can you teach at a medical school without a PHD

[NervousNed]

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Can an MDwithout PHD teach at a medical school?

 

[AGDJenni]

I believe so, but don't quote me on it.

 

[Catalystik]

Ours has MDs teaching Physical Diagnosis and Clinical Medicine.

 

[lilnoelle]

Can an MDwithout PHD teach at a medical school?

Yes. Many of our instructors are PhDs, many are MDs, honestly, there haven't been that many MD/PhDs.
I don't know how other schools do it, but generally teachers teach about their field of knowledge for a period of time (maybe 3 lectures a week for a block, 3 lectures a month over a year, or if they're important, they may be in charge of a course). Its not the same as undergrad, you see many different instructors every week and see very few of them over a long period of time.
These instructors usually work for the hospital in either research or as physicians, and as a part of their contract, they are required to teach a few courses.

 

[bigdog8829]

yes. why not.
who else is going to teach about clinical medicine.
a phd doesnt really know about it...

 

[Pinkertinkle]

Sure, most PhD's tend just to go off topic and talk about their beloved research anyways, yielding in one esoteric and useless lecture.

 

[lilnoelle]

Sure, most PhD's tend just to go off topic and talk about their beloved research anyways, yielding in one esoteric and useless lecture.

🙂 Agreed.

 

[ssquared]

If you look at most of the curriculum faculty websites, you'll find that it's probably pretty rare for MD/PhDs to be teaching. I imagine that their heart is set on research, not teaching. Having an MD is usually sufficient (or PhD, as the case may be)

 

[dutchman]

From what I have heard, medschool has the most amount of unqualified teachers. Anyone is allowed to teach. Even the intern that just killed someone 2 days ago is given his/her own group of students to teach. I am surprised they haven't let nurses start teaching years 1 and 2.

 

[NonTradMed]

From what I have heard, medschool has the most amount of unqualified teachers. Anyone is allowed to teach. Even the intern that just killed someone 2 days ago is given his/her own group of students to teach. I am surprised they haven't let nurses start teaching years 1 and 2.

In a hospital, residents have med students under them during the students' 3rd adn 4th rotations in the hospitals. If a resident was really incompetent, keeping him away from students is probably not first priority for hospitals.

First two years of basic sciences is taught by most PhDs with smattering of MDs. We never had a resident coming in to teach us anything. As far as I can tell, med school will let attendings teach residents, residents teach med students, and PhDs teach the first two years. Not sure how that means they allow unqualified teachers but hey, I'm just a first year and I know nothing.

 

[dutchman]

In a hospital, residents have med students under them during the students' 3rd adn 4th rotations in the hospitals. If a resident was really incompetent, keeping him away from students is probably not first priority for hospitals.

First two years of basic sciences is taught by most PhDs with smattering of MDs. We never had a resident coming in to teach us anything. As far as I can tell, med school will let attendings teach residents, residents teach med students, and PhDs teach the first two years. Not sure how that means they allow unqualified teachers but hey, I'm just a first year and I know nothing.

Seeing as students improve their grades by skipping class, I can only assume the teachers are valueless.

 

[p9142]

Seeing as students improve their grades by skipping class, I can only assume the teachers are valueless.

That is something I still don't understand. The general SDN consensus is that the best way to Honor your classes is to skip and learn on your own. If that is the case, why can't we just skip class the first two years and just pay for a proctor to give us exams. That should cut down on tuition quite a bit!

 

[Tired Pigeon]

That is something I still don't understand. The general SDN consensus is that the best way to Honor your classes is to skip and learn on your own. If that is the case, why can't we just skip class the first two years and just pay for a proctor to give us exams. That should cut down on tuition quite a bit!

Not a bad idea.😀

Seriously, I'd say that for about half my classes the lecture adds NOTHING to the material in the syllabus & readings. When I first started med school I felt like I needed to go to every class because I might 'miss something'. Once I was honest with myself and realized certain classes were a waste of my time and I would be better off teaching myself the material, my grades improved (I have honored every single one of the classes I stopped going to), my free time increased, and I was in general less stressed out. Glad I figured this out.

 

[NonTradMed]

Seeing as students improve their grades by skipping class, I can only assume the teachers are valueless.

Not true for everyone. I skipped classes and it does nothing for me or my grades. The top student in our class attends all lectures, but one kid from my small group section swears he never attends lecture and is doing very well.

It depends on your learning style. Some students do better by learning the notes on their own. Others are auditory learners and learn better by listening. Also, some schools, mine included now have audio and video lectures online so people can skip the lectures and just listen/watch at home. One can't assume that students who skip classes are not listening to lectures. Also, we all learn by the notes, which are written by the professors. So we can't discount the professor's ability to teach just b/c people dont' like to attend lectures, the professor's skill as as teacher is also reflected in the notes they write (which can vary in quality as well).

That is something I still don't understand. The general SDN consensus is that the best way to Honor your classes is to skip and learn on your own. If that is the case, why can't we just skip class the first two years and just pay for a proctor to give us exams. That should cut down on tuition quite a bit!

SDN is not representative of the entire med school population. Plenty of students show up for class at my school, depending on how the professor teaches and if we have an exam that day.

People on SDN like to be contrary and say they are different from the general assumption that one must attend class to do well. One must study to do well in class, attendance helps for some, not for others.

Not a bad idea.😀

Seriously, I'd say that for about half my classes the lecture adds NOTHING to the material in the syllabus & readings. When I first started med school I felt like I needed to go to every class because I might 'miss something'. Once I was honest with myself and realized certain classes were a waste of my time and I would be better off teaching myself the material, my grades improved (I have honored every single one of the classes I stopped going to), my free time increased, and I was in general less stressed out. Glad I figured this out.

I can skip some classes, others I don't skip. My grades have not changed and I do not have more free time. In fact, I've tried all permutations: skip class and learn on own, go to all classes and study again afterwards, listen to lecture double speed and study again etc. My grades don't seem to change much with each modification.

But some students feel they MUST attend class to do well, others say they do so much better w/o class. I think it depends on personal habit. I really don't see the 'skip class and honor your classes' sentiment shared by everyone at my school. It really varies.

 

[QofQuimica]

Can an MDwithout PHD teach at a medical school?

Yes. There are a variety of people teaching in med school besides PhDs: MDs, DOs, PharmDs, probably others that I don't know about yet. 🙂

 

[Quix]

yes. why not.
who else is going to teach about clinical medicine.
a phd doesnt really know about it...

I wouldn't say that's a fair assessment. For instance, I'm a PhD and I'm writing a clinical textbook (and clinical reference book); it also depends on the kind of PhD and the degree of clinical exposure. PhD's can teach pathophysiology, pharmacology, and medicinal biochemistry, for instance.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Yes. There are a variety of people teaching in med school besides PhDs: MDs, DOs, PharmDs, probably others that I don't know about yet. 🙂

I've seen a couple of people with MS degrees teaching at one IU medical school satellite campus.

 

[lsumedgirl]

There are people with a variety of degrees teaching at medical schools... plenty of MDs without PhDs.

 

[Critical Mass]

That is something I still don't understand. The general SDN consensus is that the best way to Honor your classes is to skip and learn on your own. If that is the case, why can't we just skip class the first two years and just pay for a proctor to give us exams. That should cut down on tuition quite a bit!

I would like this very much. Better yet, put us on an honor code and do away with the proctors. The best places use computer-based testing systems that mimic the USMLE and don't really require proctors.

Tuition is only a small part of our school's operating budget. My dean puts it at 3% (state school). Tuition = "what they think we'll pay for the degree" relative to our competitors. With a state school, they set oos to compete with nearby oos and private houses. In-staters get the bill cut in half or so as a general rule. The point is that tuition really has nothing to do with paying the professors or really the technology in most cases. Our lectures have merely been repeated over the last few years, and basic science profs are funded through their research programs much moreso than state funds.

Take home message: They will charge you what they think you will pay them for tuition without hurting recruiting. It doesn't have anything to do with what it actually costs to deliver the material. Never forget that medicine is a business at every stage. The preclinical years would require little faculty interaction from my perspective save for the phony clinical experience.

It seems like Texas and Mississippi can easily get away with dirt cheap tuition, but they also represent cases in which the public strongly believes in investing in the future. State schools that charge over $20K a year for med school in otherwise cheap states to live in are less interested in subsidizing the future.

Also, MD/PhD is not a teaching degree. I have nothing against mudphuds who become didactic profs, but those guys are usually too busy to do much teaching.

My .02--go back to the Hippocratic Oath and give free tuition at public schools. Raise the money by reducing Medicare reimbursements so that medical tuition no longer drives the cost of healthcare up. I'd gladly take a lower salary in exchange for less debt. I didn't go into medicine for the money.

BTW, PA's and MS 4's are just as capable of teaching basic clinical skills.

 

[CCLCMer]

Can an MDwithout PHD teach at a medical school?

Yes, definitely. I'd say at least half if not more of our seminar leaders and PBL tutors are MDs, not PhDs. Also, our anatomy speakers are always MDs. Our clinical skills instructors are all MDs, and some of our communications instructors are MDs too. The pharm people are usually PharmDs.