but in truth, I have been trying to apply since last semester. But my school didn't even put their prospective projects up until January. Then I was interested in another program to which I applied but then was rejected. Then classes and tests got cancelled due to the weather and I fell behind in my school work and as you know getting behind in medical is like taking a punch to the gut and trying to catch your breath.

So now I am here emailing physicians like crazy and I probably wont get funding but I just want to get onto a project. But if I can't... does this mean I can't get a competitive residency? I mean I plan to do research during the school year next year if I have to. But having a summer (my only free summer) with nothing to show will look awful won't it? As you can probably tell I am really freaking out. Anyway, any advice would be greatly appreciated!

I've been wondering this, too. I have a major commitment this summer that won't allow me to do anything until very late June or the beginning of July, so I'll only have a month to do anything. That excluded me from all major programs since they have set deadlines and now I'm not getting any responses from emails I'm sending to faculty.

Not trying to hijack the thread (although this is related to OP), but should I continue to try and set something up on my own for no stipend?

 

[da8s0859q]

It's unfortunately not ridiculous. It's a tried and true method for giving you that extra something to land one of the more highly competitive residencies. Truth of the matter is that some fields are so competitive that everyone applying has high Step 1 scores, rave evals, is tops in their class and has good LORs. What do you do to distinguish yourself from that pack if you really want that rad onc spot? You get some meaningful research and a peer reviewed article, and maybe a presentation at a national meeting into your CV. You can't really accomplish this in a short summer, so some people who are gung ho for certain paths will take some time off to do this. Yeah it's expensive and time consuming, but if you are hell bent on a certain field and want to give yourself maximum changes, it helps.

And it doesn't stop here. Lots of residencies are going to expect you to continue publishing along the way. Certain fields (eg some surgery subspecialties) will expect you to extend your residency a year or two to do some meaningful research along the way. So you may be "jerking off a phd" for quite some time on certain paths. It may be a pain, and it's not for everyone or every path, but it's not ridiculous to consider this option for research.

L2D or anyone else substantially "in the know" on such things: in terms of specialty competitiveness, where do you draw the line between "research is basically essential" and "need not have any research"?

We all look at derm, rad onc, and surgical subspecialties as having research as a de facto requirement, but what about the specialties underneath those in competitiveness? EM, anesthesiology, general surgery, radiology (dx or interventional), etc.

I have seen the NRMP PD survey but am interested in others' takes on it.

 

[ArcGurren]

Eh, research no matter in what field looks good. Someone from our school just matched into the top Rad Onc spot at MD Anderson (the best in the world) but he didn't do rad-onc research... he took a year off to do Neurosurgery research.

That being said you do not have to take a year off for research at all. I know people going into Ophthalmology and Urology who didn't do anything during that "free summer", then when they decided on it, they approached someone at the school during their third year and they set them up with a project. Of course they had the Step 1 score to back it up though! Don't underestimate the importance of this exam!

The only specialties where I've really seen preclinical grades thoroughly scrutinized are Dermatology and Neurosurgery, neither of which I have any desire to go into. Of course AOA status will help no matter what but that's why you have so many other things (most importantly Step 1 score) to offset anything that might be weaker. I'm definitely not going to be chosen for AOA so I'm hoping to crush my Step 1.

 

[ArcGurren]

L2D or anyone else substantially "in the know" on such things: in terms of specialty competitiveness, where do you draw the line between "research is basically essential" and "need not have any research"?

We all look at derm, rad onc, and surgical subspecialties as having research as a de facto requirement, but what about the specialties underneath those in competitiveness? EM, anesthesiology, general surgery, radiology (dx or interventional), etc.

I have seen the NRMP PD survey but am interested in others' takes on it.

General surgery I've never heard cares much for research... it's also not that tough to match IMO.

Anesthesia, it helps, but Step 1 is more important. Radiology, just approach the program director at your school once you've decided, talk to them, and get set up with a project.