cGPA 3.3 and a Medical Laboratory Scientist

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bluestrawberrypie

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I'm currently a senior majoring in medical laboratory science at my state school. Because I was aiming to become a medical laboratory technologist (basically one of the people who works in the lab) my entire undergrad, my GPA isn't that high. However, after this past year of clinical rotations and working in hospitals I've come to the realization I really want to be more than a MLS and be one of the people who take our lab results and make the critical decisions that impact patient care. As part of my job description I have to attend rounds, and I have frequent interactions with physicians that make me really aspire to do what they do.

My current GPA is 3.31 (science GPA is probably lower) because I've been all over the place with my grades. I haven't completely failed any class besides ochem (retook my 1.7 and got a 3.5, and took a high level calculus class when I thought I wanted to major in computer science and got a 2.2, planning to retake next quarter). However, my classes really reflect classes that I would take in medical school- hematology, medical microbiology, clinical chemistry, transfusion medicine, immunology, virology, parasitology, etc. It's mainly these high level classes that I did mediocre in. My pre-med requirements are mostly ok (about 3.5ish) I'm really worried that my grades in those classes especially would reflect bad on me since they would be a representation of my work in med school.

So, as a senior graduating soon and aiming for MD (I rather do MD than DO for personal reasons), what path should I take? I will 100% be working in a hospital laboratory, and because of the shortage of MLSes out there I'm pretty much guaranteed whatever job site I am for. Should I:

1) Get a job at the hospital that our state med school (one of top med schools in the US, especially among public schools). They offer tuition exception if I work here so I can possibly retake classes that I got a 2.6-3.0 grade in. I would also be working in the same system as the medical school I'm planning to apply for. However, they don't pay that well and I don't really like their labs.

2) Get a job at the local children's hospital. If I go the MD route I think I would aim to be a critical care pediatric physician, and being at this hospital will give me plenty of opportunities to shadow the doctors I work with. This hospital offers a tuition reimbursement program, but I need to work here 1 year before that benefit kicks in. However, this hospital pays great and has great benefits

3) Get a job at a research facility that handles cancer patients and pharmokinetics. Pro: I get full time research experience (I actually did research for two years/500+ hours in undergrad) and the hours/pay is great. Con: I don't know about their tuition reimbursement and I wouldn't be close to any doctors or actual inpatient samples

4) I'm also currently considering going back to school for either another degree in computer science or bioinformatics as these degrees will help me advance in my current field. Should I pursue these paths and if I get a great GPA in my post-back career then apply for med school? I'm worried because these classes wouldn't be bio related.
 
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I think you need to work for awhile and figure out if med school and physician are your passion. My sense is that it is not but you're trying to figure out what to do with your life and med school is an option (though, right now, not a very feasible one).

Keep asking questions, keep researching your passion - life is long and there's generally, always a 2nd chance.
 
Read Goro's "How to reinvent yourself..." Esp if you are ORIM, your cGPA and esp your sGPA, is likely too low without reinventing yourself in some way and applying as non-traditional applicant in the future. MCAT will be imp piece of the puzzle ultimately as well.

You may certainly be able to find some MD faculty at your state school who work in the hospital you will be working in. If they have experience on the admissions committee, or have advised other students at your institution in the past, they might be able to give you some specific advice. I have advised many "techs/medical assistants" who worked in our hospital and wanted to apply to medical school in the past, and many of them came from state school undergrads and had what I consider mediocre GPA's. My advice to them and to you is to keep your mind open to DO, bc even with reinvention, you may not get to MD, and there are some great DO schools that will open many doors if you do well. But even these schools can afford to be relatively picky; one of my kid's best friends will be going to a top DO school - reapplicant after MD only apps last year, from top 20UG, 3.6GPA and 51x MCAT. And keep an open mind to APRN (some schools have direct pathways from non-nursing bachelors), and to PA. Many of these advanced practice practitioners (APPs) allow you to do many of the things that you want to do in clinical medicine. Academia is not even ruled out (though rare to have much of a research career with these degrees). Keep in mind that the PA application process does require a lot of clinical hours...
 
I'm planning to study for the MCAT. I'm planning to do that while I work and study. I'm not too worried about studying for an exam that encompasses a ton of subjects, as that's what I have to do for my board of licensure exam anyways.

I initially went into this field because I love science, medicine, and technology. It wasn't until I started my clinicals that I realized how repetitive and disconnected this field feels from actual patient care. I love getting the results, but I also enjoy patient interaction and wish to make actual decisions that put a patient onto a new plan of treatment. I've volunteered for the past four years at the local children's hospital and I enjoy seeing the patient face to face instead of just staring at their body fluids. For example, I'm currently in a microbiology lab and I can determine exactly what kind of bacteria my patient has. However, during rounds, all I do is stand back and watch the doctors decide what drug is best with all the information they have.

I guess what I'm saying is that I want to have patient interaction and greater responsibility in patient plan of care. I don't want to just provide the results- I want to help analyze them and take into account all aspects of their symptoms and not just a CBC report.
 
I'm planning to study for the MCAT. I'm planning to do that while I work and study. I'm not too worried about studying for a long term test, as that's what I have to do for my board of licensure exam anyways.

I initially went into this field because I love science, medicine, and technology. It wasn't until I started my clinicals that I realized how repetitive and disconnected this field feels from actual patient care. I love getting the results, but I also enjoy patient interaction and wish to make actual decisions that put a patient onto a new plan of treatment. For example, I'm currently in a microbiology lab and I can determine exactly what kind of bacteria my patient has. However, during rounds, all I do is stand back and watch the doctors decide what drug is best with all the information they have.

I guess what I'm saying is that I want to have patient interaction and greater responsibility in patient plan of care. I don't want to just provide the results- I want to help analyze them and take into account all aspects of their symptoms and not just a CBC report.
Totally makes sense to me. However, without MAJOR reinvention, MD (or good DO) isn't going to happen. So plan to reinvent yourself if you must have "Dr." in front of your name. However, with PA or APRN, you would be able to do all of the things you say you want to do....
 
How do you recommend I go about this reinvention? I've read up on SMPs, but I'm not in a financial situation where that's affordable at all. I was thinking of being a scribe in additional to my MLS job (I'm okay with working night shifts) but I'm really worried about my GPA. I plan to continue volunteering at my local hospital and possibly helping with research in my future lab. I have my research rotation next in hematology at the Children's Hospital, so I will learn more about clinical laboratory based rotations. At the end of this year, I will have presented at two research symposiums and have been cited on poster presentations presented before at national medical conventions.
 
How do you recommend I go about this reinvention? I've read up on SMPs, but I'm not in a financial situation where that's affordable at all. I was thinking of being a scribe in additional to my MLS job (I'm okay with working night shifts) but I'm really worried about my GPA. I plan to continue volunteering at my local hospital and possibly helping with research in my future lab.

Goro's advice for pre-meds who need reinvention

GORO is an adcom who has tens of thousands of posts here. He is the guru for people like you and has an entire thread that I have posted above. There are several other ADCOMS on this site who have similar engagement on this site and you can read their advice as well. (LizzyM etc)
 
That is great to hear.

I understand that studying for the MCAT is very difficult, and I will definitely have to brush up on my ochem and physics. However, my board exam already covers clinical chemistry, transfusion medicine, parasitology, virology, immunology, hematology, etc. I also worked in a neuroscience research lab focusing on autism (granted it was more for the protein interaction/biology portion than psychology) for nearly 3 years. So I'm not too worried about the biology/biochemistry/psychology portions. As for critical reasoning, I actually consider this to be a strength of mine. It's always been one of my best subjects (I got an 800 on this section on my SAT if that means anything at all)

Don't get me wrong I know it's EXTREMELY difficult. But, I am willing to put in the work and I plan to slowly study for it the same way I'm preparing for my boards (i.e. practice questions, study guides, schedules for myself, etc).
 
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Goro's advice for pre-meds who need reinvention

GORO is an adcom who has tens of thousands of posts here. He is the guru for people like you and has an entire thread that I have posted above. There are several other ADCOMS on this site who have similar engagement on this site and you can read their advice as well. (LizzyM etc)

I just read GORO's post. The problem with that post is that of all the classes he suggested:

Anatomy
Biochem
Bioinformatics
Biostats
Cell Bio
Developmental Biology or Embryology
Histology
Immunology
Med Micro OR Bacteriology and/or Virology
Molecular Bio or Genetics
Neuroscience or Neurobiology
Parasitology (if offered)
Pathology
Physiology
Tumor or Cancer Biology

I've actually already taken all of them with the exception of bioinformatics, developmental biology, histology, neurobiology, and cancer biology. I don't know if taking only these 5 classes would be enough to raise my GPA to a 3.7+. I could retake the other classes he listed, but he also said don't retake classes that you got a B- in. So in that case I shouldn't retake any of the classes listed here?
 
I used to work at a clinical laboratory (PM me for details) and a number of colleagues were successful applying to MD/DO programs. The *most* successful were those who worked hard and impressed the lab directors such that they got publications/ excellent work recommendations. There are a lot of entry level lab techs and lab directors don't always get to know them well, but those that stuck it out and were promoted/ excelled in their careers got a lot out of it. Part of this is being smart and seizing opportunities in areas that are expanding/ up-and-coming. When a new next gen sequencing department opened there was a guy who worked his way up from another department to running the place (and ran point with the lab directors). I think it took him something like 7 years, but he went from that to being admitted to a top MD-PhD program.

Of the places you described working, do you feel one is doing more exciting research/work than the others? That is probably where I'd try to go. Most labs worth their salt will do some kind of tuition deal for employees trying to further their careers. It sounds like you may be signing up for a number of classes to improve your GPA though, so maybe try to figure out which will give you the best deal/ most flexible schedule for studying. It is best to not take any of this process lightly (don't skimp on MCAT studying or on volunteer or shadowing hours), but it is all doable while working the right job.

I'm afraid the CS/bioinformatics degree would look too much like a tangent/ take up time that you don't have if you're focusing on being a pre-med. With a good starting position at a lab you can learn a lot on the job.

As for classes to take, you can always look for things that build upon entry level classes you have already taken. Even if you got a B- in into to molecular bio for example, if you aced an upper level mol bio class that would help your GPA. Good luck!
 
The one doing research would definitely be at the research/cancer care system. They're really heavily recruiting my graduating class as they're shifting out all their biology/chemistry graduates to only having MLS in their labs so I'm not too worried if I want to apply there. I know I can probably get publications or at least be cited on papers out of that lab. My concern is that if I work there I will probably lose all my clinical skills and knowledge, whereas if I work for a hospital I can keep up my knowledge of clinical chemistry/hematology/microbiology at the very minimum.

I am excited to work for my future lab! The reasoning why I'm learning CS is so that I can be more of use to whatever lab accepts me, so I can take up more projects for them. During my rotations my (rudimentary) knowledge of CS already got me placed on several projects from helping implement the new bioplex analyzer (HIV 5th generation testing!) to modifying the hematology analyzer to give nRBC results for newborns when nobody else in our lab could figure out how. I really feel like if I can understand how the lab and analyzers work it would help me understand lab results when interpreting results or determine what tests to order.

One thing I learned during my time in the lab is that a LOT of doctors don't know how to order tests or interpret preliminary results!
 
... my board exam already covers clinical chemistry, transfusion medicine, parasitology, virology, immunology, hematology, etc.
None of that is a topic on the MCAT and if it is, you might get an orgo reaction to with a piece of it missing and need to know not only the orgo reaction completely but all enzymes catalyzing the reaction and how to interpret the graph that explains the outcomes

can you do that?
 
None of that is a topic on the MCAT

If anything, they'll help me prepare for the biology sections. I'm not saying that I'm confident that I'll ace the MCAT (not at all), I'm just saying that I am able to continue to keep up knowledge through my current career field that may help me on questions.
 
If anything, they'll help me prepare for the biology sections
You really need to research the MCAT before speaking because what you just typed indicates to me, that you don't have any idea what's on it, or how the material is tested
 
You really need to research the MCAT before speaking because what you just typed indicates to me, that you don't have any idea what's on it, or how the material is tested
Bro OP is 100% correct on the bio ish. OP is going to destroy the bio portion just walking out of school.
 
I definitely will research more on the MCAT! I have looked at a few review books, and I think that my knowledge about the subjects I listed above do help me think more deeply about questions, especially those that stump me. A few of them even seem to be pulled from my MLS review books!

For example, a quick google search for a MCAT biology question (like you said, I need more review on the MCAT) pulled up this question:

A patient presents to the emergency room with an asthma attack. The patient has been hyperventilating for the past hour and has a blood pH of 7.52. The patient is given treatment and does not appear to respond, but a subsequent blood pH reading is 7.41. Why might this normal blood pH NOT be a reassuring sign?

A. The patient’s kidneys may have compensated for the alkalemia.

B. The normal blood pH reading is likely inaccurate.

C. The patient may be descending into respiratory failure.

D. The patient’s blood should ideally become acidemic for some time to compensate for the alkalemia.

This is a type of question I learned during my clinical chemistry COURSE, and during my chemistry rotation at a level one trauma center I was doing blood gas analysis on coding patients (in the room). My experience definitely helped me answer this question!
 
Those aren't the types of questions you get on the MCAT...

At the risk of getting into trouble with one test prep company, below is a picture of a passage that could be seen on the MCAT.

IF this is something you can do easily for bio, awesome! Can you do the same for physics, orgo, gen chem, biochem?

rx1CYGs.jpg
 
I understand that studying for the MCAT is very difficult, and I will definitely have to brush up on my ochem and physics. However, my board exam already covers clinical chemistry, transfusion medicine, parasitology, virology, immunology, hematology, etc. I also worked in a neuroscience research lab focusing on autism (granted it was more for the protein interaction/biology portion than psychology) for nearly 3 years. So I'm not too worried about the biology/biochemistry/psychology portions. As for critical reasoning, I actually consider this to be a strength of mine. It's always been one of my best subjects (I got an 800 on this section on my SAT if that means anything at all)

Don't get me wrong I know it's EXTREMELY difficult. But, I am willing to put in the work and I plan to slowly study for it the same way I'm preparing for my boards (i.e. practice questions, study guides, schedules for myself, etc).

Just so you know, the MCAT doesn't test the subjects covered in your board exam, in fact, a great majority of the questions are based on the passage, which you will need your basic science knowledge to actually understand. So if you do take it you are going to need to be sure that you understand those subjects you were weakest at in college as well as all the other subjects.

I would take a practice exam to see where you stand and get a general sense of the testing format (it is after all a 7hr exam, so timing is important). From that you can also get a general sense of what your understanding of the material is, what are your weak areas, etc.

Also based on what you are saying, I would NOT recommend studying for the MCAT while taking classes AND working. It's good you realize you need to reinvent yourself, but you want to destroy this exam to be at a better academic "standing". Take some time off to prepare (i.e. 3 full months of dedicated MCAT), take the exam and kill it.

Remember it's a marathon, not a sprint, you are in a tough spot (and believe me when i tell you as I am also a low stat applicant) and you want to show the schools the you from back then it's not the you right now, so they will need to see consistently good performance from you and you will need time for that to happen.
 
Those aren't the types of questions you get on the MCAT...

At the risk of getting into trouble with one test prep company, below is a picture of a passage that could be seen on the MCAT.

IF this is something you can do easily for bio, awesome! Can you do the same for physics, orgo, gen chem, biochem?

rx1CYGs.jpg

Yes, these types of questions were considered "basic" knowledge that my higher courses were based upon. Also, for what it's worth I did an entire research project in my lab based on PI3K and my courses have taught me about all these proteins and their interactions before I even looked at this passage (let alone allosteric binding and enzyme activity). For MLS, we don't need to just know how to run an ELISA, for example, but the concepts behind how it works and the fundaments of what the test is based upon.

I'm not trying to argue with you about my how prepared I currently am for the MCAT. I know I'm not prepared at all, I'm just saying my current knowledge will give me a leg up on thinking about questions I don't know. I concede that I need to brush up on ochem and physics especially, but I don't know why you're being so adamant that I know nothing about biology.
 
Just so you know, the MCAT doesn't test the subjects covered in your board exam, in fact, a great majority of the questions are based on the passage, which you will need your basic science knowledge to actually understand. So if you do take it you are going to need to be sure that you understand those subjects you were weakest at in college as well as all the other subjects.

I would take a practice exam to see where you stand and get a general sense of the testing format (it is after all a 7hr exam, so timing is important). From that you can also get a general sense of what your understanding of the material is, what are your weak areas, etc.

Also based on what you are saying, I would NOT recommend studying for the MCAT while taking classes AND working. It's good you realize you need to reinvent yourself, but you want to destroy this exam to be at a better academic "standing". Take some time off to prepare (i.e. 3 full months of dedicated MCAT), take the exam and kill it.

Remember it's a marathon, not a sprint, you are in a tough spot (and believe me when i tell you as I am also a low stat applicant) and you want to show the schools the you from back then it's not the you right now, so they will need to see consistently good performance from you and you will need time for that to happen.

Thank you for your advice! I plan to take the free MCAT that the premed club at my school is offering. I understand it's a really long marathon, and I hope I can see you at the finish line!
 
Yes, these types of questions were considered "basic" knowledge that my higher courses were based upon. Also, for what it's worth I did an entire research project in my lab based on PI3K and my courses have taught me about all these proteins and their interactions before I even looked at this passage (let alone allosteric binding and enzyme activity). For MLS, we don't need to just know how to run an ELISA, for example, but the concepts behind how it works and the fundaments of what the test is based upon.

I'm not trying to argue with you about my how prepared I currently am for the MCAT. I know I'm not prepared at all, I'm just saying my current knowledge will give me a leg up on thinking about questions I don't know. I concede that I need to brush up on ochem and physics especially, but I don't know why you're being so adamant that I know nothing about biology.
I suggest an SMP. Work for a few years and save up the money.
And having cratered your GPAs, you have ot have DO schools on your eventual list. Beggars can't be choosy.
 
I suggest an SMP. Work for a few years and save up the money.
And having cratered your GPAs, you have ot have DO schools on your eventual list. Beggars can't be choosy.

Thank you for your advice. I will consider that going forward (and DO programs), but for short term should I still work on improving my medicore grades from undergrad through the tuition exception program offered by my university hospital?
 
I don't know why you're being so adamant that I know nothing about biology.
I'm not adamant re: biology, I'm positive you are not prepared or know enough about what you need for the MCAT and you think you do.

That's fine - it's your life and you can choose accordingly but you asked for advice, I've been around a long enough time to see what helps people succeed (especially those with shoddy GPAs, myself included) and I think you're not thinking very clearly about what short-comings you have or what it will take to have a fab MCAT score to do so.

Last, if you really think you can breeze through that passage and answer the questions, what are the answers? I'll let you know if you're right 🙂
 
It's more of a starting line for me tbh hahahaha, but I know what you mean! I took quite the beating and it was hard, but when you get that A, it makes all that hard work worth it. It will be a long run, but put in that hard work. Remember, every single day counts towards that bigger picture.

Wish you best of lucks!
 
I'm not adamant re: biology, I'm positive you are not prepared or know enough about what you need for the MCAT and you think you do.

That's fine - it's your life and you can choose accordingly but you asked for advice, I've been around a long enough time to see what helps people succeed (especially those with shoddy GPAs, myself included) and I think you're not thinking very clearly about what short-comings you have or what it will take to have a fab MCAT score to do so.

Like I said, I know I am not prepared. I'm 100% positive I'm not prepared. And I appreciate your advice, I really do. I know that I need to study up on all the subjects, biology included.
 
I'm not adamant re: biology, I'm positive you are not prepared or know enough about what you need for the MCAT and you think you do.

That's fine - it's your life and you can choose accordingly but you asked for advice, I've been around a long enough time to see what helps people succeed (especially those with shoddy GPAs, myself included) and I think you're not thinking very clearly about what short-comings you have or what it will take to have a fab MCAT score to do so.
Unless you’re familiar with the MLS curriculum you really don’t know what this student is or isn’t prepared for. I’ll give you the lack of clarity of thought and the need to access with prep test. Absolutely. But not the biological sciences prep OP is starting out ahead of 90% of premeds in that section, even with a crap GPA.
 
Thank you for your advice. I will consider that going forward (and DO programs), but for short term should I still work on improving my medicore grades from undergrad through the tuition exception program offered by my university hospital?
Yes. Take any upper level science coursework.
 
But not the biological sciences prep OP is starting out ahead of 90% of premeds in that section, even with a crap GPA.
I have straight A's through almost everyone of my pre-req courses, advanced biological and chemistry science courses and *I* struggled with that passage and still don't for sure know WTH is going on ... so for someone with a shoddier GPA to say that he'd breeze through it? I don't believe it. (and he didn't, you did)

Working in the industry does not mean you read science journals and interpret them on daily basis. Even the physicians I work with see some of the stuff I'm working through, take one look, give me a blanched look, sigh, smile and walk away, chuckling and under their breath I think I hear them say, "Damn, glad I don't have to learn that @#$"
 
I believe 19 is C. Km = 1/2 Vmax, and a high Km means that the enzyme has low affinity. PTEN has a higher Vmax and thus has a higher Km, so low affinity for the substrate.

I believe 20 is B. The Vmax shouldn't be affected by the increase in (the reversible) substrate since it's basically maximum rate of the reaction. However, the slope should be decreased because the increase in the reaction rate will be slower as more substrate is already bound to the enzyme.

Am I right? This is just off the top of my head. I could be wrong since I'm not currently rotating through chemistry. Talk to me again in 5 weeks and I'll answer any questions you have much more confidently.

Also, I'd like you to go into a clinical lab and say that they don't read science journals. You do realize we have to have continuing education credits to keep up our licenses? Just the other day I went on break and over half my lab was in the break room listening to a lecture on the new method of testing for tuberculosis and how it uses an ELISA method (enzyme based) instead of an IGRA screen.

You know why physicians don't have to learn that ****? It's because we (supposedly) already have.
 
Why do you have a 3.3 GPA?
 
OP you asked for advice and you have mainly blown off the advice. You are a very long way from taking the MCAT and applying the medical school. Graduate, get a job and work for a few years. You have lots of work to do to make you competitive for any medical school. Your grades are too low for MD and even with a full time post bacc there is no guarantee that any schools will take a chance on you! You are against DO for “personal reasons” but honestly that might be your only chance to be a doctor.

Finish your degree. And maybe at some point you’ll decide you are happy in the lab or maybe you’ll decide to pursue a medical career. I’m not sure you understand the whole process ! I think you are looking at what you see in your rotations through rose colored glasses. Medicine is hard and not rosy and romantic at all!
 
OP you asked for advice and you have mainly blown off the advice. You are a very long way from taking the MCAT and applying the medical school. Graduate, get a job and work for a few years. You have lots of work to do to make you competitive for any medical school. Your grades are too low for MD and even with a full time post bacc there is no guarantee that any schools will take a chance on you! You are against DO for “personal reasons” but honestly that might be your only chance to be a doctor.

Finish your degree. And maybe at some point you’ll decide you are happy in the lab or maybe you’ll decide to pursue a medical career. I’m not sure you understand the whole process ! I think you are looking at what you see in your rotations through rose colored glasses. Medicine is hard and not rosy and romantic at all!

I’m sorry (to all) if I’m seeming like I’m blowing off advice. I’m taking notes, honest! I’m going to be taking a closer look at MCAT lesson plans and, thanks to some users, am going to be exploring the DO path more. I 100% know I’m not competitive and I’m not prepared.

I never expected to immediately apply. I was thinking of at least 5+ years in the field building up my knowledge of my career, repairing my GPA, and preparing for the MCAT. Hence why my original post was where should I choose to work that would help me accomplish all of the above and not how to apply directly out of college.

This is my first time posting to a message board like this. Sorry if I tread on a few toes I’m just trying to get a feel for my options going forward.
 
This is my first time posting to a message board like this. Sorry if I tread on a few toes ...
Meh, don't be hard yourself and no need for apologies. I know I came here, years ago, looking for encouragement but my first post was pretty humble-bragging and I 100% didn't mean it that way + I blew off the advice thinking I knew it all ... heh!

Little did I know (and still don't). 🙂

The worst thing I could think of would be for someone to get smoke blown up their bloomers and have them think they can nail the MCAT based on real life experience, which the MCAT does not test.

My GPA is worse than yours and also, 30 years old. Time does wonders for looking at medical school and right now, you have all the time in the world. Use it to your advantage!
 
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