Cant get a residency spot, What's next with only 1 year of residency

[DRZIVAR]

Hello all. I am a family medicine IMG resident who has been in and out of two programs and can’t get back in anyway and shape and form. I have been trying for almost 3 years now. I am now finally evaluating my other options. I do not want to go the PA route and be downgraded but that suits my capabilities most and is shortest. I rather go to pharmacy or even dentistry but cannot get myself motivated to do any of those plus let alone go back to school. I am in process of applying for Wisconsin licensure see if I can get it. What can I use that for if I am living in California? I know I can go to Wisconsin to practice but well I don’t want to leave California and know that some government agencies might let me work in California such as VA hospital. Can I use my MD degree and one year of internship towards anything else to get credit for anything? What other options are available out there? I am getting really frustrated and hopeless.😕

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[Shikima]

May want to consider doing research for a few years at an institution you'd like to train at. After a couple of years, your past transgressions would be forgiven/forgotten, you could start new in IM/FP.

 

[JelloBrain]

Why not try for research positions? You are an MD, you can become a postdoc and work in a research specialty of your choice. The salary is equivalent to a resident's. If you do a successful stint for 2-3 years, and get well known and well-published, you could look into moving ahead in that career.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

May want to consider doing research for a few years at an institution you'd like to train at. After a couple of years, your past transgressions would be forgiven/forgotten, you could start new in IM/FP.

Why not try for research positions? You are an MD, you can become a postdoc and work in a research specialty of your choice. The salary is equivalent to a resident's. If you do a successful stint for 2-3 years, and get well known and well-published, you could look into moving ahead in that career.

I have concerns about both of these suggestions. First, prior transgressions will not be forgotten with the passage of time. In fact, the farther you get from your medical school graduation, the harder it will be to get a spot. Perhaps, if you're lucky and play your card right (i.e. get as much face time with the PD, go to teaching conferences, try to get an observership) you might be able to get a spot in IM/FM but it's certainly not a sure thing and, if you've already been dismissed from two prior programs and tried for 3 years to get into another, I agree that your chances of getting a spot are not good.

As for the second comment, you certainly could try to get a research position. If you really like research and if you get into a good lab and if you are productive, you might be able to make a career out of it. In general, research doesn't pay all that well unless you're the one in charge of the lab. Most research spots you could apply for are not designed to launch a research career, so you'd really have to work to make that happen.

As to your original question (What can a Wisc license do for me in CA?), the answer is "not much". You need a CA license to practice in CA. You're correct that any state license will let you work at a VA, but most VA's will want you to have completed a residency. You might get lucky and find a spot that will take you. Other than at a VA, you're Wisc license will be worthless in CA. You MIGHT be able to get a temporary CA license with a Wisc license, but that would only be good for a few months at most.

A Wisc license would allow you to work in Wisc, and that would allow you to gain additional clinical experience. 1-2 years of clinical experience might offer a chance to get a residency again, esp a residency wherever you were working.

 

[ResidentMD]

I have concerns about both of these suggestions. First, prior transgressions will not be forgotten with the passage of time. In fact, the farther you get from your medical school graduation, the harder it will be to get a spot. Perhaps, if you're lucky and play your card right (i.e. get as much face time with the PD, go to teaching conferences, try to get an observership) you might be able to get a spot in IM/FM but it's certainly not a sure thing and, if you've already been dismissed from two prior programs and tried for 3 years to get into another, I agree that your chances of getting a spot are not good.

As for the second comment, you certainly could try to get a research position. If you really like research and if you get into a good lab and if you are productive, you might be able to make a career out of it. In general, research doesn't pay all that well unless you're the one in charge of the lab. Most research spots you could apply for are not designed to launch a research career, so you'd really have to work to make that happen.

As to your original question (What can a Wisc license do for me in CA?), the answer is "not much". You need a CA license to practice in CA. You're correct that any state license will let you work at a VA, but most VA's will want you to have completed a residency. You might get lucky and find a spot that will take you. Other than at a VA, you're Wisc license will be worthless in CA. You MIGHT be able to get a temporary CA license with a Wisc license, but that would only be good for a few months at most.

A Wisc license would allow you to work in Wisc, and that would allow you to gain additional clinical experience. 1-2 years of clinical experience might offer a chance to get a residency again, esp a residency wherever you were working.

👍
1. I think this OP has posted before under a different screenname (and often had arguments). But then maybe I am paranoid and there are too many people with such similar issues here (changing residencies more than once).
2. I agree with aPD that the number of years away from graduation messes things up. Clearly the OP doesnt have a strong enough CV, and the years from graduation will make it worse.
3. Agreed about the research.
4. My principal concern is someone treating patients with only one year clinical experience and on a limited license, and NOT under supervision (because I guess if you apply to work in the VA, you will be on your own?) I'm not sure about that. Residencies are structured to train you to be a competent internist over a period of 3 years.
5. I like the Wisconsin license followed by USCE thing the best.

Important caveat - The OP may be an FMG with visa issues - I wonder if that comes into consideration. I also dont know how his in-and-out of residency programs affects his years of training in the grand schema of things (Medicare funding).

 

[dragonfly99]

Actually being a PA would not be bad...yes you'd have to go back to school, but for how many years? If it is only 2, that wouldn't be that bad, honestly.

I agree about the research thing. It would be a job, but IMHO it's likely to be a dead end job (you'll end up as a research tech with not much upward mobility). However, if your goal is to stay in California and stay in the US first and foremost, this may not be a bad option.

I doubt the VA will hire you with only 1 year experience. In my experience they don't require board certification but they do usually require a completed residency. You may not want to waste money on a Wisconsin license before you determine this.

I know there are some FMG docs working as things like echocardiographers. Presumably they did med school abroad but never did a residency over here. These kinds of jobs actually aren't that bad...you'll never make the money a physician makes, but it's decent money and good benefits.

 

[JelloBrain]

I agree about the research thing. It would be a job, but IMHO it's likely to be a dead end job (you'll end up as a research tech with not much upward mobility). However, if your goal is to stay in California and stay in the US first and foremost, this may not be a bad option.

These kinds of jobs actually aren't that bad...you'll never make the money a physician makes, but it's decent money and good benefits.

Why would someone with an MD degree work as a tech? S/he will be recruited as a postdoc. Postdoc pay and benefits are equivalent to residents.

Of course with the terrible bottleneck in academia, progression to tenure might be very difficult, but long term permanent SRA-3/4 position is not hard to come by. Or s/he can move on to research admin kind of jobs.

On the other hand, working as a tech is not a bad option. While postdoc pays are on NIH scale and exempt, tech pays are based on university employee levels, are non-exempt, and most even include pension that postdocs are not eligible for. So after the first 2 years or so, techs start earning more than the postdocs who supervise them! And they have job security, something us postdocs don't.

AFAIK, anyone with one year of internship can work in the VA and the prison system.

All the research stuff I have mentioned is from my own experience. I have had many excellent offers, and could cherry pick what I wanted. But of course, I do have super-duper jello for my brain, 😀.

OP, PM me if you want to know more about wanting to pursue the research route.

 

[sethco]

:4. My principal concern is someone treating patients with only one year clinical experience and on a limited license, and NOT under supervision (because I guess if you apply to work in the VA, you will be on your own?) I'm not sure about that. Residencies are structured to train you to be a competent internist over a period of 3 years.

This happens all the time in the military. In fact, some even make careers out of it without ever going into a residency. 😎

 

[dragonfly99]

I have also worked as both a research tech and a postdoc type (the latter with my MD). I agree that a research tech can often make the same or more as a post-doc (after a few years of experience).

The reason that some physicians with a foreign MD degree work in other jobs (like research tech, echocardiographer/ultrasonographer, even medical assistant) is that they need a job and can't get a job as a physician without completing a residency.

I've worked at a VA (ER and hospitalist moonlighting stuff) and the one I worked at wouldn't hire anyone without a completed residency. Board certification was not required, but a completed ER or IM or fp residency was. Maybe some other VA's are different, but the couple I've worked for have not accepted people without a completed residency. It would seem to be unwise for them to do so, unless there aren't any residency-trained physicians available for them. It would seem to expose them to liability. I know it's pretty hard to sue the VA, but it's not totally impossible.

 

[turquoiseblue]

To the OP,
You can get licensed if you take step 3 and then work for insurance companies, work on native american health care, or work as a GP for out of pocket pay although they're not the greatest they're a way to get back into medicine without doing residency. Pay is much better than research. Best of luck.

I also agree that being a PA is not bad as they get paid lots and are very resepcted. maybe you can get back into residency if you work at a program as a PA. Not an easy route though as you're going back to basic sciences for a while, but it may be worth it.

 

[Eta Carinae]

To the OP,
You can get licensed if you take step 3 and then work for insurance companies, work on native american health care, or work as a GP for out of pocket pay although they're not the greatest they're a way to get back into medicine without doing residency. Pay is much better than research. Best of luck.

I also agree that being a PA is not bad as they get paid lots and are very resepcted. maybe you can get back into residency if you work at a program as a PA. Not an easy route though as you're going back to basic sciences for a while, but it may be worth it.

I second the PA idea.

 

[DrJosephKim]

You may want to seriously evaluate your options outside of clinical medicine. There are many alternative career paths for people in your position. These non-clinical careers could be right for you, but make sure you do your research so that you can make an informed decision.

 

[Pickyournose]

You may be screwed. You might have better luck in your home country. I know of doctors in India who drive 3 series BMWs, which costs about $80,000. How many doctors in the US drive $80,000 cars? And in India, you can pay your receptionists $3,000 a year, possibly lower. In the US, you need to pay $60,000 in benefits and wages.